At long last, Presenting GSH2, a Brawl+ Nightly Test Set and Discussion Topic

[SymphonicSage12]

Charizard's up b is amazing...what are you talking about? It has superarmor, it goes a long way, it's angleable, it's connecting hits has low SDI multipliers, AND ITS DISJOINTED.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Charizard's up b is amazing...what are you talking about? It has superarmor, it goes a long way, it's angleable, it's connecting hits has low SDI multipliers, AND ITS DISJOINTED.

And yet it's still extremely easy to spike with Falcon, Ike, Ganon, Wolf, Mario, Ness, Charizard HIMSELF, and I can go on all night. XD

 

[Elefterios]

Minor glitch found. If lucario does a grounded upB and moves hozontally across the stage, he will not be able to do another one unless he jumps or attacks.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

You have tap-jump OFF, right? If so, then that's known, and has been that way since vBrawl. If not, then hmmmm.....

 

[GHNeko]

We know about that glitch.

Ninja'd

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Granted I'll have to get used to it, I take back everything I said about liking the lack of aerial mobility in this set. **** cheap as hell Pit. >_>

 

[maniac200]

The homebrew autoupdater on the B+ site doesn't seem to be working for me. Instead, It just downloads the official version but with the strap loader. Do I have to download this version pac by pac (I have a mac), or is there a fixed homebrew autoupdater?

 

[goodoldganon]

So fixing that 'grabbing the ledge during hitlag.' Though a horribly ghetto fix, we could remove hitlag on all the Up'bs in the game (sans a few, like Ganondorf since it's not causing auto snap problems). The obvious characters getting a massive buff out of this would be Link and Luigi because you wouldn't be able to DI their no KILLER up-b, though it could be debatable for Wolf as well. Maybe MK. *shrugs* As I said, it's a horribly ghetto fix but it might be our only hope if there really is no way to distinguish hitlag in PSA like Shanus is saying.

I'll go down the list and if it would be a problem if you could not DI their aerial Up-bs

• Mario: No
• Luigi: Yes
• Peach: Possibly, depends if the parasol combos
• Bowser: No
• DK: No, but it might need a damage nerf if you couldn't DI out of it.
• Diddy: No
• Yoshi: No
• Wario: No
• Link: Yes
• Zelda: I've never seen Zelda use the hitlag grabbing edges trick
• Sheik: See above
• Ganondorf: No
• Toon Link: Maybe
• Samus: No
• ZSS: No
• Pit: No
• ICs: No
• ROB: No
• Kirby: No
• MK: Probably
• D3: No
• Prolimar: No
• Fox: No
• Falco: No
• Wolf: Probably
• The Captain Falcon: No
• Pikachu: No
• Squirtle: No
• Ivysaur: No
• Zard: Maybe
• Lucario: No
• Puff: No
• Marth: No considering he won't be snapping onto the ledge with the initial hitbox, aka the one to fear
• Ike: I don't think it's possible for Ike to snap during hitlag
• Ness: No
• Lucas: No
• Game and Watch: No
• Snake: No
• Sonic: No

Worst case scenario we could do it character by character. Just food for thought. Probably wouldn't even pass.

 

[Shadic]

I don't have a problem with the snapping. It's a decent mix between Smash64/Melee (No snap) with Brawl (Snap). And it rewards you for hitting somebody during your recovery. (You know, on top of the hitting.)
I can't remember who/why, but I think I was called a n00b, or a scrub, or an idiot for that logic before. Oh well.

Then again, I'm just a biased Link main.

 

[Kink-Link5]

If we could remove the hitlag for up-B's only against shields I think it would solve the major problem. If you get hit by a recovering character it really doesn't matter if they grab the ledge or not since they have successfully recovered anyway, but it is just ******** that the opponent gets to god-mode recover against an anticipating and ready shielding opponent.

Or better yet, if the grabbing most up-B's have could be directly coded out. For example, what stops the character from grabbing the ledge out of their double jump in vBrawl? Or, what stops R.O.B., snake, sonic, and wario from auto-snapping with their recoveries? Or how any PSA character who is given a recovery move that- unless it is called upon in the move's coding to do so- does not grab the ledge?

