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Is This What You Call Entertainment And Fair Play?

GuruKid

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 14, 2007
Messages
875
Location
Brooklyn, NY
I laughed sooooo hard at the hilarious "exchange" between Bum and Ryko. You guys argued about... nothing? lol

I possibly can't make any sort of argument that wasn't already stated, so I'll just say this: regular Brawl makes me sleepy.

You make some valid arguments Bum, but as everyone knows, talk is nothing more than talk. Let's get to boosting the Plus popularity here by holding events, intense training sessions and shiz. I'll be looking forward to these summer throwdowns.
 

JFox

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 25, 2005
Messages
5,310
Location
Under a dark swarm
I dont understand. If you guys understand that brawl is a bad game, why are so many of you still so into playin it? Plank, you go around playin this **** just to piss people off? Is that really fun to you? Does a random stranger getting annoyed in a video game tourney really make it worth while for u to travel around to tourneys?

I dont understand. A lot of you guys that are complaining once said "brawl is gonna ruin melee, and i still really love melee" but than u let it ruin melee by joinin the brawl scene and quittin melee. Now you are saying "I hate this game, its cheap and lame/boring, things were never like this in melee."

Why don't u fellas just get back to melee? I'm not talkin to bum, cuz i know you were tired of playin and u like brawl+ or w/e. But a lot of you guys that still enjoy melee and hate brawl still continue to play brawl over melee.

Everyone likes to complain about how brawl takes no skill, but than no one wants to put the necessary time into a real game, so u just keep on playin a dumb frustrating game. If ya hate brawl- quit. If you are playin for the money, stfu and win ur god**** money cuz thats all ur after anyways. dont come on the boards and ***** about a game when we all knew since day one this game could never be competitive.
 

Glick

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Messages
1,186
Location
Brooklyn, NY
Hah. He called you ryko****

GET IT. since you're only one letter off of **** in the second portion of your name?

That's so clever. I might just borrow that. Truly an pivotal moment in ryko name calling.
Shall this day be remembered forever as a monument to this truly inventive nickname.

Sorry I had to go all east European literature on your *****. I just couldn't help myself.

But yeah, I see nothing interesting about this argument. I never did well in vbrawl, even after trying different characters I was still stuck with a full year of practice with a ****ty character and 1-2 months of practice on all the good characters. I guess I'm just stupid. since this game is so easy, apparently. vbrawl just isn't fun anymore. I'm not going to lie. When brawl first came out it felt like playing smash64 again and I loved it because of that. Recently, it's lost its spark so I tried to find it again in brawl+again and it's amazing how great it feels to play a game with hitstun again. As well as a little more speed and some balancing, I can see this game going far.

I'm really sad that I missed out on melee, but I had my fun. I hope there are more brawl+ tournys in NYC because I would definitely attend.

As for this argument? Its just a d!ck slapping contest now, so I have no input.
 

Emblem Lord

The Legendary Lord
Joined
Aug 11, 2005
Messages
9,720
Location
Scotch Plains, NJ
NNID
ShinEmblemLord
3DS FC
3926-6895-0574
Switch FC
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My God.

I...AGREE WITH JFOX?!

WHAT...WHAT HAVE I BECOME?!?!?!?

*Throws myself off a cliff
 

_Yes!_

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 5, 2006
Messages
8,787
Location
WHERE AM I
I dont understand. If you guys understand that brawl is a bad game, why are so many of you still so into playin it? Plank, you go around playin this **** just to piss people off? Is that really fun to you? Does a random stranger getting annoyed in a video game tourney really make it worth while for u to travel around to tourneys?

I dont understand. A lot of you guys that are complaining once said "brawl is gonna ruin melee, and i still really love melee" but than u let it ruin melee by joinin the brawl scene and quittin melee. Now you are saying "I hate this game, its cheap and lame/boring, things were never like this in melee."

Why don't u fellas just get back to melee? I'm not talkin to bum, cuz i know you were tired of playin and u like brawl+ or w/e. But a lot of you guys that still enjoy melee and hate brawl still continue to play brawl over melee. Im talkin bout people like plank, eazy, yes!, etc.

