Official BBR Matchup Chart v1.0

[mikeHAZE]

ike is hard too LOL

 

[Suspect]

Reported for trolling.


I didn't even lose that set, and I'm 7-0 vs that Ike in tournament sets.

LOL MAD

I dont think diddy beats marth as bad as 99% of marth players think. 55-45 diddy perhaps

Diddy just has a better representation of his character than marth

aka

Diddy mains(some) are on a higher level imo

 

[Raziek]

^See? xD (Edit: @ MikeHaze)

We originally sort of agreed at +2, but after seeing the discrepancy with the Ike panel (They had 0's and +1 Marth), we re-discussed briefly and settled on +1.

I'm pretty sure I play one of the few actually existent Ikes other than San and Mr. Doom, lmao.

 

[mikeHAZE]

LOL MAD

I dont think diddy beats marth as bad as 99% of marth players think. 55-45 diddy perhaps

Diddy just has a better representation of his character than marth

aka

Diddy mains(some) are on a higher level imo

you're too good of a troll

 

[etecoon]

diddy mains are horrible, ice climbers are the only character I can think of offhand whose mains are worse when given a different character, most of them just learn when to throw bananas and spot dodge and ****

razieks knee jerk salt spewing is amazing because it's the same inability to let something go that causes him to challenge ike's fsmash head on repeatedly and then act like he knows other characters' MU's better than they do

 

[Suspect]

you're too good of a troll

diddy mains are horrible, ice climbers are the only character I can think of offhand whose mains are worse when given a different character, most of them just learn when to throw bananas and spot dodge and ****

razieks knee jerk salt spewing is amazing because it's the same inability to let something go that causes him to challenge ike's fsmash head on repeatedly and then act like he knows other characters' MU's better than they do

no he is

and dont be mad mike, west coast too good

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

I'm pretty sure I play one of the few actually existent Ikes other than San and Mr. Doom, lmao.

no. there is only san. and that which we call mr.doom is actually the spirit of SDI that came into brawl in the form of ike. but san is the only true ike ever....

thus sayeth der random san fan

 

[Steam]

I said Lucario v Marth was a 0, but even with the info I put in it still ended up as a -1, oh well I was flip flopping on -1 and 0.

G&W is not a -1, that one I am absolutely certain on.

what's even more stupid is that the marth's never replied to what we gave them :/

 

[Spelt]

razieks knee jerk salt spewing is amazing because it's the same inability to let something go that causes him to challenge ike's fsmash head on repeatedly and then act like he knows other characters' MU's better than they do

kind of ironic seeing as if anyone anywhere at anytime brings up anything even the slightest bit related related to meta knight being overpowered you go bat**** crazy and call them scrubs and say they don't know how to play against meta knight.

you should just change your name to 'salt', honestly. more fitting.

 

[En.Ee.Oh]

diddy mains are horrible, ice climbers are the only character I can think of offhand whose mains are worse when given a different character, most of them just learn when to throw bananas and spot dodge and ****

etecoon... are you me...?


no... seriously....

 

[Blue Yoshi]

It shows in the chart that Zelda/Sheik (combined) vs DK is an even matchup (0), however, Sheik vs DK is an advantage for Sheik (1). So... by definition of Zelda/Sheik (best combination depending on matchup), Zelda/Sheik should be at least a 1 against DK, but their score shows 0.

Just a mistake I saw that I thought I'd point out. It may have already been pointed out, but I didn't feel like reading through 2000 posts.

Some matchups here are not at all what I expected to see... but I guess better people know what they are talking about...

 

[Luigi player]

Sheik doesn't beat DK. -_-

 

[Juushichi]

That matchup is even.

 

[Tagxy]

Which match-ups are coming off as overrated for Marth?

The sense Im getting is that no one feels like one particular MU is far off. But while every other character (even Metaknight) had some MU disagreements that fell for and against their favor, Marth had basically all of them fall in his favor. And if you do that with like 10 MUs it adds up.

From what I read what happened was character X would claim a ratio like 0, marth panel would then claim something way out like -3, then theyd settle at -1 and would call it "compromise".

kind of ironic seeing as if anyone anywhere at anytime brings up anything even the slightest bit related related to meta knight being overpowered you go bat**** crazy and call them scrubs and say they don't know how to play against meta knight.

you should just change your name to 'salt', honestly. more fitting.

Hes sort of right though. Not to pick on Raziek because hes not the only one and hes certainly not the worst one, but he's the most recent culprit

(I blame MK under-rating himself, LOL 3 EVEN MATCH-UPS)

Without making a claim to what the ratios should be, what does Raziek know about metaknight, diddy, falco, pikachu and more specifically the MK-diddy/falco/pika MU to make such a statement? Of course people who do this make blanket statements so people skip over it, but when he says that he's claming knowledge of 4 different characters and 3 different MUs. It sorta screams bias from those who want MK banned, as if they want him banned before they even bother to look at evidence against it. And just to quote something relevant...

mike LMAO @ how many people "know marth's MUs and how he should win" in comparison to how many people actually know how to use/play marth at all

****s like 3,000 - 10

replace marth with MK or whatever character

 

[san.]

I think most people should know about Meta Knight since a vast majority of players have a pocket Meta Knight.

