Samus Matchup Listing

[DanGR]

Anyone mind explaining why sheik is nuetral? (or is it wrong in the OP)

 

[kown]

yes and pit should be unfavorable.

 

[PKNintendo]

Pit vs Samus eh? Battle of of the wits I tells ya!

 

[ADHD]

this is all terribly wrong btw, i should fix this, shouldn't I

Edit: I changed some stuff, tell me what you guys think now.

 

[Atire]

Sorry but I really hate your style. For everything you wrote, spam him with z air/missiles. Cmon Samus isn't at all about that. I prefer her close range and my matchup list is different because of that. The only matchups I struggle with are diddy, link and possibly game and watch.

 

[Hive]

The only matchups I struggle with are diddy, link and possibly game and watch.

that can't be right... have you played many mks, olimars, DDDs?

 

[ADHD]

Sorry but I really hate your style. For everything you wrote, spam him with z air/missiles. Cmon Samus isn't at all about that. I prefer her close range and my matchup list is different because of that. The only matchups I struggle with are diddy, link and possibly game and watch.

Yes she is random noob that goes to my school btw, I can show you some ****in awesome tricks samus can do with the bananas, she controls the bananas better than diddy kong can

 

[PKNintendo]

Eww, Diddy+Nana's=/= fun

 

[Hive]

Yes she is random noob that goes to my school btw, I can show you some ****in awesome tricks samus can do with the bananas, she controls the bananas better than diddy kong can

Oh hey kwl! Another chick samus mainer! ^^

 

[Xyro77]

i thought me and hive were the only chic samus mainers?

 

[Undrdog]

I don't think there's a Samus that has more experience versus Pit then Sauna. Conversely I probably have more experience as a Pit against Samus then most any other Pit. You should leave this match-up to us! ...

Anyway as far as the match-up goes Pit has this at about 65-35 or 70-30. However I would like to point out that Samus' move-set and physics both counter Pit's. Meaning she has an answer to most of the things Pit can do. If these two characters were of the same tier my guess is that Samus would be a hard counter for Pit. But as things stand right now, Pit is an all around better character then Samus, and therefore easily overcomes Samus' natural counter against him.

Did any of that make sense? I mean I know Xyro probably didn't follow all of that, but I wouldn't've expected that even if it was coherent. ^_^

 

[Xyro77]

I don't think there's a Samus that has more experience versus Pit then Sauna. Conversely I probably have more experience as a Pit against Samus then most any other Pit. You should leave this match-up to us! ...

Anyway as far as the match-up goes Pit has this at about 65-35 or 70-30. However I would like to point out that Samus' move-set and physics both counter Pit's. Meaning she has an answer to most of the things Pit can do. If these two characters were of the same tier my guess is that Samus would be a hard counter for Pit. But as things stand right now, Pit is an all around better character then Samus, and therefore easily overcomes Samus' natural counter against him.

Did any of that make sense? I mean I know Xyro probably didn't follow all of that, but I wouldn't've expected that even if it was coherent. ^_^

sorry but either both of you are terrible or your just terrible.

pit has a massive advantage. theres no question about that. in fact its not hard to see it

 

[Undrdog]

sorry but either both of you are terrible or your just terrible.

pit has a massive advantage. theres no question about that. in fact its not hard to see it

Looks like I was right. ^_^ That's exactly what I said.

To reiterate, while looking at the match-up, Samus' move-set and physics both counter Pit's. However Pit is such a better character overall that Samus' natural counter is completely nullified.

There was no point in me posting that other then to be confusing. =P No matter how one looks at it Pit has a tremendous match-up against Samus at this point in time. The fact that you didn't seem to catch my drift is a little startling though. Anyone with experience against a good Pit can see that...

Pit's lack of range vs. Samus Screw Attack
Pit's lack of range vs. Samus Zair
Pit's lack of DI + short Midair Jump vs. Samus Zair
Pit's Arrows vs Samus Zair
Pit's Recovery vs Samus projectiles
Pit's attack speed vs Samus' attack speed
Pit's priority vs Samus' priority
Pit's overall range vs Samus' overall range
Pit's aerial game vs Samus' aerial game

All of this comes out in favor of Samus. However as we all know Pit still maintains the advantage in this match-up fairly easily. That was my point. There's a glaring weakness that Samus has that manages to drop the ball in this match-up. I kinda wanted to see what the Samus forums think the issue actually is.

 

[Xyro77]

its 65-35 in pits favor(imo). i wouldnt give much more to samus on this one.

