Spank That Dill
Smash Journeyman
this sums up my thoughts exactly
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Merkuri
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2010
- Messages
- 1,860
But that's at smaller tournaments, not larger tournaments. Jman winning SMYM11 was the first time a fox won a National tournament since around 2007. He's overrated; and the funny thing is that it's the mid-level players who rave about how broken he is. Few of the top pros seem to think that he's still the best(well at least in singles)
BunBun
Smash Master
SMYM12 hasn't happened yet lol
BunBun
Smash Master
Derrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrp
White_Mike
Smash Lord
IC's are good against fox falco and falcon? Falcon can easily seperate IC's and its pretty much GG after that.
Falcon has always been a good pick against them.
And fox? Don't even get me started.
If the fox player isn't totally ******** and knows how good shine is against IC's than they really have no chance, it ***** IC's completely.
Falco is also good at seperating IC's but I see that matchup as a bit more even.
Falcon has always been a good pick against them.
And fox? Don't even get me started.
If the fox player isn't totally ******** and knows how good shine is against IC's than they really have no chance, it ***** IC's completely.
Falco is also good at seperating IC's but I see that matchup as a bit more even.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Peach wrecks Ice Climbers.
I'm not really sure they're even good against Sheik. But I don't ever play against them so whatever.
I'm not really sure they're even good against Sheik. But I don't ever play against them so whatever.
White_Mike
Smash Lord
That's why it's not even worth mentioning.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Do they have any good matchups in the top 6 - 7 characters?
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
Fletch: Yeah i have play against many good Falcos in the world (Mango Calle w and Shiz in tournaments to) in tournaments and friendlis (a lot).
Calle w is a really good friend to me and he is a really good Falco player so i have a lot experience against him in tournament and friendlis.
But Falco have not more potencial if mango or me or if a random player play him.
The char have still the same potencial and if you ask me falco is overrated.
The potencial should doing the list.
The char with most potencial (puff) will be first at the list.
Calle w is a really good friend to me and he is a really good Falco player so i have a lot experience against him in tournament and friendlis.
But Falco have not more potencial if mango or me or if a random player play him.
The char have still the same potencial and if you ask me falco is overrated.
The potencial should doing the list.
The char with most potencial (puff) will be first at the list.
BunBun
Smash Master
"Potential" can be considered "potential" all the way up to perfect play, in which case (Fox = Bowser) > Falco > everyone else.
Where do you draw the line for "potential".
I don't think a tier list should represent potential....
Just to be clear, because my english isn't great so I don't know exactly what you think, but I didn't change his post in any way.
Where do you draw the line for "potential".
I don't think a tier list should represent potential....
Lol?
Just to be clear, because my english isn't great so I don't know exactly what you think, but I didn't change his post in any way.
INSANE CARZY GUY
Banned via Warnings
he meant current "potential" like the ice climbers could be waaaaay better if someone mastered their de-syncing, there' no way you could get them if they mastered de-syncing popo carefully spacing with nana using projectiles or coming from the air and if you sheilded anything the other ice climber would WD in for a game same for if your hit or you roll or spotdodge.
in theory ice climbers are even more ******** than puff will ever be. but the current "potential" ice climbers can only do small de-synces like ice block to follow up.
the tier list to me should say who is currently the best. Not as in just winning tournments but real battles and not based on number of players.
in theory ice climbers are even more ******** than puff will ever be. but the current "potential" ice climbers can only do small de-synces like ice block to follow up.
the tier list to me should say who is currently the best. Not as in just winning tournments but real battles and not based on number of players.
White_Mike
Smash Lord
Sheik is the only matchup they win and I don't even think it's as **** of a matchup as everyone says, but they definitely do have the advantage.
Edit: Just saw your edit, I agree about the whole sheik thing. I feel like if a sheik plays really fast, runs around, and avoids grabs that the IC's can't really do much. Everyone usually acts like it is one of the worst matchups in the game.
They also go even with puff and falco but I think falco has an advantage over them. They just have to know what they're doing so they don't fall for IC's weird and random play style.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
It has something to do with a super ridiculous ledgestall.
INSANE CARZY GUY
Banned via Warnings
bowser can edge stall forever with perfect inf. frames
Fletch
Smash Master
Both have frame-perfect stalls.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Because if he starts a WD Bowser will hit him? And then resume ledge stalling?
