Official BBR Tier List v7

[Doc King]

Dedede is broken and should be top tier. He has good slope infinites and rco lag that make Dedede so well. He can also infinite snake and yoshi and thats TOP TIER MATERIAL!

He does so well against Falco and his planking and can beat puff with the no di glitch.

Dedede can edge guard olimar well and can make so much use out of slopes. Dedede can also camp zelda and ike and dk and mk and the others with waddle dee throw.

He also goes even with mk because while mk has a good edge guarding game Dedede has the same thing too.

He also can make ZSS chaingrabable with this weight glitch. He can also air release Squirtle.

 

[Sunnysunny]

It wasn't really sarcasm, more like me coming here and seeing discussion about both Dedede and Jiggs and deciding to say something stupid

Thats because stupid begets more stupid, stupid~ <3
And this is a pretty stupid discussion imo. Because like, seriously, who knows this MU?! DDD vs jiggs? Theres so few hardcore DDD mainers out there, and even less good jiggs~ Its gonna come down to "Well DDD has b-air, and jiggs sucks so derpderp -4 MU."

 

[infiniteV115]

Lol it's funny cause Puff has bair and Dedede sucks so derpderp it's actually -4 for Dedede.

 

[MEOW1337KITTEH]

Because slopes are so common.

I hope you are going along with the joke Doc, because D3 is not Top tier, That's the scary land of Snake, Olimar, IC's, Diddy, Marth, Wario, Falco and friends. D3 is bottom of high, no more no less. He is too fat to rise, and too much of an ******* to drop.

 

[Lukingordex]

Some of D3´s MUs with the Tops do not allow him to raise...

 

[Doc King]

Because slopes are so common.

I hope you are going along with the joke Doc, because D3 is not Top tier, That's the scary land of Snake, Olimar, IC's, Diddy, Marth, Wario, Falco and friends. D3 is bottom of high, no more no less. He is too fat to rise, and too much of an ******* to drop.

I am going with the joke. Dedede is too damn slow and limited against top tiers - Wario and only beats mid and low tiers + Wario, Lucario, and Wolf.

He's probably gonna stay where he is for the rest of the metagame. I think many will be staying and some have.

Some of D3´s MUs with the Tops do not allow him to raise...

Really it's most of them. It's not just amount it's the quality.

 

[Sunnysunny]

I think many will be staying and some have.

Forever, a high tier. ;~;

 

[MEOW1337KITTEH]

Forever a top tier. No wait.. high tier. Yeah, high tier. No wait.. FFUUU

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Dude.

D3 is ***.

You've been going on about D3 for like 8 months

let it go.

 

[Luxord]

Lol it's funny cause Puff has bair and Dedede sucks so derpderp it's actually -4 for Dedede.

Last edited by infiniteV115; Yesterday at 09:20 PM. Reason: Forgot to mention the 'derpderp'

this is why this thread is worth reading

Mink, what's your Avy from?

 

[Orion*]

Snake gets ***** if he gets hit.

There's only... a handful of MKs that can legit take advantage of this. Many of the setups that high level MKs do (a great example would be rain or tyrant) essentially just involves baits and 99% of the time while the reward is a little bit greater, is also not consistent because it relies on reading the snakes landing.

I think the only person really just ****ing that **** up option wise is jason on a good day. Otori has the speed to, but he's still not perfect at the snake MU.

One of the ugliest posts ever recorded above me.

this

Tell me I don't know anything about the DDD/Puff match-up when I doubt you have ever played a Puff main in your life?

-dead-

grim plays the game for a week and now uses credibility call outs LOLOLOLOLOLOL.

homie there isn't even a puff "main" that's good. there are good players that can use puff, san for instance but cmon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yMb0flSiBo

Id be will to bet my jiggs, which I only play for fun is better than yours. Note that despite actually even agreeing with you that puff D3 is not that bad, your reasoning is garbage.

He is flat out telling me I'm wrong with no experience to back him up.

I really should find those quotes of you and BPC from back in the day when people called you out on this and you wrote essays and complained on how much experience shouldnt matter LMAO.

Dedede doesn't get the lead against Falco because he is huge, barely mobile and Falco has lasers.


How does this translate to the Puff/D3 match-up...?

I don't see how you don't get the comparison/analogy.

Bair and I believe fair both out-range up tilt. Ftilt does not cover the area that Puff approaches at. Fair is slow, utilt and dtilt can be SDI'd out of and are easy to miss against a high mobility character like Puff.

Even if with god spacing they beat utilt... you have to be ******** to risk that kind of trade/reward with jiggs LMAO.

Fair is pretty good if people come in from to high, **** will kill you, and jiggs fast speed makes it hard to punish from certain angles. Reliable, no. But it's worth using sometimes as a mixup.

Your statement should actually be "can outrange everything with a bair"

I don't see why he has to state that, it's pretty obvious DDD is just going to wall puff with bair. Every matchup where he walls that's what he does. Wtf did you expect like metagame minute dash cancel pivot utilt walls or something.

MK is the only character who can edge-guard Puff properly. I don't see how Dedede can, I'd like some elaboration. If it is something stupid like "fast-fall bair wall" I'm going to be upset, as she has 6 jumps, infinite pounds and amazing aerial mobility to avoid that.

This is one of those things that's easier to explain in person with a wii than like on SWF. but Regardless jiggs shouldnt be getting beaten up to much offstage, but DDD has options with a smart read and can remain safe in regards to risk reward doing so.

Are you trying to challenge 's Utilt with Fair/Bair? LOOOL.

