Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-

[RaynEX]

What do people follow up shine oos with? Do you just jump out of the shine and run away or try to wave land out of it and follow it to something?

Depends on a bunch of factors. If the shine knocks your opponent onto a ledge you may want to waveland backwards and wait for a ledgehop attempt. If you shine them while under a platform, you can land on the platform and stalk them from above. You have so many options on the platform stages...but on FD its rather simple. Waveland towards them if it connects and retreat if its blocked. You can obviously deviate from this plan if you're feeling yourself in that particular match.

Only time you should waveland in with the intention of being aggressive is when it actually connects and gives you some hitstun/a knockdown to work with. Otherwise, weigh your options and use common sense. If you're close enough to land on top of them with shield pressure after the shine oos, you could do that too. I'm sure you'll figure it out.

 

[FoxLisk]

use what is comfortable to you when jumpiing. I use control stick but it depends.

The claw method is used by a number of known players such as Javi and M2k. it hurts your fingers buts well worth it.

it only hurts your fingers for a couple weeks, then you get used to it.

 

[Sinji]

it only hurts your fingers for a couple weeks, then you get used to it.

ok I'll get used to it.

 

[FoxLisk]

ok I'll get used to it.

wicked profile pic btw

 

[Sinji]

Yea I added the "no fat chicks" to make it peter griffin legit.

 

[Thanos828]

Short hopping with fox is less about how fast you press the button and more about how fast you let the button go, I think. Other than that it's all just practice. Eventually you end up somewhat feeling the way you should press whatever button you use - I can usually tell if I short hopped or not without looking.

I never really short hop with the control stick unless I'm lazy and use it for SHDL. I've tried it for shield pressure but it feels really weird (short hopping and fast falling with the control stick is kind of difficult to do, IMO).

I don't use a claw but I can imagine short hopping with a claw would involve more of a sliding motion with the index finger on Y (anyone who actually uses a claw can correct me on this otherwise).

I use X for wavedashing (unless it's WD OoS, then I use R+Cstick up)

 

[FoxLisk]

yeah with the claw you kinda tap the corner of the button and slide off it real quick. way less demanding than regular grip imo

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I'll try doing a slide, since I honestly don't think I can get my finger to let go of the button any more quickly.

When people claw, do the put their thumb on the c-stick, one finger on Y, and one on R? Or do also put a finger on B?

 

[Thanos828]

I'll try doing a slide, since I honestly don't think I can get my finger to let go of the button any more quickly.

When people claw, do the put their thumb on the c-stick, one finger on Y, and one on R? Or do also put a finger on B?

I believe Javi has an extra finger for B/buttons that aren't jump. A two finger claw is usually one (index) finger for ABXY and thumb for the C Stick. Fingers for Z may vary, I figure it would either include using the middle finger or abandoning the claw during grabs.

 

[KirbyKaze]

What do people follow up shine oos with? Do you just jump out of the shine and run away or try to wave land out of it and follow it to something?

If they grab the edge: Get good onstage positioning.

If they don't grab the edge: Grab if they block, Up smash if they don't block.

 

[omgwtfToph]

Unknown522 why do you say it's easier to edgeguard Marth in PAL? How is it any different?

Also Raynex it would've been dope to have you at apex, your canadian brethren are dope :D

 

[Strong Badam]

Shine sends them further so shine is basically instant death even if they have a DJ.

 

[Zoler]

That's because of Marths weight I guess. I didn't notice any difference though, can't be that huge right?

 

[RaynEX]

Unknown522 why do you say it's easier to edgeguard Marth in PAL? How is it any different?

Also Raynex it would've been dope to have you at apex, your canadian brethren are dope :D

Yeah, I'm surrounded by a pretty awesome group of smashers. Maybe we'll catch each other at the next major?

Marth falls down from Fox's shine in PAL, so I'm pretty sure shining him while he's close to the edge = an easier edge-guard than in NTSC. Also, shine spike kills are more or less guaranteed after you hit one shine offstage. No miraculous barely-made-it up+Bs due to the trajectory and knockback.

 

[Zoler]

If you shine marth close to the ledge he just grabs it? Both in PAL and NTSC.

 

[FrootLoop]

how do you approach fox?
It's like trying to catch smoke

 

[omgwtfToph]

You shouldn't think of the matchup as trying to catch him, but rather trying to box him in or shut him out (depending on your style).

