DDD Social: we livin' in smash 4

[Coney]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=13992616

A VOTE FOR ME IS A VOTE FOR DDD

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Seeing as you're not winning, I will refrain from voting until another time.

 

[allshort17]

Do any of you use Skype or AIM actively? Because I have a lot of theories and ideas about the game I wanted to talk about.

 

[| Big D |]

 

[KuroganeHammer]

^ best gif

 

[Coney]

Seeing as you're not winning, I will refrain from voting until another time.

WHY

THIS DOESN'T MAKE SENSE

 

[Doc King]

I just wanna point out this cool thing that can do where you can punish 's up b recovery by f smashing him. If timed and spaced correctly, you can sweetspot the f smash on while he's coming down with his sword.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I'd still rather time a dash attack.

 

[Doc King]

I think something cool and a good thing for we can do is test out his punishes and see what we can do to punish moves. Stuff like out of shield and lag. Also, what would be the best strategies for certain situations.

I think if we air release and then throw an air move so has to air dodge it. We can force into his bad and laggy recovery. From there we can like punish it with like f smash or dash attack.

Edit: Also, maybe when we send opponents offstage, we should probably air release more often because f throw is DIable and it doesn't send off as well as an air release would.

 

[Coney]

seeing as you're not winning, i will refrain from voting until another time.

go vote for me now

i'm only down by a bit

rally the troops

 

[Kite0692]

I think I saw 9B doing that on an Ike long time ago, it work pretty well actually.

I was messin up in training the other day and I figured out that in 0% D3 can turn a Bair (trip) into a Nair and Up tilt. Of course, it can be SDI´ed, but if its not then its a guaranteed combo (32 - 37%). He can Bair (trip) into chaingrab too. The bair must be pulled very close, I think it should be used as a punish. Someone please test this. I tested it at 0% on Marth and Falco.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I'm a nice guy. I'll test it for you later.

Strong bair is about -1 on hit, so I dunno what trip would make it.

Is Dedede even fast enough to capitalise on bair > nair?

 

[da K.I.D.]

Doc,

That set up to put ike off stage does work and coney and others do it from time to time but even if you time your grabbing of the ledge correctly, and force them to land on stage with aether, the lag doesnt last long enough to hit with anything other than a ledgehopped fair, or standing up from the ledge and grabbing. Which is good because you get a free max damage chain grab off of it, but you cant f smash or dash attack him.

Also trying to time an f smash to beat aether is not something that should be relied on. the margin for error is too high and the risk reward ratio isnt usually worth it. it does work, but more often than not, youre going to eat like 10% in aether damage and if they do it right, youre forced to eat a jab afterwards too, which is not something ddd wants to do in this matchup.

Youre better off going over the aether and down airing it, it kills around 120-130. and is much safer.

 

[Kite0692]

I'm a nice guy. I'll test it for you later.

Strong bair is about -1 on hit, so I dunno what trip would make it.

Is Dedede even fast enough to capitalise on bair > nair?

You can Bair > Nair or Bair > grab

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Clearly he can.

Well, I'm still dubious about bair > nair. Assuming trip gives +20 (LOL I DOUBT IT), Dedede has to still jump (takes 5 or 6 frames), nair (takes 7 frames) and whatever it takes to move Dedede toward the opponent.

But that's why I'm the one with Frame Advance.

I'll test it all later.

 

[Kite0692]

Clearly he can.

Well, I'm still dubious about bair > nair. Assuming trip gives +20 (LOL I DOUBT IT), Dedede has to still jump (takes 5 or 6 frames), nair (takes 7 frames) and whatever it takes to move Dedede toward the opponent.

But that's why I'm the one with Frame Advance.

I'll test it all later.

DDD doesnt need to jump, he can hit the Nair in the same jump. You just have to do the Bair pretty quick and it must be pretty close from the other char

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Oh okay, well that makes sense.

In that case, no, it's not possible unless you hit with the late hit of bair.

 

[Kite0692]

Oh okay, well that makes sense.

In that case, no, it's not possible unless you hit with the late hit of bair.

Dont get your point. What is not possible?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

The combo. There's not enough advantage on hit even with tripping to link bair into nair.

 

[Kite0692]

Well, try the grab thing at least. I´ll be trying some stuff with the Grab release offstage.

 

[Coney]

i just ftilt ike

safer and puts them in an "oh ****" situation

 

[Doc King]

I just found out something cool. If ZSS misses her grab, D3 can punish it with a f smash. You can like spot dodge it and then f smash her.

 

[Player-1]

charged jet hammer r bettar

 

[Kite0692]

i just ftilt ike

safer and puts them in an "oh ****" situation

Lol´d at this

GR Link at the ledge is funnier

 

[KuroganeHammer]

 

[White91]

Does anyone know where i can fi nd the video of the dthrow to upsmash on fat charcters is at, zekey was showing me how briefly but i had to **** off

 

[KuroganeHammer]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=291550

Don't need a video. It's simple buffering.

 

[Zekeishere]

I feel like I should post something here to wake everyone up but I don't know what to. Honestly, I haven't been playing much since the TJ tourney, and I've been playing Diddy as much as DDD lately. I haven't given up on DDD at all, its just that its so hard to be consistent. So the best thing I can offer is just focus on fundamentals and awareness. MK and various other characters rolls are too hard to react to and often involve you dropping your shield only to get D smashed and DI terribly. Have faith in your shield. You don't even have to predict when someone is gonna roll to do a run back pivot grab or Full hop Dair or something. I'd like to think that a lot of DDDs have bad peripheral vision lol. They don't have answers to people rolling/gliding behind them. They only focus on what's in front of them and one major option at a time.

I got this.

Also, Doc King and the rest of you data crunchers, Why is Coney the best DDD yet probably the least technical? And I'm hardly technical and yet do fairly well.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I can answer this.

Technical players overthink the situation. You should be able to know what your character is capable of at any given time, allowing you to choose the best option for any situation. Technical players are too worried about what'll happen next and don't focus on what's happening now.

I think.

 

[AtotheZ]

Simply put, DDD isn't a technical character, or rather doesn't benefit as much from technical players due to his limits. You don't find the same results with, say, R.O.B., Sheik, Pikachu, and Diddy Kong, who almost always have a much larger advantage over non technical players of said characters. Having a technical DDD can help, but doesn't necessarily make a huge gap in player skill from non-technical DDD players.

 

[Doc King]

I think that is actually a pretty technical character with tech chasing, Snake buffered pivot grab infinite, Yoshi dash dance pivot grab infinite, and the shuffle. Also, chaingrabbing on middleweights rather take on some timing. You also have to predict a lot and react quickly in ur gameplay.

 

[da K.I.D.]

having played coney, zekey and tech chase all in a row.

Coney is better than all of you I assume because 1. he is precise. he knows his spacing of his moves. He doesnt need to worry about doing overly technical complicated things, he just focuses on what he can do and he does it to the best of his ability.
2. Character knowledge. This kind of blends into precision. but when I played him, I spaced a bair perfectly on him and he managed to powershield it, turn around and catch me with a dash grab before I recovered. it was incredibly precise and I know zekey and tech couldnt have done it so perfectly, but if the frame data would have allowed me to get away from that punish, it wouldnt matter how precise he is, he wouldnt have gotten it. He knows the spacing for what he can do and what he can punish. this gives him the ability to properly apply the few things that he knows how to do and that ddd can do, to maximum effectiveness.
against a character like yoshi for example, knowing how to space out his moves and combat his egg throws from the ledge and doing it CONSISTENTLY, everytime, is a much more critical part of the matchup than a niche infinite or something of that nature that you might have.

That and he probably has better reads too. but thats self explanatory for the most part.

 

[∫unk]

Sweeping statements about DeDeDe or players are not very useful.

Also stop thinking about technical stuff it's nearly worthless. If you can't command basic options well why are you thinking about extra options?

If you're bent on releasing something useful, how about a common d-throw tech chase guide? Reading isn't some mystical subject, it's a formula that a player uses to counter the opponent. Every player has some formula and there could be huge payoff in studying this but no one has.

edit: this post was at no one in particular

 

[Coney]

Also stop thinking about technical stuff it's nearly worthless. If you can't command basic options well why are you thinking about extra options?

Yeah.

10yeahs

 

[MysteryRevengerson]

Sometimes I wish Dedede was a great character

That's all I want man

 

[Doc King]

having played coney, zekey and tech chase all in a row.

Coney is better than all of you I assume because 1. he is precise. he knows his spacing of his moves. He doesnt need to worry about doing overly technical complicated things, he just focuses on what he can do and he does it to the best of his ability.
2. Character knowledge. This kind of blends into precision. but when I played him, I spaced a bair perfectly on him and he managed to powershield it, turn around and catch me with a dash grab before I recovered. it was incredibly precise and I know zekey and tech couldnt have done it so perfectly, but if the frame data would have allowed me to get away from that punish, it wouldnt matter how precise he is, he wouldnt have gotten it. He knows the spacing for what he can do and what he can punish. this gives him the ability to properly apply the few things that he knows how to do and that ddd can do, to maximum effectiveness.
against a character like yoshi for example, knowing how to space out his moves and combat his egg throws from the ledge and doing it CONSISTENTLY, everytime, is a much more critical part of the matchup than a niche infinite or something of that nature that you might have.

That and he probably has better reads too. but thats self explanatory for the most part.

Player knowledge is actually more important than Character knowledge. Although, I do think that reading and that crap is important, but little theory facts can help a little. I mean, how is gonna advance his metagame? There's something called adapting to situations too.

Sweeping statements about DeDeDe or players are not very useful.

Also stop thinking about technical stuff it's nearly worthless. If you can't command basic options well why are you thinking about extra options?

If you're bent on releasing something useful, how about a common d-throw tech chase guide? Reading isn't some mystical subject, it's a formula that a player uses to counter the opponent. Every player has some formula and there could be huge payoff in studying this but no one has.

edit: this post was at no one in particular

I actually have a guide on tech chasing. http://allisbrawl.com/forum/topic.aspx?id=191110

 

[KuroganeHammer]

you think you can.techchase jigglypuff though.

Doc, I'll start up frame advance later today, again sorry I took so long, been super busy. lol

 

[infiniteV115]

Tech Chase you still coming to RoS? I want confirmation on our MM

 

[Zekeishere]

+5 more of what Junk said.

And you guys keep doing it. Frame data and what ever Doc king posted is not going to help you guys get that one win that snow balls you into the next level of player.

 

[Player-1]

chaingrabs and back airs.


WHAT MORE DO YOU NEED?!?!?!?!?!?!!!?!?!??!?!