 

[Undrdog]

I edited my post as Xyro was posting. Doesn't alter his post though I don't think. ^_^

 

[Xyro77]

Pit's lack of range vs. Samus Screw Attack
Pit's lack of range vs. Samus Zair
Pit's lack of DI + short Midair Jump vs. Samus Zair
Pit's Arrows vs Samus Zair
Pit's Recovery vs Samus projectiles
Pit's attack speed vs Samus' attack speed
Pit's priority vs Samus' priority
Pit's overall range vs Samus' overall range
Pit's aerial game vs Samus' aerial game

1. if pit spaces correctly screw attack does not work. h3ll a single jab messes up samus up+b. and if you arnt spacing right in BRAWL....then your pretty **** bad.

2. zair is a HIGHLY predictable move. you have to be dumb to not adapt to it. and im talkin its so predictable it only take a few matches to see the many different types of ays it can be used........or just screw all of what i said and power shield. power shielding is easy in this game.

3. learn to shade and buffer correctly

4. arrows have a freakin sick advantage over zair any day. its faster and can be tilted. it can be looped and can be used to gimp better than zair can(zair can only TRULY gimp while off the stage...pit can be on or off). not to mention u can recover while arrowing far mor times than i can zair while recovering.

5. if your a trashy pit your recovery may be ***** by samus. pit can go under levels and grab ledges faster than samus can run. i could stop here. however, theres more. if you arrow spam while recovering that also can stop samus in her tracks or slow her down. h3ll, u can glide if need be without getting punished.

6. attack speed? thats a general statement. which attacks? u cant say "all or pits are slower than samus's attacks" because thats a flat out lie. there are a select few. but where it counts....pits killing moves are faster and break thru samus's ****.

7. priority cannot be argued. pit has this one hands down. with the exceptions of samus u-air or taunt.

8. over all samus has more projectiles.....so if u compare that to pits arrows....then yes samus wins.

9. this may be an opinion thing but i feel pits attacks in the air are far better than samus... 2 or 3 of them are multi hitting attacks which can lead into good stuff. bair comes out fast and can kill easily. dair is a good fast attack that gets te foe away from you. samus had 2 good air moves. up-air and fair....thats it. the rest can be used to do cool stuff but in the end its fair and upair that are used/liked the most.

10. in the future pit is going to soar in the tourney rankings. i think hes a good character that isnt fully discovered yet. i think the same with peach and fox. these chars will start doing better as time goes on.

 

[PK-ow!]

6. attack speed? thats a general statement. which attacks? u cant say "all or pits are slower than samus's attacks" because thats a flat out lie. there are a select few. but where it counts....pits killing moves are faster and break thru samus's ****.

I'm somehow embarrassed that you can't put the charitable interpretation into that statement.

It obviously means that the handful of moves that Samus would rely on in a cross-section of "typical" situations that come up for her, have a lower distribution, in time to execute (or lag), than the handful of moves taken similarly from Pit.

This, where "time to execute" factors in the frames of setup, such as the jump just before you use an attack, or the step before a pivot Fsmash (I dunno).

It means that, overall, Samus is losing many more frames while just doing business stuff, than Pit is, which then analyzed in the broad view of matches, weighs significantly in favour of Pit.

*~*~*~
I think the sturdiness of Pit is realized in the fact that his attacks say "go away" much more powerfully than Samus'. bair does nothing without sweetspot. fair doesn't have the hitbox we wish it did. ftilt is. . . lame. And boo, no K.O. power. Pit can kill people with ftilt, has a normal Fsmash, quick directional attacks, and sturdy aerials with straightforward, large hitboxes, with little time left hanging. He's able to just go after Samus, while she has to do all this crazy stuff just to keep hitting zairs and Dsmashes, and somehow setup the K.O.. This means Pit has more mental resources available for. . . actually doing things, like mindgaming, and other character-general stuff. Samus will always be losing out on this for equal mental effort, and when something goes slightly wrong, Samus is screwed, while Pit just has to get his feet on the ground (literally).

I don't know why I stick with her. Must be the shiny new outfit.

 

[Xyro77]

I'm somehow embarrassed that you can't put the charitable interpretation into that statement.

It obviously means that the handful of moves that Samus would rely on in a cross-section of "typical" situations that come up for her, have a lower distribution, in time to execute (or lag), than the handful of moves taken similarly from Pit.

This, where "time to execute" factors in the frames of setup, such as the jump just before you use an attack, or the step before a pivot Fsmash (I dunno).

It means that, overall, Samus is losing many more frames while just doing business stuff, than Pit is, which then analyzed in the broad view of matches, weighs significantly in favour of Pit.

