ROM 5 !! November 17-18 ! Road to Apex! NEW VENUE! Streamed by VGBootCamp!!

foshio

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I'm not as emotionally charged now. I really respect Unknown & KK, I was disappointed with them today. I know M2K is infamous for controversy in large tournaments. Alukard is one of the best tournament organizers in the community. I think we have to wait for the information to come in from all places and look at the situation honestly and make sure that we make decisions that try to reduce these 'scandalous' and damaging tournament moments. This situation could split and break the community with a strong emotional response. Lets not allow that to happen and try to make something positive out of a strange and controversial time.
 

-RedShadow

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Also just for the record, the smash community isn't looked down upon because of situations such as this. It's because of everyone whining about these situations and ultimately doing nothing about it, rather than finding a solution to ensure it doesn't happen again (lack or organization/direction, something alot of people have been saying waaaaaaay before me).

If Unknown/KK/Jason are punished for this then so be it (tbh I hope they don't). Just stating my last two pennies.
 

Krynxe

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If I had to make a guess

Unknown agreed that the rematch in WF was dumb and that he shouldn't have won that set

Did what he did based on thinking that he didn't deserve to win. Maybe he thought KK deserved to be in GF or something, idk.

Again, just a guess. No real clue since I don't know Unknown personally
 

Jebril

Smash Apprentice
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All of this salt is kinda pissing me off. The M2K vs Unknown situation is another disscusion in itself, but to punish/"lose respect" for players that a)did something that didn't breach the rules (i.e. splitting) or b)didn't perform to certain people's standards is kinda ****ing dumb imo.

I guess if TO's want to implement rules that, in the future, discourage splitting, that's fine.

This is gonna be lost in this sea of bull**** but I really don't care anymore. You guys need to stop acting like you're entitiled to a performance or some stupid ****. Or that this kind of drama is only limited to Smash (do y'all even pay attention to the FGC?!).
Uh yeah I watch the FGC all the time and it's never like this at ANY National. I dare you to name one National in the last 3 to 5 years that has been like this. Quit kidding yourself, this is a mockery to what the Community is suppose to represent. If you want splitting and sandbagging to represent you I guess you're just another typical scumbag, which wouldn't honestly surprise me from how you've been talking about the situation.

No offense but TOs and Streamers, entrants (i.e. pot fillers), spectators, pretty much a good majority of people are going to be upset when they see this kind of thing play out in WFs, LFs, and GFs. It's disrespectful on many levels for all the people who put work into this tournament especially.

I mean seriously I have to ask do you know anything about the FGC? Because you seem to think this kind of thing happens all the time at the FGC. I have news for you, it really doesn't. Even if players split over there they have the decency to just play it out and not tell anyone. When two EG members are at GFs they go their mains, they don't choose secondaries and mess around for 18K to watch. You think if they did things like that, they would get 18K viewers at their streams? No.

The reason the FGC grew the way it did is because it has something the Smash community clearly lacks, discipline and drive. There is a much stronger passion for the games that they play in that community than when it comes down to the Smash community. Do you ever see thousand to five thousand dollar MMs in the Smash community or even a quarter of that? I guess Smash will always be a party game at heart while others will actually be competitive as long as the community acts like this.

Let me make this clear though, I don't want rules for this kind of thing. I don't really even want rules for splitting or showing it or w/e, I would rather the players just have the decency not to this type of garbage in the first place. But I guess Nationals are going to start needing them if this is how top players are gonna treat tournaments. Why are you mashing on your taunt button to the community? M2K, Unknown, KK? Why!? D:
 

ShroudedOne

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At the end of the day, I just blame M2K, really. KK and Unknown...I can reconcile that.

They shouldn't have replayed out game 5 of...was it WSF?

Splitting does allude to fixing outcomes, which by all accounts is not cool (for big tournies).

Jumping to conclusions is bad and I'm guilty, but I had time to think it over. If we really, truly want to be seen as competitive, we shouldn't let this kind of thing occur.

We should also be solution oriented, and try to figure out how we can make sure this doesn't happen again, in the way it did (making sure that each player has a copy of the ruleset, banning splitting [if it should come down to that]).

Umbreon is also right (kind of). I don't think top players should be allowed to just get into WFs/GFs and say "Hey, let's just split and not take the matches seriously." Whether or not you play seriously is up to you. The issue here, in my opinion, is the collusion.
 

