Samus Matchup Listing

[Emblem Lord]

Ok, seriously.

I don't even know half of what Hylian knows about Samus. But just going by basic fighting game fundamentals with a working knowledge of each character's tools, I can easily tell that this match-up list is...not good at all.

 

[Orichalcum]

yeah where are the character specific advices like in all those other matchup threads O_o

 

[DanGR]

King dedede (60-40 without infinite) (55-45 with infinite)

lol, only .05 less with the infinite.

Olimar seems about right.

 

[Atsu]

Is this a joke thread or something? o.o

Anyways, look at the other character boards. You just don't make up official match ups off the top of your head, no matter how good you are. It looks like others have already explained it pretty well, but you still don't seem to get it. So just look at the organization and thought that is put into this and try to apply that to this (You probably want to create a new thread).

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=174763
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=183577

Good Luck.

 

[Crystanium]

So, instead of contributing on what could be fixed, everyone says, "This list is wrong. Let's go out and eat. Forget the list"? Thanks for the contributions, people! Heck, it wouldn't kill you to make a match-up list in here or in a new thread and say, "This is how it should be."

 

[stealthsushi]

The matchup list is kind of like a work in progress. Even if the numbers that were initially made were based off of simple guesses and reasoning, contributions from the boards can shift the numbers into something you think is reasonable. Of course, if enough people vouch for and can explain their reasoning for changing a matchup from 70-30 to 40-60, then the number will change to reflect the general consensus.

The list is by no means a be-all-end-all list, but more of an approximation of how the matchup fairs for Samus. If the meta-game developed or some kind of exploit was found against Samus, then opinions will be voiced to change the matchup value against that opponent.

Its not really that bad of an idea, its just a nice source that can help people get an idea of what matchups are in Samus' favor, and which ones aren't. It just needs constant input from people with experience and even people who think something might work in theory. If the reasoning for changing a matchup is bad, then someone with experience will come and argue against it to get it fixed.

 

[ADHD]

The matchup list is kind of like a work in progress. Even if the numbers that were initially made were based off of simple guesses and reasoning, contributions from the boards can shift the numbers into something you think is reasonable. Of course, if enough people vouch for and can explain their reasoning for changing a matchup from 70-30 to 40-60, then the number will change to reflect the general consensus.

The list is by no means a be-all-end-all list, but more of an approximation of how the matchup fairs for Samus. If the meta-game developed or some kind of exploit was found against Samus, then opinions will be voiced to change the matchup value against that opponent.

Its not really that bad of an idea, its just a nice source that can help people get an idea of what matchups are in Samus' favor, and which ones aren't. It just needs constant input from people with experience and even people who think something might work in theory. If the reasoning for changing a matchup is bad, then someone with experience will come and argue against it to get it fixed.

Thank you

10char

 

[Atsu]

I probably shouldn't have came in all troll-like. My bad ChromePirate. ^^;

How about we start working on this now? It'll keep things on the Samus boards a little more active :3

 

[PKNintendo]

It's okay, but DDD should be a 7-3 or 8-2 .Using the infinite. It's an infinite grab, meaning getting grabbed once=lose of stock. 55-45 seems much to generous for Samus.

 

[3xSwords]

Well infinites are usually banned. Unless you are going to a **** tourney.

Besides zair against fat ppl gives you a lot of room to work with it.

 

[Atsu]

Well infinites are usually banned. Unless you are going to a **** tourney.

Besides zair against fat ppl gives you a lot of room to work with it.

But you also have to consider that they're a good D3. The only thing you can hope for is that they don't really know the Samus match-up. It should be combo city seeing as how you have such a big target. Just gotta space yourself just right so they aren't in grab range. But it's hard to 'not get grabbed' when your opponent is looking for the perfect moment =/

EDIT: If the Infinite was banned at the tournament, then it shouldn't be that big of a problem with the grab except taking a large amount of damage.