You really can't detect sarcasm, can you.....

the above to posts made me laugh out loud

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Just cause of my shameful keyboard warrior history on the stage discussion boards doesn't mean I am bad/only played the game for a week haha - I attend and place high in tourneys all the time

Credibility call out is legit. This MU is pretty much entirely theory-craft at the moment, and he said I was flat-out wrong. Doesn't mean I know how the MU works for sure, but he certainly doesn't.

I used to say (and I still do) that experience with being good at the game doesn't matter for making rulesets. Obviously it matters for match-ups >_> C'mon Orion you can handle context, right?

Out-ranging utilt isn't some huge risk... A good Puff should be trying to hit with the tip of his/her aerials anyway, and should be able to tell when that is gonna happen and when it won't.

I don't see why he has to state that, it's pretty obvious DDD is just going to wall puff with bair. Every matchup where he walls that's what he does. Wtf did you expect like metagame minute dash cancel pivot utilt walls or something.

I said it because Doc King said that D3 outranges with everything... Which is wrong... Did you even follow the conversation?

Your puff isn't actually too bad for just a fun character, but mine is still better sorrrry Way too aggressive (everyone is when they use Puff for some reason), general character/MU unfamiliarity, etc... Though that was practically a friendly so maybe you'd play better with higher stakes, I dunno.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

Diddy should be below ICs. They have better overall match ups than Diddy and better tournament results

 

[Grim Tuesday]

I agree with Jebus.

 

[infiniteV115]

Wait, you guys played each other? O.o

Either Grim travelled to NA/whatever country Orion goes to school in (I think it was The Netherlands?) or you guys played on Wifi...

 

[Grim Tuesday]

If I've played Orion, it is news to me.

 

[Steam]

I am glad I never come here anymore. and I'm sure you guys are too.

D3 is the worst character in the game.

 

[infiniteV115]

God dammit Steam is back

 

[Peachy-Desu]

I see V~ I can't believe puff is still being talked about.. let alone D3! X3

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Last edited by infiniteV115; Yesterday at 09:20 PM. Reason: Forgot to mention the 'derpderp'

this is why this thread is worth reading

Mink, what's your Avy from?

It's from the manga Psyren.

 

[Steam]

God dammit Steam is back

don't worry, I never come here anymore... I never even play brawl anymore to be honest.

 

[Spelt]

What a scrub.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I hear Colorado is dead these days.

Also, I still don't understand how Toon Link isn't considered a better character. He has so much going for him on paper.

 

[Spelt]

Co has been dead since like 2009.

 

[infiniteV115]

I could see TL moving above Dedede but I don't think he's better than anyone in top tier or ZSS or Lucario

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I think he's better than both of those characters. Lucario for sure. ZSS, maybe; she's pretty comparable in..."good-ness."

 

[san.]

Properly spaced, a lot of Jigglypuff and DDD's most used moves trade, which is obviously unfavorable for Jigglypuff.


Fortunately, Dodging around DDD's front/back, and getting in grabs and interrupting his attacks are still viable. You just have to hit DDD many more times than he has to hit you.


TL, maybe. I think global options such as powershielding and other things like that can make it difficult for TL but he does have quite a few decent things going for him to handle most of the cast.

 

[GOofyGV]

Diddy should be below ICs. They have better overall match ups than Diddy and better tournament results

I honestly think that IC should be sacond.

mk is the best followed by IC,Diddy and Olimar and after those snake,marth and falco.

 

[Lukingordex]

Has someone seen the recent japonese Tier List?

Some characters are really in a different place than they are on this Tier List,Lucas is in D and Pit is in A.

Is their different gameplay the reason for it?

 

[infiniteV115]

Well for one they have a different ruleset
And I believe their tier list is based on results and nothing more

 

[Lukingordex]

I think a Tier List based only in results is a little...inaccurate...

The MUs and other stuffs are important too...

 

[Luxord]

Yeah pure-results wouldn't work because you could have random beginners entering tournaments and wouldn't their placings bring down the results?

On that note I doubt they make their list off of pure results, Japan isn't stupid.
or if they do there's a certain system in place, not just char. x placed this and chars. wyz placed that - now we make tier list.

 

[infiniteV115]

I would imagine it's more like who wins the most often or places highest.

Not the average result of every player of a specific character.

 

[da K.I.D.]

Pit is higher over there because of masashi, just like how sonic is way higher over here because of espy and X.

 

[Luxord]

Pit is higher over there because of masashi, just like how sonic is way higher over here because of espy and X.

yet Lucas isn't allowed to be higher just b/c of Mekos who was called an outlier >.>
especially annoying because a lot of characters are only who they are because of outliers

also, FAE is a sexy lucas

 

[BSP]

IMO we need to look at the outliers more because they're the ones bringing out the character's potential.

 

[Espy Rose]

No.
Otherwise Pikachu would be top 3.

 

[Lukingordex]

lulz......

 

[Life]

@Espy: Is the tier list reflective of the highest level of play? If so, if only ESAM is playing Pika at the highest level, then Pika should be judged primarily by ESAM. If the tier list isn't reflective of top-level play, then what good is it? Should we have a separate "noob" list? If so, how do we judge "noob"?

And frankly, so what if Pika is top 3? Maybe he really is, but only ESAM plays him correctly. Compare to V1 Sonic.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

tl;dr explanation of why you can't have only one person as an example of how good a character is: it leaves too many variables to the point you can't say that it's the character that is that good and not simply a player being amazing.

I swear, this conversation in general has come up several times now. It was proven to be the case with PT, its how things work.