 

[Nike.]

Diddy ***** Marth.

Raziek is very knowledgeable of marth and especially stages. His name is purple for a reason.

We have complete opposite views on stage legality (he's liberal, I'm conservative) but he backs his info up like a motha. I'm unsure why people are attacking him for his views.

 

[Espy Rose]

I think most people should know about Meta Knight since a vast majority of players have a pocket Meta Knight.

I would think not, considering pocket Meta Knights only occur when the player is losing.
Now, they can't be losing all of their games all of the time, right?

Not to mention that some of them just might not be at a reasonable level to grab experience from.

 

[Tagxy]

I honestly didnt mean to single out Raziek, only the highlighted part of what I quoted. He was just the last person from a large group of people that said something like that.

 

[Raziek]

No hard feelings, Tag.

Hard feelings against Etecoon though. ***.

 

[jiovanni007]

I'm unsure why people are attacking him for his views.

Cuz we prejudiced foo.

On topic, sort of.

I looked at Kirby's matchups and they look legit, but why is he +3 on Sheik lol?

 

[Coney]

diddy mains are horrible, ice climbers are the only character I can think of offhand whose mains are worse when given a different character, most of them just learn when to throw bananas and spot dodge and ****

 

[Max Ketchum]

Hard feelings against Etecoon though. ***.

Was that necessary? <_<

 

[Judo777]

yea the DK Sheilda MU is a mistake. I think the confusion arose when I talked to the DK boards about Sheilda, and I forgot that we agreed on +1 for sheik in the sheik thread (mostly due to the fact that I thought Sheik DK was even but the other 2 disagreed so i conceded). As a result i spent the entire time talking about how we thought Sheilda was even (when i should have been arguing +1 for Sheik and Sheilda which was agreed on in the sheik thread.)

So my mistaken and IDK if we can update the OP or not but honestly if you wanted to A change the Sheik MU to even, or B change the Sheilda MU either would be ok with me. (TBH i do think Sheik should be bumped down to even with DK because Sheik does well vs DK but she can't freaking kill him.)

Actually i am going to try and fix this.

 

[-Mars-]

Yea the DK-Sheik ratio struck me as a little odd.

Edit: Kirby is +3 with Sheik because Judo gets handled by Y.b.M. :D

I think that MU is +2.

 

[Judo777]

Yea the DK-Sheik ratio struck me as a little odd.

Edit: Kirby is +3 with Sheik because Judo gets handled by Y.b.M, Joey and Soldier 2 when he picks his tertiary Kirby :D

I think that MU is +2.

Hahaha fixed.

Dude i really think it is +3 tho. Its a large advantage. Not as bad as Pika and IC's mind you but again the MU's aren't comparable within the numbers.

 

[Max Ketchum]

Real talk, Kirby vs. Sheik does seem pretty horrible just thinking about it.

 

[Flayl]

Why more horrible than against high tiers?

 

[Max Ketchum]

She can't challenge bair at all. Kirby can also crouch under needles and abuse her landing options horribly.

 

[Spelt]

and i doubt ftilt = free damage on him like it does to most of the cast.

 

[Z'zgashi]

she can get 2-3 ftilts off at low damage

 

[WindMajor]

Don't forget:

Inhale break to foot stool.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I agree with etecoon soooooooooooo much @ IC and Diddy.

 

[Luigi player]

I agree with etecoon soooooooooooo much @ IC and Diddy.

I exist though, so his statement is invalid

(pretty sure the other Diddys are also good with other characters, but of course not as good as with Diddy... but the same can be said for everyone)


This is also not really true for IC mains :\ most if not all of them use 2ndaries that might not be as good as their ICs (obviously since they main ICs and not someone else), but most of them have MKs or other chars they can use.

 

[Juushichi]

She can't challenge bair at all. Kirby can also crouch under needles and abuse her landing options horribly.

Also returning to the stage >100 is bad enough, I won't say it's impossible vs Kirby, but I feel like if I get on stage over one hundred, that Kirby is doing something wrong.

Love Coney's reaction gif and I wish I saw Joey (zenigame) and S2 offline more. They're so good.

 

[Steam]

why does shielda not do better against lucario than Sheik or Zelda seperately? They each really solve each other's problems against him and I honestly think It could be a 0...

 

[Flayl]

She can't challenge bair at all. Kirby can also crouch under needles and abuse her landing options horribly.

Can't Marth do this too except for the crouching?

 

[-Mars-]

Can't Marth do this too except for the crouching?

Except Marth doesn't have 5 jumps so he has to land a lot and eat needle storms.

 

[Doc King]

I think that the Dedede vs Wario matchup should be a +3 for Dedede because of Wario's grab release problems which gives Dedede a good advantage for a swallow kill when your in the lead, an up tilt kill, etc. Dedede can combo Wario pretty good and kill him pretty good with his down throw and stuff. Dedede can also infinite Wario on slopes where Wario goes upward with my new Dedede infinite discovery technique (http://allisbrawl.com/forum/topic.aspx?id=176686).

 

[Spelt]

you would have a point if it were still 2008.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Yeah. The matchup is troublesome for Wario, but it's definitely not more than +2, and I might argue that it's better than that.

You just have to embrace your inner lame.