 

[0RLY]

First off, Dedede MUST be changed to 75:25 or greater in his favor. Chaingrabs, range+priority on ground moves, priority and speed on air moves... Samus stands little to no chance. Plus, the dude is heavy so don't expect kills sooner than 150%. A good D3 will keep Samus near the edge through the whole game with repeated chaingrabs, dtilt, ftilt, and bair. This prevents Samus from keeping the spacing she needs for zair and missiles. D3's uair pretty much means he's unspikable, and he can make it back from the bottom of the screen with his enormous up-B.

Chrome, add descriptions for the match-ups. I don't care if it's 1 sentence. Just do it. You have my permission to use my post as part of D3's description.

 

[Orichalcum]

Noped the best id rate is 70 or 65, which is actually enough but isnt as horrible, and i played some good DDD

 

[PK-ow!]

How does Samus fight Pikachu at all?

You know this and the dead Samus guide are the only threads with the words 'Pikachu' and 'matchup' in them... so... I came here.

I suppose the question is a challenge to the 40-60 listing. Everyone I've fought who... didn't kill himself was invulnerable to all my stuff. Too short to be supermissiled, even homing missiled... jab goes over his head, no hitstun means ftilt eats fair or bair right after, good aerial mobility gets around zair...

And his combos are better!

I mean what do you do against someone who's good?

 

[Crystanium]

How does Samus fight Pikachu at all?

You know this and the dead Samus guide are the only threads with the words 'Pikachu' and 'matchup' in them... so... I came here.

If you are referring to my Samus guide, it's not dead. It's in progress, and phanna was kind enough to sticky it for me, since I requested it. Here are his very words:

Great stuff, please keep up the good work to help out fellow Samus players!

It's still active. To think otherwise is just foolishness. Please consider the updates.

 

[0RLY]

Yeah, Pikachu is one of those impossible matchups. In order to even get close to not getting 2 stocked, I constantly have to space out of Pikachu's smash range, while staying too close for Pikachu to spam thunder jolts.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Could somebody tell me, why Wolf vs Samus is only 60:40 for Wolf? It should be higher. I have a lot of experinece against Samus as my best friends used to main Samus and he was quite good with her.

Sure Zair is great and all but what does she have on him to have only such a slight disadvantage?
He outcamps her, outranges her and outspeeds. She can't even kill him properly. He's just too heavy to get killed sub 120% and she's having troubles getting Wolf there in the first place.

 

[ADHD]

Could somebody tell me, why Wolf vs Samus is only 60:40 for Wolf? It should be higher. I have a lot of experinece against Samus as my best friends used to main Samus and he was quite good with her.

Sure Zair is great and all but what does she have on him to have only such a slight disadvantage?
He outcamps her, outranges her and outspeeds. She can't even kill him properly. He's just too heavy to get killed sub 120% and she's having troubles getting Wolf there in the first place.

Yeah I guess you're right

Wolf screams spike me tho

 

[Deathcarter]

Yoshi IMO is 70:30 in favor of Yoshi. Yoshi's egg shield is simply IMPENETRABLE. It protects Yoshi from everything except a grab. Grab approaches from Samus however will become predictable and Samus's grab is quite punishable.

When Yoshi is slightly out of ftilt range, he can easily close the distance aerialy considering his air speed. Short hopped bairs do not leave Yoshi very punishable; they will either break through Samus's shield or he can land and go back into his impenetrable egg fortress.

He is heavy and ungimpable. He can make it to the stage with mostly egg throws and his second jump is not punishable. Samus's weak attacks (zair) will not knock him out of it and he can easily defend himself from Samus's dair with his uair considering he no longer double jump cancels.

Frankly, this matchup is in 4th place in Samus's most difficult matchups behind Dedede, Olimar, and Pikachu and ahead of Falco, G&W, and Meta Knight. The Yoshi forums even have the matchup at 65:35.

By the way, when will you edit Chrome Pirate?

