Becoming Pro Isn't Fictional.

[Jim Morrison]

Good read.
Still, where you live is possibly the biggest obstacle in becoming pro D:

 

[Red Arremer]

Good read.
Still, where you live is possibly the biggest obstacle in becoming pro D:

I will quote this for insanely true truth.

Problem is, that, here in Europe, there's an insane dominance of Melee. I don't know exactly about other regions but the German-speaking (Germany, Austria, Switzerland), but here, only a fraction of people recognize Brawl as viable game.

And I don't want to play Melee

Spoiler

(anymore because the Melee players are jerks...)

. Here in Vienna, a big city with a pretty big Smash community of about 30 people, only 4 or so of them are Brawl players, including me. =/

I mean, I would travel to the states for the big tourneys like Genesis if I had the money

Spoiler

which I don't right now

. But it's pretty hard for Europeans to get better if the region you are in is pretty much screwed when it comes to competetive Smash, let alone Brawl.

 

[ssbbFICTION]

Spadefox I'll admit that that is very very true.

 

[Blad01]

I mean, I would travel to the states for the big tourneys like Genesis if I had the money

Spoiler

which I don't right now

. But it's pretty hard for Europeans to get better if the region you are in is pretty much screwed when it comes to competetive Smash, let alone Brawl.

Last Brawl tournament in Paris had 106 players, and the next one will have even more players ^^

So no, it's not hard to get good in all Europe, since in France it's still possible haha XD

By the way, you should come to TSL4 this summer / BI9 / A possible European tourney this summer.

Anyways, this isn't the subject of the thread. ^^

 

[Smasher89]

Interesting read ^^

 

[Red Arremer]

Last Brawl tournament in Paris had 106 players, and the next one will have even more players ^^

So no, it's not hard to get good in all Europe, since in France it's still possible haha XD

By the way, you should come to TSL4 this summer / BI9 / A possible European tourney this summer.

Anyways, this isn't the subject of the thread. ^^

Then I guess that France is an exception, maybe. But - judging from Gf2tw's posting and my own experience - it IS hard to improve yourself if you have hardly anyone or even noone to train with in your area.

It's not like I could come over to Paris for an afternoon and play with you, Blad.

 

[:034:]

Gf2tw has plenty of good players around him, he just needs to look better

 

[Red Arremer]

Gf2tw has plenty of good players around him, he just needs to look better

lol. I first thought you meant he had to be less ugly-looking. XD

Yea, I mean I have Gheb and other good Brawlers around me. It's not like I can't improve. Still Brawl is pretty much under Melee's thumb in Europe from what I know.

 

[Jim Morrison]

I cba visiting you, FD.
Also, I wasn't talking about just myself, just Europe. It's harder to get pro in europe than in mericaaa.

 

[:034:]

Yeah, okay, it's generally harder in Europe than in America. At Brawl, that is.

Otherwise just... play Melee?

 

[Jim Morrison]

Melee is basically the same, as long as you have no one to play with, you'll never get good. The brawl scene in America is just signifacantly larger than in Europe.

 

[Saltix]

I'm gonna play White Lucario instead of default from now on.
Purple diddy and Dark falco still though.
I need a new tag.

 

[:034:]

Melee is basically the same, as long as you have no one to play with, you'll never get good. The brawl scene in America is just signifacantly larger than in Europe.

I can disagree with you on the first part. You can still get good at Melee without really having someone to play with. You can work on tech skill for a long time, especially if you want to be a technical player. If you want to main Fox or Falco even more so.

Gf2tw, just go to www.smash-bros.nl/phpbb, get on the MSN chatroom there and just ask around. There are plenty of active brawl players who are just a train-trip away. :D

But yeah, your point still stands - it's harder to get better in Europe then it is in America.

 

[Takeover1806]

It takes a long time of playing brawl with people to find that special character.

 

[Red Arremer]

Otherwise just... play Melee?

Check the Spoiler tags I put in my post quoting Gf2tw. ^^"

But to sum it up:
I originally wanted to play Melee and Brawl, but the Melee-players (not all of em, just a couple) in my area ruined my interest due to their behaviour. I know not all Melee players are like that, but I prefer to be in the minority instead of getting insulted for no reason. I hope you understand that. =)

 

[:034:]

Check the Spoiler tags I put in my post quoting Gf2tw. ^^"

But to sum it up:
I originally wanted to play Melee and Brawl, but the Melee-players (not all of em, just a couple) in my area ruined my interest due to their behaviour. I know not all Melee players are like that, but I prefer to be in the minority instead of getting insulted for no reason. I hope you understand that. =)

Yeah, I get that. Melee players can be pretty hostile when it comes to Brawl, but they're generally really nice folks.

