Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-

[JonaDiaper]

lol pchu i read where you said you were getting as technical as silent wolf and i saw your vids and i lol'd hard bro

multishining like crazy =/= technical lol

i dont know where you got that from

 

[BEHR]

Hey Guys I would love some tips on my Fox and what I need to improve on. ;]

Here are soem Vids of Mine not that good. = 3=

Anyways yeah Vids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHowtEjkzIw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiNr9BJ3x-0&feature=related

 

[EWC]

@PCHU: If you want to improve from your current position, the best thing to do is to practice the basics against level 1 computers. Unfortunatlely, that won't get you very far. To really get good, you have to find someone good to play, no way around it.

@BEHR: I've only watched the first match so far, and I really think you should watch it yourself while keeping in mind the question "Why am I getting *****?"

 

[BEHR]

@PCHU: If you want to improve from your current position, the best thing to do is to practice the basics against level 1 computers. Unfortunatlely, that won't get you very far. To really get good, you have to find someone good to play, no way around it.

@BEHR: I've only watched the first match so far, and I really think you should watch it yourself while keeping in mind the question "Why am I getting *****?"

Lol I know just keep watching I do good the rest of the way. :3

 

[EWC]

Okay, so you're not nearly as bad as I would have been forced to assume if I had only watched the first match, but I still think my earlier comment holds. I could give lots of very specific advice, but it would all be stuff that you can probably figure out on your own by watching the matches carefully, and with the right mindset. That mindset should be "What am I doing wrong in this match, how am I being punished, and how can I avoid this?" I think you will benefit more by learning to do this than you would with any advice I or anyone else could give you.

 

[Tomacawk]

Hey Guys I would love some tips on my Fox and what I need to improve on. ;]

Here are soem Vids of Mine not that good. = 3=

Anyways yeah Vids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHowtEjkzIw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiNr9BJ3x-0&feature=related

(first game)
at :27 you set up a ledge guard from your bair, which is good, but when you have time and they're recovering from under you need to get on the ledge and ledge hop bair their illusion (or just edgehog it)
1:04 is a funny gimp attempt, but normal grab combos would have been a better choice (unless you felt you needed something risky to pull of a victory)
all that did was get your OWN stock gimped
start of the next match, you did a 0% dash attack and got grabbed for it
maybe you meant do SHFFL nair? if you didn't, then don't dash attack at 0 percent again
i can't really critique more, I'm really busy at the moment, hopefully somebody else will help you out


EDIT:my set is up. Any and all critiques are extremely wanted, accepted, and appreciated.
game 1-fox v dk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB92YR7Ne4I
game 2 -marf v dk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB76gI1a_mI
game 3- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dhqx3GGBd4
game 4- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlfMBcorpXE
game 5- fox v falco http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0niIV8daWhI
game 6- fox v falco http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35vBczuQ-PI
game 7- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y
game 8- fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfMiOoyA27E <---I got 4 stocked here
game 9-marf v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcZ0rggYOvY
game 10-fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2hZvw2-jtI
game 11-fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfjgBnTeogU
seriously, thank you for all the critiques, everyone
EDIT 2:first char = mine, 2nd = his

 

[Meneks]

Hey Guys I would love some tips on my Fox and what I need to improve on. ;]

Here are soem Vids of Mine not that good. = 3=

Anyways yeah Vids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHowtEjkzIw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiNr9BJ3x-0&feature=related

Over all the one main thing I noticed in your videos was the lack of "fluidity" with fox.
One important thing i suggest that you do is to become more smooth with your fox movements and to not hesitate as much.

In the second match "dark hart" was able to read your rolls pretty easily.
Just try being unpredictable in general and tech a little bit more.

But like i said before your lacking fluidity which is very important with fox, try being more precise in your attacks and learn to hit..

Reaction time is another thing i have noticed about your fox, unfortunately its pretty slow but once you increase your fluidity and accuracy this should increase naturally.

I think i stated this a couple of pages ago but playing level 1's helped me alot with fox in terms of smoothness and accuracy, it helped me to be very precise in my movements unfortunately it doesnt teach you how to tech chase.
Thats going to be something you must learn while playing other people..

Hope this helps

 

[CanISmash]

tips for fox dittos?

seriously raynex how do i beat you? everyones loves fox dittos i dont really like em.

also tips on cg. i miss a lot but im trying to learn.

