Player-1
Smash Legend
Peach Vs Diddy is even, if not even then very slightly in diddy's favor. Our fair wrecks peach so hard.
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Official BBR Matchup Chart v1.0
- Thread starter Marc
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RE: Throws
Wao, so Peach is pretty fat.
I lived to 244% as Peach in teams once, like, a year ago on wi-fi or something.
But Peach's moves kill at far higher percentages than Diddy's.
Also Peach has like, nothing to answer Diddy's fair since it has lolMarthfair range. At best, Peach's bair will trade with it, but Diddy's fair should beat out her other aerials comfortably.
Peach is like a midweight. So she doesn't die early. The thing is that Diddys killing is dependent on bananas. Peach can abuse those seriously good making it harder to get those things too. But I am terrible against Diddy Kong so I have huuuge bias about everything.
Judo777
Smash Master
- Joined
- Sep 9, 2008
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- 3,627
If sheik had peaches nair.......... if sheik had diddys fsmash.................. you guys should see how well sheik kills.....
Also Diddys throws kill all the freaking time. They are weak but his bthrow is so fast you can hardly react to it.
Also Diddys throws kill all the freaking time. They are weak but his bthrow is so fast you can hardly react to it.
Fuujin
Smash Champion
Most of the time Diddy's F air is fresh enough to kill at decent percents.
I use a lightweight character so I'm bias I guess.
I use a lightweight character so I'm bias I guess.
Sheik's killing power isn't too bad if you manage ftilts properly.
I don't though, so I just get them to 140% and switch to Zelderp.
This has lost me matches. But w/e.
I don't though, so I just get them to 140% and switch to Zelderp.
This has lost me matches. But w/e.
Fuujin
Smash Champion
Everything Sheik has is weak as **** except for a tippered up smash.
And she also has setups into tippered up-smash via ftilt. Hence why I said if you manage it properly. 
Supermodel From Paris
Smash Hero
Sheik definitely has setups. They're not the best ever but it's better than anything Peach has tbh
infiniteV115
Smash Hero
About Diddy killing Peach vertically...wouldn't a fresh utilt kill at around 160?
smashkng
Smash Lord
I'm sure Marth lives longer vertically than Peach does because her fast fall is far slower than Marth's is. And Peach isn't even that much heavier than Marth is. Marth for example can live Snake's Utilt up to 105% or something with good DI and momentum cancelling while Peach can get killed by it below 100%.
Player-1
Smash Legend
with good DI you can live from a fresh utilt til like 165ish with midweights, but it's so fast that no one ever DIs it well unless they expect it.
1PokeMastr
Smash Champion
- Joined
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- 2,251
Actually.. Marth can take Snake's U-Tilt to 130% on FD. He can't survive higher than that on a U-Tilt.
D3/ Dk/ Bowser/ Snake all can Survive it at 160%. Snake's of course.
As for Diddy's U-Tilt.. Yeah, doesn't kill until 170 on Marth, and Marth out lives Peach because of his Fall Speed.
Peach may be heavier, but, she has a much slower fall speed.
D3/ Dk/ Bowser/ Snake all can Survive it at 160%. Snake's of course.
As for Diddy's U-Tilt.. Yeah, doesn't kill until 170 on Marth, and Marth out lives Peach because of his Fall Speed.
Peach may be heavier, but, she has a much slower fall speed.
smashkng
Smash Lord
DI doesn't matter that much vertically IMO. With or without it, Marth still lives longer because his fast fall is still better and you're going to eventually react to Diddy's Utilt with momentum cancelling unless you're like very close to the top screen (which will only happen in stages like Delfino or Brinstar LOL).
And no, only the heaviest characters can live a fresh Snake up tilt at 130%. I mean that's when Ganon starts to always get killed by it in an average blast zone. Like only DDD can possibly live a fresh Snake Utilt at 150%.
And no, only the heaviest characters can live a fresh Snake up tilt at 130%. I mean that's when Ganon starts to always get killed by it in an average blast zone. Like only DDD can possibly live a fresh Snake Utilt at 150%.
1PokeMastr
Smash Champion
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Wait, Diddy will forget to Ban Brinstar? Haha.
You have to SDi the U-Tilt down and Away from Snake at insane levels to live it, and Dk has his Dk break too.
Maybe the U-Tilt was stale on Marth, but, I remember going from 117% -> 130% when I got hit.
You have to SDi the U-Tilt down and Away from Snake at insane levels to live it, and Dk has his Dk break too.
Maybe the U-Tilt was stale on Marth, but, I remember going from 117% -> 130% when I got hit.
This. Pretty sure everyone thought he meant he lived a fresh snake utilt AT 130 with someone as light as marth. If that was possible imagine how long characters like DK and DDD could live against it.
It is also possible that you only got hit by the sour spot/ending frames.
Judo777
Smash Master
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- Sep 9, 2008
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- 3,627
I manage my decay very VERY well. Sheik still has the hardest time killing of any character (even Samus but not by much and its actually debatable). There are a few problems with Sheiks ftilt Usmash setup.And she also has setups into tippered up-smash via ftilt. Hence why I said if you manage it properly.
1. it is decay AND range dependent! It doesn't work at all ranges inside the ftilt, only specfic ones (usually max and min range of the move but not in between).
2. It requires a minimum of about 4 points of decay in order to true combo into it (at least at percents it will guaranteed kill them). So yes if you want to walk around throwing ftilts and hope your opponent is dumb enough to get hit by all of them then you will have your combo.