 

[Sky`]

Well, Melee players are generally hostile to Brawl kids, who didn't play melee before.

I can understand that, it's irritating to hear Brawl kids complain about Melee, when they haven't even been there, you know? It gives brawl players a horrible rep.

 

[DTP]

Awesome stuff Sky! =D

I main Luigi, Peach, and I sort of main Zelda lol
As you can see I'm kinda stuck in the D and E Tiers, but I love the characters I use. I've semi tried to pick up a high tier character but it didn't work out.....
Maybe I should try again?

 

[Red Arremer]

Well, Melee players are generally hostile to Brawl kids, who didn't play melee before.

I can understand that, it's irritating to hear Brawl kids complain about Melee, when they haven't even been there, you know? It gives brawl players a horrible rep.

I'm by no mean a Brawl kid, nor a kid in general. I'm one of the 3 oldest people in the Viennese Smash scene, and have played Smash since the very first minute on the 64. Just saying.

The problem is not the Brawl stuff, though, but general arrogance, elitism and hostility towards newcomers - even tho I'm 5 or more years older than some of those guys.

 

[Sonic Phantom]

I'm by no mean a Brawl kid, nor a kid in general. I'm one of the 3 oldest people in the Viennese Smash scene, and have played Smash since the very first minute on the 64. Just saying.

The problem is not the Brawl stuff, though, but general arrogance, elitism and hostility towards newcomers - even tho I'm 5 or more years older than some of those guys.

I would agree. I played melee since it hit the shelves, but I did not start playing competitively until two or three years before Brawl came out - the later years of melee. The elitism and hostility was palpable not only in the players but in the TMs. They have the usual set of people that always place high/win the tournament that are stuck up to newcomers while the TMs cheat the newcomers out of positions so the usual winners win. It was double knock; I was only knocked out once and somehow that equals two knocks?

 

[Rx-]

the only way for noobs to get good is for them to enter tournaments all the time and keep practicing.

you can't get better if you don't enter tournaments.

 

[Pirate Goomba]

I am in that process and finding a main and second and this did get me thinking about the character that I love using. And I have a long way to go , especially with learn the other characters than the ones i use.

Excellent read.

 

[Geist]

If your character lives in the region of D tier and below, You can't do it alone. No matter how many times I try to convey this to other people, they insist that their character is amazing. This is what I call, the Anime Effect.

"If I practice and train hard enough, Oni-chan, I'll make it to the top! Despite the odds against me, I'll make it to first and prove everybody wrong! You'll see!"

lol I really like this.
So many people have this idea that they can single handedly make their character rise up and become the greatest, and that can be the wrong kind of confidence boost.

Ignorance is what keeps a player from getting better more than anything else, and I think you nailed it here.

Well, Melee players are generally hostile to Brawl kids, who didn't play melee before.

I can understand that, it's irritating to hear Brawl kids complain about Melee, when they haven't even been there, you know? It gives brawl players a horrible rep.

I might not be for the game, but that doesn't mean I don't respect the community. Some people here deserve mad rep, just as much as any world quality melee player. Personally it's the inexperience and ignorance in some newer players that make me generally hostile.
The only point where I'm disrespectful is when I meet somone who is not just unknowledgable, but refuses to accept anything he/she doesn't like to hear.

There are some people who play melee that I'd like to hit upside the head too, you know?

 

[Sky`]

Well, Melee people have that thing of elitism...cause they are the ones who claim to know the most about the smash series. And to an extent, that's very true.
Some let it get to their heads, and they inflate themselves.

However, think of it this way. Not all Melee Kids are Elitest. Maybe a small population. You've seen it around your area, and you predisposed that image to every other Melee kid.

Melee kids do the same things to brawl kids. When a Melee kid sees a brawl kid acting stupid, they predispose all of the brawl kids into this catagory of ignorance, which again, to an extent is sometimes true.

The reason I use the word Kids, is because both elitists in that regard, are ignorant, and childish.

 

[Red Arremer]

Well, Melee people have that thing of elitism...cause they are the ones who claim to know the most about the smash series. And to an extent, that's very true.
Some let it get to their heads, and they inflate themselves.