 

[Tomacawk]

tips for fox dittos?

seriously raynex how do i beat you? everyones loves fox dittos i dont really like em.

also tips on cg. i miss a lot but im trying to learn.

fox dittos are gay
nair shine all daaaaay
CG shouldn't be that hard as long as you always jc your grab

 

[JonaDiaper]

(first game)
at :27 you set up a ledge guard from your bair, which is good, but when you have time and they're recovering from under you need to get on the ledge and ledge hop bair their illusion (or just edgehog it)
1:04 is a funny gimp attempt, but normal grab combos would have been a better choice (unless you felt you needed something risky to pull of a victory)
all that did was get your OWN stock gimped
start of the next match, you did a 0% dash attack and got grabbed for it
maybe you meant do SHFFL nair? if you didn't, then don't dash attack at 0 percent again
i can't really critique more, I'm really busy at the moment, hopefully somebody else will help you out


EDIT:my set is up. Any and all critiques are extremely wanted, accepted, and appreciated.
game 1-fox v dk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB92YR7Ne4I
game 2 -marf v dk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB76gI1a_mI
game 3- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dhqx3GGBd4
game 4- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlfMBcorpXE
game 5- fox v falco http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0niIV8daWhI
game 6- fox v falco http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35vBczuQ-PI
game 7- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y
game 8- fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y <---I got 4 stocked here
game 9-marf v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcZ0rggYOvY
game 10-fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2hZvw2-jtI
game 11-fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfjgBnTeogU
seriously, thank you for all the critiques, everyone
EDIT 2:first char = mine, 2nd = his

sorry to quote this but i watched like 4 games
i honestly had no idea why you won any of those matches...
i really dont see whats your doing to win
i dont mean to be mean or anything but i just dont see it
what did you do right? i dont know man
i guess you gotta be good if you beat ripple...even tho he plays brawl
but i guess maybe the vids just dont show it all...
idk bro but congrats on the win

 

[RaynEX]

lol pchu i read where you said you were getting as technical as silent wolf and i saw your vids and i lol'd hard bro

multishining like crazy =/= technical lol

i dont know where you got that from

agreed.

Hey Guys I would love some tips on my Fox and what I need to improve on. ;]

Here are soem Vids of Mine not that good. = 3=

Anyways yeah Vids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHowtEjkzIw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiNr9BJ3x-0&feature=related

I watched a couple seconds of the first one. Stop approaching him when he ledge camps like that. He keeps luring you there and gaying you. Don't get hasty and run straight at him. USE TEH LASER OR TEH DASHDANCE.

I'll watch more tmr.

tips for fox dittos?

seriously raynex how do i beat you? everyones loves fox dittos i dont really like em.

also tips on cg. i miss a lot but im trying to learn.

For Fox dittos don't always make the first move. If you miss a nair or grab you take huge damage, so be extra careful. Edge-guarding in this match-up is HELLA EASY. Force yourself to kill them everytime they are off the stage. Low percents bair to knock them low then shine, or simply shine. High percents bair.

Uthrow usmash, uthrow utilt, uthrow shine, uthrow (they d.i. offstage) fsmash etc etc. Be creative with your combos.

Spam bair, its really gay. Don't miss lcancels because you get ****ed if they grab you.

Usmash trades with nair/dair/bair so if they run at you blindly while they are at kill percents smile and say GGs.

Keep your back towards the edge so you can easily react and cover all their options.

1: If they try to firefox sweetspot, WD back and FF to grab the ledge before they do. (1st stock of this match is a good example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzSFT5ZdRK4)

2: If they Firefox at you or illusion at you, you can utilt or fsmash to intercept

3: If they try to illusion for the edge, simply dsmash then grab edge and hog or shinespike.

Basically, having your back turned is amazing. : D

But you don't always have to do that, so keep it creative and keep it different.

 

[Tomacawk]

sorry to quote this but i watched like 4 games
i honestly had no idea why you won any of those matches...
i really dont see whats your doing to win
i dont mean to be mean or anything but i just dont see it
what did you do right? i dont know man
i guess you gotta be good if you beat ripple...even tho he plays brawl
but i guess maybe the vids just dont show it all...
idk bro but congrats on the win

ouch.
I'd like to think I won because I am really unpredictable with when I bring in my tech skill and overwhelm people with speed, and then slow down and react to what they do. I'd also like to think I won because I successfully abused the matchup advantages fox had in every one of these situations.
Playing Brawl hasn't innately made him worse, it's just slowed him from improving by taking out melee time.
It's ok if you don't see it, I guess, we'll have to play at a tourny sometime and maybe you'll understand? IDK (not saying I'm gunna **** you or whatever)
I've just never heard that before.
thank you for the congrats, none-the-less

 

[Teczer0]

Keep your back towards the edge so you can easily react and cover all their options.

