Important Carefully Ask PPMD about the Tiara Guy

[ZoSo]

Falcon mostly just has a much easier time killing Marth than vice versa. As Marth it sometimes becomes a game of "gimp or no kill," which sucks, but the matchup is still completely doable.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Marth's nair is as good against falcon as it is vs everyone else.

One of my favorite tricks is to purposely trade first hit nairs with falcon, but marth can get a fair on his way to the ground while falcon can't do anything.

 

[Niko45]

Falcon can't grab you out of your nair and unless they get lucky with the raptor boost timing you can fast fall and cover that too.

Pivot nairs are really good they often catch them trying to attack past your dash dance. For baiting, nair in place, dash away works just like fair does.

At high % if falcon tries to up B very high it's basically the best option for forcing another recovery.

Mostly it just works the way it does in any other matchup. Gives you a timing mix-up if they are anticipating your fairs too much. In general with Marth, don't do advancing nairs and it's pretty safe.

 

[Staco]

Can any1 pls tell me why Marth players hit their enemy between their chaingrab throws?
I have seen Ken and M2K doing this against different people?
Why do they do it, couldnt the enemy just escape (and why dont escape their enemies)?
The hits give you enough time to escape. :/

hitting between chaingrabs = pressing A when your enemy is grabbed
in german its called pummel, dunno if its the same in english

 

[ChivalRuse]

Most people won't escape if you pummel them once. For some people, the pummel buys them some time to think about which way they think the victim will DI. In any case, the extra damage doesn't hurt.

Also, M2K doesn't pummel much.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qW-diM94E8A

 

[Niko45]

They can definitely escape from like 0-10 if you pummel at all. You should be throwing immediately in that situation. They can definitely still escape for some time if they just mash continuously during the chain throw. However, if you don't hear them mashing their controller like crazy, start pummeling once between throws. Each pummel is basically 1/2 a throw, so you can cut down your margin of error (by needing less throws/re-grabs to get to up tilt).

 

[zhao_guang]

Hey, after watching the videos from my last melee tournament, i've realized that i have a naaasty f-smash habit and i'm developping a rolling problem. I don't play people who are good enough to punish my rolling habit often, so i was wondering if anyone has any tips to sort of weaken the habits? basically to help me lay off of the f-smash and rolls.

thanks in advance

 

[Dogysamich]

Practice looking for other stuff instead.

I mean, it sounds like an easy cop-out answer, but that's realistically what you have to do when you're in a situation like that.

You see the f.smash, and you're like "Ok, well, what else could i do? Can I land a grab? lets try it." or "Oh ****, I wanna roll, do I really need to roll?"

Eventually, you'll start to see whether you can really hit those f.smashes or not, and whether you absolutely HAVE TO (or really should) be rolling.

The thing that sucks is when you find somebody who's actually baiting that ****, so you question if it works or not.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

you can't really use strategies that work on higher leveled players on lower leveled players.

For example i have a friend that understands adv techs and uses them, but isn't on a tournament level at all. Against good players, you get punished when you're out of position and you know when you can attack in because they are out of position. Against him, there will be times when i make a mistake and anticipate an attack and he just doesn't even get that i made a mistake. Then theres other times when he makes mistakes all over without regard to anything.

Basically, you can't expect your friends to play on that level. Just shield/dd camp and wait for them to make a mistake, then go into **** mode. Keep doing that and either they will learn their mistakes or you will have excelling punishing skills and learn the rest from better players

 

[Niko45]

I would just fsmash until it stops working. I think it's the kind of thing that has to really be beaten out of you because tho against a casual player you have time to go "Ok, lets dtilt instead," against people better than you things need to come naturally, and you'll revert back to fsmash when pushed to your limit unless you have experienced the consequences already.

The hope is that the casual player on the flip side gets so sick of getting fsmashed and eventually learns how to punish you for it.

 

[zhao_guang]

i'll definitely try out other things in situations where I would f-smash or roll. i've started to work on my punishing skills like Sveet mentioned when i play my friend, so i'll just have to hit up our local melee players to learn the rest.

that's sort of what i noticed in the tournament, when i was getting rattled or pushed to my limit, i would just roll or f-smash out of pressure. i guess i'll really just have to work on my mental game so as to not get so rattled haha.

thanks for the tips guys.

 

[ChivalRuse]

how good (or not good) is marths nair against falcon

Just thought you might find this amusing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoni8YVWXC0

 

[AlcyoNite]

against worst player than me, I just love standing like an inch away from tipper spacing and doing...nothing.

then they roll or throw out an f-smash and i either grab them or tipper them ^_^ "

 

[Falcinho]

Just thought you might find this amusing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoni8YVWXC0

hahahahahaha

 

[JBM falcon08]

Lately against falco i've been countering alot.

Thing is when i counter i'll jump then counter as an approach when i see right through there approach.

Can anyone tell me why i'm countering falcos lasers and they are turning me around?

 

[Ryuker]

Lately against falco i've been countering alot.

Thing is when i counter i'll jump then counter as an approach when i see right through there approach.

Can anyone tell me why i'm countering falcos lasers and they are turning me around?