Nah. I know a lot about all 3 games. I'm not able to do stuff like Wavedashing or so due to my finger joints (as already mentioned beforehand), and making fun of me or saying I'm a noob who has no skill or whatsoever because my body limits me to do not being able is not what it should be. I KNOW about the stuff, how it works, what it does, how one can feature it. I just can't use it due to my fingers. =)

However, think of it this way. Not all Melee Kids are Elitest. Maybe a small population. You've seen it around your area, and you predisposed that image to every other Melee kid.

Sure, I never said all Melee players were arrogant and elitist, but those I got to know - especially the better ones - are like that. Most people also play Brawl occasionally, but not as competetive as Melee. I get along very well with most of them... but it's - as said - the few on the top who made me want to stop playing Melee. Again - Harassing someone because of their physical limitations or similar things is not what I would expect from competetive gamers.

Melee kids do the same things to brawl kids. When a Melee kid sees a brawl kid acting stupid, they predispose all of the brawl kids into this catagory of ignorance, which again, to an extent is sometimes true.

Fact is, though, that I haven't experienced Brawl players in my area hating on Melee. Hell, the Brawl players even took part in the Melee events.
It's just that we (the Brawlers) are being handled like a little kid noone actually wants to have around by the Melee players.

The reason I use the word Kids, is because both elitists in that regard, are ignorant, and childish.

Oh, okay, then I'm absolutely not a kid in your meaning, I hope ^_^

Edit:
Sorry that I brought that up... but it IS a major concern to me, as it limits my chances on getting better.
Some people only play Melee because of the Melee players. Otherwise they would play Brawl. That's what I've experienced and know.

 

[Tamoo]

Hmm, im having trouble deciding what to do.
I currently main olimar, and he has been rock solid for me on his own throughout tournaments. Im currently ranked 2nd in London in the ranbats, and have always ranked in the top 5 throughout. however, hes just gotten incredibly boring to play as, and im thinking if changing to my seconds (luigi and zelda/shiek) would be a good idea. Ive brought them out in tournaments before with mixed results and just ended up resorting to relying on olimar again to get me through. I really want to give up olimar but I know that my standard of play for my other characters are not as good, nor do they have the potential to achieve what i have done with olimar. I really care about winning in tournaments, but I also want to have fun playing too otherwise I know i will just exclusively play melee from now on, like most of my friends. Any advice Sky?

 

[Red Arremer]

If you don't want to play Olimar, but you are best with him anyway, I'd suggest you the following:
Switch to one of your secondaries. And use Olimar to cover their weakness(es). You don't have to play Olimar all the way if you don't want to, and can use him whenever you have the feeling that you would need him.

Play more with those others - maybe try around with other characters. You can always get back to Olimar.

That's what I'd do. =)

 

[Tamoo]

ok cheers Spadefox

 

[Sky`]

Nah. I know a lot about all 3 games. I'm not able to do stuff like Wavedashing or so due to my finger joints (as already mentioned beforehand), and making fun of me or saying I'm a noob who has no skill or whatsoever because my body limits me to do not being able is not what it should be. I KNOW about the stuff, how it works, what it does, how one can feature it. I just can't use it due to my fingers. =)



Sure, I never said all Melee players were arrogant and elitist, but those I got to know - especially the better ones - are like that. Most people also play Brawl occasionally, but not as competetive as Melee. I get along very well with most of them... but it's - as said - the few on the top who made me want to stop playing Melee. Again - Harassing someone because of their physical limitations or similar things is not what I would expect from competetive gamers.



Fact is, though, that I haven't experienced Brawl players in my area hating on Melee. Hell, the Brawl players even took part in the Melee events.
It's just that we (the Brawlers) are being handled like a little kid noone actually wants to have around by the Melee players.



Oh, okay, then I'm absolutely not a kid in your meaning, I hope ^_^

Edit:
Sorry that I brought that up... but it IS a major concern to me, as it limits my chances on getting better.
Some people only play Melee because of the Melee players. Otherwise they would play Brawl. That's what I've experienced and know.

Well, I've been in the melee Scene since 04. I used to be Decent. I spiked ken on Rainbow Cruise, and... Got trained by Husband. So that was thrilling.

However, I lost all of my tech skill when Brawl was introduced, and I lost my title as a Melee player, and became a"Brawl Scrub." I got a lot of **** all the time from the Melee community, and it discouraged me. But I stopped listening to them and realized, the only one stopping yourself from improvement is yourself.