Just take that code out and let characters only grab if they start going into freefall, like in melee.

Though... that does bring up the point of QA.

 

[camelot]

There is an event in PSA that determines if you can grab a ledge or not.

0C090100 - value of 0 = no, 1 = yes.

Idea: on those problem up-b's, you could have it so it uses that event if the up-b hitbox hits somebody.

 

[CountKaiser]

Why not just apply it to the entire UpB and not just the part where it hits someone?

 

[camelot]

Because, you can normally still auto-sweetspot when you're moving downward.

 

[Dantarion]

Okay Camelot, heres the deal.

According to PW, 0C commands are part of the Character module, which contains things specific to each character. I believe that some of these functions are impemented by all the characters modules, because some of them are called in Fighter.pac.

This belongs in the other PSA thread, but **** it, im putting it here since people keep complaining about the edgesnap thing.

Here are all the unknown 0C commands called from Fighter.pac

0C01 - Character Specific
0C04 - Character Specific
0C08 - Character Specific
0C0A - Character Specific
0C13 - Character Specific
0C16 - Character Specific
0C17 - Character Specific
0C1B - Character Specific
0C1C - Character Specific
0C20 - Character Specific
0C24 - Character Specific
0C26 - Character Specific
0C27 - Character Specific
0C29 - Character Specific
0C2B - Character Specific

One of these might do it. Who knows. To see how they are used, what params they take, check out http://pastebin.com/f2cf93f9a
Use Control-F to find where these are called.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

The homebrew autoupdater on the B+ site doesn't seem to be working for me. Instead, It just downloads the official version but with the strap loader. Do I have to download this version pac by pac (I have a mac), or is there a fixed homebrew autoupdater?

are you sure you got the updatifier under the GSH2 section?

 

[CT Chia]

Anyone make a changelist yet?

When is this going to be turned into a official set?

*posting here cause there hasnt been a post in the WBR for days*

 

[JCaesar]

Half the WBR left, and this set isn't being worked on by the WBR anyway.

It should be official soon though. No word on when the changelist is coming.

Back to the hitlag thing, why again can't we just make the problem up-Bs (like Marth's) unable to grab the ledge until the up-B is over? I don't think there's a single up-B that this would really hurt, and we don't have to touch the ones that don't have a hitbox (like Falcon's).

Hmm, actually, it would make Fox's and Falco's up-Bs unable to autosweetspot while moving horizontal or lower though. Maybe we can do the no hitlag thing for them. But ones like Marth's that move up no matter what, removing the ability to grab the ledge during the up-B would not hurt it.

I'll steal GoG's list and put the ideal solution for their up-Bs.

• Mario: No grab during up-B
• Luigi: No grab during up-B
• Peach: No grab during up-B
• Bowser: No grab during up-B
• DK: No grab during up-B
• Diddy: No grab during up-B
• Yoshi: No change
• Wario: No change
• Link: No grab during up-B
• Zelda: No change
• Sheik: No change
• Ganondorf: No change
• Toon Link: No grab during up-B
• Samus: No grab during up-B
• ZSS: No change
• Pit: No change
• ICs: No change
• ROB: No change
• Kirby: No change
• MK: No grab during up-B
• D3: No change
• Prolimar: No change
• Fox: No hitlag
• Falco: No hitlag
• Wolf: No hitlag
• The Captain Falcon: No change
• Pikachu: No change (? I don't really know how his works during hitlag near the ledge)
• Squirtle: No grab during up-B
• Ivysaur: No change
• Zard: No grab during up-B
• Lucario: No change
• Puff: No change
• Marth: No grab during up-B
• Ike: No change
• Ness: No grab during up-B
• Lucas: No grab during up-B
• Game and Watch: No grab during up-B
• Snake: No change
• Sonic: No change

 

[The Cape]

That is a genius idea (how come no one ever thought of it).

Use the method we used with the sideBs thing and put it on all the upBs.

 

[CT Chia]

any chance of a changelist by the new year for ample practice for p4?

