Ashunera’s Library - General Discussion, Q&A and Index

[King of Sack]

I think Uair is the move I use to kill Snake the most. Uair is an extremely good move.
If he is going to pull a grenade every time you hit him, use an empty SH and then go at him, or SHAD behind him and turn around and grab, etc. Aside from that, there's just perfect spacing with Nair.
Just know how to jab around his Ftilts, too. When you get close and you're not in lethal percent, you should shield because a Ftilt is coming. When he hits your shield, if you think he's going to use the second hit, spot dodge and THEN start jabbing for free %.
QD does not set off grenades, but you still do get 2-3% by just running into them.
Oh, and maybe it's just me, but I think Snakes get hit by walk-off Fair a lot.
Just a few random "tips." I like the Snake match-up. It can be fun.

Snake is fun to play against, but only if BF doesn't look like world war 4. >.>

 

[Guilhe]

Lurking at other character boards I’ve found a thread with a video compilation of all characters performing the reverse boosted pivot grab, an AT largely used by Falco mains. From what I’ve seen in the video Ike slides quite a lot and the OP maker specified he hasn’t practiced the timing on every character before making the video, so its possible that they can slide further. I was wondering if this could be used as a jab cancel follow-up. It looks interesting to me as its faster than a running grab and should give higher control to the Ike player over which direction to Bthrow his opponent. Got to test this.

Link to the OP: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=169086

 

[comboking]

When is ←throw -> Dash Attack always gonna hit DK (Percents). Because I seem to use it alot against him and hit him almost all the time.

 

[YagamiLight]

When is ←throw -> Dash Attack always gonna hit DK (Percents). Because I seem to use it alot against him and hit him almost all the time.

Off the top of my head it should work from very early percents (10% or so) up until the time where the combo just stops working as a whole, that is to say, near 100%.

 

[Kimchi]

Lurking at other character boards I’ve found a thread with a video compilation of all characters performing the reverse boosted pivot grab, an AT largely used by Falco mains. From what I’ve seen in the video Ike slides quite a lot and the OP maker specified he hasn’t practiced the timing on every character before making the video, so its possible that they can slide further. I was wondering if this could be used as a jab cancel follow-up. It looks interesting to me as its faster than a running grab and should give higher control to the Ike player over which direction to Bthrow his opponent. Got to test this.

Link to the OP: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=169086

I wouldn't recommend it after jab cancelling for a follow-up. Unless a player is really prone to shielding, most players will use an OOS option once they see you stop jab cancelling and try to run past them to reverse boost pivot grab. Kirk has stated that the reverse boosted pivot grab doesn't really benefit Ike too much and the slide isn't the greatest considering the effort to time the grab. I've tried a while back to incorporate this into my game and it just wasn't worth the effort. By the way, there's an easier way to perform the reverse boosted pivot grab. Basically, you do the same as it says in the OP except you use A for the dash attack. So it'd look like this: dash left <- press A + Z in opposite direction same time.

Thanks everyone. He is no where near predictable. I could try to post some vids in the critique thread later.

Side notes:

1) he timed the DACUS so there is nothing I can do against it.

2) I've tried baiting the C4 but he will only use it if he knows it will hit.

3) I would like to say he was camping but I can't because amongst the projectile fest... was him... meleeing me in the face.

4) Ewic is probably the best brawl player on Vancouver Island. o.O

What you can do is to turn the direction towards where he is DACUSing then once he gets past your shield with DACUS, you can grab him. It's difficult, but once you get the hang of it, you can grab Snake almost every single time he uses DACUS. Shield the first tilt and dodge the second one then jab him. Don't be afraid to roll behind him if you are forced to shield every single tilt, because eventually, he'll land an Utilt on you if you keep shielding.

 

[Teh Brettster]

Have we actually tested to see if we can DACIT items down or back? I know up and forward both work. But I don't remember anyone ever mentioning down or back. Perhaps I'll try.