1: If they try to firefox sweetspot, WD back and FF to grab the ledge before they do. (1st stock of this match is a good example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzSFT5ZdRK4)

2: If they Firefox at you or illusion at you, you can utilt or fsmash to intercept

3: If they try to illusion for the edge, simply dsmash then grab edge and hog or shinespike.

Basically, having your back turned is amazing. : D

But you don't always have to do that, so keep it creative and keep it different.

Personally I think angled ftilt is better.

Because nothing is more amazing than having falco run into your foot. Then falling to his doom.

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

the bird is the word.

 

[Miggz]

(first game)
at :27 you set up a ledge guard from your bair, which is good, but when you have time and they're recovering from under you need to get on the ledge and ledge hop bair their illusion (or just edgehog it)
1:04 is a funny gimp attempt, but normal grab combos would have been a better choice (unless you felt you needed something risky to pull of a victory)
all that did was get your OWN stock gimped
start of the next match, you did a 0% dash attack and got grabbed for it
maybe you meant do SHFFL nair? if you didn't, then don't dash attack at 0 percent again
i can't really critique more, I'm really busy at the moment, hopefully somebody else will help you out


EDIT:my set is up. Any and all critiques are extremely wanted, accepted, and appreciated.
game 1-fox v dk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB92YR7Ne4I
game 2 -marf v dk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB76gI1a_mI
game 3- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dhqx3GGBd4
game 4- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlfMBcorpXE
game 5- fox v falco http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0niIV8daWhI
game 6- fox v falco http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35vBczuQ-PI
game 7- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y
game 8- fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y <---I got 4 stocked here
game 9-marf v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcZ0rggYOvY
game 10-fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2hZvw2-jtI
game 11-fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfjgBnTeogU
seriously, thank you for all the critiques, everyone
EDIT 2:first char = mine, 2nd = his

I'll a few of your matches a watch later on today after my classes are finished. ^^

edit. I would also wouldn't mind critiquing your Marth as well, but I won't do it on the Fox forums. lol

If you want to, obviously don't have to, post your marth matches on the Marth forums and I'll help him as well. I critique like every match vid that appears over there.

 

[FastFox]

Personally I think angled ftilt is better.

Because nothing is more amazing than having falco run into your foot. Then falling to his doom.

I believe utilt has a wider hitbox than ftilt does, therefore decreasing room for error.

utilt -> bair are amazing. Running usmashes simply dominate, uthrow chain throws kick ***, full-hop nair, thunder's (of course), and a good platform game can all ensure a win.

Fox dittos are easy. You're playing the same character they are, and in essence you're basically going for the same type of kills and the same type of attacks as your opponent, unless they play a Fox that kills with fair or something.

 

[Meneks]

(first game)
at :27 you set up a ledge guard from your bair, which is good, but when you have time and they're recovering from under you need to get on the ledge and ledge hop bair their illusion (or just edgehog it)
1:04 is a funny gimp attempt, but normal grab combos would have been a better choice (unless you felt you needed something risky to pull of a victory)
all that did was get your OWN stock gimped
start of the next match, you did a 0% dash attack and got grabbed for it
maybe you meant do SHFFL nair? if you didn't, then don't dash attack at 0 percent again
i can't really critique more, I'm really busy at the moment, hopefully somebody else will help you out


EDIT:my set is up. Any and all critiques are extremely wanted, accepted, and appreciated.
game 1-fox v dk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB92YR7Ne4I
game 2 -marf v dk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB76gI1a_mI
game 3- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dhqx3GGBd4
game 4- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlfMBcorpXE
game 5- fox v falco http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0niIV8daWhI
game 6- fox v falco http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35vBczuQ-PI
game 7- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y
game 8- fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y <---I got 4 stocked here
game 9-marf v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcZ0rggYOvY
game 10-fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2hZvw2-jtI
game 11-fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfjgBnTeogU
seriously, thank you for all the critiques, everyone
EDIT 2:first char = mine, 2nd = his

