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Official BBR Matchup Chart v1.0

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Marc

Relic of the Past
BRoomer
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Sep 14, 2002
Messages
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As you may or may not know, the BBR has been working on a matchup chart for Super Smash Bros. Brawl in the past months. The primary reason for doing this is that this type of chart is a huge staple of fighting communities, several of which even base their tier list on matchup charts entirely. While it is a little too ambitious to have it replace the tier list completely with this first endeavour, we hope it can become a staple for the smash scene as well, as it provokes discussion and critical reflection on individual matchups.

The various character boards have more or less tackled their respective characters’ matchups before, but sadly, many of them do not have their act together (anymore). We treated them as a resource for the characters with active and not completely outdated boards, but we hope this can inspire more activity in and cooperation among the individual character boards. One of the major reasons why we tackled this project with primarily the BBR is that a unified approach to the entire cast doesn’t seem very feasible any other way. We did contact many top level players and character experts over the course of the project, whom you will find credited in the second post.

As you look at the matchup chart, you will find the system we used isn’t the ratio system that seems common these days. The most important reason is that it has no clear underlying structure and most people use it as 21-tier scale with 5-point increments. While there is a rough consensus as to what specific ratios mean, can you really defend (for example) that a matchup is 90:10 and not 85:15? A large part of the scale simply is close to meaningless and it lacks elegance as well as being too specific. For these reasons, we ended up going with the scale below. While 7 or 11 tiers were (probably) viable alternatives, we went with 9 and believe it to cover all major options. It will take some effort to do away with ratio thinking, but we believe this system to be less confusing in the long run.

-4: (close to) unwinnable
-3: large disadvantage/hard countered
-2: medium disadvantage
-1: small disadvantage
0: even
+1: small advantage
+2: medium advantage
+3: large advantage/hard counter
+4: (close to) unloseable
As for assumptions made, the ratings apply to the entire set. We assumed the stage list as put forward by the BBRC, as well as a LGL. Originally we intended to have multiple ratings for matchups with exploits which sometimes get banned, but, with MLG out of the picture and considering the BBR never condoned those rules in the first place, ended up dropping those.

The Matchup Chart



[collapse=Individual Character Spreads]
:metaknight:
0: :diddy: :falco: :pikachu2:
1: :snake: :wario: :marth: :popo: :olimar: :zerosuitsamus: :fox: :wolf:
2: :dedede: :gw: :lucario: :toonlink: :kirby2: :pit: :peach: :dk2: :sheilda: :sonic: :sheik: :ness2: :yoshi2: :lucas: :mario2:
3: :rob: :luigi2: :ike: :pt: :bowser2: :falcon: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2:
4: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:snake:
-1: :metaknight: :marth: :olimar: :pikachu2: :dedede:
0: :falco: :wario: :fox:
1: :diddy: :popo: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :rob: :pit: :dk2: :wolf: :sheilda: :sonic: :ike: :sheik: :yoshi2:
2: :gw: :lucario: :kirby2: :peach: :luigi2: :ness2: :pt: :mario2: :bowser2: :falcon: :samus2: :link2:
3: :lucas: :jigglypuff: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:diddy:
-1: :snake: :wario: :peach: :luigi2:
0: :metaknight: :falco: :olimar: :toonlink: :kirby2: :rob: :pit: :mario2:
1: :marth: :popo: :pikachu2: :dedede: :gw: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :fox: :wolf: :sheilda: :ike: :sheik: :ness2: :pt:
2: :dk2: :sonic: :yoshi2: :lucas: :falcon: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
3: :bowser2: :ganondorf:


:falco:
-3: :pikachu2:
-2: :popo:
0: :metaknight: :snake: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :gw: :lucario: :kirby2: :fox: :pit: :sheilda: :sheik:
1: :toonlink: :peach: :wolf: :lucas:
2: :olimar: :dedede: :zerosuitsamus: :rob: :dk2: :luigi2: :sonic: :ike: :ness2: :pt: :yoshi2: :mario2: :bowser2:
3: :falcon: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :zelda:
4: :link2: :ganondorf:


:wario:
-2: :marth: :peach:
-1: :metaknight: :dedede:
0: :snake: :falco: :popo: :olimar: :gw:
1: :diddy: :pikachu2: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :kirby2: :fox: :rob: :luigi2: :sheilda: :sonic: :ike: :sheik: :ness2: :yoshi2: :falcon:
2: :pit: :dk2: :pt: :lucas: :mario2: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda: :ganondorf:
3: :wolf: :bowser2:


:marth:
-1: :metaknight: :diddy: :dedede:
0: :falco: :popo: :toonlink: :rob: :dk2: :wolf:
1: :snake: :olimar: :pikachu2: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :kirby2: :fox: :pit: :peach: :sheilda: :sonic: :ike: :sheik:
2: :wario: :gw: :luigi2: :yoshi2: :bowser2: :falcon: :samus2: :link2:
3: :ness2: :pt: :lucas: :mario2: :jigglypuff: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:popo:
-1: :metaknight: :snake: :diddy: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :peach: :yoshi2:
0: :wario: :marth: :pikachu2: :lucario: :rob:
1: :olimar: :pit: :wolf: :sonic: :ike: :lucas:
2: :falco: :gw: :dk2: :luigi2: :sheilda: :ness2: :pt: :mario2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
3: :dedede: :kirby2: :fox: :sheik: :falcon: :samus2:
4: :bowser2: :ganondorf:


:olimar:
-2: :falco:
-1: :metaknight: :marth: :popo: :peach: :luigi2: :wolf:
0: :diddy: :wario: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :pit: :ness2: :yoshi2: :mario2:
1: :snake: :toonlink: :fox: :sheilda: :ike: :sheik: :pt:
2: :pikachu2: :dedede: :gw: :kirby2: :rob: :dk2: :sonic: :lucas: :falcon: :link2:
3: :bowser2: :samus2: :jigglypuff:
4: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:pikachu2:
-2: :olimar: :lucario:
-1: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :gw:
0: :metaknight: :popo: :toonlink: :kirby2: :pit: :peach: :ness2:
1: :snake: :zerosuitsamus: :rob: :luigi2: :sheilda: :sonic: :ike: :pt: :yoshi2: :lucas: :mario2:
2: :dedede: :dk2: :bowser2: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
3: :falco: :fox: :wolf: :sheik: :ganondorf:
4: :falcon:


:dedede:
-3: :popo:
-2: :metaknight: :falco: :olimar: :pikachu2: :zerosuitsamus:
-1: :diddy: :fox: :pit: :sheilda:
0: :gw: :toonlink: :kirby2: :peach: :sheik:
1: :snake: :wario: :marth: :sonic: :yoshi2: :zelda:
2: :lucario: :wolf: :ike: :lucas: :falcon:
3: :rob: :luigi2: :ness2: :pt: :mario2: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :ganondorf:
4: :dk2: :bowser2:


:gw:
-2: :metaknight: :snake: :marth: :popo: :olimar:
-1: :diddy: :toonlink:
0: :falco: :wario: :dedede: :zerosuitsamus: :fox: :dk2:
1: :pikachu2: :lucario: :rob: :pit: :peach: :luigi2: :wolf: :sonic: :ike: :pt: :yoshi2: :link2:
2: :kirby2: :sheilda: :sheik: :ness2: :lucas: :bowser2: :samus2:
3: :mario2: :falcon: :jigglypuff: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:lucario:
-2: :metaknight: :snake: :dedede:
-1: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :gw: :fox:
0: :falco: :popo: :olimar: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :pit: :dk2: :wolf:
1: :kirby2: :rob: :peach: :luigi2: :ike: :ness2: :lucas: :mario2:
2: :pikachu2: :sheilda: :sheik: :pt: :bowser2: :falcon: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
3: :sonic: :yoshi2: :ganondorf:


:zerosuitsamus:
-2: :falco:
-1: :metaknight: :snake: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :pikachu2:
0: :olimar: :gw: :lucario: :fox: :pit: :peach: :wolf: :sheilda: :sonic: :sheik:
1: :popo: :toonlink: :kirby2: :ike: :ness2: :pt: :yoshi2: :lucas: :mario2: :samus2:
2: :dedede: :rob: :dk2: :luigi2: :bowser2: :falcon: :link2:
3: :jigglypuff: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:toonlink:
-2: :metaknight:
-1: :snake: :falco: :wario: :olimar: :zerosuitsamus:
0: :diddy: :marth: :pikachu2: :dedede: :lucario: :fox: :pit: :dk2: :wolf: :sheilda: :sheik:
1: :popo: :gw: :kirby2: :rob: :peach: :luigi2: :sonic: :ike: :mario2:
2: :ness2: :pt: :yoshi2: :lucas: :bowser2: :falcon: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
3: :ganondorf:


:kirby2:
-3: :popo:
-2: :metaknight: :snake: :olimar: :gw:
-1: :wario: :marth: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink:
0: :diddy: :falco: :pikachu2: :dedede: :rob: :pit: :peach: :dk2: :wolf: :sonic: :ike:
1: :fox: :luigi2: :ness2: :pt: :yoshi2: :mario2:
2: :sheilda: :lucas: :bowser2: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda: :ganondorf:
3: :sheik: :falcon:


:fox:
-3: :popo: :pikachu2: :sheilda: :sheik:
-1: :metaknight: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :olimar: :kirby2: :pit:
0: :snake: :falco: :gw: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :peach: :wolf: :ness2:
1: :dedede: :lucario: :dk2: :luigi2: :sonic: :ike: :lucas: :mario2: :falcon: :samus2:
2: :rob: :pt: :yoshi2: :bowser2: :jigglypuff: :zelda:
3: :link2: :ganondorf:


:rob:
-3: :metaknight: :dedede:
-2: :falco: :olimar: :zerosuitsamus: :fox:
-1: :snake: :wario: :pikachu2: :gw: :lucario: :toonlink: :pit:
0: :diddy: :marth: :popo: :kirby2: :peach: :dk2: :sheilda:
1: :luigi2: :wolf: :ike: :sheik: :ness2: :yoshi2: :lucas: :mario2: :bowser2: :samus2: :link2: :zelda:
2: :sonic: :pt: :falcon: :jigglypuff: :ganondorf:


:pit:
-2: :metaknight: :wario:
-1: :snake: :marth: :popo: :gw:
0: :diddy: :falco: :olimar: :pikachu2: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :kirby2: :peach: :sonic:
1: :dedede: :fox: :rob: :wolf: :sheilda: :ike: :sheik: :ness2: :pt: :yoshi2: :mario2:
2: :dk2: :luigi2: :lucas: :falcon: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
3: :bowser2: :ganondorf:


:peach:
-2: :metaknight: :snake:
-1: :falco: :marth: :gw: :lucario: :toonlink:
0: :pikachu2: :dedede: :zerosuitsamus: :kirby2: :fox: :rob: :pit: :dk2: :wolf: :ike: :pt:
1: :diddy: :popo: :olimar: :luigi2: :sheilda: :sonic: :sheik: :yoshi2: :samus2:
2: :wario: :ness2: :lucas: :mario2: :bowser2: :jigglypuff: :zelda:
3: :falcon: :link2: :ganondorf:


:dk2:
-4: :dedede:
-2: :metaknight: :diddy: :falco: :wario: :popo: :olimar: :pikachu2: :zerosuitsamus: :pit:
-1: :snake: :fox: :sonic:
0: :marth: :gw: :lucario: :toonlink: :kirby2: :rob: :peach: :wolf: :sheilda: :ike: :sheik: :pt: :yoshi2:
1: :luigi2: :mario2: :falcon: :samus2:
2: :ness2: :bowser2: :link2: :zelda: :ganondorf:
3: :jigglypuff:
4: :lucas:


:luigi2:
-3: :metaknight: :dedede:
-2: :snake: :falco: :marth: :popo: :zerosuitsamus: :pit: :pt:
-1: :wario: :pikachu2: :gw: :lucario: :toonlink: :kirby2: :fox: :rob: :peach: :dk2: :wolf: :ike: :lucas:
0: :sonic: :ness2: :yoshi2: :mario2: :samus2:
1: :diddy: :olimar: :sheilda: :sheik: :jigglypuff:
2: :bowser2: :falcon: :link2: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:wolf:
-3: :wario: :pikachu2:
-2: :dedede:
-1: :metaknight: :snake: :diddy: :falco: :popo: :gw: :rob: :pit: :sheilda: :sheik:
0: :marth: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :kirby2: :fox: :peach: :dk2:
1: :olimar: :luigi2: :sonic: :ike: :ness2: :lucas: :bowser2:
2: :pt: :yoshi2: :mario2: :falcon: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2:
3: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:sheilda:
-2: :metaknight: :popo: :gw: :lucario: :kirby2:
-1: :snake: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :olimar: :pikachu2: :pit: :peach: :luigi2:
0: :falco: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :rob: :dk2: :sonic: :sheik:
1: :dedede: :wolf: :ike: :pt: :yoshi2: :mario2: :bowser2: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
2: :ness2: :falcon:
3: :fox: :lucas:
4: :ganondorf:


:sonic:
-3: :lucario:
-2: :metaknight: :diddy: :falco: :olimar: :rob:
-1: :snake: :wario: :marth: :popo: :pikachu2: :dedede: :gw: :toonlink: :fox: :peach: :wolf: :yoshi2:
0: :zerosuitsamus: :kirby2: :pit: :luigi2: :sheilda: :ike: :sheik: :pt: :lucas: :mario2:
1: :dk2: :ness2: :bowser2: :falcon: :jigglypuff:
2: :samus2: :link2: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:ike:
-3: :metaknight:
-2: :falco: :dedede:
-1: :snake: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :popo: :olimar: :pikachu2: :gw: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :fox: :rob: :pit: :wolf: :sheilda: :sheik: :samus2:
0: :kirby2: :peach: :dk2: :sonic: :mario2: :bowser2: :jigglypuff:
1: :luigi2: :ness2: :pt: :yoshi2: :lucas: :falcon: :zelda:
2: :link2: :ganondorf:


:sheik:
-3: :popo: :pikachu2: :kirby2:
-2: :metaknight: :gw: :lucario:
-1: :snake: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :olimar: :rob: :pit: :peach: :luigi2:
0: :falco: :dedede: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :dk2: :sheilda: :sonic:
1: :wolf: :ike: :pt: :yoshi2: :mario2: :bowser2: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
2: :ness2: :falcon:
3: :fox: :lucas:
4: :ganondorf:


:ness2:
-3: :marth: :dedede:
-2: :metaknight: :snake: :falco: :popo: :gw: :toonlink: :peach: :dk2: :sheilda: :sheik: :pt:
-1: :diddy: :wario: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :kirby2: :rob: :pit: :wolf: :sonic: :ike: :mario2:
0: :olimar: :pikachu2: :fox: :luigi2: :yoshi2: :falcon:
1: :lucas: :bowser2: :samus2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :zelda:
2: :ganondorf:


:pt:
-3: :metaknight: :marth: :dedede:
-2: :snake: :falco: :wario: :popo: :lucario: :toonlink: :fox: :rob: :wolf: :yoshi2:
-1: :diddy: :olimar: :pikachu2: :gw: :zerosuitsamus: :kirby2: :pit: :sheilda: :ike: :sheik:
0: :peach: :dk2: :sonic:
1: :bowser2: :samus2: :link2:
2: :luigi2: :ness2: :lucas: :mario2: :falcon: :jigglypuff: :zelda:
3: :ganondorf:


:yoshi2:
-3: :lucario:
-2: :metaknight: :diddy: :falco: :marth: :toonlink: :fox: :wolf:
-1: :snake: :wario: :pikachu2: :dedede: :gw: :zerosuitsamus: :kirby2: :rob: :pit: :peach: :sheilda: :ike: :sheik:
0: :olimar: :dk2: :luigi2: :ness2: :mario2: :samus2:
1: :popo: :sonic: :lucas: :falcon: :zelda:
2: :pt: :jigglypuff: :link2:
3: :bowser2: :ganondorf:


:lucas:
-4: :dk2:
-3: :snake: :marth: :sheilda: :sheik:
-2: :metaknight: :diddy: :wario: :olimar: :dedede: :gw: :toonlink: :kirby2: :pit: :peach: :pt:
-1: :falco: :popo: :pikachu2: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :fox: :rob: :wolf: :ike: :ness2: :yoshi2: :bowser2:
0: :sonic: :mario2: :samus2:
1: :luigi2: :falcon: :zelda:
2: :jigglypuff: :link2: :ganondorf:


:mario2:
-3: :marth: :dedede: :gw:
-2: :metaknight: :snake: :falco: :wario: :popo: :peach: :wolf: :pt:
-1: :pikachu2: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :kirby2: :fox: :rob: :pit: :dk2: :sheilda: :sheik:
0: :diddy: :olimar: :luigi2: :sonic: :ike: :yoshi2: :lucas: :bowser2: :samus2: :jigglypuff:
1: :ness2: :falcon: :link2: :zelda:
2: :ganondorf:


:bowser2:
-4: :popo: :dedede:
-3: :metaknight: :diddy: :wario: :olimar: :pit: :yoshi2: :samus2:
-2: :snake: :falco: :marth: :pikachu2: :gw: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :kirby2: :fox: :peach: :dk2: :luigi2:
-1: :rob: :wolf: :sheilda: :sonic: :sheik: :ness2: :pt: :zelda:
0: :ike: :mario2: :falcon: :link2:
1: :lucas: :ganondorf:
2: :jigglypuff:


:falcon:
-4: :pikachu2:
-3: :metaknight: :falco: :popo: :gw: :kirby2: :peach:
-2: :snake: :diddy: :marth: :olimar: :dedede: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :rob: :pit: :luigi2: :wolf: :sheilda: :sheik: :pt:
-1: :wario: :fox: :dk2: :sonic: :ike: :yoshi2: :lucas: :mario2: :jigglypuff:
0: :ness2: :bowser2: :samus2: :link2:
1: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:samus2:
-3: :metaknight: :falco: :popo: :olimar: :dedede:
-2: :snake: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :pikachu2: :gw: :lucario: :toonlink: :kirby2: :pit: :wolf: :sonic:
-1: :zerosuitsamus: :fox: :rob: :peach: :dk2: :sheilda: :sheik: :ness2: :pt:
0: :luigi2: :yoshi2: :lucas: :mario2: :falcon: :jigglypuff:
1: :ike: :link2:
2: :zelda:
3: :bowser2: :ganondorf:


:jigglypuff:
-3: :metaknight: :snake: :falco: :marth: :olimar: :dedede: :gw: :zerosuitsamus: :dk2:
-2: :diddy: :wario: :popo: :pikachu2: :lucario: :toonlink: :kirby2: :fox: :rob: :pit: :peach: :wolf: :pt: :yoshi2: :lucas: :bowser2:
-1: :luigi2: :sheilda: :sonic: :sheik: :ness2:
0: :ike: :mario2: :samus2: :zelda:
1: :falcon: :link2:
2: :ganondorf:


:link2:
-4: :falco:
-3: :metaknight: :dedede: :fox: :peach:
-2: :snake: :diddy: :wario: :marth: :popo: :olimar: :pikachu2: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :kirby2: :pit: :dk2: :luigi2: :wolf: :sonic: :ike: :yoshi2: :lucas:
-1: :gw: :rob: :sheilda: :sheik: :ness2: :pt: :mario2: :samus2: :jigglypuff:
0: :bowser2: :falcon:
1: :zelda: :ganondorf:


:zelda:
-4: :metaknight: :olimar:
-3: :snake: :falco: :marth: :gw: :zerosuitsamus: :wolf:
-2: :diddy: :wario: :popo: :pikachu2: :lucario: :toonlink: :kirby2: :fox: :pit: :peach: :dk2: :luigi2: :sonic: :pt: :samus2:
-1: :dedede: :rob: :sheilda: :ike: :sheik: :ness2: :yoshi2: :lucas: :mario2: :falcon: :link2:
0: :jigglypuff:
1: :bowser2:
2: :ganondorf:


:ganondorf:
-4: :metaknight: :falco: :popo: :olimar: :sheilda: :sheik:
-3: :snake: :diddy: :marth: :pikachu2: :dedede: :gw: :lucario: :zerosuitsamus: :toonlink: :fox: :pit: :peach: :wolf: :pt: :yoshi2: :samus2:
-2: :wario: :kirby2: :rob: :dk2: :luigi2: :sonic: :ike: :ness2: :lucas: :mario2: :jigglypuff: :zelda:
-1: :bowser2: :falcon: :link2:
[/collapse]
 

Marc

Relic of the Past
BRoomer
Joined
Sep 14, 2002
Messages
16,323
Location
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This second post will be a work in progress, as it leaves room for frequently asked questions and possible writeups. If you have any further suggestions for what you want to see in here, don’t be afraid to make them. We still have all the data and discussion available to us.

Frequently Asked Questions

I don’t agree with the score you guys gave to Chun-Li vs Birdo!!!!11111111 :mad:
Okay, now tell us why. While it is hard to have a dialogue between a group of people on one hand and a mass of people on the other hand, reactions are definitely being read and kept track of. This is a first attempt at doing this and it is obviously not going to be perfect for roughly 700 matchups right away, not to mention that this type of chart will likely never completely satisfy everyone. Virtually every matchup had both sides of the coin represented and there were many compromises, which is inevitable. If enough people have qualms with a specific score and aren’t satisfied by responses put forward by individual BBR members (please have some patience here), we can definitely reconsider in future updates. Some of the most legitimate concerns I’ve heard so far have to do with relative difficulty of matchups (“there’s no way character X is -3 if character Y is only -2”) and that’s an area where with some spreads could be improved upon. It’s hard to have a central top-down overview of the entire chart though and for some characters more responsibility was taken in this department than for others. Character boards taking a crack at the entire picture for their respective characters would definitely be helpful in this aspect, as long as they can respect that there is another side to every matchup.

What is this Sheilda character supposed to be interpreted like!? Sounds like a terrorist name to me!
Sheilda represents the optimal usage of the combination of Zelda and Sheik. In many matchups this will come down to using one of them (usually Sheik) for most or even all of the time. Sheilda’s scores are, by definition, always the best score between Zelda and Sheik individually. In some cases the combination does better than either character individually and ends up with a better matchup.

Who was on the Professor Layton panel!? I’ll have his head! :mad:
Some panel leaders might decide otherwise, but we typically don’t single people out for their opinions or individual contributions. The BBR member list is public and the outside resources who gave us a response are listed in the second post of this thread. That should really give you enough of an idea. Some characters had more representation than others, but that is a given since that is the case in the actual population as well as tournament data and we tried to reach out to high level mains for all characters. I did a lot of this contacting myself and several people just flat out didn’t respond. As a result, the spreads for Mario and Link are for a large part bolstered by the opposing panels while Luigi’s spread was entirely statistically derived. So far I’ve not seen (m)any complaints about Luigi, but Mario and Link could have turned out somewhat wonky because of this. Not something we can do much about internally, not to mention we had to release at some point.

I wish I had more insight in the discussion that took place!
Several panel leaders are addressing matchups in this topic and I’m hoping they will keep this up for a while as it’s the most direct way of communication. I originally wanted to give you guys more to read alongside this, but doing that as well as building the chart itself from scratch was too daunting a task and we couldn’t afford to spend forever on this. On the bright side the numbers by themselves should provide a strong basis for discussion and letting this flow rather than lay it all out like it’s the law with airtight writeups for 700 matchups doesn’t seem so bad. But yeah, the closer we get to getting it right, the more effort we can spend on summarizing discussion. If anything, future updates should be better in this department. Note though that other fighting game scenes don’t typically have writeups accompanying their charts either and Brawl has a lot of characters.

The BBR doesn’t condone a LGL but took one into consideration here... do I smell a contradiction? :troll:
Not really. We have never officially condoned one, but with the creation of the BBRC are out of that business altogether when it comes to making recommendations. The matchup chart is supposed to be applicable to real life situations, so taking rules most tournaments run with as a basis seems like the best way to avoid losing ourselves in theorycraft. It’s always a tough call to make because variation in rulesets is very hard to factor in when you’re primarily looking at characters. From here on out expect us to follow the BBRC ruleset, so consistency will definitely improve.

I want more data manipulation! :3
All the data and files are right here. Knock yourself out.

Additional statistics

In the link below you will find the game’s characters ordered based on their average matchup score, as well as additional statistics on their number of advantageous, disadvantaged and even matchups. One thing to keep in mind here is that this list doesn’t take into account the fact that characters aren’t evenly distributed in the tournament environment, nor does it add weight to more “important” matchups.

Click me!

Credits

Here you will see a list of the outside resources the BBR at some point got input from on characters and/or specific matchups, which is much appreciated. :) It was typically the responsibility of whomever approached you to get you on this list, so if for some reason you’re not on it while you should be, don’t hesitate to contact me about it (a PM would be best). Note that we reached out to more people, but several character experts are either very hard to reach or simply didn’t respond, sadly.

Before getting to the list, I want to specifically mention Slhoka for all his work on the data and preparing this final release. Merci beaucoup!

[collapse=Outside Resources]~Pink Fresh~
AC
ADHD
Atomsk
Ayoub
Chaz
da KID Goggles
ENSiS (formerly known as MJG)
FightAdamantEevee
Gnes
Holms
JJwolf
JoWiiCIDE
Kadaj
Kain
Kool-aid
lloDownedu74
Mr. Eric
MVD
NAKAT
san3711
Seagullman
Shaky
Shugo
SK92
Speed
stingers
TheJerm
The Official Lucario Back Room (main contacts: phi1ny3, Red Ryu)
TKD
Triple R
Turtle
UltimateRazer
Ussi
Vermanubis
Willz
Xyro77
Yass
Yink[/collapse]
Grand Finale: The Sethlon Version

From the bowels of the BBR comes an alternative version of the matchup chart, inspired by the legend known as Sethlon. Proceed at your own risk.

The Sethlon Version
 

~ Gheb ~

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Wolf is 0 vs ICs / Pit and +1 / +2 vs GW / ROB.

The rest looks solid.

Wolf / Peach is +1 or +2 for Wolf too.

:059:
 

Flayl

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Why is Bowser -3 vs Pit and Samus? Not that those are the only ones I disgaree with, but those came out of nowhere.
 

Poltergust

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Aw, so that's what the final numbers for Wario and Kirby are, huh? Oh well. =/

 

~ Gheb ~

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Wait, people still think Diddy loses to Peach / Luigi? Both are solidly in Diddy's favor.

:059:
 

MythTrainerInfinity

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Why is Marth v. Lucario -1 for us?

We weren't given a final rebuttal why Marth had an advantage over us. I thought G&W vs. us was even as well...

Do you guys give the benefit of the doubt to higher tier characters?
 

Nidtendofreak

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*sees MK vs Falco/Pikachu as 0*

*sees Ike vs ICs as -1*

*bursts out laughing*

I'll get around to explaining it later, but those are some pretty funny joke numbers you got going on there.

Also: why LGL rules in place? Officially, the BBR doesn't support LGLs. Kinda a contradiction to have them in the MU chart now, ain't it?
 

Supreme Dirt

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*sees MK having even MUs*

*leaves*

No, but seriously there are a lot of things wrong with this chart. I might add it's also completely worthless to players except as a deterrent to maining Ganon, which if that's what the goal of this was then bravo, you succeeded.
 

Poltergust

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lso: why LGL rules in place? Officially, the BBR doesn't support LGLs. Kinda a contradiction to have them in the MU chart now, ain't it?
If I remember correctly, it was so that match-up discussions wouldn't degenerate into hitting someone once then planking the whole match while the other character finds some way to deal with it.

That said, I believe most tournaments use a LGL anyways, so incorporating that would make these numbers more relevant, too.


 

Tesh

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This chart is horrible. My dog took one look at it and died. Sonic v ROB = Sonic v Metaknight? Stay away from comedy BBR.
 

Chuee

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Yea, some of these numbers look off :/
Like D3 vs ICs as -3?
I thought most of the top D3s and ICs considered it -2?
 

Lokinario

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MK's matchups are waaaay different than what i expected. Not that this is a necessarily a bad thing, lol. Also, how come Pikachu goes even with him?

Ganon vs Bowser as -1? It looks even to me.

EDIT: Overall, i think you from the BBR made a very nice job. Thanks for the initiative.
 

Seagull Joe

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Wolf is 0 vs ICs / Pit and +1 / +2 vs GW / ROB.

The rest looks solid.

Wolf / Peach is +1 or +2 for Wolf too.

:059:
This^

And D3 should be switched with Pikachu. D3 is -3 and Pika is -2.

Wolf does NOT lose to Rob. He solidly beats him. He is even with Pit and Ics...GaW is even too.
 

SpliziT

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Nice Job overall to the BBR members. Been waiting for this cause I've been questioning some MU's with Fox.
 