By the way, today's the day they landed on the moon, 40 years ago.
It's also Carlos Santana's birthday.
Oh and it's like.. my birthday too, or something like that.

 

[King of Sack]

I miss that place. Comox/Courtney was on the small side, but Victoria was nice....

Is Pirate Ship a legal CP in BC?

When was the last time you were here? You would probably be surprised at how much it has changed. And, no... I'm pretty sure it is banned.

What you can do is to turn the direction towards where he is DACUSing then once he gets past your shield with DACUS, you can grab him. It's difficult, but once you get the hang of it, you can grab Snake almost every single time he uses DACUS. Shield the first tilt and dodge the second one then jab him. Don't be afraid to roll behind him if you are forced to shield every single tilt, because eventually, he'll land an Utilt on you if you keep shielding.

That is a good idea, I'll go try that. Btw Ewic seems to use the DACUS when I'm airborne but too low for an aerial so if I air dodge I will get hit by da missile. ~_-

 

[Teh Brettster]

Okay, in case nobody knew, we -can- DACIT items up, forward, AND backward. I cannot get Ike to toss down, and I'm pretty sure it isn't possbile.
Anyway. I'm not sure if inputs are any different for smash C-stick, but I'll tell you for attack C-stick.


Upward: Running start, C-stick down, up+Z. (Also works with C-stick forward.)

Forward: Same thing, but you should always use C-stick down, and instead of up+Z on control stick, use up+forward+Z.

Backward: Same thing as forward. Always use C-stick down, and use up+back+Z.


Hooray, I answered my own question. Just decided to post in case there are others who don't know.

 

[King of Sack]

Oh and it's like.. my birthday too, or something like that.

Well then... happy birthday, or something like that.

Since we are on the subject, I noticed that when a lot of Ikes use the DACIT they throw the item up, is there a benefit to this? I usually throw it foward to get some extra damage/ stun my opponent so I can slide in with a forward smash or jab combo.

 

[Kirk]

Upwards is most useful when retreating, for obvious reasons.

Usually, at least for me, when people throw it upwards while going toward my opponent, its usually by mistake. That, or you're aiming for your opponent who is in the air above.

 

[Guilhe]

Kirk, could you test the frame disadvantage for performing the reverse boosted pivot grab as a follow-up for jab1?

 

[Kirk]

Kirk, could you test the frame disadvantage for performing the reverse boosted pivot grab as a follow-up for jab1?

Not necessary. Unless you can give me a practical reason for its use. Because I can tell you right now you'll be at more of a disadvantage than a jab1 --> grab(which is already a frame disadvantage). To me it seems unnecessary to increase the amount of time it takes for your grab hitbox to come out.

Unless you're going for some sort of mindgame...but again, it still doesn't seem practical to me.

 

[Kimchi]

Not necessary. Unless you can give me a practical reason for its use. Because I can tell you right now you'll be at more of a disadvantage than a jab1 --> grab(which is already a frame disadvantage). To me it seems unnecessary to increase the amount of time it takes for your grab hitbox to come out.

Unless you're going for some sort of mindgame...but again, it still doesn't seem practical to me.

I stated this :D.

 

[King of Sack]

Upwards is most useful when retreating, for obvious reasons.

Usually, at least for me, when people throw it upwards while going toward my opponent, its usually by mistake. That, or you're aiming for your opponent who is in the air above.

Yet from what I've seen, you always seem to throw it up. Can you (if any...) reveal the deallio behind this? Forgive me if I am wrong, just stating my observations.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

When was the last time you were here? You would probably be surprised at how much it has changed. And, no... I'm pretty sure it is banned.

Vancover Island? Ah.....2 years now. BC? I'm currently in BC visiting relatives, but not on VI.

Tell BC to stop being wimps and allow Pirate Ship. It's not even in the CP/Banned list, it's flat out a CP.

