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PPMD's Falco Discussion Thread

Fortress | Sveet

Fortress | Sveet

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Intuition said:
don't you ever get tired of *****ing about how bad your character is? if you could play marth as well as you complain you wouldn't need a smashboards account.
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i like how there was a string of jokes going on about marth and then niko added to the joke and you reply with this... are you stupid or purposefully an *******?
 
oliman

oliman

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how come like no falcos powershield? it seems like an optimum solution to powershielding would be to powershield right back.

also has anyone noticed how falco's hardest mu's are against women? lol
 
D

Druggedfox

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Max? said:
I would **** all of his "mentees" except PP, so please bring it :)
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I won't bring anyone else into this (since I'm pretty sure I'd beat you), I just find it funny that you think you'd **** m2k... or an on point scar, for that matter.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Max? said:
It's hilarious considering that Niko would most likely destroy you mercilessly Mow. You might know alot about this game, but you're most certainly washed up. And if you aren't feel free to come and prove it.

Oh wait, you won't, because it's so much easier to talk ****.
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wait, it's easier for me to talk shit? or for you to talk shit? I can't tell. You can come to me home boy.

I'm not trying to go for a skill contest, I haven't seriously played smash for a few years. I'm just tired of the bitching. But I already won $18k off this game, and I don't have to prove shit.

my bad @ niko.
 
Dr Peepee

Dr Peepee

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Give me like another week or something lol I got lots of stuff

Marth's hard but I think that guy *****. I'm probably worst at fighting Falcon with my Marth which is interesting to me. I don't think I've ever really sat down and tried to perfect the matchup though so whatever lol.

Falco dittos on FD....mean stuff.

I'll make better posts later lol but keep up the fair discussion.

Can't wait to get super serious again =)
 
leffen

leffen

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Peach wins by a tiny bit over falco or goes even, no way Falco wins with a reasonable stagelist (and that is after countless hours of playing that match up vs Armada, me and Calle W probably have 10x the top lvl peach experience any other falco has lol ;o).

I'd say he goes even with sheik and marth and he loses to jigglypuff. He definitely wins over Samus lol.

Considering he has very few match ups that are even I'd say that the statement is pretty accurate.

he gets ***** by nana lol
 
Fortress | Sveet

Fortress | Sveet

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http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9556192&postcount=1792
HugS said:
I'll simply go by my experience on a few match ups before I have to head out again. People usually just chime in with "well it's HugS, not Samus, otherwise Samus gets *****" which is why I refrain from posting any kind of opinions I have on match ups.

Anyways.

I believe Samus has a slight advantage on Falco. It's so hard to describe why some matches are advantageous since there is so much that goes into a match. So in the interest of communication, I'll break the matchup down into 3 crucial categories:

1. Defense
2. Offense
3. Edge game

Samus effectively shuts down Falco's offensive game with her defensive game. I'll assume that the prevention of your opponent's offense is the main purpose of a good defense. Simply put, Samus's upB out of shield stops most any effective approach Falco has in any other match up. The Falco can only hope to be able to trick the samus into mis-timing or mis-using her upB. These are artificial ways of dealing with the situation IMO, as tricks run thin. You can play rock paper scissors with a good samus and hope she can't figure out when you're grabbing/attacking. Any attack will be beaten.

If you do manage to get that first hit in, Samus has her passive defense, which involves her inability to be combo'd very well. Not that it's flawless, but it helps make this portion of the match up go into her favor.

Defense Adavntage - Samus

Offense - Clearly, falco has a better offense. He can overwhelm most any character. Samus's offense isn't the greatest, but it's better than Falco's defense. And if Falco's Defense has 1 purpose, it's to stop Samus's offense, and it won't be able to do that. Missiles aid in the approach, and once Samus is in there, it becomes a matter of outranging Falco and being able to quickly switch to defensive mode if needed. The main factor that puts this slightly in Samus's favor (IMO) is falco's ability to be combo'd. Which means that Samus need break through falco's defense only once to possibly end his stock. And if the falco is camping, Samus can close in with missiles, break through lasers with a wavedash - tilt and catch falco only once to tie up the damage, or take the stock. This is all hard, mind you, which is why most people don't even consider this an advantage for Samus. Either way, it's only a slight advantage to either no matter how you look at it.