*~*~*~
I think the sturdiness of Pit is realized in the fact that his attacks say "go away" much more powerfully than Samus'. bair does nothing without sweetspot. fair doesn't have the hitbox we wish it did. ftilt is. . . lame. And boo, no K.O. power. Pit can kill people with ftilt, has a normal Fsmash, quick directional attacks, and sturdy aerials with straightforward, large hitboxes, with little time left hanging. He's able to just go after Samus, while she has to do all this crazy stuff just to keep hitting zairs and Dsmashes, and somehow setup the K.O.. This means Pit has more mental resources available for. . . actually doing things, like mindgaming, and other character-general stuff. Samus will always be losing out on this for equal mental effort, and when something goes slightly wrong, Samus is screwed, while Pit just has to get his feet on the ground (literally).

I don't know why I stick with her. Must be the shiny new outfit.

so your proving my point. samus is trash. sweet

 

[Hive]

hmmm are Kirby and G&W matchups really that high? I mean they are pretty much at the level of DDD on the chart.... that just doesn't seem right.... does it?
The G&Ws I've played so far, while advantaged, at least seem beatable.... DDD is just pure fatty chicken death (20-80 probably) @.@
TLink is fricken hard though too... I'd say 65-35 maybe? His spam game is actually really hard to get around compared to most ppl, and I think he wins at close range...

 

[Hive]

Also, I wouldn't put Charizard at so much of an advantage (60-40 or 65-35 I would say) (I play P.T.s waaaay too much btw lol@.@)
Sure, you can spam the crap out of him, but he has a wonderful edgeguard against any samus returning, i.e. his flamethrower- which he can hit you with while you are on the ledge, lasts forever, and he can hit you coming up from the ledge too... once you are stuck in it expect at least like 20% damage depending how stuck you are into it initially... your best bet is to stall on the ledge until there is an opening and full jump or fair out of it... but many Charzys will stay slightly back and time out your jump, or bluff stopping and then hit you when you try to jump... since the flamethrower goes over the ledge samus usually can't short jump from the ledge and use missiles to open anything either
His recovery is pretty awesome as well, his up B has super armor and usually results in samus being punished if she goes out for the spike.... also his grab game and fair are pretty good too.... and his grab release is pretty effective if you're not aware.
His side B is devastating (can do like 50% damage in a single hit and has phantom hitboxes) but luckily a spammy samus should never worry about this too much since he is pretty easy to space....
Also on stage kos don't start around 145%ish with dtilt ... don't get me wrong... samus still has advantage here, but I wouldn't put it as 70-30 is all...
I would actually put Charizard in front of Ivysaur... simply because dtilit is super effective on Ivysaurs (works at about 110% damage ) and zair eats razor leaf and kills most of Ivys bair, tentacle game. Plus Ivy is ridiculously easier to spike/gimp. ^^ Ivysaur is the one pokemon who relies mainly on his range to have an advantage, unfortunately for him, samus almost completely outclasses him in this field ^^

 

[Undrdog]

1. if pit spaces correctly screw attack does not work. h3ll a single jab messes up samus up+b. and if you arnt spacing right in BRAWL....then your pretty **** bad.

2. zair is a HIGHLY predictable move. you have to be dumb to not adapt to it. and im talkin its so predictable it only take a few matches to see the many different types of ays it can be used........or just screw all of what i said and power shield. power shielding is easy in this game.

3. learn to shade and buffer correctly

4. arrows have a freakin sick advantage over zair any day. its faster and can be tilted. it can be looped and can be used to gimp better than zair can(zair can only TRULY gimp while off the stage...pit can be on or off). not to mention u can recover while arrowing far mor times than i can zair while recovering.

5. if your a trashy pit your recovery may be ***** by samus. pit can go under levels and grab ledges faster than samus can run. i could stop here. however, theres more. if you arrow spam while recovering that also can stop samus in her tracks or slow her down. h3ll, u can glide if need be without getting punished.

6. attack speed? thats a general statement. which attacks? u cant say "all or pits are slower than samus's attacks" because thats a flat out lie. there are a select few. but where it counts....pits killing moves are faster and break thru samus's ****.

7. priority cannot be argued. pit has this one hands down. with the exceptions of samus u-air or taunt.

8. over all samus has more projectiles.....so if u compare that to pits arrows....then yes samus wins.

9. this may be an opinion thing but i feel pits attacks in the air are far better than samus... 2 or 3 of them are multi hitting attacks which can lead into good stuff. bair comes out fast and can kill easily. dair is a good fast attack that gets te foe away from you. samus had 2 good air moves. up-air and fair....thats it. the rest can be used to do cool stuff but in the end its fair and upair that are used/liked the most.

10. in the future pit is going to soar in the tourney rankings. i think hes a good character that isnt fully discovered yet. i think the same with peach and fox. these chars will start doing better as time goes on.

