ZetTroxX
Smash Journeyman
Jailgadis special
yes, I´m funny
anyway, I know that technique works on spacies, anyone else?
yes, I´m funny
anyway, I know that technique works on spacies, anyone else?
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Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-
- Thread starter Silent Wolf
- Start date
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
It works on Ness!
ZetTroxX
Smash Journeyman
Finally I might be able to beat that CPU Ness! What a glorious day!
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
Anything works on Ness's recovery haha
Sinji
Smash Master
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
i really wouldn't put zelgadis on a list with ken and isai lol
Sinji
Smash Master
Didn't Zelgadis discover the wave shine technique or am I wrong?
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
I'm pretty sure he just made Shined Blind ... but hell if I know Smash history
Sinji
Smash Master
Is it true Zelgadis is the legendary blue fox? I'm not sure.
Palpi
Smash Hero
I've come to the conclusion sinji is a troll.
Fortress | Sveet
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I think its funny that merkuri used to have that same avatar
Sinji
Smash Master
Could be Merkuri. He came down to jamaica last year and I crushed him. He's been trolling the jamaica thread since then.
Its probably Merkuri impersonating the real erasor from jamaica. Notice the period after the word Erasor.
Its probably Merkuri impersonating the real erasor from jamaica. Notice the period after the word Erasor.
trahhSTEEZY
Smash Champion
Lol, never have ken or isai ever attempted to steal $6,000 from their own community..i don't think they fall into the same category at all mang.
Peach has tricky recovery. If they are coming from high in the umbrella then you can pressure with bairs but they will probably alternate fast falls and umbrellas. When they get low enough you can fsmash, usmash, ftilt, bair, or uair from ledge because they really have no options. If they are below the stage and have float available then be careful with shines/bairs. If you hit them with bairs then they will eventually be above the stage with their only option to umbrella. That's when you can bair, uair, fsmash, or usmash.
If anyone can get a priority list or discussion on attacks that beat out umbrella/float attacks then that would be great.
Sinji
Smash Master
@ trahh lol. I meant as players not people.
Their skill and transformation to the melee community contributed to future generations to take up and maintain the metagame or even make it better.
Their skill and transformation to the melee community contributed to future generations to take up and maintain the metagame or even make it better.
Fortress | Sveet
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I'm driving behind a car with plates "SW MW" and all I can think is "damn she must have some good tech skill
Palpi
Smash Hero
Texting and driving i dont feel safe hes gonna crash!
Pengie
Smash Lord
Against Peach, I find that the safest thing to do is to force her to grab the edge; once she grabs the edge she doesn't have very many safe options for getting back on because of hep double jump. Mostly focus on spacing bairs on her recovery until you she looks like she's going to take the edge then you stand at a distance where you can react to whatever she decides to do to get back on. You might even be able to sneak in an up air to finish the job as she's falling back to the stage. To my knowledge, Fox can't really beat the umbrella due to how disjointed the hitbox is and I believe that it has some invincibility on start-up, making most attacks lose to it.
Walt
Smash Ace
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
Jump behind her to grab to ledge when she up-b's
I've never done it before (but only because I never think about it in time) but Winston does it and it seems like it works for him
I've never done it before (but only because I never think about it in time) but Winston does it and it seems like it works for him
Winston
Smash Master
The jump from behind thing is basically is if you are onstage and she is below the stage but hugging the edge. This usually happens if you shined her off but didn't wavedash offstage.
Normally you'd try to wavedash onto the edge and use invincibility to shine her, but if she's already in position she can just umbrella as you try to do it and hit you. But if she's already in that position, you can jump backwards around the umbrella trajectory and grab the edge from behind her to edgehog.
It's just a situational trick, but it does come up fairly often (usually when you shine her offstage while shield pressuring or something), and it does work. Peach's umbrella takes a surprising amount of time during the rising animation if you think about it, so you have time to do it.
Does anyone know how consistently it works vs Doc's wallhug? I feel like it usually does but I'm not confident enough to use it in tournament.