Your obviously a very technical player but one thing i noticed that you dont do alot is dair...
Dair waveshine combos rack up a whole lot of damage and it looks pretty sick...
As for marth i would really want to help you but this is a fox thread if you want and can give you tips in pm for marth

 

[Tomacawk]

I'll a few of your matches a watch later on today after my classes are finished. ^^

edit. I would also wouldn't mind critiquing your Marth as well, but I won't do it on the Fox forums. lol

If you want to, obviously don't have to, post your marth matches on the Marth forums and I'll help him as well. I critique like every match vid that appears over there.

if you don't mind, PM me a critique on my marth. I'm not actively seeking marth improvement as this tourny pretty much showed me I'm a 1 trick pony and fox is by far my best character (I lost marf vs roy AND dk. what the ****.) but I'd have to be ******** to turn down free advice.
EDIT-@Meneks-if you don't mind, PM me. =D

 

[Brookman]

sorry to quote this but i watched like 4 games
i honestly had no idea why you won any of those matches...
i really dont see whats your doing to win
i dont mean to be mean or anything but i just dont see it
what did you do right? i dont know man
i guess you gotta be good if you beat ripple...even tho he plays brawl
but i guess maybe the vids just dont show it all...
idk bro but congrats on the win

I'm gonna be honest and tell you he's got a pretty solid playing style, and his shuffles are really tight most of the time.

also, these two links are the same: me 7- fox v cf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y
game 8- fox v roy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNE6Xtto09Y <---I got 4 stocked here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2hZvw2-jtI

I saw the counter around 3:10 coming a mile away, it just made me laugh XD

here's the four stock: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfMiOoyA27E&feature=related

the single piece of advice i have for you right now is STOP JABBING SO MUCH!!! It's definitely an ok move, but I feel like you do it entirely too often. Sure, it can disrupt a shield grab but if they don't try to shield grab before you jab then they just get a free grab anyway. Your waveshines are solid so try to rely on those more. Definitely got good mix ups on your offensive game though. Definitely work on smoothing some of the rough patches where your control slips up.

p.s. fastfox sucks at melee.

 

[Tomacawk]

argh, it would be the 4 stock that I ****ed up linking, which makes me look bad.
I'll go edit my post

the single piece of advice i have for you right now is STOP JABBING SO MUCH!!! It's definitely an ok move, but I feel like you do it entirely too often. Sure, it can disrupt a shield grab but if they don't try to shield grab before you jab then they just get a free grab anyway. Your waveshines are solid so try to rely on those more. Definitely got good mix ups on your offensive game though. Definitely work on smoothing some of the rough patches where your control slips up.

come to think of it, I was jabbing a lot. some of the jabs are ****ed up shffl nairs, but most were legit jabs.
I'll agree that my control does slip up a lot. That's my main issue right now imo and why my vs falco game is rough, I get disoriented when I get hit unexpectedly (lasers with falco) and it really ****s up my movement.
thanks for the advice, what should I do rather than jab? shine->waveshine backwards and bait their shield grab? because I've done that in the past but I get grabbed during my waveshine
or could I shine instead of jab and sh dair (non fastfalled) and land behind their shield by the end of the dair?

 

[Brookman]

woah thats the power ranger villain as your avatar *explodes*

 

[FastFox]

Yeah I'm so bad at melee, it's not even funny.

I've never once posted a video while not on a haitus and playing for ****s and giggles.

 

[Grmo]

HAAAAAAAAAAGS

Alright Fox boards. I was in the middle of making a video archive for Fox, and then we had a power outage and it didn't get saved (I had been keeping it on hibernate and I'm stupid and didn't save etc), anyway that's a legit john imo so now I need to know: how many people even want a video archive? I'll make one if you guys think it'll be useful/can help me out a little. If you can PM me some videos that you think are good then I'll have it up in a few days (because of my hands I can't spend more than like an hour on it every day). On second thought, don't PM them to me; this way we can talk about good matches and what sort of things we can learn from them.

 

[Tomacawk]

HAAAAAAAAAAGS

Alright Fox boards. I was in the middle of making a video archive for Fox, and then we had a power outage and it didn't get saved (I had been keeping it on hibernate and I'm stupid and didn't save etc), anyway that's a legit john imo so now I need to know: how many people even want a video archive? I'll make one if you guys think it'll be useful/can help me out a little. If you can PM me some videos that you think are good then I'll have it up in a few days (because of my hands I can't spend more than like an hour on it every day). On second thought, don't PM them to me; this way we can talk about good matches and what sort of things we can learn from them.