O.o. Lasers must have passed you or something and thus to the game you got hit from the other side. That's about all I can think of though.

 

[Rappster]

Just thought you might find this amusing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoni8YVWXC0

what was up wit so many nairs?

 

[Taylor-Corn]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAgOYVOMnVI&feature=related

2:06. Q_Q. My sword's always too short at the end of really cool looking combos (this isn't the first time I've gotten a phantom hit on my finisher Q_Q)

edit: Also don't judge the match. I picked Corneria specifically because I wanted him to switch to Fox (who'm I have more experience against than Dr. Mario). He took my bait And we were both kinda off that day (mostly him <_<)

/johns

haha, i cried a little when u phantomed. Also wow that was really cool how you used that ledge to up b combo. Im gonna have to try that.

 

[Staco]

Different questions:

vs. Jiggs

Does fthrow to wavedash to UTilt work?
I know that Ken did it once to a Jiggs player.

And what about fthrow to pivot tipper? (pivot, but then the fsmash in the direction of the jigglypuf)

 

[Dark Sonic]

Different questions:

vs. Jiggs

Does fthrow to wavedash to UTilt work?
I know that Ken did it once to a Jiggs player.

And what about fthrow to pivot tipper? (pivot, but then the fsmash in the direction of the jigglypuf)

Neither of them work at kill percents if the Jiggs DI's your throw down. However if they don't DI, or DI towards you both will work until about 80%

 

[Tee ay eye]

playing marth dittos against forward makes me feel like the worst player in the world
ill try to get vids of me playing him

 

[Rayku]

How many different knockbacks does Marth's Fsmash have?

I would assume it's just 3 (weak hit, middle hit, tipper hit)

This Fsmash made the noise for a middle hit, but had the knockback of a tipper hit. Wondering if anyone could clear something up for me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zt3Rl6Gg2Lk#t=9m37s

 

[KirbyKaze]

playing marth dittos against forward makes me feel like the worst player in the world
ill try to get vids of me playing him

There's this thing called crouch canceling. It's really good against Marth's Fairs and stuff because when they like don't tip Fair (or even when they do) you can get like free moves.

 

[Cross.]

hey guys a quick question, how do you do the fast ledge grab that i see m2k do on the edge? When I wavedash off it seems marth doesnt grab the edge instantly but he does when m2k does it. Am I just seeing things?

 

[ChivalRuse]

hey guys a quick question, how do you do the fast ledge grab that i see m2k do on the edge? When I wavedash off it seems marth doesnt grab the edge instantly but he does when m2k does it. Am I just seeing things?

Fastfall. Wavedash and tap down when you're off the stage (if you hold it you'll fall through without grabbing the ledge).

 

[mers]

How many different knockbacks does Marth's Fsmash have?

I would assume it's just 3 (weak hit, middle hit, tipper hit)

This Fsmash made the noise for a middle hit, but had the knockback of a tipper hit. Wondering if anyone could clear something up for me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zt3Rl6Gg2Lk#t=9m37s

I'm pretty sure that just happens sometimes. I think I've hit with the middle of the blade and got the tipper noise before. Maybe the way the game determines which knockback to assign is slightly different than the way it determines which sound to play? Or not, that seems unlikely.

And yes, Marth's fsmash has three different hitboxes along the sword's length. They overlap slightly, maybe that had something to do with the noise/knockback confusion.

 

[Staco]

If you run and then cancel it with a crouch.
Is there a special name for this technic?

 

[X1-12]

its called dash-cancelling normally but if you do like dash-> crouch -> turnaround grab its often called pivot grab

 

[Dark Sonic]

^^You're wrong about the pivot grab part.

Pivot grabbing is a separate technique. which refers to....grabbing out of a pivot <_<

 

[KAOSTAR]

There's this thing called crouch canceling. It's really good against Marth's Fairs and stuff because when they like don't tip Fair (or even when they do) you can get like free moves.

Thats probably what forward was doing. Hence why tai feels like the worst player in the world.

 

[X1-12]

^^You're wrong about the pivot grab part.

Pivot grabbing is a separate technique. which refers to....grabbing out of a pivot <_<

ohh by bad, thanks though

 

[JesiahTEG]

How come sometimes when I counter with Marth, I turn around in the counter animation and don't hit my opponent?

 

[ChivalRuse]

I'm guessing it happens when their hitbox connects primarily with the back part of your trapbox, resulting in Marth perceiving the target is behind him and attacking there.

 

[yoichX]

How do i do all of dancing blade in melee? For marth.... i only do 2

 

[unknown522]

It's just timing.

 

[I.B]

@ yoichX: make sure you're not mashing b. press it rhythmically

 

[yoichX]

What do you mean???

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

b... b... b... b...

instead of bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb

 

[Devil Ray]

playing marth dittos against forward makes me feel like the worst player in the world
ill try to get vids of me playing him

is forward still good? old school players rarely do well these days.


and marth dittos are fun, but so gay. it's all about the gimps

 

[Just Sexed]

Grabs, tips and gimps to be more exact things you tend to miss a lot vs forward tai

He def has you in the experience department.