This is assumed to be perfect Melee so 0.0000001 reaction time, perfect execution and the whole spiel. Stealing the edge becomes much harder. There's some invincible way to land onstage during Bowser's ledgestall in the event they even get that far (iirc) but you're best asking Magus.
The idea behind Bowser's placement (iirc) is that he can't lose to most of the cast. Because of his stall the best you can hope for, fighting a Bowser, is a draw.
Fortress | Sveet
▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀
In frame perfect play edge stalls aren't even that good because you'll be able to take the edge from them frame perfectly. They have no free frames to wait it out, so they are forced to roll/getup to the stage. If you thought fast technical foxes were good at covering rolls, think about how amazing a frame perfect anything would be covering that only option. Wd off the stage to take edge, sees the roll start, immediately dj->waveland back onto the stage, cover all options.
no it's not going to stay the final one, i dont know why they even put it like that.
I mean, if for nothing else, the only reason there'll never be a final tierlist for this game is because tierlists are heavily based off of tourney results.
So if axe and n64 start winning every tourney, pikachu becomes top tier.
Think about it.
I mean, if for nothing else, the only reason there'll never be a final tierlist for this game is because tierlists are heavily based off of tourney results.
So if axe and n64 start winning every tourney, pikachu becomes top tier.
Think about it.
Blackshadow
Smash Ace
edit: whoops
Magus420
Smash Master
Fox should draw against Fox/Bowser but would actually beat everyone else so you could say he's 'better' than Bowser in that sense, then again true perfect play for a player would first involve choosing Fox on the character selection screen so nobody else would be relevant anyway.
Bowser shouldn't be hittable with his no commitment DJ stall/land on stage option then depending on what they do after a steal either be able to safely retake the edge (lightshield/SDI to FF edgegrab if in range of a ledgehop frame 1 hit move, or fortresshog if they go back on the stage) or remain safe on the end of the stage, and then nobody wins and everybody loses.
...kind of like discussing a physically impossible level of play in a tier list thread.
Bowser shouldn't be hittable with his no commitment DJ stall/land on stage option then depending on what they do after a steal either be able to safely retake the edge (lightshield/SDI to FF edgegrab if in range of a ledgehop frame 1 hit move, or fortresshog if they go back on the stage) or remain safe on the end of the stage, and then nobody wins and everybody loses.
...kind of like discussing a physically impossible level of play in a tier list thread.
Mew2King
King of the Mews
LOL @ MAGUS'S Sig!!!!!
mosesrko24
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2007
- Messages
- 107
jason play brawl marth and record it
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
you put SMYNM12 in his quote. it said SMYNM11.
then you said SMYNM12 hasn't happened yet lol.
it was just funny because he got mad about it.
Kyu Puff
Smash Champion
Fox, Falco, Sheik, Jiggs, Falcon
They aren't necessarily good match-ups, but none of them are far from even, but Fox and Jiggs are a little worse and Falcon and Sheik are a little better.
Nø Ca$h
Smash Champion
human techskill hasnt evolved to the point of perfect play. it prolly wont for some time to cool
Merkuri
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2010
- Messages
- 1,860
No my post reads SMYM11, I didn't change his quote at all.
You're being stupid and believing exactly what he wants you to believe. And I'm not mad about any of this, I just find it a bit annoying.
PB&J
Smash Hero
i dont care what anyone says icys against all those characters are even.. im tired of people saying different..
Lovage
Smash Hero
lol fox vs. ic is not even
White_Mike
Smash Lord
He could just not be good at the matchup? Someone being bad at a match up makes them ********? IDK this all seems to be opinion but I really don't think IC's vs fox or falcon is even
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
Fox is the best character. ICs are even with Falcon and Falco though.
Kyu Puff
Smash Champion
I don't see how it's opinion, I could argue theory or results with you but it doesn't seem like it would change your mind.
ChivalRuse
Smash Hero
White_Mike
Smash Lord
Pulling out videos of a specific match really doesn't prove much, especially when the fox player you showed mains falco....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0e76UFXTek
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9fboPkOuk0
I can do it too!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0e76UFXTek
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9fboPkOuk0
I can do it too!
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