Smash Balls

[Rad]

Guys. Seriously. Anyone who wasn't at the item crew battles at ACL that time doesn't understand the power of Wolf's final smash.

I played smash at Uni the other day and lost because I died to Wolf's final smash three times in a row. Tell me how to beat it.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I played smash at Uni the other day and lost because I died to Wolf's final smash three times in a row. Tell me how to beat it.

But Ghostbone has already answered this.

It doesn't have hitboxes from moving when in the air, so again if it goes off-stage and you're on the edge, just run to the other edge when they go off-stage, landmasters don't have enough mobility to follow you very well. (they can still get lucky and hit you, and some characters can't avoid them at all, which is what puts them above other final smashes).
You can just drop down and sweet-spot the ledge to avoid the barrel roll.

It's foolproof!

 

[Rad]

Say you do die and you're stuck spawning above the landmaster. What options do you have?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

It's possible to drop through the cannon, but the only thing you can do is try to run off.

Vs Falco and Wolf, it's pretty much death for over half the cast.

 

[Remastered]

OK I read till about page 6 for the first time today, and it's time for me to jump down some throats.

Firstly, Mario's Final Smash is the worst in the game. (You can DI out of it, and that's if it even connects)

Secondly, Grim, I did not say 3 starters was what I wanted, however I explained that it is balanced for the majority of the cast, given that most first games end up on 1 of 3 after strike anyway.

Thirdly, Ghost, I did not bring it up to discredit you or Grim, it was simply brought up as an example of dealings I have had with the 2 of you in the past. Which is completely relevant and in no way pulled from thin air just so we can all point and laugh. If I really had too, I could bring up countless other times where I have disagreed with you both, however this ruleset discussion was the most recent.

Lastly, regardless of who set up the ruleset discussion, it was still me vs the 2 of you. You 2 wanting stages like picto, PS2 and having both of you try to explain why Castle siege isn't glitchy and campy for 45 secs or a 3rd of the match or something. There is very little I have ever agreed with you on, and this is simply because I don't think you go about arguing your points the right way. Saying Ted and others were theorycrafting.... Nice work guys.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

We both hate Picto and think it should be banned, lol.

Now you're just making things up.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I like Pictochat.

The hazards aren't really disruptive, except for maybe the spikes.

 

[...Ellipsis...]

PS2 should be a starter. Or at the least counterpick it is way better than PS1

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Ellipsis knows what's up.

 

[Ghostbone]

Lastly, regardless of who set up the ruleset discussion, it was still me vs the 2 of you. You 2 wanting stages like picto, PS2 and having both of you try to explain why Castle siege isn't glitchy and campy for 45 secs or a 3rd of the match or something. There is very little I have ever agreed with you on, and this is simply because I don't think you go about arguing your points the right way. Saying Ted and others were theorycrafting.... Nice work guys.

Again, I was hardly on either side, just pointing out flaws in your arguments

And I wouldn't disagree that Castle Siege is campy for 1/3 of the match lol, what are you on about.

On and Mario's FS isn't the worst in the game...it's terrible but there are worse. (looks at Lucario, Kirby, etc.)

 

[KuroganeHammer]

tbh, I think Marth's could be worse than ZSS's.

I mean, at least it has a chance of hitting?

And if they walk into Samus they might die?

 

[dean.]

Marth's might punish lag really well I guess. And like was said jokingly earlier in the thread, it can be used for recovery. And after the final smash is completed, Marth remains Marth.

Grimbone stay on topic please.

 

[Ghostbone]

tbh, I think Marth's could be worse than ZSS's.

I mean, at least it has a chance of hitting?

And if they walk into Samus they might die?

Marth's...idk, can punish lag I guess, can hit the opponent if you predict them doing something, won't kill you if you're on the edge of the stage.
ZSS's turns her into a terrible character, it's not worth using, ever.

Plus Marth could get lucky with a shield-breaker on a weakened shield, leading into critical hit.

 

[dean.]

Can't use Shieldbreaker if you have a Smash Ball...
Unless you want to break the shield, grab a Smash Ball (although it would have to already be weakened to make it in time) and then use Critical Hit...

 

[swordsaint]

buffering.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

No Scoot. Buffering doesn't make a Shield breaker come out.

If that's what you're reffering to.

One word answers are difficult to distinguish.

I feel like Ghostbone's post was Dean's but with the shield breaker part tacked on.

 

[swordsaint]

No Scoot. Buffering doesn't make a Shield breaker come out.

If that's what you're reffering to.

One word answers are difficult to distinguish.

I feel like Ghostbone's post was Dean's but with the shield breaker part tacked on.

if you buffer b moves immediately after breaking smash ball (im not sure about other situations) you wont final smash.

 

[dean.]

But if you break a Smash Ball you'll generally be in the air, so Shieldbreaker would only hit an airborn opponent which can't shield.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Oh, that's only if the smash ball doesn't load in time.