 

[ADHD]

Yoshi IMO is 70:30 in favor of Yoshi. Yoshi's egg shield is simply IMPENETRABLE. It protects Yoshi from everything except a grab. Grab approaches from Samus however will become predictable and Samus's grab is quite punishable.

When Yoshi is slightly out of ftilt range, he can easily close the distance aerialy considering his air speed. Short hopped bairs do not leave Yoshi very punishable; they will either break through Samus's shield or he can land and go back into his impenetrable egg fortress.

He is heavy and ungimpable. He can make it to the stage with mostly egg throws and his second jump is not punishable. Samus's weak attacks (zair) will not knock him out of it and he can easily defend himself from Samus's dair with his uair considering he no longer double jump cancels.

Frankly, this matchup is in 4th place in Samus's most difficult matchups behind Dedede, Olimar, and Pikachu and ahead of Falco, G&W, and Meta Knight. The Yoshi forums even have the matchup at 65:35.

By the way, when will you edit Chrome Pirate?

I quit samus, I'm still editing this though but I'm not going any further as in adding descriptions :/

 

[Dark.Pch]

I think you should change the Peach Vs Samus. Samus does not have the advantage here. Its about even or Peach does better. But Samus over Peach is not correct. How did you come to this logic?

 

[Hylian]

I think you should change the Peach Vs Samus. Samus does not have the advantage here. Its about even or Peach does better. But Samus over Peach is not correct. How did you come to this logic?

The same way he came up with all the other ones I suppose >_>.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

I would have said that the Peach match up is probably wrong as well so I'll give my opinion on it.

Zair will tear a floaty Peach apart. I've had to alter how I fight a certain Samus simply because of it. Missile spam can work reasonably well if used correctly against Peach. Samus' best kill moves for Peach are D Tilt and D Smash (Bair and F Smash if you can get them in). A fully charged Neutral B can really do the job but you have to use it when Peach leasts expects it, trick her into walking into it or when she can't escape from it

Beware of Peach's Bair as it can stop your Missiles in their tracks, be they homing or linear. Her aerials are better than yours imo, especially her Nair. Your Dair can spike but our Dair can rack up a lot of damage. Watch out for her Turnips. These will play a big part of her game vs Samus in a projectile fight. Don't forget she can Glide Toss them at you and follow up with a grab or jab or a D Smash if she's close enough.

In short, you really have to master using your Zair to win this fight complete with effective spacing, both for attacking and recovery. Never ever try to recover with your Up + B unless you have no other choice because it's so easy to edgeguard and edgeguarding is one of the things Peach does best. Always recover from below with your Zair if you can but be aware of her throwing Turnips to gimp your recovery

This match up is probably even or slightly in Peach's favour imo. At least from my experience

 

[ADHD]

The same way he came up with all the other ones I suppose >_>.

Then help me get a better approximation instead of *****in

 

[kown]

im a pit main so i mite be a little biased. but doesnt pit have a big advantage towards samus?

my reasons are.
reflectors are a big factor in this match up.
better projectiles.

these are the big ones that i dont think a samus player can prevent.
especially when u face a good spammy pit than what can you do. obviously you can Ps but only for so long u know.

 

[Crystanium]

You tell me, kown.

 

[kown]

You tell me, kown.

for the most part im better than that pit : ) haha. but it proves my point also. of course the ending was bad but i mean he controlled the entire match.

 

[ADHD]

for the most part im better than that pit : ) haha. but it proves my point also. of course the ending was bad but i mean he controlled the entire match.

Undrdog can shed the light on this matchup

 

[Julz]

im a pit main so i mite be a little biased. but doesnt pit have a big advantage towards samus?

my reasons are.
reflectors are a big factor in this match up.
better projectiles.

these are the big ones that i dont think a samus player can prevent.
especially when u face a good spammy pit than what can you do. obviously you can Ps but only for so long u know.

Pit has only one projectile.

The thing is zair spam beats pit arrow spam. Air dodge the first arrow, cancel it into a zair. Zair also has higher priority than that arrow.

