VaNz Stuff.. about Peach (Tactical Discussion)

[choknater]

wow lol what an avatar

 

[ShroudedOne]

Just trying her out. I like it, so far.

 

[Degree]

hey guys/and or girls very basic question what button combination do u use to wave dash out of shield? I am using L and Y right now, but i know i would feel more comfortable using R and Y since i use r for normal wavedashing. I am just so use to shielding with R i started using L to wavedash out of shield I even toyed around with the idea of using L and X. Anyway just wondering what u people use

Bizarrely I realised only the other day I'm having that exact problem when I realised that if I'm being forced into shield, I don't have any good escape route except to roll. I came to the conclusion that retraining myself to shield with L so I can use R for a wavedash OOS will (for me) be the quickest and most efficient way of being able to use the technique.

 

[baka4moé]

speaking of wd oos, if you want to stick with just one trigger, what's one way of "thinking" about doing it to get it down more accurately? like, so i'm holding shield, then when, relatively speaking, should you be pressing each input to make it easiest to wd oos? if that makes sense..

 

[Sovereign]

Sure thing, Sovereign! =)

I always claw for FC aerials. It's so good. But I don't claw for double jump lands or things like that. And I also use Y.

Thank you for responding. Also, don't laugh at us. We're working hard on getting our tech skill, and basic mechanics down to muscle memory. I'm a Marth, Ganon, Samus player. He's Peach and some Sheik.

 

[ShroudedOne]

Don't worry, no laughs here (unless he gets like, nine bom-ombs in a match).

@baka: I've recently started telling my to stop holding shield when I'm WD'ing out of shield. Bad habit. Make sure you let go of the trigger when you jump. Once you jump, and input down, press down on the trigger again. Hope that helps some.

 

[Sovereign]

Uploading a set right now. Hopefully you guys enjoy.

EDIT: Video has been uploaded, for anyone interested.

 

[Wake]

I use Y and sometimes up.

 

[Composeur]

The claw grip seems ideal and I really wish I were comfortable enough with it to adopt it, but the stretch between the index and middle fingers on the right hand is too much for me. I just don't feel like I can do it ergonomically. For the record, my hands are a fairly standard size, maybe slightly larger than average (can reach a comfortable 10th on a piano).

And to N.A.G.A.C.E.: as Degree suggested, you could also learn to shield with L and do all wavedashing with R. Either option involves reassigning some important function to L and then committing to it. In my case, for whatever reason I decided that the strong familiarity of shielding with R was more important to me than the less deeply rooted impulse to wavedash with R. I still airdodge with R because I'm used to it, but I kind of think I should retrain myself to do that with L so wavelanding with L is also more organic. I'm still up in the air about which to tech with, so if anyone has any relevant points to make on that one, I'm all eyes...

 

[Veril]

Yeah you really have to use L and not R with the claw grip. I can reach it but its awkward and I've always preferred L.

 

[Cia]

Uploading a set right now. Hopefully you guys enjoy.

EDIT: Video has been uploaded, for anyone interested.

where es da link?

 

[Wake]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJbQGeowZBI

The quality is pretty bad... but critique what you can! (Pretty please?)

 

[ShroudedOne]

The link is in the video archive thread, Vanz.

@ Sovereign: In the future, you can just post the links in here.

@Wake: Ow...my eyes...

 

[Wake]

I'm sorry! It's all we had!

 

[ShroudedOne]

It's fine, it's fine. I feel like you controlled space very well in that match, staying in Fox's air space, threatening him with your moves. You did seem a little anxious, and FC faired a lot. At least one of them got you upsmashed (on the FD match, I think). Be careful about that, cause if you approach with that and Fox reads it, you will eat an upsmash. Period. You also liked throwing out d-smashes when he was near you, which got you shined sometimes. So be more conservative about that.

When Fox runs away from you (3:06), chasing him with an FC nair that low isn't a good idea. It doesn't have range, and as you can see, it got you upsmashed. If he's retreating, follow him, but be careful about it.

5:24 If he jumps onto a platform like that, a good nair will do the trick. He'll be trying to escape you, and that puts him back in his place.

6:13 I think you d-smashed, and he wavedashed OoS, and grabbed you. Less down smash when he's near you, especially if he's picking up on it (he seemed to, anyways).

