Official BBR Matchup Chart v1.0

[Flayl]

AKA we need a japanese Dedede

 

[SaveMeJebus]

And Jebus, everybody is going to watch a match that has some kind of new technology that alters a matchup in it. I understand that you might not see that since http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Z9CyEvg_BQ is the only vid anybody has ever seen of you. But its true.

You're just jealous because nobody watches any of your videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyXaUnYVD60

 

[Sinister Slush]

The infinite doesn't matter at all until it becomes a common occurance, and a consistently proven one at that. People will give 0 ****s about that infinite until there is high level tournament evidence of it making a difference.

AKA we need a japanese Dedede

Basically, I have yet to see any High level D3 even use the Infinite on Anyone in tournament. So can't really say that cause of one thing that's never been used that the MU is -2.

 

[Yink]

The infinite doesn't matter at all until it becomes a common occurance, and a consistently proven one at that. People will give 0 ****s about that infinite until there is high level tournament evidence of it making a difference.

This sounds really familiar...

 

[Player-1]

What lock are we talking about? I can guarantee you that banana locking across the stage works on every character...

 

[Alphicans]

He definitely does not mean that lock, because he's making it sound like it only works on characters with poor rolls.

 

[Player-1]

oh yeah, i just went back and read it. Yeah jebus is dumb, that doesn't work....but GaW does have the worst "get hit with a banana" animation in the game. It's tied with Jiggz, at least according to the frame data I have.

 

[san.]

D3 has more to Ike than chaingrabs and getting gimped like D3 has good options to punish Ike's side B (Which is like the only fast thing going for him)

Got to here before I stopped taking you seriously.

 

[C.J.]

*Sees new post in Brawl Metagame subforum and cringes*
*Sees it's from San and clicks thinking something well thought out and insightful to make people shut up*
*One liner*

 

[PZ]

I am sorry but this thread stopped making any sense anymore btw jebus that cv is probably my favorite diddy kong CV.

Wish I could see a shield break from some characters cuz alot can really abuse it at any percent to the extent of a 0-death.

 

[Judo777]

I did, lol. u-smash is like, 65% and D-smash is about 75ish

Uhhhhh bull****. Were you DIing with her at all? Tipper Usmash doesn't even kill jiggs that early.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I tested this and Ness slides too far for D3 to regrab him unlike Lucas.

I tested this as well, and Ness can be regrabbed.

Trust me. lol

Also as far as I know, Yoshi cannot be infinited by Dedede, unless its against a wall or by that near impossible to do pivot grab thing.

1. Yoshi slides too far away
2. buffered spot dodge says helllllooooooooooooo.

Man imma go ask Aerodrome to see if dash dance pivot grab infinites actually exist.

I mean Doc King, no offense intended but no one will really believe you about them if you have no videos of them or no analysis of the frame data, especially for one with your reputation around these boards.

No worries, I can do this for you, as long as you tell me how it's supposed to be inputted.

Talk to me on MSN later tonight imo.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Uhhhhh bull****. Were you DIing with her at all? Tipper Usmash doesn't even kill jiggs that early.

It was charged and fresh. She died pretty much before she could begin momentum canceling.

To be fair, I didn't DI, but perfect DI would probably only add an extra 10% at the most.

 

[Judo777]

It was charged and fresh. She died pretty much before she could begin momentum canceling.

To be fair, I didn't DI, but perfect DI would probably only add an extra 10% at the most.

um no holding the opposite direction of your hit adds about 10% good Di adds about 20 to 30% (maybe more).

No DI ivysaur dies to Eruption at 4% (max power) you can't convince me he can't survive at 14%

Also 100% was an exaggeration but its closer to about 85%

 

[Conviction]

WTF IS GOING ON HERE?

Nothing is making sense in here. I was just joking before when I used to say but damn Jebus and Doc King you got **** so ****ed up in things don't make any damn sense.

 

[Fuujin]

Aero Judo is right, Sheik can't really kill Jigglypuff that early.