Normally you'd try to wavedash onto the edge and use invincibility to shine her, but if she's already in position she can just umbrella as you try to do it and hit you. But if she's already in that position, you can jump backwards around the umbrella trajectory and grab the edge from behind her to edgehog.
It's just a situational trick, but it does come up fairly often (usually when you shine her offstage while shield pressuring or something), and it does work. Peach's umbrella takes a surprising amount of time during the rising animation if you think about it, so you have time to do it.
Does anyone know how consistently it works vs Doc's wallhug? I feel like it usually does but I'm not confident enough to use it in tournament.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Edgeguarding Peach is bleh. She goes so high from your Bair and Nair if they don't kill her (and the latter kills at 165%+ on some levels).
But in general if you can shine her, do it. Grabbing the edge when she's coming in low or just above the edge is good. From there you can ledgehop shine her or drop off shine her appropriately (sometimes you must combine them to make drop double jump shine, which is good for getting her if she floats too low and too close, but be careful as it can be difficult to abort mission in this position and shine doesn't have much range). She doesn't lose her float when she Up+Bs, however, so be aware you may need to shine her more than once. Keep track of how much time she has on her float and use invincibility wisely (refresh if you think it's safe; in this case I personally think it's best to ledgehop to refresh invincibility because it's more innocuous than a firefox stall).
Winston's thing about jumping around her Up+B hitbox (or behind, if that makes more sense) is somewhat applicable here if you run out of invincibility and she makes a gamble for the edge.
You can down smash her Umbrella if they fail the sweetspot or if you super time with the invincible legs. Whichever. Not a great choice, but if you can't make it to the edge for whatever reason it's probably the best option you have onstage (unless they don't go for the sweetspot so you can shine her, but that requires her to be so high she could almost make it onstage with the parasol; this sometimes happens, though so keep that in mind).
Otherwise hit her with Bairs. Ledgehop Bairs, full jump double jump Bairs, etc. Just some kind of Bair.
At about 95%+ (stage dependent, not sure on exact percents) you can use Uair instead of Bair if you think you can hit it. This will kill her and drastically shorten this whole edgeguarding thing, which is dandy. I find most Peaches aren't actually good at SDIing the Uair; I find more often than not they press for a variety of inputs and this produces an action that shifts their character slightly so they only get hit by the first hit; this is why many Peaches question how they lost their jump / float after being thrown by Fox and "SDIing" the Uair.
And as usual, if they're at 80%+ (again, stage dependent) and for whatever reason you can up smash them, do it.
But in general if you can shine her, do it. Grabbing the edge when she's coming in low or just above the edge is good. From there you can ledgehop shine her or drop off shine her appropriately (sometimes you must combine them to make drop double jump shine, which is good for getting her if she floats too low and too close, but be careful as it can be difficult to abort mission in this position and shine doesn't have much range). She doesn't lose her float when she Up+Bs, however, so be aware you may need to shine her more than once. Keep track of how much time she has on her float and use invincibility wisely (refresh if you think it's safe; in this case I personally think it's best to ledgehop to refresh invincibility because it's more innocuous than a firefox stall).
Winston's thing about jumping around her Up+B hitbox (or behind, if that makes more sense) is somewhat applicable here if you run out of invincibility and she makes a gamble for the edge.
You can down smash her Umbrella if they fail the sweetspot or if you super time with the invincible legs. Whichever. Not a great choice, but if you can't make it to the edge for whatever reason it's probably the best option you have onstage (unless they don't go for the sweetspot so you can shine her, but that requires her to be so high she could almost make it onstage with the parasol; this sometimes happens, though so keep that in mind).
Otherwise hit her with Bairs. Ledgehop Bairs, full jump double jump Bairs, etc. Just some kind of Bair.