Mew2King

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you're dumb and don't know what you're talking about. Go to this thread for all the info - http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=329934&page=3

it was my fault for asking to split, but i also allowed alukard/unknown/KK to change the brackets after they asked me (since I was on eggm's side, who i always beat), to make my bracket harder so they (kk vs unknown) wouldn't have to fight each other again before finals but fight us NJ players instead, and I agreed to it knowing full well it would disadvantage me.

The other situation is that after I won game 5 of GF they make me redo it and ruin my mood and mindset the rest of the day. It was the normal ruleset so I assumed it was the same again but I found out later it wasn't, but we had already played the match out and i won it, so it's not fair to redo it. The only reason I even went to try to win the tourney (I was in such a bad mood i wanted to forfeit from then on) is cuz Hax wanted to play me and then he told me to try to win the tournament.

I played GF serious but unknown didn't use his serious characters.
 

ZoSo

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Uh yeah I watch the FGC all the time and it's never like this at ANY National. I dare you to name one National in the last 3 to 5 years that has been like this.
Not saying I agree with what went down, but wasn't there a Canada Cup where Daigo and Mago blatantly sandbagged in the finals?
 

Beat!

Smash Master
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Wow. This is so disappointing.

People can split all they want at locals, but at majors, you pull yourself together and play your ****ing matches.
 

pewpewyou

Smash Journeyman
Joined
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Messages
206
What about the love of the game?

Since when did we start playing smash like it's a ****ing chore?

We play this game because we love it. So show some love, man.
 

Sanji Himura

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you're dumb and don't know what you're talking about. Go to this thread for all the info - http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=329934&page=3

it was my fault for asking to split, but i also allowed alukard/unknown/KK to change the brackets after they asked me (since I was on eggm's side, who i always beat), to make my bracket harder so they (kk vs unknown) wouldn't have to fight each other again before finals but fight us NJ players instead, and I agreed to it knowing full well it would disadvantage me.

The other situation is that after I won game 5 of GF they make me redo it and ruin my mood and mindset the rest of the day. It was the normal ruleset so I assumed it was the same again but I found out later it wasn't, but we had already played the match out and i won it, so it's not fair to redo it. The only reason I even went to try to win the tourney (I was in such a bad mood i wanted to forfeit from then on) is cuz Hax wanted to play me and then he told me to try to win the tournament.

I played GF serious but unknown didn't use his serious characters.
I may piss you off, but since when do you care about having a harder bracket? That is the fault of the TO for not seeding properly, and if you beat eggm all the time, tough ****. You don't have the right to rearrange the entire bracket just because you beat eggm all the time.

And concerning GF, there was a rule that I place on every tournament that I run, and it goes something like this.

The TO reserves the right to have any game of the set replayed, even if it is the last game of the set.
What that meant was that I, acting in my capacity as the TO, can tell players to replay any game of the set, even if it was the deciding game.

It appears to me that you got pissy at GF because Unknown used characters that he normally doesn't use, and enter your typical ranting and raving.
 

Eddie G

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Pewpewyou speaks the truth. I think that's part of the reason people were so excited to see a Ken cameo over at the Cali event. He was the reigning champion during a time when being a champion and having something to shoot for meant something - not this "split to take home a little bit more than a full time biweekly minimum wage paycheck amount" garbage. Shameful, ****ing shameful...the lot of you.

:phone:
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Pewpewyou speaks the truth. I think that's part of the reason people were so excited to see a Ken cameo over at the Cali event. He was the reigning champion during a time when being a champion and having something to shoot for meant something - not this "split to take home a little bit more than a full time biweekly minimum wage paycheck amount" garbage. Shameful, ****ing shameful...the lot of you.

:phone:
this would mean a lot more if splits weren't common as **** back in the day. ken split way more than any of those other players at KoC ever did.

misinformation + ethics = this situation.
 

♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡

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as you are someone who is increasingly involved with many projects, this is fairly disappointing coming from you.
I understand and I apologize about my earlier rant which was inappropriate.

I hate splitting and I am disappointed at players that do it. In my opinion it shouldn't be allowed at all. GIMR put it well, if you want to do it, don't do it in public.

I'm sick of seeing results threads (either smaller or larger) with players splitting the pot because it hurts the whole competitive community. I think this is an issue that should be discussed more, especially how to prevent people from splitting.
 

