DaomarIsBear
Smash Journeyman
Would you suggest a different way in gimping him? Lol, this must sound strange, but a local CF was giving me trouble when I went to edge guard him.
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How do I do a Barrel Roll? ~ Fox Q&A (Check the OP)
- Thread starter ¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯
- Start date
Red Arremer
Smash Legend
Gimping Falcon is not really easy, haha.
yoshq
Smash Master
guys what's the best way to DI with fox, the moves, the order, etc
Depends on what move you're hit with.
Momentum cancel with Uair+FF. If you check the Index of threads, you'll find a guide about that there. No one is going to teach you how to DI every single move in the game. Experiment; don't be lazy.
Momentum cancel with Uair+FF. If you check the Index of threads, you'll find a guide about that there. No one is going to teach you how to DI every single move in the game. Experiment; don't be lazy.
DaomarIsBear
Smash Journeyman
I'm getting ***** inside out by a local ROB. Any chance anyone could help me with the match up? He either shield grabs or spot dodge down smashes every form of approach I throw at him.
Why the hell are you approaching ROB?
You have lasers and a shine. Camp that mofo to death, and it quickly goes in your favor. ROB is pretty easy to punish. You can Nair a lot of his ground approaches, and on most stages, good positioning will prevent you from getting destroyed by aerials.
If you do have to approach, attack the back of his shield. Shine stall as well if you need to. Also, pivot wave grabs are a good mixup as well.
These are just little things I remember about the matchup, so if you need anything more specific, just ask.
You have lasers and a shine. Camp that mofo to death, and it quickly goes in your favor. ROB is pretty easy to punish. You can Nair a lot of his ground approaches, and on most stages, good positioning will prevent you from getting destroyed by aerials.
If you do have to approach, attack the back of his shield. Shine stall as well if you need to. Also, pivot wave grabs are a good mixup as well.
These are just little things I remember about the matchup, so if you need anything more specific, just ask.
I need some help with my Fox.
What do I need to learn that is semi-recent. I have a good understanding of the basics but need things to help me advance.
Who are the top Foxes right now and do they have vids? Besides Rookie obviously.
does jab true combo into grab? and is it better to double jab or single jab for jab cancelling?
How does Fox do against Diddy?
What do I need to learn that is semi-recent. I have a good understanding of the basics but need things to help me advance.
Who are the top Foxes right now and do they have vids? Besides Rookie obviously.
does jab true combo into grab? and is it better to double jab or single jab for jab cancelling?
How does Fox do against Diddy?
NeverKnowsBest
Monochrome Like A Panda
*runs to Marsulas and gives him the biggest hug!*
http://www.youtube.com/user/HITorMISS167
I have some video with my friends Diddy. He isn't the best Diddy but you can see what things might work against Diddy.
http://www.youtube.com/user/HITorMISS167
I have some video with my friends Diddy. He isn't the best Diddy but you can see what things might work against Diddy.
*Hugs NKB back*
Diddy is so annoying. I feel like just picking Fox and shine stalling lol. I really am serious about Fox though. I need to get some videos up so you guys can tell me what i'm doing wrong.
Conviction
Human Nature
I think the last match-up ratio was 55-45 Diddy.
Top Foxes: Rookie,Light,Zeton,(me cause Im'a *******)
NeverKnowsBest
Monochrome Like A Panda
*Blocks slap and up smashes Iblis!*
Jab does not true combo into grab, but it's a **** good frame trap.
As far as double or single jabbing, depends on your opponent's DI. If he sucks at it, do 2. If he can DI out of the two to get behind you, do one.
Fox v Diddy is about even. It's an annoying fight, but not a particularly difficult one.
As far as double or single jabbing, depends on your opponent's DI. If he sucks at it, do 2. If he can DI out of the two to get behind you, do one.
Fox v Diddy is about even. It's an annoying fight, but not a particularly difficult one.
