Close, Please, and sticky the official tier list.

[Jim Morrison]

I would say kirby is better in some match-ups people overrate kirby in the wrong places. kirby has some good things going besides the fact very few people choose to play the match-up so it's impossible for kirby ever land a single hit. kirby isn't bad vs people like roy, falco(like 20x easier if they don't have a clue what to do), and some match-ups for roy I really have no idea what roy could do like vs samus/sheik.


overall kirby has that is a few decent match-ups.

INSANE CRAZY GUY IS BACK *****

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

of course I am I done with my 14 mile bike trip for today.

 

[trahhSTEEZY]

you dont think luigi is on par with mario lovage?

 

[kpm91]

You forgot to put Mewtwo on your list Lovage.

 

[The Star King]

Pikachu for mid tier Lovage.

Before everybody says so, no, I don't think this just because of Apex. I've had this opinion long before Apex.

 

[Marijuana]

you forgot to put _____________ here lovage

 

[ryuu seika]

Top
Fox/Falco/Jigglypuff

High
Sheik
Marth


Upper
Peach/Falcon
Ice Climbers

Middle
Ganon/Samus
Doctor Mario
Mario
Pikachu

Low
DK
Luigi
Link
Zelda
Mewtwo

Bottom
Yoshi/G&W
Bowser/Young Link
Ness/Roy/Kirby
Master Hand

ICG
Pichu

[COLOUR=DarkerOrchid]Ryuuka[/COLOUR]
Keeby

That better?

 

[MarioMariox2]

That would be if it weren't for Master Hand being higer than Pichu. :\ No way Lcancel w/ Master hand cause you don't land.

 

[Stratocaster]

^that list is the best one yet imo because
the whole thing not just ICG tier, but masterhand may belong even below ICG tier, I'd hate to make a 'unusable', 'trash' or 'glitch' tier just for him, but he's so bad he needs one unless he's just takin out

 

[OkamiBW]

I feel like HugS is right...Samus and Doc are better than Ganon. Also, Luigi should probably be higher than Donkey Kong. If there were no Ganon's or Sheik's, Pikachu would be much more viable.

I don't have enough information about Mario and Luigi, but I feel as though Luigi's harder to combo and has better horizontal recovery (1/8 of the time). Mario's got overall better recovery due to his UpB beating out half of the non-disjointed edgeguarding moves. Luigi also can slide away from Fox/Falco shield pressure because of his lack of traction. Still don't know which is better though.

And as a Sheik/Fox player...Ganon's way easier to fight than Samus and Doc (though we really don't have any good Doc's in SoCal/Arizona).

So then, this would be what I would consider the tier list being:

Top (Generally considered best)
Fox/Falco/Jigglypuff

High (Not the best, but have good matchups)
Sheik
Marth


Upper (Good, but have a bad matchup or two that ruins it for them {Peach vs Marth, Falcon vs Sheik, ICs vs Peach/Samus})
Peach/Falcon
Ice Climbers

Upper Mid (Tougher learning curve with some bad matchups, but still tourney viable, even for average intelligence players)
Samus
Doctor Mario
Ganon

Middle (Because this is where the median is by definition) (The last of the tourney viable characters for the average player, cutting it close)
Mario/Luigi
Pikachu
DK
Link

Bottom (Your average player cannot do well in tourney with, even with a bit of practice)
Zelda/Mewtwo/Young Link

Garbage (Are still bad even if Top/High Tiers are banned)
Yoshi/Ness/Bowser/Roy/G&W
Kirby/Pichu

 

[ryuu seika]

ICG Tier was invented to be bottom at about the same time as it was stated that Master Hand aught to be on there. Master Hand cannot be lower than Pichu without ruining the joke.

Plus, MH can take down Jiggly most of the time and possibly the other Top Tiers if they make one bad mistake (his throw is unforgiving).

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

I've been told i'm funny I don't understand the joke did I miss the punchline? please don't bring out your falcon.

 

[ryuu seika]

please don't bring out your falcon.

I'll show you! Divine Justice!

 

[Dragoon Fighter]

Top
Fox/Falco/Jigglypuff

High
Sheik
Marth


Upper
Peach/Falcon

Middle
Ice Climbers
Ganon/Samus
Doctor Mario

Low
Mario/Pikachu/DK/Luigi
Link

Bottom
Zelda/Mewtwo/Young Link

Garbage
Yoshi/Ness/Bowser/Roy/G&W/Kirby/Pichu


All following values suggested by KirbyKaze, with slight modifications from other players.

I like the lack of rigidness in this tier list but I still would like the numbers, Thanks you anyways .

 

[MarioMariox2]

Meh, IMO I still don't think Doc v Mario is two ranks apart :\

 

[TheGoat]

I highly doubt Falco is at the very top, but I definitely agree on putting mewtwo a bit higher up-the latest official tier list puts him below bowser, which is just wrong.

Also, I think eventually, we should try to put together an "official" tier list that perhaps doesn't depend so much on tournament placements. If only there was some way to study/analyze a character without simply looking at tournament results. I'm not saying the current system is bad, but it just places the characters in positions that completely depend on how people are playing them in tournaments. For example, the third tier list had mario way above captain falcon. I do not know if it is possible, but some form of "ultimate" tier list that draws information throughout smashes history would be nice.

Also, the information on the bottom tiers is pretty unreliable. Some sort of low tier tournament would help that. Most characters have been well developed throughout the years-as falcon and mario reached their potentials (so far) and became developed, it became quite clear that falcon is higher up than mario. I think it would be cool to see the same thing with bottom tier characters.

 

[Hax]

Fox, Falco, Jigglypuff, Sheik, Marth, Peach, Falcon, IC's, Ganon, Doc, Samus, Pikachu, Luigi, Mario, DK

 

[Merkuri]

^ Luigi > Pikachu imo.

 

[llamapaste]

I like Hax's list. Except Samus>Doc. Maby Luigi>Pika but it's close.

 

[ryuu seika]

I highly doubt Falco is at the very top

I was going to place him below Fox but then I'd have to know how Jiggly relates to them.
From what I understand (which isn't actally that much but hey), Falco isn't better than Fox at anything other than using his weaknesses to predict opponents moves.

EDIT:

Top
Fox
Falco/Jigglypuff

High
Sheik
Marth


Upper
Peach
Falcon
Ice Climbers

Middle
Samus
Ganon
Doctor Mario
Mario
Pikachu

Low
DK
Luigi
Link
Zelda
Mewtwo

Bottom
Yoshi/G&W
Bowser/Young Link
Ness/Roy
Kirby
Master Hand

ICG
Pichu

 

[Doc King]

I think you should switch Pichu and MH and change the very last tier name into Garbage Tier or something.

Also: Hell no Roy being that low on the Tier list! He should be tied with Mewtwo or something.

 

[Cosmo!]

Master Hand is not a character.

 

[KAOSTAR]

I think you should switch Pichu and MH and change the very last tier name into Garbage Tier or something.

Also: Hell no Roy being that low on the Tier list! He should be tied with Mewtwo or something.

why should roy be higher. he sucks.

 

[Dragoon Fighter]

Master Hand is not a character.

Actually he is, just a very rarely used character (not without reason of course).

 

[Merkuri]

why should roy be higher. he sucks.

Roy is underrated, it sucks that we need an Axe apex like event just to show people how viable a character is.

 

[Doc King]

why should roy be higher. he sucks.

Roy is a fastfaller so its hard to KO him upward and he's light so you can't shine combo him. Roy has some good hard KO moves, the Fsmash, the counter, the neutral B move, the Side B, and the D Smash. he can chain throw spacies and juggle them with the U air, the D tilt, and the U tilt. His recovery also gives a horizontal reach to it and the side b can make him float a little (like Marth).

I'm telling you, Roy is not Garbage, he can do ammazing things like the others.

 

[rhan]

Roy's sooo good. He's so amazing! He's heavyish. He falls fast. He has one killing move.

He's the real sandbag of this game. All he's worth is comboing around. Zelda is better then him.

 

[Doc King]

Roy's sooo good. He's so amazing! He's heavyish. He falls fast. He has one killing move.

He's the real sandbag of this game. All he's worth is comboing around. Zelda is better then him.

I actually think its Fox and Falco in a way because of they are very fastfallish to the point where up and down chains basically kill them. Like Pika can 0 death Fox with his up throws.

Also he has more than 1 killing move and he's light.

