Official MBR Tier List

[Nø Ca$h]

hbox and mango.... whos the next best? darc, right? the gap of mango/hbox and darc is much bigger than the top foxes and falcos. that means its mango and hbox that ****, not puff.

 

[Merkuri]

It's because the games a little stag. There are plenty of fresh low level high tier players and there are only handfuls of dedicated and invested low tier mains who can even considering competing in tournament. The fact remains, at the top level of play, those characters get ****ing *****. You don't see them winning, just their name halfway down the ****ing results!

Kage(Ganon) got 3rd at Rom2. Axe(Pikachu) got 3rd at Nice Shot Hugo, I could name you a bunch of lower mains who have come close to winning national and regional tournaments. They do not win the tournaments themselves but I think like everyone that is simply the fault of them not being good quite good enough to pull it off. They're only a hand full of people winning regional and national tournaments anyways. There characters have disadvantages but their players are not getting ***** because of that, their losing to players who are just slightly better than they are.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

Half way??? how many players were there at pound4? LOL 17th isn't half way. axe I know for a fact has won a AZ tournment and maybe more than just the one I heard of and he mostly goes pikachu it's not like 50% or anything.

also mango vs axe money match WTF. It's not like axe isn't able of winnning a decent sized tournment if he gets any better he should place higher in apex. And we both know players can always get better includeing mango as unreal as it sounds.

Really people shouldn't just think of only the high/top tiers being able to win. mid tiers and like 2 lows tiers can totally place decently and when you compare it to the number of falcons and foxes it's really impressive. However i'm NOT saying bottom tiers are like low tiers in metagame they are still to low in the metagame to place in decent sized tournemnts other than in maybe a future freak case.

 

[Nø Ca$h]

no, theyr kinda losing because of their characters lol

 

[TheManaLord]

You are all absurdly literal and don't really read into the meaning behind anything.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

Why you pick your characters is because that's how you play most of the time. If I play very defenseive and punish thheir approaching and hate being edge gaurded I play as puff. If I use my my size , speed, and mindgames with limited options I may play as pikachu/pichu depending on which feels better.

If I love control I may play as falco/marth. How I play deceics in many ways who I play as.

 

[Merkuri]

no, theyr kinda losing because of their characters lol

Right and did they place that high because of their characters as well? I bet your response will be ''no they placed that high because of their skill'', and if that's the case then when they lose why isn't it because of their lack of skill? Do you see why your argument is one big circle and doesn't make any sense now?

 

[Scidadle]

Thats like saying Ness can win a national tournament.

He can't.

His argument does make sense. Bad characters will lose to people who are good with good characters.

 

[Merkuri]

Thats like saying Ness can win a national tournament.

He can't.

His argument does make sense. Bad characters will lose to people who are good with good characters.

Nah all the characters I mentioned are a lot better than Ness. And have you seen the list of people Kage and Axe have beaten? Mango, Jman, Korean DJ, Azen, Dr Pee Pee. These are all people who have won national or regional tournaments, if they can beat the winners of national and regional tournaments then why can they do it themselves? His argument does not make sense.

 

[Nø Ca$h]

lower tiered chars dont have enough options to fully transfer a players skills into the game.

you cant just compare two ppl saying the winner is all around better... its more complicated than that

 

[JPOBS]

m2k and armada also think jiggs is the best

there's no point in arguing the overwhelming evidence of the past like 3 years, it's a little out of fashion to deny such common observations =/

m2k thinks anyone who beats him on a given day is the best char ever

i wouldnt really call two successful players "overwhelming evidence"

the "people don't know how to fight jigglypuff" excuse is growing older and older...

hbox and mango are still getting top 3 consistently at nationals...

mango uses falco against everyone not named hbox. ...and wins

its not even a matter of people not knowing how to fight jiggs, its a matter of there being LITERALLY TWO top jiggs players. thats IT. as someone else has mentioned, if jiggs is the best character, why is there such a disparity between successive jiggs placings in tourny? whereas the gap is much closer between foxs and falco.

and honestly the fact that mango doesnt even play puff to beat people just goes to show that regardless of which character is actually the best, mango is a statistical outlier because he will beat people regardless of the character he uses, so him winning with puff cud entirely be the case of his skill.

so in essence, hbox is literally the only successful puff player. And before i get the "why does mango switch to puff then blah blah" its because
1. the jiggs ditto is more even than jiggs vs falco as a matchup and
2. mango ***** hbox in puff dittos so why do anything else

 

[EC_Joey]

its a matter of there being LITERALLY TWO top jiggs players. thats IT.

