The Official SBR-B Brawl Tier List v3.0

[FatJackieChan]

WHEN IS THIS COMING OUT!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!!!!!!!!?!??!????????????????!?!?!!!!?!11/1/1?!?!??!?!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!???????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??????????????????????????????????????????????

We were promised another one for September, 1 every 3 months (4 a year), but alas it has been a year, and we have had one list. It is time for another, give us the tier simply based on the fact that you are one full conception late. lulz

 

[Justblaze647]

Dude idk what kinda bs you're on.

Obviously TL beats Snake.

100:0?

 

[FatJackieChan]

Top
Meta Knight
Snake

High
Ice Climbers
Diddy Kong
Falco
Wario
Marth
Pikachu
King Dedede
Olimar

Upper
Lucario
Donkey Kong
Mr. Game & Watch
R.O.B.
Toon Link
Zero Suit Samus
Kirby

Middle
Pit
Wolf
Fox
Luigi
Peach
Ike
Sheik

Low
Sonic
Zelda
Bowser
Mario
Lucas
Ness
Pokémon Trainer
Link
Yoshi

Bottom
Captain Falcon
Samus
Ganondorf
Jigglypuff

 

[Justblaze647]

Both IC's and Pika are too high, but you did get one thing right.

Jiggz position.

 

[hichez50]

jiggz can defiantly beat ganon and Captn falcon.

 

[Justblaze647]

I will continue to argue this point until i die. Jiggz is "defiantly" the worst character in the game.

Some one prove to me how Jiggz beats any character, and i want video demonstration.

 

[adumbrodeus]

I will continue to argue this point until i die. Jiggz is "defiantly" the worst character in the game.

Some one prove to me how Jiggz beats any character, and i want video demonstration.

Because you don't understand the game obviously...


Jiggs has the aerial maneuverability to literally dash-dance in the air (consider why Wario is so high for a second...) and the ability to SDI pretty much any multi-hit into rest.


Heck, the fast that she has moves faster then reaction time is more then enough to give her the advantage vs. Ganon.


Video proof? Given enough time I could produce a video of any character beating any character, vids of that sort are meaningless, what matters is attributes.

 

[Justblaze647]

Because you don't understand the game obviously...

This statement is easy enough to refute: Yes, Actually I do understand the game just fine.

Jiggs has the aerial maneuverability to literally dash-dance in the air (consider why Wario is so high for a second...) and the ability to SDI pretty much any multi-hit into rest.

Wario is high because he has the tools of a high tier character, such as KO potential, a plethora of safe moves, his neutral b, and the fart. Wario has OPTIONS.

Heck, the fast that she has moves faster then reaction time is more then enough to give her the advantage vs. Ganon.

Show me an example of a notable Jiggz defeating a notable Salmonpork.

Video proof? Given enough time I could produce a video of any character beating any character, vids of that sort are meaningless, what matters is attributes.

Okay, maybe I should clarify. Barring all friendlies, show me MM's or tourney sets in which Jiggz performs well at higher levels of play, por favor.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

*blinks.*

And show me irrefutable proof that Jiggs is absolutely horrible.

>_>

Smooth Criminal

 

[Justblaze647]

I know you guys dont wanna hear this, but I will use tournament results as my proof.

Look at Ankoku's list. If Jiggz wasn't absolutely horrible, dont you think she would have something to show for it? Which is what I'm asking for. Show me something that proves Jiggz isn't a **** character.

Go ahead, I'll wait.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Tournament placings at the bottom...1/2 to 1/3 don't even matter lol. At that point it's a matter of representation.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

I know you guys dont wanna hear this, but I will use tournament results as my proof.

Look at Ankoku's list. If Jiggz wasn't absolutely horrible, dont you think she would have something to show for it? Which is what I'm asking for. Show me something that proves Jiggz isn't a **** character.

Go ahead, I'll wait.

TIME PASSES...

Tournament placings at the bottom...1/2 to 1/3 don't even matter lol. At that point it's a matter of representation.

Lolololololololololololol.

You were saying, Blaze?

Smooth Criminal

 

[<π]

I hear someone got out of pools at #4 with solo jiggs?

JIggs is crazy underrated. only real cons she has is weight and with her momentum canceling she still live till like MK percents and "low priority" but like all characters with low priority that can easily be solved by baiting errors and taking advantage of oppertunities.

Assuming I don't miss my rests I easily live till well past the mid 100s because as jiggs you never have to put yourself at huge risk to apply pressure. think a lesser version of wario.
I never really run into priority problems because I don't challenge moves I can't beat...

The main reason, I think, people suck with jiggs and don't understand her is because they don't understand the importance of spacing, zoning, and baiting in this game. If you don't understand these very fundamental ideas only a small sub set of character can be viable by definition.

 

[DanGR]

Shigglypuff is terrible. I don't think anyone is arguing against that point.

That said, you'll be hard set on finding much worth noting for either character to prove that either is better than the other... because they're both terrible beyond words...

