Meta Knight's Revenge: The Official Match-Up Thread *Wario* -> GO

[saviorslegacy]

I think Sheik is probably the 1st or 2nd most underrated character in the game.

Wait, who is the other one?

 

[Max Ketchum]

I'd be willing to bet it's Toon Link, Luigi, or Pit.

 

[Palpi]

I would be willing to bet that is is Fox or Captain Falcon. Blazing speed makes all match-ups even!!!!! -.-'

 

[saviorslegacy]

Hey, I was going to sat C. Falcon.
I might say Link though.

 

[Cold Fusion]

It's Jigglypuff! It's Jigglypuff! It's a Jigglypuff!

 

[ksizl4life]

LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

lolsheik

just lolz

LOLLLLLLL

 

[smasher01]

Whats the C. Falcon match up lol

 

[OverLade]

I was actually thinking Donkey Kong was mad underrated, but come to think of it TL and Pit are mad underrated as well.

lol@Blazingspeedmakesallevnematchups.

 

[Omni]

Let's not talk about what a Sheik player "could" do if they used her correctly or if they used her to her maximum extent. It hasn't happened for a reason. Leave the theory at home.

Sheik using a chain correctly doesn't change how bad this match-up is for Sheik. It's kinda' like IC's Blizzard. Just DI into the blizzard (while in the air) and mash d-air and you'll break through.

 

[HungryLikeAWolf]

My wolf vs. metaknight experience

I have a friend who plays meta all the time, and i honestly think that wolf is the best match against him. My friend's rob also does well but in the case of wolf I think that he has counters a good amount of metaknight's moves and tactics. First of all, wolf can easily lock down the corkscrew and tornado w/ his laser(shoot normally or short hop shoot). secondly, because wolfs front smash and down smash have so much priority and speed on the ground metaknight is forced to slow down and play a much less aggressive style. It's obvious that metaknight can dominate when these two characters are off the edge but that just means wolf has to stay away from the edge and fight in the middle of the stage. ppl can argue that metaknight will own wolf in the air, and that's true. But if wolf doesn't meet metaknight in the air and air dodges like crazy whenever there is an arial engagement, then meta is forced to use short hop attacks. when he does that wolf can short hop laser and also forward b metaknight(who's short hop is at a perfect height to get metaknight tagged with this move pretty consistently) another move that can throw a wrench in metaknights game is the occasional up B across the stage. This is effective late in matches when u've been peppering metaknight with ur laser for a good 5 minutes and want to make an aggressive approach to slam the door on him. I also think spamming back air is a sh**ty idea against metaknight avoid arial combat in this matchup, period. Stay away from the edge and use down smash for a knock out. and if ur really feeling it and up by a bit then maybe chase off the edge for a surprise b-air KO or F-air KO. In conclusion if u didn't want to read this whole thing...

PS: I didn't even mention the reflector shield. Sidestep when metaknight dashes then reflector shield to a Downsmash very easy

ground: adv. wolf
air: adv. metaknight
recovery: adv. metaknight
projectile: adv. wolf
grab: slight adv. metaknight
dodging: slight adv. metaknight

If you think I'm an idiot plz explain and do it well because I've played mult. metaknights w/ my wolf and I always feel like I'm in control and it's on me to lose the match with an untimely suicide or an over anxious chase off the edge.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Let's not talk about what a Sheik player "could" do if they used her correctly or if they used her to her maximum extent. It hasn't happened for a reason. Leave the theory at home.

This entire discussion IS theory. Whether it's theory backed up by personal experience or theory backed up by frame data and other technical details it still the same core thing THEORY.

 

[Affinity]

I have a friend who plays meta all the time, and i honestly think that wolf is the best match against him. My friend's rob also does well but in the case of wolf I think that he has counters a good amount of metaknight's moves and tactics. First of all, wolf can easily lock down the corkscrew and tornado w/ his laser(shoot normally or short hop shoot). secondly, because wolfs front smash and down smash have so much priority and speed on the ground metaknight is forced to slow down and play a much less aggressive style. It's obvious that metaknight can dominate when these two characters are off the edge but that just means wolf has to stay away from the edge and fight in the middle of the stage. ppl can argue that metaknight will own wolf in the air, and that's true. But if wolf doesn't meet metaknight in the air and air dodges like crazy whenever there is an arial engagement, then meta is forced to use short hop attacks. when he does that wolf can short hop laser and also forward b metaknight(who's short hop is at a perfect height to get metaknight tagged with this move pretty consistently) another move that can throw a wrench in metaknights game is the occasional up B across the stage. This is effective late in matches when u've been peppering metaknight with ur laser for a good 5 minutes and want to make an aggressive approach to slam the door on him. I also think spamming back air is a sh**ty idea against metaknight avoid arial combat in this matchup, period. Stay away from the edge and use down smash for a knock out. and if ur really feeling it and up by a bit then maybe chase off the edge for a surprise b-air KO or F-air KO. In conclusion if u didn't want to read this whole thing...

PS: I didn't even mention the reflector shield. Sidestep when metaknight dashes then reflector shield to a Downsmash very easy

ground: adv. wolf
air: adv. metaknight
recovery: adv. metaknight
projectile: adv. wolf
grab: slight adv. metaknight
dodging: slight adv. metaknight

If you think I'm an idiot plz explain and do it well because I've played mult. metaknights w/ my wolf and I always feel like I'm in control and it's on me to lose the match with an untimely suicide or an over anxious chase off the edge.

No. Just no.

 

[OverLade]

No. Just no.

Why does this keep happeniong? That sounds like a Gamefaqs wifi summary btw.

 

[Jim Morrison]

Lmao, that was a prettyinaccurate write-up and it most certainly made me lol. Wolf has like... nothing.

No, just... No.

 

[OverLade]

Well to be entirely nonbiased and productive...

Wolf has a couple things on MK. MK can't nadospam him (reflector is probably one of the most versatile nado counters in the game), and Wolf can force MK to approach.

Other than that MK wins, but I hear Anti's Wolf does really well against top MKs. Its possible that it's not as bad as people say...but that doesn't mean it's good or that Wolf does any better than most good characters at best.

 

[ksizl4life]

anti is probably the only good wolf in the country. maybe ninjalink.

this guy says hes played multiple mk's? are any of them good? that are notable? plz name a few.

i hate ignorance

 

[OverLade]

edit: Nvm I think hes from WC.

Isn't JJ the best wolf?

 

[DMG]

Doesn't matter if Anti's Wolf beats MK players, the question really is about is Wolf SUPPOSED to beat those MK's?

I mean, I don't think Wolf is Poopoo, but I'm gonna start clawing at my eyes if I see one more person say something like "55:45 MK favor" when it's against a character who clearly beats then 60:40 at least.

So for my Sake, please don't do that.

 

[LiL.Will]

edit: Nvm I think hes from WC.

Isn't JJ the best wolf?

Yeah the Wolf boards consider him the best Wolf now.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

JJ is the best Wolf mainer but that doesn't mean his Wolf is the best. I haven't seen much of Anti's Wolf but it's easy to see why he's supposed to be better - simply because it's Anti. JJ has a really good Wolf though but overall he isn't good enough a player to be a top-level Wolf (he also told me often on Aim that he doesn't consider himself a very good player) and I also think NLs Wolf is better (but that's just imo). JJ is mostly known to **** Diddy Kong and he also seems to play the Snake match-up well. However, he also told me that he also beat dmbrandon's MK (to get back on the Wolf/MK match-up), which doesn't mean nothing. It also doesn't mean nothing if Anti's Wolf takes games off M2K and ksizzle.
I know a lot about this match-up but I rather let more experienced players speak up first to see what they think.

Imo it's 6/4 MK favour.

 

[OverLade]

Doesn't matter if Anti's Wolf beats MK players, the question really is about is Wolf SUPPOSED to beat those MK's?

I mean, I don't think Wolf is Poopoo, but I'm gonna start clawing at my eyes if I see one more person say something like "55:45 MK favor" when it's against a character who clearly beats then 60:40 at least.

So for my Sake, please don't do that.

I agree with this, and I think as long as MK plays the appropriate kind of gay then the majority of matchups are at least 60/40 in his favor. But a lot of MK players choose not to use "optimal gayness".

Personally I think Wolf "optimally could do really well against MK though. Assuming you could master his invincibility on Shine you could avoid being juggled (I may be wrong, but sounds like it would work).

But on paper isn't what cranks out tourney results anyway so...

 

[Jim Morrison]

If Wolf had a somewhat less gimpable or obvious recovery, it could've been 55:45 (methinks), as I nearly never kill a Wolf off the sides/top.
(inb4Wolfmainssayingnooowolfsrecovery is almostungimpable)

 

[Deoxys]

The matchup depends on the counterpicks available, but it's at least 65:35 MK. I don't think I've even played 10 games against a good wolf, but it's still really clear to me. This is assuming we're talking about the matchup numbers for a best-of-3 set.

I have a friend who plays meta all the time, and i honestly think that wolf is the best match against him.

I stopped reading there.

 

[vicious1990]

I have a friend who plays meta all the time, and i honestly think that wolf is the best match against him. My friend's rob also does well but in the case of wolf I think that he has counters a good amount of metaknight's moves and tactics. First of all, wolf can easily lock down the corkscrew and tornado w/ his laser(shoot normally or short hop shoot). secondly, because wolfs front smash and down smash have so much priority and speed on the ground metaknight is forced to slow down and play a much less aggressive style. It's obvious that metaknight can dominate when these two characters are off the edge but that just means wolf has to stay away from the edge and fight in the middle of the stage. ppl can argue that metaknight will own wolf in the air, and that's true. But if wolf doesn't meet metaknight in the air and air dodges like crazy whenever there is an arial engagement, then meta is forced to use short hop attacks. when he does that wolf can short hop laser and also forward b metaknight(who's short hop is at a perfect height to get metaknight tagged with this move pretty consistently) another move that can throw a wrench in metaknights game is the occasional up B across the stage. This is effective late in matches when u've been peppering metaknight with ur laser for a good 5 minutes and want to make an aggressive approach to slam the door on him. I also think spamming back air is a sh**ty idea against metaknight avoid arial combat in this matchup, period. Stay away from the edge and use down smash for a knock out. and if ur really feeling it and up by a bit then maybe chase off the edge for a surprise b-air KO or F-air KO. In conclusion if u didn't want to read this whole thing...

PS: I didn't even mention the reflector shield. Sidestep when metaknight dashes then reflector shield to a Downsmash very easy

ground: adv. wolf
air: adv. metaknight
recovery: adv. metaknight
projectile: adv. wolf
grab: slight adv. metaknight
dodging: slight adv. metaknight

If you think I'm an idiot plz explain and do it well because I've played mult. metaknights w/ my wolf and I always feel like I'm in control and it's on me to lose the match with an untimely suicide or an over anxious chase off the edge.

wow just wow lol.

 

[Sushi-Man]

He is probably new to this site since he only has two posts. Cut him some slack

 

[hinkage]

For the Fox/Falco match up one thing I like to do is ledge hug then they use side B and immediately follow with Shuttle Loop. Best that can happen is you reverse SL them, worst is that you mistimed it and they hit you out, which still should be near nonpunishable. However, if you miss the reverse SL and they don't go through you, you can glide attack. This is, of course, more for higher per cents and if you don't feel confident just use nado.

 

[Roxas1988]

Why is Reverse SL gimps the sexiest thing in the game. I pull it off and get yelled at all day. Like "this is why we call him Metagay." LOL ooo the haters they are so funny. killing at nearly 0% with that is the best feeling ever.

 

[Toronto Joe]

antis wolf has so many umad combos xD

also what do u ppl think is the best way to gimp wolfs sideb? i only have the up-b gimp down xD

 

[Overswarm]

Stand underneath where he's going to be and charge an f-smash.

Or go off and dair him.

Either or.

If you want the guarantee, tornado. Then hit him with something as he's coming down to knock him off stage and edgeguard again. It's ****ing wolf.

 

[smasher01]

what do you mean on paper lol?

 

[Roxas1988]

Should MK be ****** wolf or be getting *****. Cuz some people were tellin me its in wolf's favor. Im not buying it though. Any thoughts?

 

[DMG]

Should MK be ****** wolf or be getting *****. Cuz some people were tellin me its in wolf's favor. Im not buying it though. Any thoughts?

MK gets wrecked. He doesn't have a projectile, so Wolf can outcamp him easily even though his blaster really isn't that good.

I hope I am a good troll.

 

[Roxas1988]

MK gets wrecked. He doesn't have a projectile, so Wolf can outcamp him easily even though his blaster really isn't that good.

I hope I am a good troll.

really? I thought MK could be just as campy with spacing his aerials. I have heard that wolf's bair ***** MK. I thought the nadoe beats his blaster. I guess not though. What about wolf vs MK aerial-wise? LOL dont tell me youz a troll. jk

 

[OverLade]

Wolfs bair is so gay and disjointed. None of MKs moves beat it, and if they just camp it then MK can't really do anything.

 

[FunkMaster]

christ.

rozas, don't be fooled.

if suddenly wolf has an advantage on metaknight then the world has truly gone mad.

wait.....YOU aren't tricking me, are you? Like some kind of reverse mind-game thingie.

anyway, if anyone has something on metaknight, it's sheik. but only on FD, I believe.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I told you guys already that it's 6/4 in MKs favour. Gimping is the key in this match-up if you don't gimp Wolf the match-up is like even. Wolfs recovery is not inherently gimpable but MK has the right tools to gimp him regardless. If you want to have the advantage you SHOULD gimp him at least once every match.

Here are some facts:

- Shine, Blaster, bair and fair all consistently beat the tornado. Fair doesn't beat tornado if it's stale though afaik
- FFNair -> dsmash is a true combo @ high % and FFnair -> AAA is always a true combo.
- Bair -> fsmash is a true combo @ low %. Depeding on staleness bair can combo @ much higher % though (there's a vid of JJ using 7 bairs in a row against a rob and it's inescapable) but idk how much vs MK
- If you hit Wolfs shield with dsmash he can dsmash you back
- Wolfs fair has a pretty ridiculous hitbox...it's possibly one of the largest aerial hitboxes. The tip of it's hitbox is 100% disjointed and it beats MKs fair, bair, nair and can also beat MKs dair camping (plus a fresh, well spaced fair beats the tornado too).

 

[Roxas1988]

Wolfs bair is so gay and disjointed. None of MKs moves beat it, and if they just camp it then MK can't really do anything.

WHOA let's not get carried away now. I have played campy wolf's. It's not like there's nothing we can't do. For instance we could approach with a drill rush as well as a GA if they start camping.

christ.

rozas, don't be fooled.

if suddenly wolf has an advantage on metaknight then the world has truly gone mad.

wait.....YOU aren't tricking me, are you? Like some kind of reverse mind-game thingie.

anyway, if anyone has something on metaknight, it's sheik. but only on FD, I believe.

LOL im not tricking you in any way. I just started playing good wolfs recently and the matches started getting a lttle harder to win. And besides, when it comes down to it MK gimps wolf a new butt hole no matter how campy he can be. And def agree with sheik being a good match against MK. I recently stated about the GR>DAC **** on MK, as well as her early D-smash kills on the edge.

 

[Toronto Joe]

-______________________-

 

[Jupz]

How do you guys feel on the Pikachu matchup? Is pika's 0-52 chaingrab real or not? Because anther never seems to use it.

 

[Roxas1988]

How do you guys feel on the Pikachu matchup? Is pika's 0-52 chaingrab real or not? Because anther never seems to use it.

Ive actually used pikachu quite alot and have spoken to anther about pika. It's treu in some cases. But DI and Mk's fast aerials get him out of almost anything. One thing pika always has at low damage is the fthrow>hyphenUS.