Everyone likes to complain about how brawl takes no skill, but than no one wants to put the necessary time into a real game, so u just keep on playin a dumb frustrating game. If ya hate brawl- quit. If you are playin for the money, stfu and win ur god**** money cuz thats all ur after anyways. dont come on the boards and ***** about a game when we all knew since day one this game could never be competitive.
I don't play brawl anymore. I invited you to my dorm for a melee smashfest I held for you, spam, tec0 and others. None of you showed up besides spam and doyoung. I don't appreciate what you said here.
 

DireVulcan

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 15, 2004
Messages
1,310
Location
Queens, N.Y.
Lmao Ryko...**** Bum put it in your butt real deep.

Point of this entire thread summed up for those just tuning in.

Camping is lame, but necessary in nearly all forms of competition.

Brawl sucks, but it's newer so it draws bigger numbers.

Dire will always have the best GaW this side and that side of the fcking cosmos
 

Plairnkk

Smash Legend
Joined
Jan 18, 2006
Messages
10,243
I dont understand. If you guys understand that brawl is a bad game, why are so many of you still so into playin it? Plank, you go around playin this **** just to piss people off? Is that really fun to you? Does a random stranger getting annoyed in a video game tourney really make it worth while for u to travel around to tourneys?

I dont understand. A lot of you guys that are complaining once said "brawl is gonna ruin melee, and i still really love melee" but than u let it ruin melee by joinin the brawl scene and quittin melee. Now you are saying "I hate this game, its cheap and lame/boring, things were never like this in melee."

Why don't u fellas just get back to melee? I'm not talkin to bum, cuz i know you were tired of playin and u like brawl+ or w/e. But a lot of you guys that still enjoy melee and hate brawl still continue to play brawl over melee. Im talkin bout people like plank, eazy, yes!, etc.

Everyone likes to complain about how brawl takes no skill, but than no one wants to put the necessary time into a real game, so u just keep on playin a dumb frustrating game. If ya hate brawl- quit. If you are playin for the money, stfu and win ur god**** money cuz thats all ur after anyways. dont come on the boards and ***** about a game when we all knew since day one this game could never be competitive.
i went to apex for melee. brawl was all day sunday, and i didnt feel like sitting around all day doing NOTHING.
 

GimR

GimR, Co-Founder of VGBootCamp
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
5,602
Location
Maryland
NNID
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Dire will always have the best GaW this side and that side of the fcking cosmos
lolz


Dire, you will always be the self proclaimed best G&W.


Don't get me wrong you're still awesome.
 

Rykoshet

Smash Champion
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
2,225
Location
No really, I quit.
Lmao Ryko...**** Bum put it in your butt real deep.
You're one of the more obviously literate posters around so I'm working under the assumption that you are capable of reading and that your post was satire or otherwise one big joke. All he did was beat his chest talking about some irrelevant tourney set and say how he was gonna stomp me at a practice session he didn't even go to.
 

Rykoshet

Smash Champion
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
2,225
Location
No really, I quit.
And before you point out that I didn't show either, I wasn't the one making huge *** irrelevant posts about how I was gonna do this that or whatever at an event, I even stated that my showing up was iffy.
 

Tec0+9

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 7, 2008
Messages
122
You're one of the more obviously literate posters around so I'm working under the assumption that you are capable of reading and that your post was satire or otherwise one big joke. All he did was beat his chest talking about some irrelevant tourney set and say how he was gonna stomp me at a practice session he didn't even go to.
Bum definitely Up taunted you.
 

Eazy23

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Messages
1,383
Jfox, I don't even really play SMASH anymore. I honestly never play brawl, melee, brawl+ or anything. If I do it's like once in a blue moon. N if you took my statements as complaints, you should reread. My game of choice is an irrelevant factor in my argument against the flawed logic of the masses.
 

HOTBOX

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 17, 2007
Messages
33
Location
bronx
i had sex faster than lame video.... but them again i was using that L canceling and wave dash. to be real this game is not that fun
 

Lobos

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 7, 2007
Messages
4,548
Location
Columbia, MD
Eazy we need to play more!

LOL at brawl vs brawl+ vs melee.......too much hating going on..like omni said "Just play what you like." You don't really have to bash another game that people do enjoy to play without all the camping and gayness. Brawl + is still technically Brawl....just a mod, like Counter Strike: Source and Counter Strike. People play CS:S but say CS is still better and more balanced etc. Ehhh don't know where I'm going with this anymore.......I'm better than everyone here in Guitar Hero/ Rock band!!!
 