I'll go ahead and point out that, because of her air game, I think she is at least capable of winning games on a player's counterpick. For example, you can take certain opponents to Jungle Japes and air camp there if you happen to get the lead- you can RUN AWAY, PERIOD with Jigglypuff. I mean, that alone is enough to nudge Jigglypuff ahead of Ganon. lol

edit:

It has nothing to with Jigglypuff being a horrible character. It has everything to do with Jigglypuff being an obnoxious balloon that can do nothing but air-plank, gimp, give off squeaks of ear-wretching quality, and win by being annoying and nothing else.

qfml

 

[Clai]

I know you guys dont wanna hear this, but I will use tournament results as my proof.

Look at Ankoku's list. If Jiggz wasn't absolutely horrible, dont you think she would have something to show for it? Which is what I'm asking for. Show me something that proves Jiggz isn't a **** character.

Go ahead, I'll wait.

It has nothing to with Jigglypuff being a horrible character. It has everything to do with Jigglypuff being an obnoxious balloon that can do nothing but air-plank, gimp, give off squeaks of ear-wretching quality, and win by being annoying and nothing else.

Jigglypuff is clearly better than Captain Falcon and Ganondorf. Her matchups give the best proof of that.

 

[Deleted member]

Jigglypuff has great maneuverability, a **** grab game (good running grab and her jabs do 3% and her throws do 10, meaning she can do D3-esque grab damage at higher percents), and some decent priority sometimes. She also has pretty good zoning tools.

If she was mid weight she would be mid tier imo, but her weight realllly makes it hard for her to be successful, so shes bottom 5. However i think she is better than link xD And worse than falcon (falcon is mad good)

 

[Melomaniacal]

Can we all just agree that Jigglypuff is bad, and not tournament viable?

Okay, so she may be underrated. She's still not tournament viable.

 

[Col. Stauffenberg]

As long as we can agree she's not the worst character in the game. That's about as silly as saying she's good.

 

[<π]

Sheik on the other hand... she's a beast.


Falcon isn't a beast. his approaches are too straight forward to take advantage of. I play a solid falcon I want to main him but he is just too easy to take advantage of in just about every situation. Personally I can see him below GDorf. all of his options are easy to see and react to.

I can play jiggs in tourney in some match ups. (I use jiggs for the sheik ditto in tourney) Despite how atractive my C.Falc is I can't see any match up where he'd do well.

 

[Justblaze647]

Hmm I'm pretty sure I asked you guys to SHOW me that jiggz wasnt bad, not tell me about it...

There's a fine line between seeing something for myself, and taking someone else's word for it

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Hmm I'm pretty sure I asked you guys to SHOW me that jiggz wasnt bad, not tell me about it...

There's a fine line between seeing something for myself, and taking someone else's word for it

I asked for irrefutable proof that Jiggz was bad. You gave me a list that is RAW DATA FOR CHARACTER PLACEMENT IN TOURNEYS.

I agree that Jiggs is a bad character, but you should at least back up YOUR claims before you start asking everyone else to back up theirs.

>_>

Smooth Criminal

 

[Justblaze647]

I asked for irrefutable proof that Jiggz was bad. You gave me a list that is RAW DATA FOR CHARACTER PLACEMENT IN TOURNEYS.

I agree that Jiggs is a bad character, but you should at least back up YOUR claims before you start asking everyone else to back up theirs.

>_>

Smooth Criminal

Haha nice job continuing to dodge what I asked for. I used the tourney data for a reason. Characters that are used (and succeed) in a tourney setting do so for a number of reasons, ranging from character popularity, to the current state of the metagame, to their viability in such a setting. By pointing out that Jiggz is DEAD LAST IN TOURNEY PLACINGS, I am implying that she is the most underused, unviable, and unpopular character in a setting that focuses on HIGH LEVEL PLAY. Why do you think that is?

Is it unreasonable to assume that because a character performs the worst out of the cast when it counts for anything, that she is the worst character?

That is sound logic, imo

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Haha nice job continuing to dodge what I asked for. I used the tourney data for a reason. Characters that are used (and succeed) in a tourney setting do so for a number of reasons, ranging from character popularity, to the current state of the metagame, to their viability in such a setting. By pointing out that Jiggz is DEAD LAST IN TOURNEY PLACINGS, I am implying that she is the most underused, unviable, and unpopular character in a setting that focuses on HIGH LEVEL PLAY. Why do you think that is?

Is it unreasonable to assume that because a character performs the worst out of the cast when it counts for anything, that she is the worst character?

That is sound logic, imo

I'm not dodging anything.

Give me reasons. Tell me how she fares in this match-up and that match-up. Tell me her inherent flaws as a character. Y'know. Kinda like what everybody else is doing.

Smooth Criminal

 

[RDK]

Haha nice job continuing to dodge what I asked for. I used the tourney data for a reason. Characters that are used (and succeed) in a tourney setting do so for a number of reasons, ranging from character popularity, to the current state of the metagame, to their viability in such a setting. By pointing out that Jiggz is DEAD LAST IN TOURNEY PLACINGS, I am implying that she is the most underused, unviable, and unpopular character in a setting that focuses on HIGH LEVEL PLAY. Why do you think that is?

Is it unreasonable to assume that because a character performs the worst out of the cast when it counts for anything, that she is the worst character?