I stopped listening to them, picked up Doc, and although I'm still not amazing, or even good for that matter, I've stepped up, and regained the four years that I had thought I lost.

Do the same. Your fingers hinder you, but you don't have to be techincal to be good. Look at Silent Wolf. Hella Tech skill. Ain't that good. haha.

 

[momochuu]

Time for a color change...

 

[Sky`]

ololol.

<3 Kawaiii bunni.

 

[M@v]

This thread wins. That is all.

awesome read.

 

[TreK]

lol i just realised destiny is weird.
I changed my nickname like 1 week ago and then i discover your thread. Nice job, big beard of the clouds.
I used to be called as Kiros, "Kiki", or even "Kirikou". It pleased me, cus to me diddy was still a mid tier character like when i picked up him and i acted like a low tier scrub. No cgs, no infinites, and stuff. I didn't do many tournies, and i used to play a lot of friendlies.
Then i realised Diddy is actually a top tier. He has 2 locks, a lot of true combos, plenty of ways to approach/camp/spam/edgeguard/space/pressure/everything i could dream of. I just didn't take the time to put stuff like single banana lock into my game.
So i decided to change before i even heard of your thread. From now on i'll be called ¤TreK. I'll try to intend to more tournaments, and i'll start to compete in aib's ladder to learn matchups/competitive playing atmosphere.

 

[Red Arremer]

Well, I've been in the melee Scene since 04. I used to be Decent. I spiked ken on Rainbow Cruise, and... Got trained by Husband. So that was thrilling.

However, I lost all of my tech skill when Brawl was introduced, and I lost my title as a Melee player, and became a"Brawl Scrub." I got a lot of **** all the time from the Melee community, and it discouraged me. But I stopped listening to them and realized, the only one stopping yourself from improvement is yourself.

I stopped listening to them, picked up Doc, and although I'm still not amazing, or even good for that matter, I've stepped up, and regained the four years that I had thought I lost.

Do the same. Your fingers hinder you, but you don't have to be techincal to be good. Look at Silent Wolf. Hella Tech skill. Ain't that good. haha.

Thanks, but... I'll stay with Brawl. =)

To everyone their own. I think my time with Melee has passed. It was there before I started playing competetively... I only started doing that a year before Brawl got released. Before? Just casually. Melee is a good game. I even recognize it as better than Brawl when it comes to competetive aspects. But I don't want to play it anymore - the Melee community is only the major part which made me change my mind.

I don't care anymore about the Melee community. Shall they play their game, I'll play mine. The Brawl "Back Room" (yes our German board ripped off SWF XD) of the German-speaking area (which is pretty small here) is planning to end the Melee dominance in our area.
Brawl isn't recognized here as a viable tournament game, and is only played if the Melee players allow it to (exaggeratingly speaking).

I will step up to them - though I won't step up as a Melee player, I will step up as a Brawl player, showing that my game is as tourney viable as theirs.

Thanks though, for the support. It speaks for you to try to encourage me to not give up, although I basically hijacked your thread.
You're a cool person, and I'm glad we could have a talk through this thread. If I ever come to an American tourney, I'll hope to see you there. <3

 

[Raiken]

Best thing i've read since i started coming here.

Great, informative post OP.

 

[hyperhopper]

what if a character is f tier (lucas) (hey im trying to find a main and considering ALL possiblilities)

would he even have any chance AT ALL even with a secondary?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

By picking up high tiers to do the dirty work.

Only for unwinable match-ups.

Which Peach vs MK on rainbow Cruise might be.

 

[SSJ5Goku8932]

MY PT takes care of everyone except Falcos and Snakes.I use Falco to deal with them.I have accepted PT is not a GOD character.however people underestimating him will be punished.

 

[choknater]

West Coast is too good.

 

[BentoBox]

Only for unwinable match-ups.

Which Peach vs MK on rainbow Cruise might be.

Sure you can CP GW if that happens and stand a chance at winning, but aside from such extreme cases (I don't even know why RC is still legal but w/e), I don't believe there are any unwinnable matchups. RC remains the only stage where you have to fight for land. If you're better than your opponent, game 1 and 3 are yours.

Fiction (10:50:55 PM): i think that a character with
Fiction (10:51:03 PM): decent matchups
Fiction (10:51:10 PM): can win as long as theres nothing unwinnable
Fiction (10:51:12 PM): that they cant work around

edit: color