I wouldn't use the archive, so forget about it imo.
and can you critique my set against ripple? =]
there's 11 games so i'm pretty sure you can get a really good grasp on what i need to work on, should you have time and be willing to do it

 

[Grmo]

Yeah. It might take a while because my hands are in really bad shape/I'm trying not to spend much time on the computer so that healing goes better, but I'll have a look at it and I'll probably have some stuff to you by the end of tomorrow.

 

[BEHR]

Thanks for all the advice guys I'll get more Footage this weekend at HERB. :]

 

[PCHU]

lol pchu i read where you said you were getting as technical as silent wolf and i saw your vids and i lol'd hard bro

multishining like crazy =/= technical lol

i dont know where you got that from

I don't know where you got that from either.

I never said ANYTHING about me being as technical as Silent Wolf.
I've got a very long ways to go.
My waveshining could use a lot of work, as could a lot of other things.
I said once YOU START to get there.
In a sense, yeah, I'm getting there, but I'm not NEAR there.
Goodness, is it that hard to read?
And you could use some punctuation.

By the way, does anyone have any tips as to how I could work on waveshining?
CPUs are pure crap.
I have no problem waveshining, it's just that I have trouble going farther with it.
I do better going right waveshining than I do left.
Is there a good way to train?

 

[Silent Wolf]

Watch Perfect Control videos.
They're sure to give you something to work on.
If that's not enough for you, then something is wrong with you.
You'd have to be some kind of robot.
Or a Tool-Assisted Human.

The TAS videos really give me something to work on.
I'm fast, but I still need a good kick in the rear to get me even faster.
People like Silent Wolf are awesome and all, but now that I'm reaching their tech level, I don't feel as inspired as I used to.
I don't really feel like I'm getting anywhere.
Of course, here in Jackson, I barely have a challenge, so where is there to go to?

I've gotten farther in learning about the 4th dimension and tesseracts than I have in anything pertaining to Melee.

I don't know where you got that from either.

I never said ANYTHING about me being as technical as Silent Wolf.
I've got a very long ways to go.
My waveshining could use a lot of work, as could a lot of other things.
I said once YOU START to get there.
In a sense, yeah, I'm getting there, but I'm not NEAR there.
Goodness, is it that hard to read?
And you could use some punctuation.

By the way, does anyone have any tips as to how I could work on waveshining?
CPUs are pure crap.
I have no problem waveshining, it's just that I have trouble going farther with it.
I do better going right waveshining than I do left.
Is there a good way to train?

Contradiction..? I'd say so.
Also, there's no point of attacking someone's conventions as if they were trying to have perfect grammar while posting on a game forum. Whether it's all you think you have against him at that point or not lol.
The best way to practice everything is to just do it over and over. As hard as that may seem in some cases, it's true. The game's tough.

 

[EWC]

I don't know where you got that from either.
By the way, does anyone have any tips as to how I could work on waveshining?
CPUs are pure crap.
I have no problem waveshining, it's just that I have trouble going farther with it.
I do better going right waveshining than I do left.
Is there a good way to train?

The best way to learn all the basic combos is to do them against level 1 CPUs.

 

[Tomacawk]

Contradiction..? I'd say so.
Also, there's no point of attacking someone's conventions as if they were trying to have perfect grammar while posting on a game forum. Whether it's all you think you have against him at that point or not lol.
The best way to practice everything is to just do it over and over. As hard as that may seem in some cases, it's true. The game's tough.

I love you.

 

[Miggz]

Contradiction..? I'd say so.
Also, there's no point of attacking someone's conventions as if they were trying to have perfect grammar while posting on a game forum. Whether it's all you think you have against him at that point or not lol.
The best way to practice everything is to just do it over and over. As hard as that may seem in some cases, it's true. The game's tough.

This is so true. To this very day I still practice aerial to wave shines simply because I enjoy increasing my consistency with it.

 

[RaynEX]

I wouldn't use the archive, so forget about it imo.

Bad logic. Just because you don't need it, doesn't mean it'll be just as useless for other people. lol

: D

 

[Tomacawk]

Bad logic. Just because you don't need it, doesn't mean it'll be just as useless for other people. lol

: D

that's why I put imo lol
he wanted opinions. mine is it isn't very useful, but some people may find it worth-while
i see your smirking emoticon and I raise you one angry emoticon
>= [

 

[LLDL]

The main thing is that i still don't understand why fox is number 1 on the teir list? Does a frame perfect fox have an advantage over a frame perfect marth?