Wow... I'm not even sure how to reply to some of this. Most of it is utter nonsense. After reading number one I am actually confused as to how you got your status. Before I got on I will say that I like to tease you just for the sake of it. I would never tease someone I didn't think was actually pretty good

Anyway...

1. Jab beating the Screw Attack? Maybe if someone who plays Samus wanders in here we can ask one of them how ridiculous this claim is. You've even had time to reread your post and edit anything stupid out, so no excuse there.

Samus' Screw Attack has more priority then any attack Pit has. She can interrupt all of Pit's attacks. The jab, while I can't prove it, I suspect is the extreme in this matter. Seriously, any Samus players here EVER been pulled out of Samus' Screw Attack at the beginning of it by a Pit? Or even at all I'd like to hear about it.

2. Again, pure insanity. Pit has no range and Arrows can't win the game. As you said, Powershielding is the only way to go. I suppose Powershielding is still applicable when the Zair auto cancels and can be comboed from VERY easily? The Zair is an amazing defense against Pit's approach. Remember I'm just talking about the characteristics of a counter. I'm not saying that the Zair kills Pit's game.

3. Thanks for the insult. I'm not sure what you meant by it though. It's not like Samus' aerials autocancel or anything... Seriously though my point was Samus can actually double and triple Zair Pit as an actual combo. Not even bringing in the fact that Pit can't DI out of Samus' multi-hit attacks even with Smash DI when the Samus knows how to DI her attacks.

4. Now this one I should've clarified. What I meant was SHUFFLED (parden the Melee terminology) Zairs are faster then Arrows. On top of that the Zair eats Arrows. SHUFFLED Zairs can also be used as an effective approach.

5. Again might I remind you this is just the criteria for a counter? Seriously, as if a decent Pit would fall for that. This falls in line with Capt. Falcon being countered by the Ice Climbers in Melee. It's a fundamental counter that can easily be overcome with skill. What I'm talking about is a natural counter. Similar to "Hey, Dedede's fat and Pit has Arrows!". In this way Samus was equipped with the tools to nerf Pit's recovery. That's all I was saying (and stressing).

6. Mostly what PK said. I can't fully explain this one and it will always be contested. My point though is that Samus has several indiscriminate "get off my back" attacks. Screw Attack, Zair and, SHFair are the most obnoxious. A Samus that is quick of mind can easily use one of these three attacks to alleviate pressure from a close-up Pit. And nothing else matters. Once one character has a spammable move that can do this they win this category. (Again I'm not saying there's anything bad about this, nor am I complaining)

7. You're pulling crap out of your rear-end now. This is like trying to argue that the world is flat.

8. Since it wasn't apparent to you that I was discluding projectiles allow me to be more frank. More range with MELEE attacks... If you try to argue this I'm not sure what else I can say/do.

9. This I didn't clarify well either I suppose. My points here is simply this. The Screw Attack can be safely used in the air so long as contact is made. If Pit is already starting an attack the Screw Attack is sure to out prioritize it. It is impossible for Pit to DI out of it, even with Smash DI implemented. And it's impossible for Pit to punish Samus after the attack ends. This isn't even bringing up the Zair. The Zair beats everything Pit has, including the Mirror Shield on occasion. Not to mention his head is exposed. More range in the air on Samus' side. The spike ranges very wide and is devastating to Pit since his DI is so poor. Pit's got no answers when it comes to falling from below... Only thing Pit has is an easier to land Sugar Bair and multi-hit attacks. In the end though they all require very close range with the opponent. Which of course leaves Pit open for a Screw Attack.

10. I agree with this but for other reasons. Mainly because MK will probably be banned in the future and he counters Pit harder then any other match-up I've seen in the game to date.


Again allow me to emphasize... PIT WINS THIS MATCH-UP! I don't want people coming in crying about how Pit wins this match-up as if I'm saying otherwise. This is an instance where the match-up on paper doesn't play out the way it seems. Pit is a higher tiered character for a reason.



But seriously, Xyro. I tease you for kicks and I never really meant any of it. But geez this is just lame what you posted. It's like I'm talking to someone who has zero experience with this match-up.

 

[Ravin]

Ive been around the block a lot lately... a lot of this list i do not agree with and felt like it was sprouted out of their *** from fighting on wifi or friends. Ill add comments and own numbers...

Ganondorf (70-30)
85-15.
Charizard (70-30)
60-40
Bowser (70-30)
90-10

Captain Falcon (70-30)
55-45 CF deserves more credit. Even fought a hard CF? they are not easy to camp.

Ivysaur (60-40)
90-10 (Too easy. Could rant. )

Jigglypuff (60-40)
... No. Try 45-55.

Even
Fox (55-45)
Lol... sounds about right, id even push 40-60

Link (55-45)
40-60 also.