 

[Ussi]

In other news, the pikachu boards has all become Hamsters (minus one) and has invaded the Snake social thread quite fun lol...

 

[King of Sack]

In other news, the pikachu boards has all become Hamsters (minus one) and has invaded the Snake social thread quite fun lol...

LOL, but... did you guys manage to get away with it? ~_-

 

[Melfice z]

Kush Kush...

>__>
<__<

I lol'd

 

[Ussi]

We'll find out when SuSa sees the 10 pages of Hamsters in his social thread

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

Not necessary. Unless you can give me a practical reason for its use. Because I can tell you right now you'll be at more of a disadvantage than a jab1 --> grab(which is already a frame disadvantage). To me it seems unnecessary to increase the amount of time it takes for your grab hitbox to come out.

Unless you're going for some sort of mindgame...but again, it still doesn't seem practical to me.

Is it really a frame disadvantage against everyone? That thread we saw a few weeks ago specifically about jabs in brawl had Ike with a 7 frame advantage so wouldn't that mean they only have 1 frame to jump?

IIRC wario has can jump out of Ike's pivot infinite but it doesn't get him out of the way in time so shouldn't the same thing happen with everyone?

As a reason for its use would be maybe jabbing someone out of there air jump and they use SDI to get far enough your your grab just misses. It could also give you better positioning like maybe sliding towards a wall with them and setting up an infinite.

 

[Rorar]

sup guys new to the Ike boards and I was just wondering it feels that my game is way too predictable and I was wondering how do I mix it up? Sorry if this is a newb kinda question but its getting to a point where my opponent can easily predict my moves and I try to mix it up with d-smash etc etc but it feels like it isnt working and I only have been playing competitively for like a month so any tips overall would be great thanks again guys

 

[fatalmztake]

sup guys new to the Ike boards and I was just wondering it feels that my game is way too predictable and I was wondering how do I mix it up? Sorry if this is a newb kinda question but its getting to a point where my opponent can easily predict my moves and I try to mix it up with d-smash etc etc but it feels like it isnt working and I only have been playing competitively for like a month so any tips overall would be great thanks again guys

I haven't been playing long, but I've played against and with some well expierenced brawlers and the advice they have given me along with what I have gathered from the Ike video threads is this. Ike has massive range which you should use to you advantage by using his nair, bair, and fair. These along with Jab cancelling will allow you to rack up a good amount of damage and with a good bair or well timed smash, can get a KO. Ike's air attacks can give you good spacing as well which is key. Also Ike can rack up some damage with his throws. So try using Jab 1-> Jab 2-> Cancel -> Jab 1-> Jab 2-> Grab. This will rack up some good damage, might be unpredictible (depending on the person your playing) and will allow you to move in to possible get a KO. Remember, I'm no expert and have been playing for a shorter time then you, but that's the advice I've recieved and what I've gathered from videos. Hope I helped a little!

 

[theeboredone]

sup guys new to the Ike boards and I was just wondering it feels that my game is way too predictable and I was wondering how do I mix it up? Sorry if this is a newb kinda question but its getting to a point where my opponent can easily predict my moves and I try to mix it up with d-smash etc etc but it feels like it isnt working and I only have been playing competitively for like a month so any tips overall would be great thanks again guys

Welcome, you posted in the right thread (we need to throw a party), but do you have any kind of recording device? The best way to get tips on your style of play and how to improve it is by uploading a video of yourself on youtube.

You can also watch other well known Ike players on youtube and see what they do.

I recommend the following...

Kirk
San
Rykoshet
Renegade

 

[Mr. Doom]

Hey there. I've been in the background watching the Ike boards, but I haven't really been making any posts here. I'm this scrub Ike player from the Midwest-West who needs to step up my game for a tournament coming up on the 25th of this month. I have a few videos up of myself going against various members of my crew, and I would greatly appreciate it if someone looked through them... Mr. Doom (Ike) would be the one you'd look for.

http://www.youtube.com/MrDoom8000
http://www.youtube.com/affinity2412

Thank you in advance.