So like, that wouldn't work if you were playing via USB loader, and under most circumstances even normal Brawl would have loaded it anyway.

 

[luke_atyeo]

Again, I was hardly on either side, just pointing out flaws in your arguments

you wouldnt know a flaw if you walked on it

 

[swordsaint]

you wouldnt know a flaw if you walked on it

This was amazing.

 

[Aussierob123]

i remember back when i played casual brawl with my friends I used to get the smash ball as ZSS purely so the others didnt get it, not because i wanted to use it.

 

[xXArrowXx]

tier list doesn't take into account how easy it is to get the smash ball with some characters

 

[toki]

Anna Bligh should be god tier

 

[Splice]

you wouldnt know a flaw if you walked on it

This is the greatest on so many levels

 

[...Ellipsis...]

But if you break a Smash Ball you'll generally be in the air, so Shieldbreaker would only hit an airborn opponent which can't shield.

charge shield breaker until you land and then use.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

tier list doesn't take into account how easy it is to get the smash ball with some characters

Nope, but only because it's difficult to gauge how easy it is to get the smash ball with different characters.

Also as if your opponent is just going to let you break his shield with shield breaker. lol

While you're charging shield breaker, your opponent has the smash ball and is using it on you.

 

[toki]

Does anyone know any good quality hairdryer?
Make tier list plz <3

 

[EverAlert]

i hear its less about the equipment and more about the technique

drying your hair for exactly 9 minutes seems quite optimal, as opposed to 8 minutes which makes you feel like camping the electricity bill even more.

 

[Gords]

peaches final smash is the worst, it is ridiculously easy to avoid and she heals her opponents.

ZSS is ok, it give her the ability to get her armor pieces back.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Re: Hair dryer tier list; I use a towel, so I don't have the matchup exp to comment on that soz.

peaches final smash is the worst, it is ridiculously easy to avoid and she heals her opponents.

Except it does 40% (or 10%/20% depending on how far away they are) damage, and the sleep effect's hitbox is around the entire time the camera is zoomed in on Peach, meaning characters who fall fast, or have bad second and third jumps will get hit by the sleep hurtbox if they touch the ground.

Admittingly, the Final Smash won't help Peach if she's low on damage, but it still puts Peach in an advantageous position, with her opponents as high as they can be so as not to be hit by the sleep effect, or on the ledge. At which Peach can go eat the peaches.

Everything C tier and under is pretty bad anyway.

ZSS's is the worst because it has very short range, won't kill anything unless they touch Samus after she's totally reformed (It has insane knockback potential) but unless they walk into her, it should never hit.

 

[Ghostbone]

ZSS's is the worst because it has very short range, won't kill anything unless they touch Samus after she's totally reformed (It has insane knockback potential) but unless they walk into her, it should never hit.

Doesn't it knock them out before the final hitbox anyway? (admittedly I'm not sure)
If not you could still probably SDI out.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Doesn't it knock them out before the final hitbox anyway? (admittedly I'm not sure)
If not you could still probably SDI out.

Nope.

When she's flashing the bright light, there's a strong hitbox (kills at maybe 70%? Possibly even more) at the end of the move, but after that, there's another even stronger hitbox, but technically it should never hit.

Ever.

Edit: Wait,
I read your post wrong. Yeah, you're right, mostly.

There's two end hitboxes. So yeah.

Edit 2:

Okay I lied. There's only two damaging hitboxes in the Final Smash. First one killed Jigglypuff at 50%, the second killed Jigglypuff at about 200%.

I... don't know what the point of the second hitbox is to be honest.

 

[xXArrowXx]

nah peachs is good for a free ko move. then heal..

 

[Ghostbone]

nah peachs is good for a free ko move. then heal..

What's Peach going to KO with though?
Up-smash won't sweetspot, f-smash is random......

 

[xXArrowXx]

u get a turnip. u throw it up. downsmash. turnip hits them up. sweet spot upsmash.
happened to a friend of a friend of mine.

 

[toki]

This is why Peach should be able to tranform into Snake.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

What's Peach going to KO with though?
Up-smash won't sweetspot, f-smash is random......

f-smash isn't that random. Chuck out a f-smash and space it properly. Hope you get the Tennis Racket or Golf Club.

Admittingly Peach will find it hard to KO, but that's hardly the Final Smash's fault. lol

 

[Ghostbone]

u get a turnip. u throw it up. downsmash. turnip hits them up. sweet spot upsmash.
happened to a friend of a friend of mine.

That wouldn't work, turnip > up-smash might, idk though.

And Aerodrome, you can only judge moves in the context of how the character can use it.
If Peach can't utilise her final smash well (she can't kill out of it) that means it's bad.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Yes, but is potentially healing off all your damage, and still doing relatively decent damage to your opponent good?

I think so.