Ike (55-45)
Apperently... You never fought a good Ike that can infinity Jab you. More to rant on later 35-65

Donkey Kong (55-45)
Now this i do not agree with. 65-35 Samus Favour. big targets ALWAYS get ***** by Samus.

Sonic (50-50)
Sonic sucks? but id even push 55-45 because of Samus > Projectiles Then Sonic.

Diddy Kong (50-50)
Diddy favor much? Granted you can glide toss more. Being small is a huge factor, and a good diddy isnt going to let you just take his naners. 40-60

Ice climbers (50-50)
small, Hard to hit, easily able to CG you. Projectile and Desyncable. 35-65

Samus (50-50) Why is this here?

Pit (45-55)
Agreeable.

Rob (45-55)
ROB > Samus... 35-65

Unfavorable
Falco (40-60)
Alright.Id even go for > camping over Samus. mmaybe 35-65

Peach (40-60)
Ive fought peaches like Skys and KB's alongside even seeing dark Peach play. the more i fight peaches, the more I am able to say... They **** the **** out of a Samus, granted a good match can be done and you can win, but its a 35-65.

Lucas (40-60)
Lucas is nothing like Ness, stop comparing them, Also. 65-35. Lucas isnt a hard matchup if you watch what you are doing.

Ness (40-60)
35-65. An agressive Ness will beat a Samus, Regardless of what you may think or even begin to think.

Sheik (40-60)
55-45

Wario (40-60)
50-50 All about playstyle. Id even push this in samus's favor due ot Warios low projectile and ranged game.

Wolf (40-60)
Easily gimpable. 45-55.

Toon Link (40-60)
Ew.... 20-80.

Zelda (40-60)
Zelda will beat a Samus... Lol... But just try your best to get her offstage. 30-70

Mario (40-60)
Lolwut. 60-40

Squirtle (40-60)
25-75.

Pikachu (40-60)
you will not beat a Pikachu thats a pro. /end. 10-90.

Marth (35-65)
Ive had no problems with Marths in tounries, even ones that are all Fair and Sworddance, which is all Marths now do in brawl. but sadly, His Fair eats projectiles and as was said before, Zair gets too predictable. 40-60

Luigi (35-65) Gah...akjlghlkgjhg Right on.

Lucario (35-65) This goes either way, if you know how to kill with Samus, your all good, but sadly, At this point, Samus racks up damage to fast and cant kill below 120%. Lucario at that point, can kill you when your at 50%. Go Die lucario. I agree with the numbers.
ZSS (35-65)... LOL ZSS gets more credit then she should. She is /not/ Good at all and easily edgeable and easy to approch, her speed is a only real factor. Samus has a great edgegame. Use it? 60-40

Yoshi (35-65)footstool. Learn to footstool... Cannot stress this enough, Once you grow afraid of the super armour.. You wont win. Eggs = Zair. not greater then, they are equal, its who gets out which one first. 50-50

Meta Knight (35-65)
Samus is a decent MK CP. You do know you can grab MK out of his whorenados and also mines stop both of them, proper spacing and downdodging is needed to avoid a lot of them, but because MK is so overplayed, no matter what i say will change these numbers. My numbers would say 55-45. But right now its a 5-95 :/

Snake (35-65)
Again, not agreeing... Samus is again a epic CP for Snake. Zair, easily spikeable, Campable, Comboable. A good snake will put up a good fight, but i am sure a lot of people who use Samus a lot and go to tounries, are getting much better at fighting Snakes. 55-45

Kirby (30-70)
Sadly, I agree.

King Dedede (30-70)
25-75 nuff said. I could even argue this and say Avoid CG, you could go 75-25 and just camp the D3, but that only works for so long.

Mr. Game & Watch (30-70)
Fought a few pro Gaw's. Not this bad of a matchup. 45-55.

Olimar (25-75)
What are you on? LOLimar isnt that bad.You just may not know how to adjust or fight them. A small jab knocks pikmin off, and simply spacing and id even recommend being very agressive to beat them. 65-35

 

[Ryusuta]

Hi, everyone. I'm from the Yoshi board, and I just thought I'd throw in a few thoughts. First, in regards to the OP on this topic, no, Yoshi can't CG Samus. He can CG Zero Suit Samus, but not regular Samus. She's just too floaty and pops out too far up to CG. So you do have that going for you.

Samus is probably NOT going to footstool Yoshi. Even with characters that have a decent aerial speed I'd say it's a really unlikely proposition. For one thing, Yoshi players are going to be looking out for a footstool and/or spike. A lot of people tend to underestimate Yoshi's recovery and charge in like a bull with a hard-on trying to gimp him. Chances are, it's not going to happen, especially in Samus' case, with her unimpressive air speed. You're better off either chasing with Z air or charging your laser (SHOOP DA WHOOP).