Tonb3rry

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I don't think I've ever seen anyone split a pot in Europe, EVER! And I've been in the community since the very start. When smash is about money and not the challenge, fun and at least a minor pride, stop playing the game and ****ing get a regular job instead. That'll give you more money, and we don't get to see **** like this. Splitting is like cutting your balls off. Not cool!
 

Krynxe

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I hear cutting your balls off is a pretty trendy thing to do here in America
 

the real jman

Smash Apprentice
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Messages
92
All of ya shut the **** up u all sound like Lil *****es

Who r ya to say they can't spilt

It's a ****ing video game they can do whatever the **** they want if they got that far in brakit

I'm ****ing glad I don't play anymore u smashers now a days r lil *****es ya ***** about everything instead of trying to get good your selfs

:phone:
 

Keitaro

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M2K the beginning problem of this is that you asked for a split. Regardless if you tried or not, asking for a split can make your opponent not try.
 

Tonb3rry

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All of ya shut the **** up u all sound like Lil *****es

Who r ya to say they can't spilt

It's a ****ing video game they can do whatever the **** they want if they got that far in brakit

I'm ****ing glad I don't play anymore u smashers now a days r lil *****es ya ***** about everything instead of trying to get good your selfs

:phone:
Now, what the hell are you talking about? Not saying they can't split, cuz obviously they can, but splitting removes everything that has anything to do with a good tournament. Competing to prove that you're good, or the best. I'm also pretty sure that a lot of the people who are against this are top players, so what you are saying makes no sense.
When people are splitting the prize pots because they are too afraid to prove who's the best, I think there's a legitimate excuse for the people who have been so hyped for the outcome of this tournament to ***** like *****s.

Btw, do you see anyone split the prize pot in other sports, like soccer or basketball? OF COURSE YOU DON'T!

Edit: And what's up with the censoring? For the first of all some of the words that are censored are not even swear words, secondly I think a 100 percent of the people on the boards have seen those words before. God bless.
 

-Darc-

Heir to the Monado
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HERE'S AN IDEA

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SPLIT MAKE IT LOOK LIKE YOU'RE NOT GOING TO SPLIT

****ing christ it's not that hard
 

KanyeRest

bair-condtioned nightmare
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anyone who says this really shows how smash is viewed is ********. so we had a bad tourney, that's happened to the FGC before, obviously. rom5 was bad but let's get our heads up for apex 2013 so we can really show what smash is all about.
 

Baskerville

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Agreed, besides we have NEC & Apex just around the corner, hopefully in the future TOs would take note and avoid something like this from happening.

Also, for the love of Christ NO warm ups in the middle of the tournament, its a waste of time for both the players & the TOs.
 

TheTantalus

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In competitive sports, there is a penalty for stuff like this. If I were Alex Strife, I would remove Mew2King and unknowns seeding points for APEX and seed them as scrubs as penalty for this tournament.

inb4thatsnotfairtootherplayers

If you want to take a stance, then do it. But I doubt anyone will have the balls.

I was really glad I was watching the steelers/ravens game and not this tournament. Very disappointing. I understand why people split and all, but keep it to yourselves! You have a responsibility as a top player in my opinion to conduct yourself at the highest level.
 

Achilles1515

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I'm just pissed about this because I stayed up until midnight to watch grand finals even though I had to wake up at 5 in the morning for work (because I f***ing love this game...), and got a bunch of bulls**t instead. When GF started, I was like “Oh okay, Unknown is throwing the first set” which is fine, because I feel like M2K really did deserve to win WF...but then he proceeds to throw set 2...

What happens in Monopoly when someone forgets to ask for their rent money and the next person rolls?
What happens in euchre when someone steals the deal without anyone noticing? That’s everyone elses f***ing fault and you continue on.

Unknown needs to know his s**t before they play and say “NO M2K….you’re not allowed to go to that stage”. It was just lame how that all played out. Even with the TO rule about replaying games, I would have said “Tough luck Unknown. You agreed to play there and ignoring all the matches prior to the last one, it was a fair fight and M2K won. Sorry but we’re not replaying it. But you can bet the bank that we’ll have our eyes on M2K now to make sure he plays according to the rules…”

I’m incredibly disappointed that Unknown threw the whole GF too…even if it didn’t matter. And double disappointed that he agreed to split with M2K….thats horses**t sportsmanship and that is how you lose your fan base – by coming all the way from Canada to not even compete to the end. Like everyone else said, if youre going to split (which no one is stopping you from doing)…play Grand Finals like you mean it - to prove to your opponent that youre better than them anyway, and if you guys want to give each other money later, then so be it. Just don’t act like a p***y about it.

