Official BBR Matchup Chart v1.0

[Cassio]

Putting an accurate matchup distribution would help people understand why he's banned.

Well since hes banned under unity I can finally give my true thoughts on pika vs MK

Spoiler

Pika-MK is even . More to come in 2.0

 

[AlanHaTe]

edit: wrong post sorry

 

[BlueXenon]

I am watching Ally (falco) vs holy (Rob) and it is very clear that Rob is not -2 with falco.
you can watch it here http://www.twitch.tv/nekonekoxd

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

he is labled as less than even with falco?! hell rob used to counter falco back in the day. sure the metagame has changed, i can even maybe see a -1, but -2 seems strange to me.

 

[Steam]

oh the days when RoB was good...

funny to see him go from top tier down to poopoo

 

[popsofctown]

How about now that Meta Knight is banned we unsugarcoat his matchups? I don't feel he had that many neutrals, (or rather, advantages that round off to 0)

 

[Shaya]

new match up chart will be coming out soon.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Days, Weeks?

 

[Shaya]

Weeks.

 

[Marc]

My estimate is late November/early December for the completely finished product. I'll speed it up if I can, but with so many people working on it it just takes time.

 

[Shaya]

Really?

mmmmmmmmmm~

 

[Ussi]

We need time for circle arguments ya dig?

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

My estimate is late November/early December for the completely finished product. I'll speed it up if I can, but with so many people working on it it just takes time.

you have to do one lease MU for each character now.

 

[Krystedez]

We need time for circle arguments ya dig?

I think most arguments will actually be fairly reasonable. A lot of matchup changes are being made, sure, but some that either unreasonable or just not backed up or understood from the side that IS backing it up will be easy peasy to just lay to the wayside or let go by.

 

[Ussi]

I'm just being paranoid

 

[Marc]

you have to do one lease MU for each character now.

MK will still be legal by the time we release this as it's at least a month before APEX and there are not only Americans on this site.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

~~
+1
+1
+1
+1.5
+1.5
+2
+1
+1.5
+2
+2.5
+2
+2
+2
+1
+1.5
+2.5
+3
+2.5
+3
+2.5
+2.5
+3
+2.5
+2.5
+2.5
+3
+3
+3
+3
+3
+3.5
+3.5
+3.5
+3.5
+2.5
+3.5
+3.5

This list is way more accurate than whatever we have at the moment. x.5 match-ups, I'm either not familiar with or I feel could go either way depending on playstyle/ruleset/etc... A lot of these match-ups will seem exaggerated to mid and low tier mains because they generally have more experience against MK than vice versa, which twists the match-up in their favour. I'll be very disappointed in the BBR if they say that anyone goes even with MK when they update the chart.

 

[Kuro~]

^^^^ that looks pretty accurate to what it should be.Especially when considering the footnote covers any discrepancies i personally would of had(like wario def. being -2 when played right)

 

[PMC66]

after looking at this chart more theres one figure that bugs me.

ZSS V Wolf should be +1 in wolf's favor she has problems with hit stun making Wolf N-air an even better move than usual, shines **** her, she has problems killing she is killed easily by wolf and is to a large extent out camped by wolf the only thing she has on him is combo ability and the F-throw chain grab which he can out space pretty easily and ZSS's tether grab makes grabing riky especially against a fast powerful character that can rack up damage.

 

[PMC66]

oh the days when RoB was good...

funny to see him go from top tier down to poopoo

back when people believed he was good not when he was good. R.O.B has always been a bit below average just took some people longer to realise it than others.


sorry can someone merge these two together i've no idea how i screwed this up :-/

 

[tekkie]

after looking at this chart more theres one figure that bugs me.

ZSS V Wolf should be +1 in wolf's favor she has problems with hit stun making Wolf N-air an even better move than usual, shines **** her, she has problems killing she is killed easily by wolf and is to a large extent out camped by wolf the only thing she has on him is combo ability and the F-throw chain grab which he can out space pretty easily and ZSS's tether grab makes grabing riky especially against a fast powerful character that can rack up damage.

dsmash makes life hard for wolf

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

tell that to kain and seagull pall.

also i have some discrepencies about some of luigi's MUs.

imo (from the luigi stand point)

falco -1
zss -1
kirby 0 or +1
rob 0
DK 0 or +1
Sonic +1
Ike -2

Isn't Luigi supposed to body PT? why is it -2? idk about that MU but i've heard it's really bad for PT. is it an error?

seriously yall really underestimate luigi. i've seen some good luigi matches and i used to play with a pretty good Norcal Luigi called Blaze (aka zzstudmuffinzz) but he can't really make many tournaments because of work. but for reals i honestly think luigi is much better than given credit for. i mean ya he isn't amazing by any means but he is better than a lot of people think.

 

[Ishiey]

It's pretty hard for ZSS to land that dsmash when the Wolf is playing the MU correctly. Honestly, I feel like Wolf has a slight edge, but it's an underexplored MU and it'd be closer to 0 anyways so s'all good

Also, Maharba, why is Luigi better than people think? His low traction messes up, like, everything. He can't get in on half the cast :/

 

[Tesh]

~~
+1
+1
+1
+1.5
+1.5
+2
+1
+1.5
+2
+2.5
+2
+2
+2
+1
+1.5
+2.5
+3
+2.5
+3
+2.5
+2.5
+3
+2.5
+2.5
+2.5
+3
+3
+3
+3
+3
+3.5
+3.5
+3.5
+3.5
+2.5
+3.5
+3.5

This list is way more accurate than whatever we have at the moment. x.5 match-ups, I'm either not familiar with or I feel could go either way depending on playstyle/ruleset/etc... A lot of these match-ups will seem exaggerated to mid and low tier mains because they generally have more experience against MK than vice versa, which twists the match-up in their favour. I'll be very disappointed in the BBR if they say that anyone goes even with MK when they update the chart.

looks like you got lazy halfway thru and just rated most of the lower tiers together.