Yoshi's not a great fight for Samus, as previously stated. He has all the tool to neutralize Samus' projectile game completely, and you really have to count on your disjointed hitboxes, which are generally either laggy or weak.

As mentioned before, Z air is the one thing you have against the dinosaur. Other than that, it's probably going to be a relatively long fight, as Yoshi tends to survive a long time against Samus' attacks.

 

[Hive]

Oh, my experiences with sonic put him at an advantage too... almost all of his attacks can close the gap on samus really fast, he has a decent recovery and his aerial game is pretty good too....
yea, I was surprised too ^^ but sonic actually does pretty good here... mainly from how well he can take out samus' spam game, and how his attacks, if they miss, still oftentimes leave him in a place where he isn't vulnerable... I'd say 65-35 sonic if he knows what he's doing...
things to watch out for- spin attack to jump to uair (fast and all both the spin attack and uair hit samus) also spin attack to jump to homing attack too... in these situations its pretty good to shield through it and then spin attack him... however after doing this maybe twice sonic will switch it up and cancel his dash attack right before you and either go for a smash or a grab...
also beware of his spring to uair follow up when you are high in the air... be ready to airdodge or it is an early off the top of the stage ko
His spin attacks usually eat missiles ... zair works well, but you can't spam it enough to keep him from approaching you...
In this match Samus is stuck playing defense...since sonic approaches so well.. which barely ever does well for her...

 

[PKNintendo]

Ive been around the block a lot lately... a lot of this list i do not agree with and felt like it was sprouted out of their *** from fighting on wifi or friends. Ill add comments and own numbers...

Ganondorf (70-30)
85-15.
Charizard (70-30)
60-40
Bowser (70-30)
90-10

Captain Falcon (70-30)
55-45 CF deserves more credit. Even fought a hard CF? they are not easy to camp.

Ivysaur (60-40)
90-10 (Too easy. Could rant. )

Jigglypuff (60-40)
... No. Try 45-55.

Even
Fox (55-45)
Lol... sounds about right, id even push 40-60

Link (55-45)
40-60 also.

Ike (55-45)
Apperently... You never fought a good Ike that can infinity Jab you. More to rant on later 35-65

Donkey Kong (55-45)
Now this i do not agree with. 65-35 Samus Favour. big targets ALWAYS get ***** by Samus.

Sonic (50-50)
Sonic sucks? but id even push 55-45 because of Samus > Projectiles Then Sonic.

Diddy Kong (50-50)
Diddy favor much? Granted you can glide toss more. Being small is a huge factor, and a good diddy isnt going to let you just take his naners. 40-60

Ice climbers (50-50)
small, Hard to hit, easily able to CG you. Projectile and Desyncable. 35-65

Samus (50-50) Why is this here?

Pit (45-55)
Agreeable.

Rob (45-55)
ROB > Samus... 35-65

Unfavorable
Falco (40-60)
Alright.Id even go for > camping over Samus. mmaybe 35-65

Peach (40-60)
Ive fought peaches like Skys and KB's alongside even seeing dark Peach play. the more i fight peaches, the more I am able to say... They **** the **** out of a Samus, granted a good match can be done and you can win, but its a 35-65.

Lucas (40-60)
Lucas is nothing like Ness, stop comparing them, Also. 65-35. Lucas isnt a hard matchup if you watch what you are doing.

Ness (40-60)
35-65. An agressive Ness will beat a Samus, Regardless of what you may think or even begin to think.

Sheik (40-60)
55-45

Wario (40-60)
50-50 All about playstyle. Id even push this in samus's favor due ot Warios low projectile and ranged game.

Wolf (40-60)
Easily gimpable. 45-55.

Toon Link (40-60)
Ew.... 20-80.

Zelda (40-60)
Zelda will beat a Samus... Lol... But just try your best to get her offstage. 30-70

Mario (40-60)
Lolwut. 60-40

Squirtle (40-60)
25-75.

Pikachu (40-60)
you will not beat a Pikachu thats a pro. /end. 10-90.

Marth (35-65)
Ive had no problems with Marths in tounries, even ones that are all Fair and Sworddance, which is all Marths now do in brawl. but sadly, His Fair eats projectiles and as was said before, Zair gets too predictable. 40-60

Luigi (35-65) Gah...akjlghlkgjhg Right on.