 

[Meneks]

^^que? I don't see how frame perfection comes into play here.
But if it did fox is soooo much faster and has more priority according to match ups etc etc.

 

[LLDL]

^^que? I don't see how frame perfection comes into play here.

thats just it. They can't base a tier list off of character stats, they have to take into account if the character were being played by a frame perfect player. Then, they'd be able to actually rank the characters based on their moves and such. Which is why I want to know, does fox have an advantage over marth? History hasn't shown it yet, so why (even though I love fox) is he number 1?

 

[Meneks]

Character stats isn't what the tier list is based off of entirely.
Like i said before match ups are taken in great consideration when the tier list was made.
Yes marth can **** a fox in a 1v1 match up, but a fox can **** a marth as well in a 1v1 match.
But that is not what its about, its also about how well the alleged characters do well against other characters. If a marth beat a fox in EVERY match played does this mean that marth is better?
In the match up yeah it might(depends on the players) but not entirely true..the bottom line is that fox has alot more better match ups then marth according to the people who created the tier list.

 

[Teczer0]

I believe utilt has a wider hitbox than ftilt does, therefore decreasing room for error.

utilt -> bair are amazing. Running usmashes simply dominate, uthrow chain throws kick ***, full-hop nair, thunder's (of course), and a good platform game can all ensure a win.

Fox dittos are easy. You're playing the same character they are, and in essence you're basically going for the same type of kills and the same type of attacks as your opponent, unless they play a Fox that kills with fair or something.

Yea I think what Raynex said was probably the most effective.

I dunno something about having falco run into your foot is hilarious =D.

I'm not talking about the best option btw.

 

[Stos]

believe it, i might second fox like for sure.
its go time.

 

[Miggz]

if you don't mind, PM me a critique on my marth. I'm not actively seeking marth improvement as this tourny pretty much showed me I'm a 1 trick pony and fox is by far my best character (I lost marf vs roy AND dk. what the ****.) but I'd have to be ******** to turn down free advice.
EDIT-@Meneks-if you don't mind, PM me. =D

Ok so here is the Fox critique I promised. I basically watched all of your fights with Captain Falcon. Game 4, on DL...you have excellent pressuring skills. I was very impressed with that. Nice SHFFL nair pressure. But in my opinion, you don't kill quick enough. This is due to a few reasons. One, you weren't very aggressive in your edge guarding in that particular match up. Try to get get some shine spike kills, especially against Falcon. Believe it or not, using ledge hop dairs when your foe is recovering below you is actually pretty useful with Fox. It may not spike but it does push your foe low enough for you to get a shine spike kill, especially when done on another Fox, or a Falco. Forward tilts, down smash and bair also ****. So definitely work on your edge guarding for quick kills/gimps.

The second reason I think you don't kill quick enough is because when you knock your foe high into the air, it seems you get restless and start doing random tech skill until they are close enough for you to land. I'm referring to Falcon's third stock. You up smashed him and instead of jumping up on the platforms to apply pressure you start doing randomness. You should always be applying pressure, and not doing so actually cost you that stock. There is plenty of time to show off when you actually make the kill. lol

Other then that, good job in that match.

Your match with cf on FD: You have this habit that I'm sure all Fox players had at one point, and that's the full jump, to double jump, to bair. This really isn't all that effective, at least when its done multiple times. Instead of doing this just simply run away/or towards your opponent. A few times your reaction speed wasn't too sharp. Like when you did an up throw on Falcon it looked like you hesitated. There is no need to hesitate after you up throw someone with Fox. Fox has more then enough speed to follow up. A full jump nair would have been ideal after that up throw since cf DI-ed a bit.

Also, try and make your wave dashes a tad bit longer. When wave dashing try and angle your analog stick as forward as possible. This will also help when waveshining Marth's as well, and others. Nice combo on Falcon's second. You followed up perfectly. :-)

Also, learn your percents for combos. You attempted a up throw to upsmash on Falcon at 0 percent. In stead of up smash after a up throw at 0%, use up tilts to grab or waveshine. This ***** Falcon's at low percents. Again, try and work on your edge guarding, although the double shine spike at the end was nice. =P


Overall, you have a pretty cool Fox. Just tidy up on the things I and others have suggested and you'll be fine. I think you should contribute to the Fox Forum combo vid, by the way.