~Mr. Doom

 

[Kishin]

Isn't the inverse boost grab thing how you do an infinite grab release on wario?

 

[Palpi]

No that is just pivot wave grab.

Mr. Doom We have a video critique thread.

 

[GwJ]

Other people need you!

DarkWarCloud has opened up the Training Grounds. What this is is a place for new players to learn who plays what characters all in a simple thread so that they can contact said person to "teach" them the basics. As of right now, we only have a handful of "teachers" for a few characters and we need more! This is where you come in. Anyone who is skilled with your characters (any character) and has the free time to teach someone how to either: Teach the basics of the game in general and/or teach specific character(s), go in the thread and either post or PM DarkWarCloud with your information (Format is in the thread) where you may possibly be contacted by someone who wants to learn. The future of smash lies in your hands.

On the other hand, if you wish to learn, go to the thread also!

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=241698

 

[Slaps]

hey guys whats been happening, sorry ive been out for a while so idk whats been going on the past weeks im still in michigan and wont get home til saturday so idk what im getting at just im starting to pay attention to the boards more now that im almost home lo

 

[Kirk]

Yet from what I've seen, you always seem to throw it up. Can you (if any...) reveal the deallio behind this? Forgive me if I am wrong, just stating my observations.

Simply put, it's easier to do. Pushing up on the control stick is much easier than finding that right angle forward/up. But this is coming from someone who doesn't practice it...at all.

Is it really a frame disadvantage against everyone? That thread we saw a few weeks ago specifically about jabs in brawl had Ike with a 7 frame advantage so wouldn't that mean they only have 1 frame to jump?

IIRC wario has can jump out of Ike's pivot infinite but it doesn't get him out of the way in time so shouldn't the same thing happen with everyone?

As a reason for its use would be maybe jabbing someone out of there air jump and they use SDI to get far enough your your grab just misses. It could also give you better positioning like maybe sliding towards a wall with them and setting up an infinite.

Which thread are you refering to? I remember getting a six frame advantage myself. But I could look into it again.

On the Wario thing, I explained this in my video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2g8RjlgMwQ (the explanation is in the video description)

The first example you gave, just how often does that actually happen. If you're going to be punishing someone who is trying to land without a jump...for one, they're going to be air dodging anyway...and two, why punish with a single jab when you can do other things just as easily(grab, smash, tilt, etc.). The positioning argument is somewhat more viable, but...eh, doesn't seem all that useful to me still.

sup guys new to the Ike boards and I was just wondering it feels that my game is way too predictable and I was wondering how do I mix it up? Sorry if this is a newb kinda question but its getting to a point where my opponent can easily predict my moves and I try to mix it up with d-smash etc etc but it feels like it isnt working and I only have been playing competitively for like a month so any tips overall would be great thanks again guys

Listen to what Bored said.

EDIT: Found what I did on the 1st Jab from like...7 months ago.

A quick factoid...because Ryko was bugging me with the idea...basically from a discussion on what can 'combo' from a Jab?

A single Jab, if connected, gives you a 6 frame advantage on your opponent. This means you can act 6 frames before your opponent can do anything(in this case it would be jumping, as it is the fastest action possible).

What does this mean? 1st Jab --> 1st Jab is a true combo. SDI can naturally be used to escape this in time, but it still does work regardless.

Now, if they do NOT jump, they have a significantly longer time before they can do anything(with my testing using Snake, it was about 7 frames more, but this value is dependant on the weight of the character and any SDI used).

Why point this out? This gives you about a 13 frame advantage. Hmmm... *looks at moves that come out in 13 frames* ...Well now we have some Grabs...Utilt...and DSmash!

Neat...eh?

P.S. Just because, I tested the 2nd Jab as well. You only get a ONE frame advantage from this. No combos here!