At about 95%+ (stage dependent, not sure on exact percents) you can use Uair instead of Bair if you think you can hit it. This will kill her and drastically shorten this whole edgeguarding thing, which is dandy. I find most Peaches aren't actually good at SDIing the Uair; I find more often than not they press for a variety of inputs and this produces an action that shifts their character slightly so they only get hit by the first hit; this is why many Peaches question how they lost their jump / float after being thrown by Fox and "SDIing" the Uair.
And as usual, if they're at 80%+ (again, stage dependent) and for whatever reason you can up smash them, do it.
chillindude829
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2008
- Messages
- 26,563
Winston
Smash Master
I don't have any experience with the invincible legs, but I think the jump around option is ideal for the situation where you don't have time to get the edge before she gets in position to do a sweetspot up B. As far as I know Peach has to hug the edge to sweetspot, and once she moves close enough to it she's pretty much committed to it since she can't move back fast enough, or move backwards using up B.
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/7002/upb.gif
The hitbox is pretty far in front of her, and the rising part of the parasol takes 40 frames, so there's plenty of time. You could also shine her head this way if you need to for some reason.
If she positions herself farther back to avoid this that lets you do something else I think, such as grab the edge or hit her because her head's poking above stage level.
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
Bananaclown lolol
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Neat. I'll keep that in mind. I prefer shining her / edgehogging her to anything else because she doesn't gain height from it, so I'll experiment more with just positioning around the umbrella.
ArcNatural
Banned ( ∫x, δx Points)
Doing the jump around the upB to edgehog is also pretty popular against Marth.
Sinji
Smash Master
If peach is floating on the ledge level, you can short hop shine spike.
If shes over the ledge level, ledge hop bair and land on the edge of the stage. this way if she backs up and dodges the bair, she will be forced to do a falling fair because her float timing will run out soon. Thats when you jump in place>shine then hold on to the ledge.
If shes over the ledge level, ledge hop bair and land on the edge of the stage. this way if she backs up and dodges the bair, she will be forced to do a falling fair because her float timing will run out soon. Thats when you jump in place>shine then hold on to the ledge.
unknown522
Some guy
Yo lovage, I saw your set with Shroomed. You did really well, but the only real piece of advice I can give is that you could probably use u-tilt some more vs him. In the beginning of game 2, he was running around and spamming SH n-air. If you walked back and u-tilted, you could've possibly started a combo. Also, if he's jumping around or standing in his shield, you can pressure with b-air, then space u-tilt on his shield. Also, if you hit with said b-air while he's in the air, you can stalk him from underneath then u-tilt him once or twice (depending on percent of course).
If you don't want to have you back turned, then instead of doing n-air -> shine pressure, then you can try to cross his shield with n-air, and then u-tilt from behind him. You can probably catch an action OoS, or force him to roll.
If you don't want to have you back turned, then instead of doing n-air -> shine pressure, then you can try to cross his shield with n-air, and then u-tilt from behind him. You can probably catch an action OoS, or force him to roll.
Pi
Smash Hero
running upsmash OoShine works on everyone right?
Sinji
Smash Master
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2011
- Messages
- 5,493
As in run, dash cancel, shine, shine cancel, upsmash?
Sinji
Smash Master
yea. You'll get the rhythm by DD first.
Pi
Smash Hero
yea that
i can't land it on marth...i feel like i'm doing it pretty quick and it's got to be close to landin....
i shall practice some more
i think dash shineupsmash is pretty op lol
gonna stream it
here
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/kniht
halp
got it on marth couple times but think ima just run shinedash upsmash instead
still need it on those it knocks down though
Palpi
Smash Hero
It requires a huge over commitment to try and do if it's not to punish a really laggy move.
I fail to see your point.It requires a huge over commitment to try and do if it's not to punish a really laggy move.
trahhSTEEZY
Smash Champion
as in, unless your punishing a really laggy move, it's requires too much commitment to be solid..i agree, to an extent. i heard awhile back that lovage reacts inbetween the shine & the usmash, deciding to continue with the usmash if the shine hits or just techchase/wd after instead
could be wrong idk
could be wrong idk