DAlegendarysamus

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 29, 2003
Messages
1,500
Location
newyork
Put Up Or Shut Up

like i told people b4 we all just need to stfu and play the game and the rules for what they are in tournaments since no TO wants to make some fair competitive rules we have tournaments with people doing stupid tactics. I'm done talking about what rules should be in what characters that should be in its like beating a dead horse with the community so "I'm just going to put up or shut up". see everyone on the battlefields. AND EVERYONE ****ING KNOWS IF A LEAGUE PICKS UP BRAWL PEOPLE WILL TAKE THE BULLET NO **** THAT EAT THE BULLET AND PICK UP THE GAME AGAIN JUST TO BE ABLE TO PLAY A GAME THAT THEY CAN POTENTIAL WHEN MONEY AT IN A LEAGUE. That's one of the realest ****ing reasons why a lot of people quit because brawl sucks and its not going anywhere except just fan-made tournaments. In melee a ****load of people that was suppose to quit that called melee wack and unfair cause their characters couldn't win still went to MLGs.


So people if your going to quit do it full-heart and don't make it seem like melee was the game when that game was VERY UNBALANCED AND ONLY LIKE 4 CHARACTERS HAD A CHANCE meaning probability is that 60 to 70 percent of people played with non top tiers and was forced to use top tiers just so they can hang. Brawl sucks because of the combination of the mechanics of the game seems like they did the good ol" give and take". They didn't keep certain things in and add on to it so it seems like in a sense the game went backwards the game is more like chess. I hate when people say u cant attack in brawl or u will be punished it all depends on what character u have combined with spacing in SOME cases you cant throw out an attack or you will get punished which isn't that bad a lot of fighting games are like that this, unfortunately this game just fell short of out expectation and other things too and to be honest NO SMASH IS MADE TO BE COMPETITIVE. Whats really funny to me is that people i remember was crying about melee and saying it sucks and its not fair this and that lol. And now that they feel brawl is this and that lol they go back to a game that's wack too and in some ways wacker than brawl. People have 2 options either you stay or you leave that's it because like i said its like beating a dead horse trying to get thru to these people Bum. I already know how I'm going to approach playing in these wack *** tournaments.
 

Lobos

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 7, 2007
Messages
4,548
Location
Columbia, MD
Half Life is awesome.......I'll wreck you in CS any day of the week JC!!! PC mods > console mods :p......infact......PC gaming > Console gaming :p
 

_Yes!_

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 5, 2006
Messages
8,787
Location
WHERE AM I
I started playing Command and Conquer 3 Tiberium Wars again. It's really fun. RTS is amazing even if I'm terrible at them.

Jfox fix your post.
 

Jigglymaster

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 14, 2005
Messages
5,577
Location
Northwest NJ
NNID
Dapuffster
Omg thank you bum for that first post of yours, some1 actually agrees with me on my match against plank.


Brawl community is really really bad. Brawl+ is just as bad though.

Brawl+ was good at first like version 3, but when version 4 came around it just got ruined.

I played it and the only thing i'm doing in that game is u air to rest combos the ENTIRE match. If jigglypuff didn't kill them before 40% she didn't kill them until 200%.

I used to main Pokemon Trainer in Brawl+ but v4 made me stop using him cause none of his combos worked like they did in the previous verison.
 

Eazy23

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Messages
1,383
I just think brawl+ needs ALOT of balancing. It is way to easy for characters like fox and squirtle to combo. Fox runs around nair utilt for 18 damage?!?!?!?! Lagless dair?????? Fox has falco's old combos lmao dair utilt-dair utilt, too whack and easy to do. And Squirtle is.....man I don't even need to talk about his whack utilt combos.
 

pockyD

Smash Legend
Joined
Jul 21, 2006
Messages
11,926
Location
San Francisco, CA
barlw+ has good intentions, but most people just don't realize that they aren't qualified to 'balance' a game, and when they fix something in one place, something else will become broken that they didn't even consider

there is no way a player-balanced game will work out besides by sheer luck, so I'm not holding my breath for such a 'fixed' game any time soon
 

Jigglymaster

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 14, 2005
Messages
5,577
Location
Northwest NJ
NNID
Dapuffster
To make a truely balanced game we need to make a single new character and that should be the only character allowed.