Conviction
Human Nature
I win now cause I used the pokemon style thing so ha.
luke_atyeo
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 10, 2008
- Messages
- 7,215
so guys, I know this is a complicated question and I would ask bowyer himself but apparently he quit, but anyways, can you guys give me some tips/pointers on bowyering with fox, what I should be doing, looking out for, ideal stages to do it on (fd?) things like that.
bowyering can refer to any number of things including, but not limited to the following:
- stage camping in a really slow gay way
- SDing an inordinate amount
- SDing to get a KO that puts you behind (or at least not as far in the lead)
- Leaving, but then coming back right away when you forget something
- Turning the TV on, then very shortly after, going upstairs for a bit before leaving to go somewhere else, all while leaving the TV on.
luke_atyeo
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 10, 2008
- Messages
- 7,215
lol, well if you could help me do all those things I'd sure apprechaite it, but mostly just the first one.
I thought bowyer would have been more well known...
I thought bowyer would have been more well known...
luke_atyeo
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 10, 2008
- Messages
- 7,215
I'd post a vid if I could, and yeah telling me what I'm doing wrong defensively would be hard, but I was just looking for some good feinting and bowyering strats in general.
on a side note I'd like to say that the fox boards are so well organized and informative, you guys have the rapest board, good job.
on a side note I'd like to say that the fox boards are so well organized and informative, you guys have the rapest board, good job.
I looked the Fox guide, but I couldn't find any frame data. I only need one thing. How many start-up frames does his airdodge have? I would really appreciate if you could VM me instead of posting here because I'm doing a mass search of airdodge data.
Dusk_Wolf
Smash Rookie
Well you can Dair-Shine-Usmash and it works to finish off and raise dmg.
Uzima (Uzi)
Smash Lord
did you seriously quote me from months ago O.oWell you can Dair-Shine-Usmash and it works to finish off and raise dmg.
718_ROOKI3
Smash Lord
UZI!!! hit me on AiM i need to talk to you!!! SERIOUSLY
NeverKnowsBest
Monochrome Like A Panda
NeverKnowsBest
Monochrome Like A Panda
Ok, I am stupidly confused on the Snake match up. This weekend I played Takeover's Snake at Chu Dat's place and I was getting ***** so hard. He usually 2 stocked me or had little percent on me on his last stock. Everything I did failed.
I laser camped him. He cooked grenades and ducked the lasers.
I approach with dashing shields. He cooked grenades and shield/grab and nade drop/forward tilt the crap out of my shield pushing me away from punishing with a shield grab.
I tried fighting in the air. He just shielded everything with a nade in hand.
I tried contending in the air after I throw him. His neutral air out prioritizes everything.
Help with Snake match up please. I swear, nades hinder everything Fox has going for him.
I laser camped him. He cooked grenades and ducked the lasers.
I approach with dashing shields. He cooked grenades and shield/grab and nade drop/forward tilt the crap out of my shield pushing me away from punishing with a shield grab.
I tried fighting in the air. He just shielded everything with a nade in hand.
I tried contending in the air after I throw him. His neutral air out prioritizes everything.
Help with Snake match up please. I swear, nades hinder everything Fox has going for him.
Why isn't anyone helping NKB with the Snake matchup?
Also: http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8565316&postcount=4
Pre-emptive answer that everyone needs to read.
Also: http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8565316&postcount=4
Pre-emptive answer that everyone needs to read.
crifer
Smash Lord
nkb,
1. try to laser camp him and if he ducks, shdl towards him or simply run to him and stop in a safe range,
he will stand up and try to ftilt you or wait for your attack, you can try to punish his ftilt (idk if this is possible)
2. if u know that he throws nades with grenade cooking laser him, and if you know the timing for the nades you can try to laser the nades or run to him 1 second before he throws the nade and try to shine the nade so it flies back to him... you mess up his nade cooking timing if you run to him bc you are decreasing the time the nade will be explode, you understand what I mean?
3. try to air camp with your jump and dj and try to hit between his upsmash and uptilt with a dair,
or simply air camp and airdodge through his attacks behind him, it´s somehow snake´s blindspot.
other than that there is one really important thing:
don´t rush things, snake has way too many options, be patient and use the tiny openings, once your inside you can build damage.
1. try to laser camp him and if he ducks, shdl towards him or simply run to him and stop in a safe range,
he will stand up and try to ftilt you or wait for your attack, you can try to punish his ftilt (idk if this is possible)
2. if u know that he throws nades with grenade cooking laser him, and if you know the timing for the nades you can try to laser the nades or run to him 1 second before he throws the nade and try to shine the nade so it flies back to him... you mess up his nade cooking timing if you run to him bc you are decreasing the time the nade will be explode, you understand what I mean?