I think that in this matchup, you could use more dash forward > wavedash back for spacing, as a mixup of course. Keep him guessing as to exactly where you're going to be. Last kill was sick and beastly (though I dunno if I would fight that hard for port 3...especially when port 2 is lots better...)

I hope that helps you some. =)

 

[Wake]

Yeah I get nervous against Fox because he's my toughest MU... I mess up my spacing a lot and get upsmashed... a lot hahaha.

But yeah thanks. And you have lost your mind! The yellow shield! Toooo goood.

 

[ShroudedOne]

I feel that the most important thing in that MU (it's my opinion, so do with it what you will) is that you keep up with him, and keep him afraid of you. So floating in a way that's kind of in his air space, so that he feels anxious and can't just camp you, I find that this nets a traded nair (at least), and displaces him. On ground, wavedashing back is key. It's make him a little wary about using dair, cause it requires a specific aim to hit (and you can CC his nair if he overshoots), and punish with downsmash. It's actually fairly hard for Fox to straight up approach Peach, so look out for platforms.

Just kinda threaten him and push him towards the edge.

Uh...what? Blue shield all the way. Sorry, dude.

 

[Wake]

Yeah I'll keep that in mind. WD back dsmash is hilarious

Siigh. Some people just don't understand that yellow shield is the best. Maybe someday...

 

[ShroudedOne]

Blue Shield > Red Shield > Green Shield > Yellow Shield. I mean, yellow is such an ugly color. How could you possibly want to shield with it?

 

[Wake]

Yellow Shield > Green Shield > Blue Shied > Red Shield

I think the bad quality of that video hurt your eyes a bit too much

 

[Composeur]

Thank god we've found something new to argue about, having settled that pink peach is superior. Honestly, I didn't even think about the fact that shield color's associated with controller port until this summer when professor pro always wanted a certain one (I can't remember which).

 

[ShroudedOne]

*not going to talk about how white Peach is the best one, to avoid an argument*

 

[EPsilon933]

The best ports are 1 and 4. Clears up the middle of the screen

 

[DoH]

2 because blue matches my eyes

 

[Redd]

1 because... yeah.

 

[MacD]

reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedddddddddd da besssssssssss

favorite color and pretty cool md/va person

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Port 3, green da shiz

 

[Redd]

Port 3, green da shiz

Trolling?

Yous be trollin.

(3 is yellow)

 

[Wake]

Yeah port 3 is yellow!

 

[ConnorTheKid]

port 3 is the worst

 

[Wake]

You guys are just...

 

[ShroudedOne]

I think I'm very slowly beginning to figure Marth out....

It's okay, Wake. We won't judge your poor taste in shield colors. =)

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Trolling?

Yous be trollin.

(3 is yellow)

i knew there was a reason i liked 4 better

 

[Wake]

I think I'm very slowly beginning to figure Marth out....

It's okay, Wake. We won't judge your poor taste in shield colors. =)

Well as long as you won't judge me... Also, I knew you'd figure him out.

 

[ShroudedOne]

Does anyone care to update the Peach video thread? I feel as though there are a lot more matches than the ones displayed in there, and that it could be helpful for learning some MUs visually (I plan to go through some of them for Marth/Falcon and see if I can see what I might need to do). Or does no one care anymore?

 

[baka4moé]

port 1 cause im used to it, used to play my little brother all the time and i was always first player

 

[The Irish Mafia]

same
i know the spawn points and ****, it's just familiar

 

[Veril]

I've decided the next thing to check is the percents we can CC fox moves at and not be put in the tumble state and forced to tech in place. Fox is a jerk, thinking he's so cool with his tech cheese and carpal tunnel syndrome. Plus technical Fox's are everywhere! So seems like counter-fox tactics should be priority, and CCing his bs seems like a great place to start.

Example: cc fox nair strong hitbox induces tumble vs peach at 78%, weak nair at 117, dash attack at 109, etc

 

[Wake]

port 1 cause im used to it, used to play my little brother all the time and i was always first player

same
i know the spawn points and ****, it's just familiar

Yeah this is really the main reason why I use 3rd. I'm just used to it (though I had to use 4th for 6 months so I'm cool with that too ).

 

[thesage]

I personally don't use a specific port. Sometimes I use 2nd since blue is my favorite color.