Everyone needs to get off M2Ks back also. This wasn’t all his fault.

Edit: Oh and 5min button checks!?!? that was absolutely ridiculous and selfish. I understand that being warmed up is a key part of playing your best....but warm up on a different TV prior to your match. Is that really so much to ask?
 

Juushichi

sugoi ~ sugoi ~
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The only thing that I would personally blame Alukard for is switching up the contestants for WSF.

They played all the way to ****ing Winner's Semis. Why... why... why the **** would you change KK vs Unknown and M2K vs Eggm because they're from the same region or play each other all the time? TO 101, you do not **** with the bracket once it's going. Whether you sympathize with Alukard or not, without this, the ruling of M2K vs Unknown as it happened never would have happened.

Hax was the one who got ****ed by this the hardest. Instead of a likely rematch vs Eggm (in a 1-2 loss that imo was pretty much an instant classic) to try to escape the 5th place Falcon curse, he gets paired up with M2K. Not only that, they also played a 3/5? What the **** is that.
 

King Funk

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It is completely acceptable to split as long as the competitors try their hardest in the actual tournament sets. What really matters is not the money itself, but the pride and prestige that comes with winning the tournament. Prog made a good example in the other thread about Justin Wong and Ricky Ortiz splitting in SSFIV:AE tournaments but still playing their best because they care to give the attendees and stream viewers a show of competitive spirit and sportsmanship.

And all of that was blatantly ignored at RoM5. Quite a shame.

Worst of all, there was no reason for Unknown or M2K to do this. Unknown had the chance to prove that he had become a top player, while Mew2King had a chance at winning a major tournament for the first time in a long while. A couple hundred dollars shouldn't be a reason for anyone to throw away their will to win.
 

Juushichi

sugoi ~ sugoi ~
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Next time I'm in a bracket and not in WF, LF, or GF (and I never am) and am supposed to play a 2/3, I will request a 3/5 or 5/7. If my opponent agrees to it, it's okay right?

Because the TO is not involved in this at all, right? What a joke.
 

HoChiMinhTrail

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This was some weak ****, but people make mistakes. Don't disrespect the community like this again, **** aint cool. That being said, just try your hardest to **** at Apex. AND STOP ****ING MAKING STUPID CONTROLLER JOHNS YOU ****ING SCRUBS.
 

GOTM

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Prog made a good example in the other thread about Justin Wong and Ricky Ortiz splitting in SSFIV:AE tournaments but still playing their best because they care to give the attendees and stream viewers a show of competitive spirit and sportsmanship.
Not only this but, where's the pride?? I guess they are just not competitive guys whatsoever. So, if they don't play for the money (obviously), and they don't play to win, what were they playing for? To waste time?
 

Tonb3rry

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Not only this but, where's the pride?? I guess they are just not competitive guys whatsoever. So, if they don't play for the money (obviously), and they don't play to win, what were they playing for? To waste time?
Could be. I'd rather waste time playing smash in a tournament than wasting time doing nothing :troll:
 

Mike G

███████████████ 100%
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This was some weak ****, but people make mistakes. Don't disrespect the community like this again, **** aint cool. That being said, just try your hardest to **** at Apex. AND STOP ****ING MAKING STUPID CONTROLLER JOHNS YOU ****ING SCRUBS.
My exact thoughts. Trail keeping it real as ****.


old school fa lyfe
 

Scar

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I may piss you off, but since when do you care about having a harder bracket? That is the fault of the TO for not seeding properly, and if you beat eggm all the time, tough ****. You don't have the right to rearrange the entire bracket just because you beat eggm all the time.

And concerning GF, there was a rule that I place on every tournament that I run, and it goes something like this.



What that meant was that I, acting in my capacity as the TO, can tell players to replay any game of the set, even if it was the deciding game.

It appears to me that you got pissy at GF because Unknown used characters that he normally doesn't use, and enter your typical ranting and raving.
jw if this guy has any clue what he's talking about in any capacity whatsoever lol

p.s. i just watched the skulls

more entertaining than RoM5 GFs

but RoM in general was an incredibly fun tourney, definitely reminded me that the homies are equally important to me as the game itself is. i love melee but it's nothing without the community (read: my friends). i feel bad for alu for all the drama =/ and i'm pretty excited for dat shoutouts thread

tope you should have been there
 
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