Offense - Slight Advantage for either Falco/Samus,

3. Edge Game - It's no surprise that falco has a shoddy recovery. It's also no surprise that Samus has one of the best. So this part of the Edgegame clearly goes to Samus.

As far as edgeguarding goes, that requires some analysis. I'd have to give Samus the advantage on this one. Samus has an amazing edgeguard coupled with the fact that Falco has a terrible recovery. Limiting his options is cake. If he side-B's, ftilt. If he up B's from below, utilt. If you don't know where he's going, shoot a missile/shot to make him go where you want, then commence with the process. Falco on the other hand, must keep track of all her options. First he must get rid of the grapple, then he must stop a sweet spot, which ain't gonna happen if the Samus sweetspots perfectly. And if the falco grabs the ledge, you should still have your jump to get in anyways. This on top of the fact that's there's no distance samus can't come back from means that Samus doesn't die from falco edgeguards.

3. Advantage - Samus

So I hope that helps explain why I feel Samus has the slight advantage over falco. I don't have more time to write about other characters atm. And I could probably delve into Samus vs Falco even more, but I think this is enough.

And FYI Fletch, your sig is dumb. You can employ patient thinking/predicting in checkers or chess, the main difference between the two games is the amount of options, and chess, like Melee, most definitely delivers more options.
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I trust the best samus player in the world :rolleyes:
 
leffen

leffen

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"Best" samus doesn't really say **** since there is no samus that places in the top. I outplaced him at G2 >_< (he also had 4th seed entering brackets btw). I could be considered the 2nd best Falco main (if you dont consider mango one) but that doesn't really mean **** tbh.

I haven't played vs HugS myself but when I played IHSB it was 2-3 stocks 90% of the games without any real effort to camp or to actually exploit samus lol >_>.

Samus upB is extremely overrated too, if you just SDI you get a free combo 80% of the time and the other 20% she just gives you ~5% if you just hold left/right lol.
 
Divinokage

Divinokage

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LOL, but Leffen is probably better than IHSB.. but you have to draw the line somewhere as for the matchups I mean. And also knowing the matchup does not equal to actually being able to execute it in battle. Umm.. not sure what i'm supposed to say here lol. Was he saying.. what Hugs says is wrong?

Because there's clearly also the problem style vs style. That affects matchups greatly too. And eventually you are able to create a nice balance to enable yourself without limits. lol.
 
leffen

leffen

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Sveet said:
Comparing IHSB to HugS is like comparing obama to bush
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I know, they are oh so different but none of them can really do ****.


@Kage. He used the argument "hurr durr hugs is da best and I trust him" which has no relevance really, since I'm still the better player >_>. There were a LOT of things I don't agree with in HugS post but I really cba to point them out, Sveet doesnt even play falco and obviously has no idea about the matchup.
 
Fortress | Sveet

Fortress | Sveet

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leffen that wasnt my argument at all... I posted a wall of text of hugs explaining the match-up. I said i trust hugs, since he is obviously a more successful and experienced player than myself I think I can trust that his experiences over 7 years of playing this game hold true.

And I'm sure you would have loved a mario bros bracket, kage. hugs probably would have rather had a spacie or falcon bracket.
 
Fortress | Sveet

Fortress | Sveet

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The argument was that it could easily be debated that samus vs falco is in samus' favor. You said "no way" and then i replied with the best samus player in the world clearly explaining his thoughts on the matchup and why he thinks its in samus' favor. Explain to me where i lost this argument?
 
Van.

Van.

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Hugs being the best Samus means that he can best explain the mu from samus point of view.

Saying "hurr durr i got 17th hugs post is invalid" is much more dogmatic than quoting a top players opinion
 
leffen

leffen

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if it 50 dollars on the line it would just be me platform camping for 16 minutes so i'd rather not ;o.

Sorry Sveet, I apparently misunderstood you but whatever.
I cannot see how it is "easily debated" in samus favor, HugS is literally the only samus that thinks the matchup isnt hard for samus (which is why he made that post from the beginning).

Even HugS hasn't pulled any major upsets versus any top falco afaik and there are a lot of characters with heavy disadvantage versus falco that are still able to win. Samus having an advantage and still failing that hard is just ridiculous to me (esp considering how even HugS thinks of all samus matchups lol).
 
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