Lucario (35-65) This goes either way, if you know how to kill with Samus, your all good, but sadly, At this point, Samus racks up damage to fast and cant kill below 120%. Lucario at that point, can kill you when your at 50%. Go Die lucario. I agree with the numbers.
ZSS (35-65)... LOL ZSS gets more credit then she should. She is /not/ Good at all and easily edgeable and easy to approch, her speed is a only real factor. Samus has a great edgegame. Use it? 60-40

Yoshi (35-65)footstool. Learn to footstool... Cannot stress this enough, Once you grow afraid of the super armour.. You wont win. Eggs = Zair. not greater then, they are equal, its who gets out which one first. 50-50

Meta Knight (35-65)
Samus is a decent MK CP. You do know you can grab MK out of his whorenados and also mines stop both of them, proper spacing and downdodging is needed to avoid a lot of them, but because MK is so overplayed, no matter what i say will change these numbers. My numbers would say 55-45. But right now its a 5-95 :/

Snake (35-65)
Again, not agreeing... Samus is again a epic CP for Snake. Zair, easily spikeable, Campable, Comboable. A good snake will put up a good fight, but i am sure a lot of people who use Samus a lot and go to tounries, are getting much better at fighting Snakes. 55-45

Kirby (30-70)
Sadly, I agree.

King Dedede (30-70)
25-75 nuff said. I could even argue this and say Avoid CG, you could go 75-25 and just camp the D3, but that only works for so long.

Mr. Game & Watch (30-70)
Fought a few pro Gaw's. Not this bad of a matchup. 45-55.

Olimar (25-75)
What are you on? LOLimar isnt that bad.You just may not know how to adjust or fight them. A small jab knocks pikmin off, and simply spacing and id even recommend being very agressive to beat them. 65-35

Finally! Someone who DOESN'T think Ness is Lucas twin clone. You are my hero.

 

[Hive]

@Ravin- these numbers are probably more accurate in my opinion than what we have up right now :/.... it might be easier just to use your numbers and work from there ^^
still I see quite a few things I would disagree with...
(Samus being a counter to MK? Sonic having the disadvantage, Jiggs having the advantage, Olimar being an advantage for samus?, and having an advantage on DDD by "just avoiding the grabs" lol, and Pit being disadvataged vs. samus.... to name a few...)

ps how often does chromepirate edit this...?

 

[Hive]

Anyways, to sum up your numbers Ravin:

Advantage:
Bowser (90-10)
Ivysaur (90-10)
Ganondorf (85-15)
Donkey Kong (65-35)
Lucas (65-35)
Olimar (65-35)?
Charizard (60-40)
Mario (60-40)
ZSS (60-40)
Neutral:
Captain Falcon (55-45)
SOnic (55-45)
Sheik (55-45)
Snake (55-45)
Wario (50-50)
Samus (50-50)
Yoshi (50-50)
Jigglypuff (45-55)
Pit (45-55)
G&W (45-55)
Disadvantage:
Fox (40-60)
Marth (40-60)
Link (40-60)
Ike (35-65)
R.O.B. (35-65)
Falco (35-65)
Peach (35-65)
Ness (35-65)
Luigi (35-65)
Ice Climbers (35-65)
Lucario (35-65)
Kirby (30-70)
Zelda (30-70)
Squirtle (25-75)
King Dedede (25-75)
Toon Link (20-80)
Metaknight (10-90)
Pikachu (10-90)


though, like I said before there are still quite a few things I would argue though @.@
But overall i think its more accurate....

 

[Ryusuta]

Ganondorf (70-30)
85-15.

Bowser (70-30)
90-10

Ivysaur (60-40)
90-10 (Too easy. Could rant. )

Donkey Kong (55-45)
Now this i do not agree with. 65-35 Samus Favour. big targets ALWAYS get ***** by Samus.
Lucas (40-60)

Lucas is nothing like Ness, stop comparing them, Also. 65-35. Lucas isnt a hard matchup if you watch what you are doing.

Ness (40-60)
35-65. An agressive Ness will beat a Samus, Regardless of what you may think or even begin to think.

Toon Link (40-60)
Ew.... 20-80.

Pikachu (40-60)
you will not beat a Pikachu thats a pro. /end. 10-90.

Marth (35-65)
Ive had no problems with Marths in tounries, even ones that are all Fair and Sworddance, which is all Marths now do in brawl. but sadly, His Fair eats projectiles and as was said before, Zair gets too predictable. 40-60

Yoshi (35-65)footstool. Learn to footstool... Cannot stress this enough, Once you grow afraid of the super armour.. You wont win. Eggs = Zair. not greater then, they are equal, its who gets out which one first. 50-50

Mr. Game & Watch (30-70)
Fought a few pro Gaw's. Not this bad of a matchup. 45-55.