Back when I used to use Sheik I always thought it was like -1 for Jigglypuff.
Sheik thrives on combos and a lot of her stuff stops working on Jigglypuff at like 50, needles aren't very effective since she's always in the air, and Sheik can't even kill her early unless you get a tipped up smash.
Jigglypuff can also gimp Sheik pretty decently.

These things also make the think the Samus Mu is only like +1 for Sheik.

Shieks combos just don't work too well on floaty characters.

Edit: Iblis gettin trolled

 

[Conviction]

I guess so, I'm slowly losing IQ points from this ish.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

um no holding the opposite direction of your hit adds about 10% good Di adds about 20 to 30% (maybe more).

No DI ivysaur dies to Eruption at 4% (max power) you can't convince me he can't survive at 14%

Also 100% was an exaggeration but its closer to about 85%

Yeah 85% is about right imo, but if Jigglypuff misses Rest, you can push her closer to the edge of the stage (for just under two seconds) and do a fully charged up-smash. Assuming perfect DI I'd assume (haven't done testing, but I can if you REALLY want me too) she'd die at about 65-70%.

Aero Judo is right, Sheik can't really kill Jigglypuff that early.

Back when I used to use Sheik I always thought it was like -1 for Jigglypuff.
Sheik thrives on combos and a lot of her stuff stops working on Jigglypuff at like 50, needles aren't very effective since she's always in the air, and Sheik can't even kill her early unless you get a tipped up smash.

lawl we were talking about punishing a failed Rest, not Sheik's in general killing power (which is very low, yeah).

 

[Delta-cod]

This sounds really familiar...

I'm not sure exaaaaaaaaaaactly what this is referencing. @_@

 

[Shaya]

Jigglypuff beats Sheik, imo.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

D3 is too good at wombo comboing puff with d throw to Donkey Punch, DK D smash, Yoshi's up smash, Falco's lazer lock, etc.

D3's down throw does not combo into anything against Jiggs unless she is a ******.

Jigglypuff beats Sheik, imo.

Either this or its even. Sheik really has nothing to threaten Puff with, the match-up is like a watered down version of the Melee one.

 

[da K.I.D.]

since yink only talks about ness and lucas, id assume her comment has something to do with a matchup that ness has that involves some random GR stuff.

 

[Kuro~]

YO FORGET THIS! I'm gonna test that crap with mink next time i go to his apartment. And i will friggin be bk.

 

[Judo777]

D3's down throw does not combo into anything against Jiggs unless she is a ******.



Either this or its even. Sheik really has nothing to threaten Puff with, the match-up is like a watered down version of the Melee one.

It's even. It's kinda like the MK and Kirby MU, but instead of us never being allowed to swing our moves actually win, but she has more mobility (which is WAAAAYYYYY less of a problem than our moves getting beat all day).

 

[Juushichi]

Puff vs Sheik is dumb. Ugh. I hate that MU so much.

I'll just play Kirby and uptilt and do stupid easy stuff.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Yeah, even sounds good to me as well Judo.

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

D3 is too good at wombo comboing puff with d throw to Donkey Punch, DK D smash, Yoshi's up smash, Falco's lazer lock, etc..

Ayo

I heard you thought falco could laser lock puff

Sheik puff is even btw.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

D3's down throw does not combo into anything against Jiggs unless she is a ******.

This. I even has frame data to prove it.

[collapse=Jigglypuff frame advantage vs Dedede dthrow]1: +0
2: +0
3: +0
4: +0
5: +0
6: -1
7: -1
8: -1
9: -1[/collapse]

 

[-LzR-]

Aero, I don't think Doc King understands that data you just showed.

EDIT: NOOOO WHY DID MY PREMIUM END T_T

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

^ Mine ended too.

But i manned up and bought it for 6 months.


Papa Mink is here.

 

[Doc King]

Man imma go ask Aerodrome to see if dash dance pivot grab infinites actually exist.

I mean Doc King, no offense intended but no one will really believe you about them if you have no videos of them or no analysis of the frame data, especially for one with your reputation around these boards.

That's true, especially for these kind of people. XD

I actually have Brawl replays of me doing this technique, so I could probably give them to you so you guys can finally understand something that should've been understood a year ago.

Got to here before I stopped taking you seriously.