 

[Metal Reeper]

Attack where he is going to be, not where he currently is.

 

[RaynEX]

Fox is fast but he can't run away forever. Once runs out of space DDing, wall his *** and watch for/punish any escape attempts. The minute you give him back neutral footing is when you've lost your advantage. Make sure you get at least some damage on him whenever you push him to the edge of a stage. Alternatively, like Toph said, you could just run defense right off the bat and never chase him. The latter is better suited for aggressive Foxes, while the former for defensive ones.

 

[FoxLisk]

how do you approach fox?
It's like trying to catch smoke

skate to where the puck is going

 

[Thanos828]

skate to where the puck is going

Best analogy ever.

 

[leffen]

Marth is MUCH easier to fight in NTSC and he's easier to gimp... You can just hog the stage and tech the shine in Pal. Marth also has higher air speed in NTSC which helps him a lot when he side b's

Whatever, I don't cba to explain

 

[unknown522]

Unknown522 why do you say it's easier to edgeguard Marth in PAL? How is it any different?

Also Raynex it would've been dope to have you at apex, your canadian brethren are dope :D

hmm, should've said it's easier to set up edgeguards. Cuz the shine knocks him down. If he camps the edge trying to fish for a gimp and gets shined, he's more susceptible to gimps because he gets knocked down and probably won't grab the edge.

 

[Jim Morrison]

jim morrison do you play league of legends?

if yes: is your in-game name "jim morrison"

No, but Jim Morrison is quite a common username in online gaming.

 

[omgwtfToph]

oh. mmm

Man if I go to Smashers Reunion this summer I might have to practice PAL lol.

Actually the only thing I had a hard time getting used to when I played PAL with Zoler @ Genesis 2 was Fox's shorter up-B >.> the usmash didn't bother me too much.

 

[unknown522]

Marth is MUCH easier to fight in NTSC and he's easier to gimp... You can just hog the stage and tech the shine in Pal. Marth also has higher air speed in NTSC which helps him a lot when he side b's

Whatever, I don't cba to explain

yeah, that makes sense. I had some wrong wording when I posted

 

[RaynEX]

If Marth hugs the sides of a level and techs the shine in PAL, Fox can grab it before he does right? One more shine and its GG

I've only played PAL a few times, and each experience happened many many years ago. It might be useful to run PAL friendlies and see what Europe has to deal with.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

If marth techs the shine he can upb immediately to hit fox, do the walljump version with an immediate bair (which can regrab the edge after if done ASAP), or simply fall and sweetspot. While its still a grim situation, it adds complexity and mixups to the edgeguard that otherwise aren't in the NTSC version.

 

[Sinji]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9i0ohnr-lE

 

[crush]

Don't act like I never "fox.ssm"

 

[Lovage]

**** pal

 

[KirbyKaze]

**** pal

 

[Divinokage]

Of course you would KK, lol.

 

[Metakill]

Fox mainers and 2nd, pocket and people who love Fox.

I can SHDL but only after a shine, i can't get the timing for short hopping with the stick without doing a shine. And I can't use button jump to DL because I use X for jump and I find that too hard.
Can someone give me how can I practice that timing or how is easily to do it?

Another thing is about Shield pressure, Like that^ .. I can Shine + SH Nair but when i'm against a shield or someone, I find that hard (using stick too), I know that when you hit the shine hitlag is more (?) or something like that, how I need to do the SH, more quickly or more slow?

Meh, hope someone can help me, I can't practice with someone, only CPU... So that's why I'm trying to get better in technical skill.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Real talk: SHDL isn't important. Learn to SHL properly.

 

[ShroudedOne]

I was going to say that, KK, but Javi made excellent use of it at Apex. So I'm not so sure....but yeah, SHL is probably best to start off with.

 

[omgwtfToph]

SHDL is legitimately easier for some people. Like M2K, if I recall correctly.

 

[Metal Reeper]

Does Fox have less shield stun on his nair? I find it so much harder to shield pressure with fox than Falco.

 

[omgwtfToph]

I don't know off the top of my head but shield stun is directly correlated to damage so you can test this yourself by checking the % damage that Fox's/Falco's nairs do.

 

[Ltax]

How do you ledge tech after a side b against Marth's down tilt? Does it rely on bad timing on the d-tilt to be even possible, or is there something I can do to make it more consistant? Like holding the c-stick towards the stage? I sometimes get it but usually just die..