...so in essence, hbox is literally the only successful puff player.

I summon thee Darc, LORD OF DESTRUCTION!

 

[JPOBS]

darc is good dont get me wrong, but i wouldnt cite him as proof as jiggs being the best char in the game.

 

[Laem]

This message contains truth

The above is true.

 

[Stev]

Mango goes puff against Hbox because he has to try significantly harder than Hbox does when he uses any other character

 

[KAOSTAR]

lower tiered chars dont have enough options to fully transfer a players skills into the game.

you cant just compare two ppl saying the winner is all around better... its more complicated than that

Very true. The way I see it: a players current skill lvl is the one he can demonstrate with the character he has chosen.

Alot of low tiers have tools to deal with high tiers but it requires them to play very well and not make mistakes. They have to capitalize on all of the opportunities they are given. They just get ***** because high tiers can punish little mistakes much harder, and because of that have an easier time getting in opportunities for combo and kills.

There is a diff between character skill and player skill. Player skill is things like DI, reads, spacing techskill. Character skill is MU knowledge, moveset knowledge, spacing tech skill, level of comfort.

Better players can often pick a low tier and have a level of success that is not that much lower than dedicated specialist except at very high levels of play. At mid lvls of play, player skill is much more important than knowing a bunch of little things to give you the edge.

obviously this is just my opinion lol

 

[HugS™]

Mango goes puff against Hbox because he has to try significantly harder than Hbox does when he uses any other character

He uses Puff because he thinks Hbox is gay and wants to beat him with his own character and at times, with his own style.

His words, not mine.

 

[Deleted member]

both statements are true cuz i heard mango say both

 

[nicaboy]

My personal list
Fox
Sheik
Marth
Falco
Jigglypuff
Peach
Ice Climbers
Falcon

No one else matters to debate over imo. Basically everyone who i mentioned can win there match ups even if they are at a disadvantage.

Funny looking at pound 4 results alot of sheiks and foxes but when i look at a teir list im looking at the character themselves. Jigs isnt like top 3 just because mango and hungrybox ****.

 

[Archangel]

My personal list
Fox
Sheik
Marth
Falco
Jigglypuff
Peach
Ice Climbers
Falcon

No one else matters to debate over imo. Basically everyone who i mentioned can win there match ups even if they are at a disadvantage.

Funny looking at pound 4 results alot of sheiks and foxes but when i look at a teir list im looking at the character themselves. Jigs isnt like top 3 just because mango and hungrybox ****.

It's only a matter of time before other Jiggs Like Darc, Soft *others start ****** at international tournaments. Once 3 Jiggs place top 3 of top 5 I quit this game. *swears on his first born's life*

As for my personal list. It's the same except I have Jiggs Tied with Fox.

 

[JPOBS]

why is it "only a matter of time"? whats stopping them right now that wont be stopping them in the near future?

 

[TheManaLord]

2 is enough to define the metagame. Even 1 is

there doesn't need to be any more debate or proof. The game is not big enough anymore, we have to work with what we have. With that said it's really easy to see what's going on t top level and most people are just ****s

 

[Merkuri]

lower tiered chars dont have enough options to fully transfer a players skills into the game.

you cant just compare two ppl saying the winner is all around better... its more complicated than that

If lower tiered charact4rs didn't have enough options to transfer the players' skills into the game then we wouldn't be seeing players like Kage, Axe and Hugs placing top 5 in major tournaments. Facts are contradicting your opinion.

And if these lower tier mains can beat top pro high tier mains then it's living proof that lower tiers can compete at the top level. If you were to quit being so stubborn and look at the facts for what they were you'd see the obvious truth.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

It can't be the players who are exceptionally smart and creative... nah the character has got to be doing the work for them.

 

[VA]

Like Jigglypuff being the source of mango and hbox's power, she's obviously the best character, durrhhh

 

[Blistering Speed]

Like Jigglypuff being the source of mango and hbox's power, she's obviously the best character, durrhhh

People who think Jiggs is the best character in the game are stupid. People who think Puff is still below characters like Falcon and Peach are stupider.