It's true that D3 has more to Ike than just chaingrabs and edge guarding.

I tested this as well, and Ness can be regrabbed.

Trust me. lol

Also as far as I know, Yoshi cannot be infinited by Dedede, unless its against a wall or by that near impossible to do pivot grab thing.

1. Yoshi slides too far away
2. buffered spot dodge says helllllooooooooooooo.

No worries, I can do this for you, as long as you tell me how it's supposed to be inputted.

Talk to me on MSN later tonight imo.

Cool to know Ness can get regrabbed.

You just dash forward and back in a dash dancing to a pivot grab right after you d throw. It takes some timing, but it can get mastered if correctly timed.

WTF IS GOING ON HERE?

Nothing is making sense in here. I was just joking before when I used to say but damn Jebus and Doc King you got **** so ****ed up in things don't make any damn sense.

You don't make any sense. Get outta here.

D3's down throw does not combo into anything against Jiggs unless she is a ******.



Either this or its even. Sheik really has nothing to threaten Puff with, the match-up is like a watered down version of the Melee one.

Team combos, Smashville platform combo, upward slope tech chases, and ice chaingrab.

This. I even has frame data to prove it.

[collapse=Jigglypuff frame advantage vs Dedede dthrow]1: +0
2: +0
3: +0
4: +0
5: +0
6: -1
7: -1
8: -1
9: -1[/collapse]

Team combos, Smashville platform combo, upward slope tech chases, and ice chaingrab.

Aero, I don't think Doc King understands that data you just showed.

EDIT: NOOOO WHY DID MY PREMIUM END T_T

I know what's he's talking about, let me explain this to you guys in detail.

When D3 d throws puff, Puff can't DI. However, Puff is just able to air dodge before landing which kills the ability to combo. However, we can still do some things with it like tech chase without puff being able to air dodge when down thrown on an upward slope. We can do that smashville combo on the platform where we can down throw and we can even get a d tilt for a finisher. We can do the d throws on the ice in ps2.

The main awesomeness of this is that we can get strong legit team combos and traps on Puff that can make her die extremely early. D3 really is a threat to puff now imo because of this. You can even do this d throw to a footstool jump with falco to a d3 jab to a falco lazer lock for a legit, untechable combo. D3 can then finish Puff with a f smash or something.

You can only air dodge at frame 15 or more, so you get a 14 frame advantage when it comes to team combos. You can even trap her with ground stuff like Brinstar acid, Diddy's bananas, and Snake's d smash.

 

[da K.I.D.]

you do realise that ddd cant combo puff out of down throw solo AT ALL right?

like, its frame neutral after the down throw and it takes 7(?) frames to grab which means puff has 7 frames to act and not get grabbed. down tilt is what? 8 frames? same thing, there is NOTHING guaranteed on a move that is frame neutral.

 

[-LzR-]

Doc King, everyone ***** 2v1 in teams.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I swear, I'm switching mains just because of not wanting to be associated with Doc King.

 

[hichez50]

Embrace your association.

 

[Doc King]

you do realise that ddd cant combo puff out of down throw solo AT ALL right?

like, its frame neutral after the down throw and it takes 7(?) frames to grab which means puff has 7 frames to act and not get grabbed. down tilt is what? 8 frames? same thing, there is NOTHING guaranteed on a move that is frame neutral.

I'm confused of what you are trying to say. I saw in a metagame minute vid that it takes 15 frames to air dodge hitstun while you are in the air. Also, different moves come out in different frames. If Puff can't air dodge on slopes, then she can't do anything else. Same thing for the other stuff. Puff can only air dodge on flat stages.

I swear, I'm switching mains just because of not wanting to be associated with Doc King.

Then I'm switching my main to

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I could imagine that.

You'd be arguing Ike beats MK, wouldn't you?

 

[Ussi]

I remember when someone said Ike's range let him compete against MK

 

[Doc King]

I could imagine that.

You'd be arguing Ike beats MK, wouldn't you?

Nope.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I remember when someone said Ike's range let him compete against MK

That sounds pretty accurate in my book. Ike can compete against MK because of his range - if it weren't for his range he wouldn't be able to.