3. try to air camp with your jump and dj and try to hit between his upsmash and uptilt with a dair,
or simply air camp and airdodge through his attacks behind him, it´s somehow snake´s blindspot.
other than that there is one really important thing:
don´t rush things, snake has way too many options, be patient and use the tiny openings, once your inside you can build damage.
Fenrir VII
Smash Master
- Joined
- Sep 9, 2005
- Messages
- 3,506
quick answers to questions, because I don't really want to type all that much...
NKB, the best possible thing I could tell you is to grab more. Of course this is punishable by tilt and whatnot... but since Fox's are apparently known for approaching stupidly, the common thing for Snakes (and DDDs, for that matter) to do is just shield camp an approach, for the most part...
Watch for predictable dodging. Snake is actually a fairly unsafe character, but makes up for it with pretty good avoiding moves, like his dodges and b-reversals and such.
His Nair does not beat:
your Bair when properly spaced/timed (bair outranges him very slightly)
your Fair from below
your uair from below (uair is very nice against Snake)
usmash
etc
Get him in the air... one reason to grab more, then punish landing with shield usmash, and you're almost guaranteed some damage from it most of the time... b-reversals are tricky, but not hard to punish, even... and all of hiis aerials fail at keeping you away from it.
Also, Fair will shield poke, which is very nice...
Cross:
Fox is very adaptable, and has a decent air game with his fastfalling and stalling, and fairly good aerials... so moving around the stage isn't hard at all for him. On top of that, Bair and Dsmash have seriously scary horizontal knockback, so he can get really early kills near the sides of RC, especially if the opponent bounces off the ground a bit. Uair and usmash are more of a scare at certain parts of the stage, too... So he deals really well with the moving environment... better than most characters, anyway. And he can snag earlier kills with good/lucky hits. I like the stage a lot, actually...
Little story, somewhat related, but mostly just funny. I played against a Luigi on Delfino. I hit him with a Dair Dsmash around 60-70% on the left side of the stairs portion (on the slope). He went nearly straight right, and bounced off the stairs on the right slope, and up onto the flat section. He went off the side of the stage, so you could see him in a bubble... he then stood up, ran left for about a second, and stood still... and died from the right blast zone. that stuff was funny... and in tournament. : )
NKB, the best possible thing I could tell you is to grab more. Of course this is punishable by tilt and whatnot... but since Fox's are apparently known for approaching stupidly, the common thing for Snakes (and DDDs, for that matter) to do is just shield camp an approach, for the most part...
Watch for predictable dodging. Snake is actually a fairly unsafe character, but makes up for it with pretty good avoiding moves, like his dodges and b-reversals and such.
His Nair does not beat:
your Bair when properly spaced/timed (bair outranges him very slightly)
your Fair from below
your uair from below (uair is very nice against Snake)
usmash
etc
Get him in the air... one reason to grab more, then punish landing with shield usmash, and you're almost guaranteed some damage from it most of the time... b-reversals are tricky, but not hard to punish, even... and all of hiis aerials fail at keeping you away from it.
Also, Fair will shield poke, which is very nice...
Cross:
Fox is very adaptable, and has a decent air game with his fastfalling and stalling, and fairly good aerials... so moving around the stage isn't hard at all for him. On top of that, Bair and Dsmash have seriously scary horizontal knockback, so he can get really early kills near the sides of RC, especially if the opponent bounces off the ground a bit. Uair and usmash are more of a scare at certain parts of the stage, too... So he deals really well with the moving environment... better than most characters, anyway. And he can snag earlier kills with good/lucky hits. I like the stage a lot, actually...
Little story, somewhat related, but mostly just funny. I played against a Luigi on Delfino. I hit him with a Dair Dsmash around 60-70% on the left side of the stairs portion (on the slope). He went nearly straight right, and bounced off the stairs on the right slope, and up onto the flat section. He went off the side of the stage, so you could see him in a bubble... he then stood up, ran left for about a second, and stood still... and died from the right blast zone. that stuff was funny... and in tournament. : )
SnowballBob33
Smash Ace
You have to actually play more conscientiously when you fight snakes. Normally you do stuff off of instinct, but snake you have to think as much about what hes doing as he is.