No one will have any experiance with that character and there will be no advantages over the other.

Though this is pretty much impossible.
 

_Yes!_

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 5, 2006
Messages
8,787
Location
WHERE AM I
It's also not gonna solve any problems. That would be almost as boring as fighting jigglypuff and diddy ;D
 

pockyD

Smash Legend
Joined
Jul 21, 2006
Messages
11,926
Location
San Francisco, CA
right, metaknight only!

obviously, it's impossible to get a "perfectly balanced game" (except for starcraft!!), but it's just as plainly obvious that there are degrees of balance

my only assertion is that any changes made by an overzealous (and probably 15-year old) gaming community to the game's actual structure are at least as likely to detract from balance as they are to improve it, and as such, it's not a cause worth following

if it flukes into something awful, i'd revisit it, but there's no reason to experience growing pains when there's not even a guarantee of actual forward progress
 

DireVulcan

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 15, 2004
Messages
1,310
Location
Queens, N.Y.
K, this post is going to be hearty (like Campbell's delicious soups!), but I've got a lot of logical crap brewing in my mind and I want to share this with everyone here and see who agrees/disagrees.

On the point of balancing Brawl+ I see a lot of people here thinking way too linearly.

For example Squirtle. There's no real need to remove his actual ability to do the combos he's able to do, all you have to do to balance him down is lower the percent damage of those quick attacks. Imagine if his Utilt did 4% and his Uair did 5%. Now take this generic but painful combo; Utilt Utilt Utilt Uair Uair. The combo is still worth doing but guess what, only 22% damage has been tacked on for it, which is very bearable. Or Fox even, if each hit of his Dair did 1.5% and you land a full 5 hits, you'll leave him with 7% maybe 8%. Fox Utilt 6% and so on and so forth.

The very idea of seeing characters in Brawl+ that can land huge combos and wanting to nerf them so they can't do such big combos pretty much breaks one of the main ideas of Brawl+ itself, ...which is huge combos. If you do that then you water down all the characters to the point where the small nimble characters can only juggle for as many hits as the big guys...which is stupid.

All you have to do is take a character, see which moves he does that lets him combo very easily, and reduce the damage of the actual attack. Tekken has done the same thing. As most of you know that's familiar with Tekken's core game play, it's heavily reliant on high damage air juggles. Well in T6 BR they heavily nerfed air juggles to the point where in the previous game a mere 6 hit combo can net you 70 dmg (half your lifebar) or more but in BR it takes about 10-11 hits to land that same damage. Now the game is much more fun to play and balanced. It's the same concept, and it's that simple.

Now on the point of creating a perfectly balanced game (or as balanced as humanly possible)

PockyD your quote "obviously, it's impossible to get a "perfectly balanced game" (except for starcraft!!)" pretty much defeats itself right there, though I understand what you meant. It's so hard to create a perfectly balanced game that unless you have 10-15 YEARS of solid development and testing, it's pretty much not worth bothering. As well as all others saying that, they are honestly wrong. When it comes to creating moves for a character, all that needs to be done with ANY kind of move is follow a simple formula.

A move that's:

Fast = weak
Slow = strong
Long range and strong = laggy
Long range and fast = weak

That's IT, as long as you follow that simple formula you can let your imagination run wild with your character and his various ways to attack (including projectiles).

There's a sub-factor when considering "well how can you make a fast move strong?"

It breaks down into Release and Retraction.

Take Marth's Fsmash. It has a really fast release, but very laggy retraction. So because of that, it's OK for it to have power because it's retraction time allows for adequate punishment if missed/blocked. The opposite of this idea would be DDD's Fsmash.

So there you have it. I personally think that's about as sound as it gets.

If the creators/updaters/balancers of the official Brawl+ somehow read this post (i'd like them to) and like what they read, I'd honestly would mind personally advising them and assisting with the balance of the moves in Brawl+. but that probably won't happen and it'll end up perpetually flawed in a critical way.

Oh well.
 

Eternal Yoshi

I've covered ban wars, you know
Joined
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Playing different games
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It would be impossible to make a perfectly balanced Smash game without sacrificing character diversity.

Edit: NVM. Saw Dire's post.
 
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