 

[Yonder]

Yes, keep Luigi in low tier >:] *remembers the **** Luigi cause in low tier tourneys*

 

[Dark Hart]

Is this Doc King serious? XD Roy is horrible

 

[Eggm]

Roy is like the PERFECT weight/fallspeed to be comboed to hell by any character. He's terrible. I think ness is the worst character tho. Or kirby. But indisputably kirby/roy/ness are bottom 3 in my book. Ness is probably the worst.

 

[Dragoon Fighter]

Roy is like the PERFECT weight/fallspeed to be comboed to hell by any character. He's terrible. I think ness is the worst character tho. Or kirby. But indisputably kirby/roy/ness are bottom 3 in my book. Ness is probably the worst.

Roy is low tier but not THAT bad. He is better than Ness and Kirby, and Ness is a lot better than Kirby it is just that Ness is REALLY hard to use (Go to the Ness FAQ at the Ness boards that should be a nice intro on why he is so hard to use and why I am not a Ness player.) Kirby is bottom tier maybe tied with Pichu but that is a debate I wish to not get into.

 

[Dark Hart]

Dude, Kirby vs Falco is winnable for Kirby if you get Falco's power. He can't be low tier.

 

[V3ctorMan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvvYeR6sJ6Q

Can Yoshi move up now? i mean i understand you all think he's bad.. and he has his weaknesses.. but c'mon he's not that bad? *cries*

<3 you all

 

[Cosmo!]

I think you should be using tournament placings/videos as evidence, not friendlies, no offense intended

 

[V3ctorMan]

I think you should be using tournament placings/videos as evidence, not friendlies, no offense intended

Yeah I know i'm not being "completely" serious.. just kinda painful to see Yoshi in the
"Garbage/Useless character" Tier list... I'm just showing from like... from a "potential standard that Yoshi isn't crap!

*cry*

 

[KAOSTAR]

kirby is worse than ness, but not by alot lol. they both suck.

imo roy is higher among the garbage tier. imo.

gw
roy/yoshi
bowser
pichu/kirby/ness

being a low tier sucks because you lack options. but then if you can't recover. ness/roy are in deep ****. imo roy is only as high as he is because marth was his clone. having mobility and a solid up throw and range keep him from being the worst just off basic attributes of what is considered good. dtit and counter are usable.

gw has solid MUs. basically good range speed and priority. his recovery is decent as well. having a random judgement hammer doesn't hurt either. no tricks/gimmicks just move and attack.

yoshi. im giving yoshi a bit of rope based off potential. that armor **** might **** and having sort armor on djs can make for interesting trades. honestly I think its more yoshi hasn't been proven to suck like the others.

bowser has a few toolz.but just too big and slow. mobility in this game is a must. even so. WK, Gf62, DJN have at least shown that being smart can win you a few matches.

I didn't want another pichu rant so I named him first. I keep hearing ness is underrated, pichu is not as bad as you think, kirby doesn't suck as much as pichu and sh triple laser *****. soo. I agree with it all and they are equally good or trash. however you want to put it.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Yeah I know i'm not being "completely" serious.. just kinda painful to see Yoshi in the
"Garbage/Useless character" Tier list... I'm just showing from like... from a "potential standard that Yoshi isn't crap!

*cry*

The only way you can prove Yoshi has potential is by using him to defeat Silly Kyle.

Beware - Silly Kyle *****.

<3 Kyle

 

[V3ctorMan]

The only way you can prove Yoshi has potential is by using him to defeat Silly Kyle.

Beware - Silly Kyle *****.

<3 Kyle

LOL I agree.. with both statements.. SK is amazerin!

I'll do my best =p

 

[ryuu seika]

Top
Fox
Falco/Jigglypuff

High
Sheik
Marth


Upper
Peach
Falcon
Ice Climbers

Middle
Samus
Ganon
Doctor Mario
Mario
Pikachu

Low
DK
Luigi
Link
Zelda
Mewtwo

Bottom
G&W
Yoshi
Bowser/Young Link
Roy
Ness
Kirby/Pichu

Glitch
Master Hand

Dude, Kirby vs Falco is winnable for Kirby if you get Falco's power. He can't be low tier.

Unfortunately Kirby is indeed practically bottom. Kirby has tricks that will get him by against anyone but AFAIK he doesn't have a single good matchup apart from MH.