That is sound logic, imo

It's not unreasonable, but it's also not proof. Tournament rankings don't determine how good a particular character is. That's all he's asking for.

You're asserting that Jiggs is bad. All you need to do is provide proof.

 

[<π]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=229478

 

[Blackrider213]

Couldn't there also be a lack of Jigglypuff representation? Love Shigglypuff by the way.

 

[Jupz]

Thankyou Djb and KID lol. And no chewe my friend doesn't main toon link lol. I'll show those posts to him.

 

[sman5093]

Yes! Toon Link moves up

 

[Browny]

poppin by to say the notion of sheik being above sonic is laughable.

Sonics always got some top player taking names since the game came out and consistently placed decently.

dont get @ me, get at tourneys where results mean infinitely more than words :DDDD

 

[Darky-Sama]

Falcon really needs more tournament representation. The improvements in his overall metagame aren't helping much when no one's out there using him competitively. Then again, I can't really blame them. I don't see why someone would place much faith (let alone their MONEY) into using Captain Falcon in a tournament. That's basically just throwing away money.

You could buy yourself a McGriddle with that s%#&.


In all honesty though, Falcon is garbage. Even with the improvements in his metagame these past four months, it still doesn't rid the fact that he's just a bad character. Dedicated Falcon users know how to get around most of the match-ups fairly easy nowadays, but eh... Falcon just doesn't have the tools to really promote any real movement on the tier list.

Representation; no.
Potential; possibly.
Movement; probably not.

I still wanna see where ZSS gets placed though. That's my main interest.

 

[mountain_tiger]

Wait... there are people that don't think Captain Falcon is horrible? That's news to me.

Couldn't there also be a lack of Jigglypuff representation? Love Shigglypuff by the way.

The reason Jigglypuff has such little representation is because everything good she can do (e.g. air camping, gimping etc.) can be done just as well or even better by Wario. As a result, anyone who could potentially do well in tourneys with Jigglypuff instead chooses Wario because that way they have a better chance of winning.

 

[Darky-Sama]

Compared to other characters, yes, he is horrible.

He's overlooked though, I can say that much. People really don't give him enough credit. Before we discussed the Wario/Falcon match-up on our boards, people were actually assuming that the ratio was 25:75 in Wario's favor. We concluded that the ratio was 45:55 Wario now or possibly better.

-facepalm-


Also: Going with that logic, everyone should just go as Meta Knight in place of their lower tier character then. lol

 

[St. Viers]

Yeah, jiggly puff's placing is due originally to the fact that she was nerfed hard from melee, meaning people didn't want to use her. Them people realized that if you wanted to play like jigglypuff, you have wario, squirtle, and to some extent kirby and MK.

The main reason people (myself included) feel she should be higher than the likes of falcon/ganon is that even though she's not as good at what she does as wario is, she still has great aerial maneuverability, as well as a better than noted ground game, with good grabs and a small frame w/ duck. Her mobility in air gives her options most characters don't have for "approaching" as she can hit a shield and move away before being countered.

Her downsides are her weight, and lack of disjoints, but that is a problem shared by falcon and ganon. At least she has options, and moves that will actually hit people (besides falcon's jab and both's up-air). W/ momentum cancelling, her survivability goes up, and because of her insane movement w/ SDI, she can get out of multihit moves (meaning less damage racked up) and better punish said multihit moves (turtle, nado, jab combos) and as she has rest (albeit nerfed), which is an excellent move for punishing people, w/ it's quick startup and insane knockback.

Also, unless she is actually killed off a side, she can recover from anywhere, and defend herself qhile doing so--something that most characters can't do.

 

[Dark 3nergy]

Landing rest is pretty challenging to do in brawl.

 

[<π]

against a lot of the cast it can be. luckily you can combo into it.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Jigglypuff is mid tier.

Like most mid tier characters she has an amazing gimmick and lacks something else (in this case, the ability to reliably kill, and she is very light). It doesn't help that Bowser can grab-release -> uair her at 50% and kill her, lol.

My experience with Jiggly has always been that I will go even with anyone I play, and then suddenly I'll realize that I'm at kill percents, and they're not, despite the fact that we're at the same percent. Really, you're never at kill percents vs. a Jigglypuff player unless fair is fresh.

 

[Chuee]

Jiggly is definitely not mid.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

LOL at Jiggs in mid tier.

She wouldn't be mid tier even if Brawl had Melee's ADing system. And with the current ADing system...she doesn't even have a gimmick. Her Wall of Pain is now a Mole Hill of Annoyance that's fairly easy to beat. She has some of the worse KOing potential in the game outside of Rest, and even then Rest isn't as good anymore. She can't set up any of her "KOing" moves (except for SDIng INTO multihitting moves of the opponent), is lol light, range is for the most part meh, and her ground game is laughable.

If Falcon and Link got more rep, they would be above her. Jigglypuff is usable for her pocket good MUs like against D3, while hopping the other player doesn't have experience against Jigglypuff and won't know what to do...and that's it.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

There are worse characters than Jiggs in mid right now, lol.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

C or D? I'm curious.