Browny

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Reserved for when I get home and can hate on this properly :p

---

Eh nvm, I was under the impression that pit and fox were going to beat everyone from the hints dropped by the bbr around here lol
 

Supreme Dirt

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You see, the thing is we can't actually argue against this. No reasoning is given for anything. If they want to, they can just say "OH WELL YOU'RE NOT TAKING EVERYTHING INTO ACCOUNT."
 

Hylian

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LOL @ people overreacting.

Just because you disagree with one or two match-ups doesn't make the entire list horrible or the people who made it stupid. Jesus, look how many match-ups there are, you think every one of those is going to fit everyones opinion?
 

Sinister Slush

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This chart is horrible. My dog took one look at it and died. Sonic v ROB = Sonic v Metaknight? Stay away from comedy BBR.
It begins already, Amazing...

Yea, some of these numbers look off :/
Like D3 vs ICs as -3?
I thought most of the top D3s and ICs considered it -2?
Keyword Top D3s and ICs, what of the players who aren't high level and just started with D3 a few months back and entered a National and played (Say) Lain?
Overrall This Chart is pretty accurate. Even for Wario Vs Yoshi which most Yoshi mains thought was Even, When it's in Warios favor which I thought was correct.


 

Chuee

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LOL @ people overreacting.

Just because you disagree with one or two match-ups doesn't make the entire list horrible or the people who made it stupid. Jesus, look how many match-ups there are, you think every one of those is going to fit everyones opinion?
No, but some of these MUs look like only 1 persons opinion of the MU.
 

Hylian

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No, but some of these MUs look like only 1 persons opinion of the MU.
And you know this based off..assumptions?

It's like people like to complain more than anything else.
 

~ Gheb ~

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LOL @ people overreacting.

Just because you disagree with one or two match-ups doesn't make the entire list horrible or the people who made it stupid. Jesus, look how many match-ups there are, you think every one of those is going to fit everyones opinion?
No, but some of these MUs look like only 1 persons opinion of the MU.
Agreed @ both posts but some of that stuff really looks hard to believe. Marth's match-ups are nowhere near that good and many of them are easily +1 too much in his favor [wtf @ him being +2 vs Yoshi but 0 vs DK]. Thinking similarly about GW's match-up.

Overall a good job and the advantages / disadvantages seem to be mostly spot on with a couple of exceptions [which is pretty much unavoidable]. It's mainly the numbers that are off here and there.

Edit @Hylian:

He said "look like", not that they actually *are* decided by 1 person.

:059:
 

Steam

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No, but some of these MUs look like only 1 persons opinion of the MU.
because it appears that it was for a lot of characters...

the only group that was credited in the 2nd post was the Lucario back room. everything else was just individual names. and the list wasn't that long...
 

MythTrainerInfinity

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So... is the Lucario Back Room the only active character backroom?

Also, no one has answered my questions yet :p
 

OnlyUseMeNades

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I for the most part, approve. The few MUs I question might just be my lack of knowledge on how some characters work.

Although I do agree with Marth's MUs being a bit up there
 

DMG

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Small changes for Wario:

Dedede at -2

Peach at -1

Change that, and I think Wario's practically taken care of.
 

Chuee

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And you know this based off..assumptions?

It's like people like to complain more than anything else.
Its just from what I saw and from what I've heard about top players concerning certain MUs.
I mean take ICs vs D3. Last time I remember, most D3s and ICs had it as -2 but it's listed as -3.
 

Yink

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*just sees this thread*

Whew, Ness doesn't look as bad as I thought he would. Nice job guys.
 

Slhoka

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LOL @ people overreacting.

Just because you disagree with one or two match-ups doesn't make the entire list horrible or the people who made it stupid. Jesus, look how many match-ups there are, you think every one of those is going to fit everyones opinion?
Well... the BBR is supposed to be so good that for every single one of the 702 matchups, it will have everyone agree with its rating.

Also, Marc thanked quite a few people in the credits, but didn't add himself, obviously. Yet he provided a fantastic amount of work, coordinating all the voting panels and gathering date to make my task easier. I guess a Dank u wel isn't too much ;)
 

san.

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I disagree with a lot, but I'll wait a day or two to see how this topic turns out.

Why isn't MK +2/+3 vs everyone?
 
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