Let me just bottom-line this: you have GOT to be kidding me. These are some of the worst match-up analyses I've seen in a very long time, especially the highlighted ones. 90-10 against Ivysaur? Are you freaking insane? Even Ness vs. Marth wasn't considered a 90-10 in Marth's favor when the infinite was still in play. And I should probably point out that Ivysaur has relatively little trouble with Samus. I'd say it's a stretch to give Samus an advantage in that match, but a 90-10? You've got to be out of your mind.

And to even imply that Game & Watch does anything but destroy Samus is absurd.

 

[Coldfront]

She's at a disadvantage against Link?

And Ness is a bad match-up for her?

Lucas doesn't seem to be on the list.

She's at a disadvantage against Ike?

Olimar is at the disadvantage against her?

 

[Hive]

Ivysaur dosn't have an advantage against samus
dtilits ko ivysaur sooo early (less than 110%), his recovery is really gimpable, and samus completely outranges him with zair and missile spams(She cancels out Ivys main strength.... that being range), and zair eats through his razor leaf spam... (90-10) is probably a stretch though... but samus def has the advantage...
P.T. probably has the slight advantage on the whole though...

 

[ADHD]

updated, my comments suck so ill just leave them for the true matchup thread that someone else did/will do, this is just a general idea of how things are.

 

[Hive]

thnx chrome ^^ switch around G&W's numbers though, you have them at (70-30)
Oh, and add Olimar too!

 

[ADHD]

thnx chrome ^^ switch around G&W's numbers though, you have them at (70-30)
Oh, and add Olimar too!

gnw is a terrible matchup for samus and I added olimar as 25-75 because that is truly a horrific matchup

 

[Hive]

gnw is a terrible matchup for samus

I realize that ^^... which is why you should change it from samus' advantage (70-30) lol

 

[Ryusuta]

Ivysaur dosn't have an advantage against samus
dtilits ko ivysaur sooo early (less than 110%), his recovery is really gimpable, and samus completely outranges him with zair and missile spams(She cancels out Ivys main strength.... that being range), and zair eats through his razor leaf spam... (90-10) is probably a stretch though... but samus def has the advantage...
P.T. probably has the slight advantage on the whole though...

You're forgetting back air, which neutralizes Samus' spam. Essentially, what you're looking at is this:

-Samus can spam Ivysaur, Ivysaur neutralizes that with back air.
-Samus can z air spam, but is outranged by defensive Razor Leafs.
-Ivysaur can defensive Razor Leaf, but Samus can go back to spamming.

That part of the game is rock, paper, scissors.

-Ivysaur has more damage and KO potential that Samus, while Samus has much safer recovery and aerial options. Both have several disjointed hitboxes at varying speeds.
-She can also edge guard Ivy relatively easily (let's not kid ourselves and say that her edge guarding is impenetrable).

Because she has a small "edge" with her edge guarding, I'd give consideration to a 60-40 advantage to Samus.

 

[Hive]

zair completely destroys ivys back air :/ I play P.T.s seriously all the time (pokemonmasterIRL, Itburns, Adriel, Youstuffstank)^^ its quicker, has way more range, and eats through Ivys bair, meaning he can't approach...
it doesn't matter if razor leaf goes further either ^^, what I'm saying is that zair EATS through razor leaf and hits ivysaur.. in pure range, homing missiles outdo razor leaf as well...
I'd put the matchup at... mayber 70-30 or 65-35ish... Ivysaur has a great grab game and some powerful spore attacks and up B ^^

 

[Ryusuta]

To be honest, PTIRL isn't the most impressive Pokemon Trainer in the world, and his Ivysaur is probably his worst. He has an incredible Charizard, but not much beyond that.

(I'm not being mean, we've discussed this before, back when I played as Pokemon Trainer.)

You can't rely on Z air to win you this fight. There are too many defensive options in this game to think that it will keep a good Ivysaur completely at bay. It just won't happen.

Don't get me wrong, Z air is a great move. So is Snake's forward tilt. But that's not going to win him a match single-handedly, and it's not unbeatable. Neither is Z air. Don't overestimate the move.

 

[Hive]

zair is a pretty solid move in this match... ivysaur really doesn't have defense options against it except power shield and dodge.... which both can become exploitable with a grab, or a homing missile/different timed zair....
In my experience.... samus can rely a lot on zair in this match... obviously though that's not the only thing she will do... that would be dumb.

 

[Ryusuta]

You're forgetting stage counterpicks and moving defense. I haven't played as PT for awhile, but I could show you if you'd like.

 

[Hive]

P.T. has some pretty good stage counterpicks: Corneria for example....
but in most any of the starters I think Samus will have the advantage over Ivy... imo

edit: I don't play wifi... not sure how you would show me otherwise... unless you mean like a thread?