 

[Kishin]

So the grab release infinite Wario only has a 2 frame opening... would that wave pivot grab make that frame opening possibly higher?

 

[Kimchi]

Welcome, you posted in the right thread (we need to throw a party), but do you have any kind of recording device? The best way to get tips on your style of play and how to improve it is by uploading a video of yourself on youtube.

You can also watch other well known Ike players on youtube and see what they do.

I recommend the following...

Kirk
San
Rykoshet
Renegade

Renegade has been quite inactive with Ike lately, and he's switched his main to Snake/Marth. His videos are pretty outdated, too. On a side note, you can check my YouTube channel for videos, since I upload pretty frequently.

 

[Teh Brettster]

Simply put, it's easier to do. Pushing up on the control stick is much easier than finding that right angle forward/up. But this is coming from someone who doesn't practice it...at all.

You'll only need to practice it once and for just a couple short minutes. I know DACIT isn't used a hell of a lot, but considering the little time it took me to completely figure it out the other day, I don't think it's NOT worth it.

I want to think of a good use of backwards DACIT now that I know it can be done.

BTW, counter-slides from DACIT are beastly. I got myself almost from one edge of FD to the other.

 

[King of Sack]

Simply put, it's easier to do. Pushing up on the control stick is much easier than finding that right angle forward/up. But this is coming from someone who doesn't practice it...at all.

Can't argue with that.

mmm... 13 frames from first jab mmm...

 

[theeboredone]

Renegade has been quite inactive with Ike lately, and he's switched his main to Snake/Marth. His videos are pretty outdated, too. On a side note, you can check my YouTube channel for videos, since I upload pretty frequently.

Oh yea, I forgot he switched mains. Good call.

 

[Ussi]

Idk if i can say i really switched mains to Pikachu o.o I spent 60% of my time playing as Ike still... course I don't get to play much and wifi is horrid for Pikachu

 

[Marauder]

Meh, I've heard worse. Apparently Havok mains Marth, but uses MK for every match up :/

Also, posting to hype BlazBlue and see my new sig in action.

 

[Melomaniacal]

pikachu is good though ussi hehe

-PALPI WOW i have to stop doing this

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

Simply put, it's easier to do. Pushing up on the control stick is much easier than finding that right angle forward/up. But this is coming from someone who doesn't practice it...at all.


Which thread are you refering to? I remember getting a six frame advantage myself. But I could look into it again.

On the Wario thing, I explained this in my video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2g8RjlgMwQ (the explanation is in the video description)

The first example you gave, just how often does that actually happen. If you're going to be punishing someone who is trying to land without a jump...for one, they're going to be air dodging anyway...and two, why punish with a single jab when you can do other things just as easily(grab, smash, tilt, etc.). The positioning argument is somewhat more viable, but...eh, doesn't seem all that useful to me still.


Listen to what Bored said.

EDIT: Found what I did on the 1st Jab from like...7 months ago.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=236603

here it is. It basically says that Ike's jab has 3 hit boxes and that one of them gives a 7 frame advantage with an aerial action witch was considered to be a jump. I do believe this makes Jab grab a true combo doesn't it?

I wish our jab was like warios though =/

 

[Teh Brettster]

Holy crap. Me too.
At 150% we'd basically have a jab to Usmash.
LOLSAUCE.

 

[Rykoshet]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=236603

here it is. It basically says that Ike's jab has 3 hit boxes and that one of them gives a 7 frame advantage with an aerial action witch was considered to be a jump. I do believe this makes Jab grab a true combo doesn't it?

I wish our jab was like warios though =/

Some characters aerial action doesnt need to be a jump. Floatier characters or characters who generally just pop upwards moreso than anything when they get jabbed can furthermore DI it upwards and then throw out a fast aerial without having to actually do anything beforehand. Mario can actually up air you in the mouth for doing it, ****'s kind of annoying.