@ maharba, luigi doesn't beat sonic. its probably in sonic's favor if he camps.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Of course he got lazy halfway through, he put Yoshi Vs MK -3.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

well blaze was reeeeaaaallly good at PS-ing so traction wasn't a big deal to him so i may be biased a bit there. also a lot of weegee's don't play like boss and biglou (back when he used him) becayse all it takes is one jab for a good weegee to make up for all the getting in damage he takes. plus that kill power. plus his cyclone really helps with getting in due to transcendent priority and when used correctly can true combo into his aerials which start combos/strings themselves. i mean does anyone else share my viewpoint? idk he just seems better to me than people think due to his fast moves + priority + strings/combos.

@tesh

i have an okay weegee so next time i see you i wanna test that for reals. since sonic will have to approach first plus weegee's priority and damage output, i just can't see it being good/great for sonic.

 

[NearZzz]

Sonic vs jiggz is +1jiggz right tesh. :nawesome:

 

[Grim Tuesday]

looks like you got lazy halfway thru and just rated most of the lower tiers together.

Nope, just a coincidence. I thought about every match-up.

Of course he got lazy halfway through, he put Yoshi Vs MK -3.

I've heard many Yoshi mains claim that the match-up is overrated for Yoshi, would a -2.5 be more accurate?

Sonic vs jiggz is +1jiggz right tesh. :nawesome:

That match-up should never be spoken of, let alone played.

So ****ing gay and campy.

 

[Sinister Slush]

I've heard many Yoshi mains claim that the match-up is overrated for Yoshi, would a -2.5 be more accurate?

Basically how I see the MU works.

MK that doesn't know it: Will get punished by Pivot grab for approaching stupidly all the time and eventually start jumping/dairing thinking they're smart to avoid grabs, but to only be pelted by eggs the whole match and eventually lose.

MK That Knows It: Will do basic MK stuff with simple reads during Yoshi's most laggiest moves (Egg toss DownB etc.), making sure to keep him offstage using Fair Dair or Shuttle loop the whole time and win.

 

[Seagull Joe]

It's pretty hard for ZSS to land that dsmash when the Wolf is playing the MU correctly. Honestly, I feel like Wolf has a slight edge, but it's an underexplored MU and it'd be closer to 0 anyways so s'all good

Also, Maharba, why is Luigi better than people think? His low traction messes up, like, everything. He can't get in on half the cast :/

Based on my experience vs PatG and Sassy I can say vs is definitely even lol. does not have a problem killing and neither does . It's a really wonky matchup for both characters...I like playing it actually. won't kill with Uair, but with Bair. Landing her Bair isn't as hard as PMC makes it seem. will kill with Fair. They die around 130~ish for and 150~ish for . They can both put each other in awkward positions with stun for her and Dthrow for .

I intend to make 's matchups better as his leader.

 

[NickRiddle]

ZSS v Wolf is even.

Can't wait to argue ZSS v Luigi.
The MU is SO SIMPLE!

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

i had a huge error up above. i meant to say "don't PLAY like boss or biglou". i switced it. sorry to those of you who got really confused when they read that.

 

[infiniteV115]

I'm inclined to think it's +1 for ZSS because of the dsmash chain, ability to edgeguard Wolf with dsmash --> footstool (guaranteed death if done properly), and because of main bias :D
That and I apparently underrate Wolf's recovery

That being said, Nick, ZSS:Luigi is -4 for ZSS.
That being said, please explain the MU. I suck at it.

 

[NickRiddle]

I'm inclined to think it's +1 for ZSS because of the dsmash chain, ability to edgeguard Wolf with dsmash --> footstool (guaranteed death if done properly), and because of main bias :D
That and I apparently underrate Wolf's recovery

It's really hard to d-smash wolf.
Basically, if that's your plan, you're going to lose to mid-level Wolf players.
You have to pretend it's any character without it.
If you land the d-smash lock... it's just extra %, and it ends at like 60 anyway.

 

[san.]

That match-up should never be spoken of, let alone played.

So ****ing gay and campy.

The matchup (Sonic vs Jigglypuff) is much fun, but don't expect it to always end before time, even when playing aggro.

Sometimes I have an easier time fighting sonics with Jigglypuff than Ike, but that may be due to them not knowing the MU correctly.

 

[Tesh]

Sonic vs jiggz is +1jiggz right tesh. :nawesome:

Dang, I actually read this post 5 hours ago and wondered why you would ask me that.

Now I remember tho.

 

[da K.I.D.]

The matchup (Sonic vs Jigglypuff) is much fun, but don't expect it to always end before time, even when playing aggro.

Sometimes I have an easier time fighting sonics with Jigglypuff than Ike, but that may be due to them not knowing the MU correctly.

fun for you maybe, jigglypuff vs sonic is stupid and lame. even by my standards. also, how the hell does jiggly play that matchup aggro?

lastly, nobody knows the puff matchup, thats why shes awful.

 

[san.]

No one likes to play against Jigglypuff in general.

I think you meant she's awful, therefore know one knows the matchup.

Aggro = approaching, because you know the sonic won't be doing anything. It's not very hard to aggro sonic with Jigglypuff, you just can't throw out moves that you think will get punished.

 

[da K.I.D.]

thats like saying, marths are super aggressive because they space fairs on peoples shields.

and i was more saying that most of the time, you dont have to know the puff matchup to beat her, which shows how bad she is.

 

[tekkie]

ZSS v Wolf is even.

this

ichu: