Falco's Match-Ups IMO

[Hai Im Fearless]

@MMM the chain grab on Marth 4 dash grabs, then 2 boost grabs.

Falco is not that easy to Juggle, he has one of the fastest fall speeds in the game. The only way you can be juggled so easily is if you're constantly DIing into them.

Pikachu can't do the chain grab with an unstale down throw from 50 ish and at the mid/high 40s he can only get get 2 or 3, which isn't too bad.

@Mav why do you think Falco Olimar is even?

Does anyone know if Hrnut has play Esam?

hrnut on fearless' account

When i do get the chance i plan to play him and see what else i can learn about the MU and keep the vids...i'm not gonna lie though fighting ESAM with falco is gonna be rough

 

[da K.I.D.]

i played a pikachu in a small tourney yesterday.

if you know cura the IC main. he went pika for a game in grand finals. he got the first grab on me, so I had to play catch up the majority of the time. but when falco gets momentum vs pikachu, he can ride it for like ever.

i almost came back in the end with like a 0-100 combo. but he narrowly edged past me in the end.

Its closer to even than one would believe but its VERY momentum based matchup.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Its closer to even than one would believe but its VERY momentum based matchup.

Most match-ups are the same way when you think about it. Most of the time it's a huge spacing war to try to get in on the other player. Once you do, it's a matter of keeping up the momentum for as long as possible. Many characters just fail that bad when it comes to getting juggled.

 

[M@v]

Falco destroys peach lol. It can be hard for falco if he doesn't know the mu however; REALLY hard if he doesn't know how to handle Peach's nair. Seriously. It the Princess's trump card in the MU. Its really good vs falco in many situations, and probably her safest aerial vs him.

 

[swordsaint]

mav im gonna go out and say you either haven't played a good peach or are just plain silly

a good peach is able to keep up with falco VERY well. although maybe i dont know the matchup. but i dont think he destroys peach at all, she chain grabs him and can't be chaingrabbed, has other good combo strings and a good projectile in the turnip.

she also plays a good defense game to hold her stocks, and can actually kill falco at a decent percent because of falcos weight an the rare turnip gimp

her jabs as fast as ours and pretty much makes her fair safe on shield.

as you said as well, her nair is good in this matchup

i also might add that peach's ftilt is absolutely **** when used correctly.

 

[M@v]

I've played kyon, the best peach in the atlantic south, tons of times. I've also beat mw peaches, and although it wasn't tourney, dark pch as well.

This matchup was drilled into me during my time in Florida, lol.

 

[HRNUT (Honey Roasted)]

Nah son peach falco is a close MU if peach plays it correctly, i'm training kyon in the MU so he gets better at it...kyon just doesn't know the answer for some things just yet.

 

[M@v]

He was doing a lot of stuff right honestly.

Like not trying to outcamp falco.

Smart nairs.

Etc.

The ratio(although I dont like them) is probably 6:4

 

[da K.I.D.]

I agree with M@v, I played a few of the higher level peaches at the last mlg and I feel like he has a solid but not overwhelming advantage over her.

also, people need to realise that peachs fair being safe is not a big deal. because she will jab after it like 98% of the time, so if you just shield the fair, AND the jabs, you should be able to punish afterwards fairly easily.

 

[Seagull Joe]

I agree with DEHF's list. It's pretty much exactly what I thought of Falco's matchups. Though probably less matchups are 60-40 and more are 55-45.

 

[swordsaint]

My recent tournaments have led me to believe Wario is 60-40 over us. The chain grab he has from 50/70 > 120 is devestating in this matchup. It's difficult to avoid without abusing platforms, and if he has the lead he can simply wait it out. Even if he decides to hit us to remove the chaingrab, it'll probably be an uair, while will make it a little more difficult to get back to the ground and you'll most likely cop at least one more uair putting us at about 90 from the small juggle he's landed.

It's very frustrating that Tedeth (Australia's Wario) know's this chaingrab, as I believe it changes the matchup tremendously, and it also feels like he has a few practically safe things on shield with dair and nair because of Wario's amazing airspeed. I don't know what to do anymore.

What's more is that while waiting he builds a waft, and while chaingrabbing us he builds is waft too. He zones us better than most characters, is difficult to kill and kills us very early.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Anyone find it ironic that Falco's biggest match-up disadvantages and potiential ones (wario?), is due to some stupid chaingrab. Chaingrabs are gay.

 

[Denzi]

Wario can only start the CG with an unstaled dthrow from 52-65%. Just don't get grabbed around then and use the fact that he'll be doing nothing but trying to land a grab then to take advantage and rack in some damage (or even kill).

Anyone find it ironic that Falco's biggest match-up disadvantages and potiential ones (wario?), is due to some stupid chaingrab. Chaingrabs are gay.

It's funny because that's one of the major reasons Falco is as good as he is.

 

[swordsaint]

Wario can only start the CG with an unstaled dthrow from 52-65%. Just don't get grabbed around then and use the fact that he'll be doing nothing but trying to land a grab then to take advantage and rack in some damage (or even kill).



It's funny because that's one of the major reasons Falco is as good as he is.

If you make a mistake though, you're grabbed. If you use the platform, you're getting *****.

 

[Coffee™]

Just gonna point these out. I'm pretty sure Falco can't CG Marth that high even with boost grabs. Marth can DI up after the 2nd grab and Up B out of anything past that. Also if you Dair him after the Dthrow he can still Up B you. >_>

As far as Pikachu is concerned. I think the matchup is 65:35. I've played ESAM a few times just to try out the matchup and it's bad....

Sure you can platform camp but it's not hard for Pika to get a few percent on you from an Uair then run to the other side of the stage and duck lasers until you approach him which makes it so much harder for Falco to get that first grab he "NEEDS" to possibly win the match.

If Falco takes the first stock without putting himself at kill percentage he has a reasonably good chance at winning the matchup as he does well at keeping Pikachu out and avoiding his kill moves.However, if Pika does get Falco's first stock it becomes an uphill battle that's ridiculously hard to come back from. To say the matchup between the two is anything lower than 65:35 is to seriously underrate Pikachu. ESAM will probably make a more detailed post on it when he name searches this. lol

 

[DEHF]

Just gonna point these out. I'm pretty sure Falco can't CG Marth that high even with boost grabs. Marth can DI up after the 2nd grab and Up B out of anything past that. Also if you Dair him after the Dthrow he can still Up B you. >_>

Pretty sure he can't get out of the chain grab at all, you're most likely timing the dash grab wrong. Marth continues to go further and further after each chain grab, that's probably why you're saying that he is DIing up out of it.

If the chain grab is done to the full % he the best he can hope for is to up b after he techs the spike, but Falco should have enough time to shield if he fastfalls after he dairs. If Marth is at a % where he doesn't have to tech the spike Falco should still have enough time to shield his up b.

 

[Coffee™]

Pretty sure he can't get out of the chain grab at all, you're most likely timing the dash grab wrong. Marth continues to go further and further after each chain grab, that's probably why you're saying that he is DIing up out of it.

This is what I thought at first too. I played Chaz last week in tournament and chaingrabbed him with the Dash Grab just fine but we played a few friendlies afterwards and he started getting out of it and I realised Marth was going slightly higher off the ground after Falco's Dthrow. I asked him what he was doing and he simply said he started DIing up and using Up B to get out. I tried it out versus Seibrik playing Marth yesterday and he was able to do the same thing. =/

I haven't tested it extensively or anything but from all the matches I played with their Marths it seems pretty likely.

If the chain grab is done to the full % he the best he can hope for is to up b after he techs the spike, but Falco should have enough time to shield if he fastfalls after he dairs. If Marth is at a % where he doesn't have to tech the spike Falco should still have enough time to shield his up b.

I know if Marth is at a % where he has to tech then Falco is safe but I'm not entirely sure about earlier percents. It's possible I wasn't fast falling the Dair after the spike like you brought up so I'll probably look into that again.

 

[ANTi_]

LUCARIO VS FALCO = 55:45 FALCO.

Dont DISAGREE *****

 

[DEHF]

LUCARIO VS FALCO = 55:45 FALCO.

Dont DISAGREE *****

Oh okay

Spoiler

I disagree

 

[da K.I.D.]

Ima practice up. and get my falco madd good. and when im feeling a bit more confident. Ill money match esam with it.

 

[ksizl4life]

Oh okay

Spoiler

I disagree

i used to think it was one of lucarios worse MUs cuz bair shuts him down in the air but after picking up falco and playing it from falcos side, it can get pretty annoying.you can have crazy momentum and **** the lucario all match, but theres still a big chance that you could lose.

i think its 55:45

 

[ANTi_]

i used to think it was one of lucarios worse MUs cuz bair shuts him down in the air but after picking up falco and playing it from falcos side, it can get pretty annoying.you can have crazy momentum and **** the lucario all match, but theres still a big chance that you could lose.

i think its 55:45

Thank you.



That's why Lee beat RAIN, *****.

 

[MetalMusicMan]

i used to think it was one of lucarios worse MUs cuz bair shuts him down in the air but after picking up falco and playing it from falcos side, it can get pretty annoying.you can have crazy momentum and **** the lucario all match, but theres still a big chance that you could lose.

i think its 55:45

I agree with this.

 

[M@v]

Falco vs lucario is simple. Falco has a hard time killing lucario. Lucario gets to super high percent because of it and becomes better than metaknight. Falco has to play keepaway to avoid getting ***** and makes the problem go from bad to worse. Its really annoying honestly.

 

[ksizl4life]

larry if we ever play in tourney, im going cario.

idc if i lose. it should be fun!

well for one of us

 

[da K.I.D.]

its a lot easier when you stop trying to fight lucario head up and focus on just getting him offstage.

falco actually does a pretty decent job of gimping luc if he can somehow get rid of his double jump.

 

[M@v]

Pretty much. Lucarios upb is almost as bad as ours......

 

[ksizl4life]

lol falcos wont be gimping lucarios with a brain. he doesnt have THAT much control off stage. i play them both so i know.

 

[da K.I.D.]

it does take some doing, but if you can get them to use their up b, its usually a free **** parade after that. but his fair is so good at beating attacks and freeing up the ledge for him its hard to put him in that kind of position.

 

[Dark 3nergy]

Pretty sure he can't get out of the chain grab at all, you're most likely timing the dash grab wrong. Marth continues to go further and further after each chain grab, that's probably why you're saying that he is DIing up out of it.

If the chain grab is done to the full % he the best he can hope for is to up b after he techs the spike, but Falco should have enough time to shield if he fastfalls after he dairs. If Marth is at a % where he doesn't have to tech the spike Falco should still have enough time to shield his up b.

having been practicing DDDs CG on marth, is it any more frame precise for Falco's CG?

 

[@TKbreezy]

I'm mad Late on this thread...lol but i still read through the whole thing

I agree with all matchups but pikachu's. I'm completely sure its only because I ****(d) the pikachus in my region and our pikachus arent that good (K9 and Menace are the only 2 I can think of)

lolwut?
Neither of them are that easy to grab lol. Not the best at avoiding grabs but certainly not really easy.
All that means is that you can kill us from a grab WOOHOO.
I mean really, if you wanted a good reason for Ness being 65-35 you could've at least said he loses his stock if you get the CG ;_;
However you can't say that for Lucas.

Falco grabs Ness/Lucas way easier then Ness/Lucas would grab him.

1. Ness Grabs with his Elbows with his already stubby *** arms so he aint gonna get a grab easy through falcos lasers Jab ftilt side B and falcos OVERLY SUPERIOR GRAB.

2. Lucas's tether is pretty garbs outside of Pivot Grabbing and I think Ftilt still out ranges that plus spotdodge>lucas grab.

Lucas and ness are bad character and all you did was come in here and show how much of a fan boy you are for lucas...if lucas was so good he wouldn't be low tier.

also

YOU GUYS SHOULDA LOOKED AT HIS LOCATION and immediately disregarded anything he had to say...pretty sure he's never broken top 10 (even in kentucky) and the only person legit in Kentucky to me is Hilt (Who i consider ohio just because he is legit)

Chuee

theres a difference between trolling and being an actual idiot. i for sake hope youre just trolling

QFT

 

[Bloodcross]

CG'ing Marth. It's 3 dash grabs then 2 boost grabs, right?

 

[-DR3W-]

Now explain them.

 

[erick gm14]

CG'ing Marth. It's 3 dash grabs then 2 boost grabs, right?

i do 2 dash grabs and when hes at 17% boost grab. always works for me.

i agree with dehf on all these except just the kirby MU. i think its safe to say its 6-4 us. as long as u dont really fall for bairs or fsmashes this MU seems like pie. though they have a pseudo CG on us, it can be SDI'd out of. but they can capitalize on it..


larry! u said mk/falco was even and icys were 45-55 :/ and wario was supposed to get ***** by falco like 6-4 xD

 

[swordsaint]

but marth is so easy to chain grab to full percent. i dont understand why people are having trouble with it

 

[Marcbri]

pretty neat list, I totally agree with most of the cast, changing marth to 55-45 for him, kirby to even and DK and sonic to 65-35 for us. Maybe Diddy even as well, and Lucario could be closer like 55-45. But these are minor changes, so overall I love this match-up list.

 

[@TKbreezy]

This is the message Chuee Left me

I'm mad Late on this thread...lol but i still read through the whole thing

I agree with all matchups but pikachu's. I'm completely sure its only because I ****(d) the pikachus in my region and our pikachus arent that good (K9 and Menace are the only 2 I can think of)



Falco grabs Ness/Lucas way easier then Ness/Lucas would grab him.
wth does this have to do with anything. I was talking about Falco grabbing them, not them grabbing him.
1. Ness Grabs with his Elbows with his already stubby *** arms so he aint gonna get a grab easy through falcos lasers Jab ftilt side B and falcos OVERLY SUPERIOR GRAB.

2. Lucas's tether is pretty garbs outside of Pivot Grabbing and I think Ftilt still out ranges that plus spotdodge>lucas grab.
I can shieldgrab ftilt.

Lucas and ness are bad character and all you did was come in here and show how much of a fan boy you are for lucas...if lucas was so good he wouldn't be low tier.
Oh, Im sorry, i didn't know you had to be a good character to not get hard countered by Falco.

also

YOU GUYS SHOULDA LOOKED AT HIS LOCATION and immediately disregarded anything he had to say...pretty sure he's never broken top 10 (even in kentucky) and the only person legit in Kentucky to me is Hilt (Who i consider ohio just because he is legit)
Uhhh, maybe because I've been to FOUR TOURNAMENTS. And the only one in the last year was a huge *** national. BTW have you even broken top ten yourself? Oh and if Im such a big Lucas fan boy then I guess that makes PF an even bigger fanboy than me.



QFT

Don't wanna get offtopic in the thread.

Oh and this

[/QUOTE]



love how people use the haters gon hate pictures soooo wrong lately

also ive broken top 10 4 times and top 5 once since you wanted to know...i suck *** now tho...lol...Still smack you tho...and yes i saw you at MLG getting the **** by cheese DK and cheese doesnt even play DK...lol

 

[Chuee]

also ive broken top 10 4 times and top 5 once since you wanted to know...i suck *** now tho...lol...Still smack you tho...and yes i saw you at MLG getting the **** by cheese DK and cheese doesnt even play DK...lol

Theres this thing called an INFINITE.
Ya know.
And DK has one on Ness and Lucas.
Just lettin ya know.
Oh, and btw I love how you hate me for no reason :D
Inb4infraction

 

[@TKbreezy]

I Don't hate you...your stupidity is just amazing though..and how outspoken you are when you typing but won't say **** to anyone in person.


I watched that match btw...you still got the ****...and Cheese ****ed up that infinite like everytime so you could have totally won that...if you weren't such a scrub
/being off topic

SUP MY ***** LARRY!...lol

 

[Chuee]

I Don't hate you...your stupidity is just amazing though..and how outspoken you are when you typing but won't say **** to anyone in person.

Yes, because saying Wario's grab release isn't a huge problem is sooooooo stupid.

ontopic:
Falco's tell me bout the G&W MU.