With reflectors, Pit doesn't really have anything good to reflect. Samus mains generally don't use super missile and when they have a fully charged beam, they'll probably use it when Pit can't do anything about it (why would a Samus player waste something that took so long to charge up?). Homing missile runs out of fuel before you reflect it so its pretty darn useless too.

What annoys me with pit is the deceptively long range on all of his attacks which makes him harder to hit and hence harder to KO.

Undrdog can shed the light on this matchup

Input from either Jasona or Undrdog would be nice. They're practically sparring partners.

 

[kown]

too bad undrdog took a break from SWF or brawl not really sure.
and even in thier matches undrdog tended to win more of them.

but the thing is that when u do use ur charged shot we always have a chance to react or predict.
The only thing samus has that can be a big pain is his zair. and pit has only one projectile cuz thats all he needs.
Pit > Samus. Im not saying by much tho. just look at the vid Dryn shows ( in this vid the pit loses but it shows that the pit had control the whole game except for the end) or look at undrdog vs jasona.

 

[Coldfront]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aynye2HUS8

Pit doesn't always have a chance to react to the charge shot, mainly when he decides to fly under the stage.
In general though Pit has the advantage. Better Fsmash, quick roll, annoying projectile, a shield that reflects projectiles and blocks attacks, a SideB which attacks and reflects projectiles at the same time.

 

[kown]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aynye2HUS8

Pit doesn't always have a chance to react to the charge shot, mainly when he decides to fly under the stage.
In general though Pit has the advantage. Better Fsmash, quick roll, annoying projectile, a shield that reflects projectiles and blocks attacks, a SideB which attacks and reflects projectiles at the same time.

lol that was sick what tudor did. but yea from that video i agree that he doesnt get a chance to react. but i dont think the pit player was very good since he didnt learn from the first try.

im glad you agree that pit has the adv. Im trying not to be biased in saying that he was but its good to know you agree.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Question why would Samus have an even matchup with Sonic?

 

[Xyro77]

Dear Lord this list is F-ing trash.

The list should be changed to:

Always Win
Advantage
Even
Disadvantage
Impossible



Oh and i play kown and beat him nearly every time. However, a truly good pit will always beat a good samus. Kown just doesnt have enough samus exp.

Peach vs Samus is EVEN from my exp.

Diddy has advantage on samus EASILY...i dont know what kind of trash you play where u are.

Assuming the IC your playing can do SOME advanced CG tactics.....samus is at a disadvantage.

An IMPOSSIBLE match up is meta vs samus. I dont care how much exp you have vs a meta.....A truly good meta WILL always beat a samus.

 

[Crystanium]

for the most part im better than that pit : ) haha. but it proves my point also. of course the ending was bad but i mean he controlled the entire match.

Come now, kown, I won against you with my Samus.

Assuming the IC your playing can do SOME advanced CG tactics.....samus is at a disadvantage.

Uh huh. Just ask Hive here at SWF.

 

[kown]

Oh and i play kown and beat him nearly every time. However, a truly good pit will always beat a good samus. Kown just doesnt have enough samus exp.

exactly. except for the part where he implies im not truly good. cant say i agree but he does beat me more. sigh* hobo 10 is where i can prove myself! haha

 

[Xyro77]

exactly. except for the part where he implies im not truly good. cant say i agree but he does beat me more. sigh* hobo 10 is where i can prove myself! haha

Dont get me wrong, your very good. by far the best pit in houston/area. You just dont have exp vs smaus...thas all.



Plz let me make a better match up chart. this list is sheer trash.

 

[cox1121]

i'm having problems with luigi...anyone else have this problem.

 

[SaiX]

i'm having problems with luigi...anyone else have this problem.

i have problems also with luigi , but mg&w? i havent any problem with him, but olimar is the samus death. -.-

 

[Z1GMA]

but olimar is the samus death. -.-

I really hate olimar when i'm Samus!