Also, I did NOT mean to start this low tier argument. Seriously, low tier characters are bad and tend to get destroyed by all the top tiers and occur less, hence are less important. People like Taj and Axe are just really good despite their bad characters.

 

[VA]

People who think Jiggs is the best character in the game are stupid. People who think Puff is still below characters like Falcon and Peach are stupider.

Also, I did NOT mean to start this low tier argument. Seriously, low tier characters are bad and tend to get destroyed by all the top tiers and occur less, hence are less important. People like Taj and Axe are just really good despite their bad characters.

people who think jigglypuff is the best include m2k, armada and amsah.

 

[john!]

Mango has arguably the best Falco and Fox in the world. But his Puff is better. Hbox can beat everybody but Mango with only Puff, and Mango can only beat him with Puff. Saying that they use the best character in the game isn't discrediting them at all. Their accomplishments stand.

Melee being a balanced game, combined with the high number of options for every character, and the relative lack of experience people have against mid tiers, is why mid tier characters can have moderate success.

Just my two cents (or tuppence for you British chaps).

 

[iamthemicrowave]

LOL John you know that hbox lost to PP's falco in WF and GF at herb 3....

Also mango has beaten hbox with fox(winterfest) and honestly only went fox 1 game against him at p4, I think he could have taken games off him with fox. he just knew the puff ditto would be easier

 

[john!]

Yeah that's true lol. Of course they don't always beat everybody. I still think Fox is the best character. But there's a lot of evidence that she's at least top tier. Some people here think she's below like, Marth and Peach...

Also are you going to be around this summer?

 

[Divinokage]

It's only a matter of time before other Jiggs Like Darc, Soft *others start ****** at international tournaments. Once 3 Jiggs place top 3 of top 5 I quit this game. *swears on his first born's life*

As for my personal list. It's the same except I have Jiggs Tied with Fox.

Ya right, i'm not gonna let that happen.

why is it "only a matter of time"? whats stopping them right now that wont be stopping them in the near future?

I'm stopping them!!

 

[Dark Hart]

shut up, kage

 

[Divinokage]

Only to post to say shut up, nice.

 

[Merkuri]

It can't be the players who are exceptionally smart and creative... nah the character has got to be doing the work for them.

All players at top level are smart and creative. They just happen to be doing it with a different character. What's your evidence for it being all the work of the player and not the character? If you notice when Axe or Ka-Master play they are not simply doing things better than other Pikachu and Luigi mains, their doing things differently as well. Their using more of the character's potential than other low tier mains are; there is no question that the meta-game for the lower tiered characters are far less developed.

 

[Nø Ca$h]

im not really being stuborn merkuri lol. ganon is high tier imo.

axe 2nds falco, btw. but, axe, taj, ect study and practice high tier matchups, and 2nd a higher tier for backup.

edit- not ALL top players are creative. look at hbox and drephen LOL

 

[JPOBS]

Mango has arguably the best Falco and Fox in the world. But his Puff is better. Hbox can beat everybody but Mango with only Puff, and Mango can only beat him with Puff. Saying that they use the best character in the game isn't discrediting them at all. Their accomplishments stand.

Melee being a balanced game, combined with the high number of options for every character, and the relative lack of experience people have against mid tiers, is why mid tier characters can have moderate success.

Just my two cents (or tuppence for you British chaps).

mango has beat hbox with Falcon (freedom to melee) and fox (winterfest)

and to my knowledge, he's never used falco/marth vs hbox so we really cant say otherwise

 

[Blistering Speed]

im not really being stuborn merkuri lol. ganon is high tier imo.

axe 2nds falco, btw. but, axe, taj, ect study and practice high tier matchups, and 2nd a higher tier for backup.

edit- not ALL top players are creative. look at hbox and drephen LOL

If people continue to discredit Hungrybox's skill at all I'm going to start popping them in the mouth.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

edit- not ALL top players are creative. look at hbox and drephen LOL

They win tourneys.

How about you?

Smooth Criminal

 

[Rostigalen]

Winning tournaments =/= Playing creative

Just sayin'. Not taking a stance.

 

[Nø Ca$h]

that was a joke son, hbox is **** creative. sdiing foxes uair>rest is ****.