Its ok to avoid all play. It is too risky sometimes to try to fight him when he has traps all over the place. If a grenade is in a spot that is good for him and bad for you, ignore the fact he wants you to approach. Its not hard to just flat out shoot him and then dodge nades. Remeber, if he ducks, he can't throw nades meaning you have an advantage
On the ledge, be fully aware of his positioning, grenades, mines mortars and everything. Don't be afraid to plank him for a few seconds until they lose control of their grenades. Once no grenades are down, depending on their location, you can illusion or just get back.
Stand a fair distance away if your going to camp and stay aware of the cooked time. Keep in mind how long the mortar slide goes so you know what you can punish if he decides to flat out use it. Standing lasers are fine in this situation because the time it takes to have the mortar fall is greater than the time it takes to put your gun away and dsmash. On stages with platforms like battlefield, its safer because the mortar doesnt fall back on your head when you dsmash him. Grenades have a 4 second fuse, meaning you shoot for seconds then jump/ shine, or block or something. They can stop grenades in flight and make you drop them too. Make sure you don't go to attack with a nade in your hand or something.
Throws are 3 times as effective vs snake as any other character. Snake goes up, then comes down, with no move with little landing lag other than nades to hit both people. Dthrow and pwg work wonders. Uthrow also is good because the snakes normally just airdodge down. Basically, throwing them is good for you and bad for them because it puts them in defensive aerial mode which sux.
Up close snake is different than most people. Look at the tendencies of your opponent. When you run up and they are crouched from ducking lasers, just block outside of ftilt range. If he steps forward, he plans to ftilt so roll behing him. In my experience, snakes spot dodge a lot. This means a lot of dair action. Basically, punish him for the fact he isn't straight up and is on the ground. If he jabs you, make sure to DI away to avoid that last hit and putting you in the air on the defensive. You can punish his ftilt with dash and grab. If he hits you with it and you can't punish, just roll away and start over.
Its ok to avoid all play. It is too risky sometimes to try to fight him when he has traps all over the place. If a grenade is in a spot that is good for him and bad for you, ignore the fact he wants you to approach. Its not hard to just flat out shoot him and then dodge nades. Remeber, if he ducks, he can't throw nades meaning you have an advantage
On the ledge, be fully aware of his positioning, grenades, mines mortars and everything. Don't be afraid to plank him for a few seconds until they lose control of their grenades. Once no grenades are down, depending on their location, you can illusion or just get back.
Stand a fair distance away if your going to camp and stay aware of the cooked time. Keep in mind how long the mortar slide goes so you know what you can punish if he decides to flat out use it. Standing lasers are fine in this situation because the time it takes to have the mortar fall is greater than the time it takes to put your gun away and dsmash. On stages with platforms like battlefield, its safer because the mortar doesnt fall back on your head when you dsmash him. Grenades have a 4 second fuse, meaning you shoot for seconds then jump/ shine, or block or something. They can stop grenades in flight and make you drop them too. Make sure you don't go to attack with a nade in your hand or something.
Throws are 3 times as effective vs snake as any other character. Snake goes up, then comes down, with no move with little landing lag other than nades to hit both people. Dthrow and pwg work wonders. Uthrow also is good because the snakes normally just airdodge down. Basically, throwing them is good for you and bad for them because it puts them in defensive aerial mode which sux.
Up close snake is different than most people. Look at the tendencies of your opponent. When you run up and they are crouched from ducking lasers, just block outside of ftilt range. If he steps forward, he plans to ftilt so roll behing him. In my experience, snakes spot dodge a lot. This means a lot of dair action. Basically, punish him for the fact he isn't straight up and is on the ground. If he jabs you, make sure to DI away to avoid that last hit and putting you in the air on the defensive. You can punish his ftilt with dash and grab. If he hits you with it and you can't punish, just roll away and start over.
Fenrir VII
Smash Master
- Joined
- Sep 9, 2005
- Messages
- 3,506
It's not useful as any kind of momentum cancel, as it actually propels you upward a bit on start... kinda weird.
As a device for freaking out your opponent, and trying to get them to utilt or something so you get a free dair, it's wonderful. ha
Toronto Joe
Smash Master
if the Dk doesnt ban it, he gets ***** bad on RC by Fox