3. Related to 2 you have to play VERY very generically if you want to be killing with that move. Like the ideal stock is grabs and needles to 30%, ftilts to about 65% (that's 4), utilt to 74ish, insert move that does 10% but NOT more than 16%, land ftilt and try to kill them. And that's only for the lightest character. If you want a heavier character you need about 5 or 6 and some of them won't combo together so its like ftilt 4 times, get them to 80%, land 2 more THEN DON'T FOLLOW UP WITH ANYTHING (as if that's not obvious) land one more and kill. Like you have to do some silly stuff sometimes in order to get the percents right (I have one occaision thrown a full needle storm into the ground, so I could hit with 1 needle to try and set that up).
4. GR DACUS is a godsend. However you have to grab your foe in certain spots of the stage, at kill percents, land it (which is hard I still whiff it in tourney), AND they have to be one of 5 characters or else you have one more condition where they must air release.......
Sheik kills well on paper, just like Sheik is a good character on paper. Tournaments aren't made of paper.
^ Yeah I know what you mean.
I have lost to a Fox in friendlies before since I was just like, "cbf" and ftilted pretty much the entire match.
Of course, I'd never play like that in a serious match though.
I personally don't bother trying to set up ftilt > upsmash, I just ftilt until they're at the percent where they get hit by both hits of upsmash, then I reset spacing and try to get a couple of hits in here and there, chuck a few needles and play everything by ear.
Probably not exactly the best of strategies, but it's fun.
I have lost to a Fox in friendlies before since I was just like, "cbf" and ftilted pretty much the entire match.
Of course, I'd never play like that in a serious match though.
I personally don't bother trying to set up ftilt > upsmash, I just ftilt until they're at the percent where they get hit by both hits of upsmash, then I reset spacing and try to get a couple of hits in here and there, chuck a few needles and play everything by ear.
Probably not exactly the best of strategies, but it's fun.
I've survived fresh snake utilts at 130 on pokemon stadium 2 and yoshi's island (w/marth).
Because I am amazing.
I've also survived fresh zss' side b on YI at final damage of 210% with snake.
Because I am amazing.
I've also survived fresh zss' side b on YI at final damage of 210% with snake.
Shire is indeed amazing.
*swoons*
*swoons*
Browny
Smash Hater
sure m80's.
infiniteV115
Smash Hero
You must be talking about the first hitbox
phi1ny3
Not the Mama
But tournaments run on paper... little sheets of green, linen and cotton hybrid paper.
Does that count?
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
people run their tournament brackets on paper?
ew...
Its the information age people, step your shiz up and get tio.
ew...
Its the information age people, step your shiz up and get tio.
stingers
Smash Obsessed
i was just at a tourney 2 weeks ago that had a paper bracket...it was nostalgic~
phi1ny3
Not the Mama
phi1ny3
Not the Mama
Yeah, I'm inclined to say she may be bottom 5, but not worse than Samus and Jigglypuff (and among the Sonic/Mario tier of overall kill potential)
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Jigglypuff KOs easier than Sheik, Sonic, Samus and Mario.
Hitting with a fair at KO percents leads to death against the majority of the cast, its easy to keep fresh if you know what you're doing and the sourspot combos into the sweetspot.
Her fsmash is viable in several match-ups for punishing landings, and her dash attack can catch people off-guard or kill them if you read a roll.
Semi-charged Rollout kills as well, you jump up and charge it as they are falling and you can often get past most of their options with it.
She is amazing at gimping too.
Rest KOs at low percents (for a KO move) and comes out on 1 frame. It KOs regardless of DI as well. Most attacks on shield can be punished by rest with correct SDI and timing, and it can be used if you are close enough to punish something laggy.
Hitting with a fair at KO percents leads to death against the majority of the cast, its easy to keep fresh if you know what you're doing and the sourspot combos into the sweetspot.
Her fsmash is viable in several match-ups for punishing landings, and her dash attack can catch people off-guard or kill them if you read a roll.
Semi-charged Rollout kills as well, you jump up and charge it as they are falling and you can often get past most of their options with it.
She is amazing at gimping too.
Rest KOs at low percents (for a KO move) and comes out on 1 frame. It KOs regardless of DI as well. Most attacks on shield can be punished by rest with correct SDI and timing, and it can be used if you are close enough to punish something laggy.
Yink
The Robo-PSIentist
Ness and Lucas should switched at the very least imo.
Yink
The Robo-PSIentist
Too bad Ness' PK Fire is a lot riskier in this match up than Lucas' is.
Believe me, Lucas also does more shield pressure with safer moves. Ness really struggles to attack while being safe. That and Ness gets demolished by DDD offstage in my own experience and from what I've seen. It's a tough match up.
*dead* at mentioning rollout and rest as kill moves
You shouldn't be having trouble with PKF honestly lol. Also if D3 can grab Lucas from release he most likely can do it to ness too.
The reason Lucas does better is because D3's CG puts Ness in an awful position offstage while Lucas doesn't have the same trouble recovering after the CG that Ness does.
You could say Jiggs kills earlier than Sonic, just like you could say Squirtle kills earlier than Wario. Thats not nearly the entire picture tho. If Sonic can kill Metaknight at 140 and die at 160, is that worse or better than dying at 100 and killing at 100?
Her killing ability compared to her survivability is still pretty bad.
Rollout doesn't "get past most options" , I've beaten rollout with spindash so I know the priority isn't anything spectacular. All you have to do is shield it, then jump.
Go punish a halfway decent move on shield with rest consistently. I, like most people here, won't believe it until I see it, and I haven't seen it yet.
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