 

[Bandit]

^Broken Record

Play the game or open the pacs yourself.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

but the thing is...wouldn't that completely remove sweetspot for marth's up b? Like, you'd always either go past the ledge, or be on it until the move ends and then you can grab the ledge? I'm not liking this idea so far...

or am I completely misunderstanding it as usual? haha

 

[Plum]

but the thing is...wouldn't that completely remove sweetspot for marth's up b? Like, you'd always either go past the ledge, or be on it until the move ends and then you can grab the ledge? I'm not liking this idea so far...

The idea is to not allow a ledge grab durring Up B at all. As soon as its over you would grab the ledge regularly. Only thing it stops is you from sweetspotting because of hitlag.

If you aim just below the ledge as long as you are still within the ledge's range you would grab it as soon as you finish Up B. A character like Marth's Up B would function the exact same way as it does now, not being able to sweetspot until the move is over and he stops rising, except you can no longer hit your opponent at the edge and sweetspot at that exact moment because of hitlag.

Just learn to always sweetspot everytime and you never have to go above the stage while recovering unless doing so purposely to avoid an edgehog attempt.

 

[MyLifeIsAnRPG]

I think the no grab till up B's are over method would work, it would need some testing though, specifically for Peach's parasol. I would think that would cause problems as she floats down. Does that still count as her UpB in progress or is that just her freefall animation?

Also why no change for Wario? I don't play him, does he already not auto snap?

 

[VietGeek]

pretty sure wario could never auto sweetspot w/ upb period, hence why the NASL never conflicted w/ him, thus he doesn't need the treatment

to my understanding anyhow

 

[The Cape]

I think Wario actually does autosweetspot on some rare occasions and we would therefore need to do this with his as well.

The oddball recoveries like the tethers and Zelda/Sheik would not need this.

 

[JCaesar]

Wario couldn't even autosweetspot in vBrawl, much less Brawl+.

btw, Hackfest 5.0 *****es!

 

[Revven]

JC, Wario has multiple hitboxes on his Up B, while it doesn't autosweetspot, he will snap on if he hits you off of it or manages to hit your shield. Also, DK sadfaces once more as his recovery gets worse despite how **** he is onstage. D:

Also, after playing Brawl recently, I realize that the Up B hitlag shenanigans have always been in the game, it's just that NASL made it way more noticeable (since NASL allows the hitbox to hit shields).

 

[maniac200]

The homebrew autoupdater on the B+ site doesn't seem to be working for me. Instead, It just downloads the official version but with the strap loader. Do I have to download this version pac by pac (I have a mac), or is there a fixed homebrew autoupdater?

 

[Roxas215]

If your friends are completely ignorant of Brawl+'s existence, just do what I do and drag them into it. My friends all loved it since they couldn't stand how Brawl was normally anyways. XD

Lol thats not it. They know it exists. They just prefer vbrawl. It's not like brawl+ tournaments are around.

 

[MyLifeIsAnRPG]

Hey guys, check this shiz out. B+ got reviewed on a gaming/movie website. I snatched it up and put it on reddit. Specifically, they said they were reviewing GSH2 but it was more of a general overview of B+ and hacking in general.

http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/ahxe6/brawl_beta_gsh2_the_future_of_smash_bros/

Huh... and apparently it is getting downvoted... balls...

 

[SymphonicSage12]

people who are having trouble saying they have troubles w/ the autoupdater...

1.) tell us whether it is the computer updater or the homedrew updatfier.

2.) specifically say what the problem is

would be a lot more helpful. Thanks!

 

[JCaesar]

Lol thats not it. They know it exists. They just prefer vbrawl. It's not like brawl+ tournaments are around.

You guys are only 2 hours from Hackfest

 

[Shadic]

Hey guys, check this shiz out. B+ got reviewed on a gaming/movie website. I snatched it up and put it on reddit. Specifically, they said they were reviewing GSH2 but it was more of a general overview of B+ and hacking in general.
http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/ahxe6/brawl_beta_gsh2_the_future_of_smash_bros/

Huh... and apparently it is getting downvoted... balls...

Upvoted. Also, people need to register and Upvote this! It's really easy to make an account. (Don't multi-account, we're not trying to cheat, here.)

Also, whoo! Geno got mentioned.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

"You know there is also a Melee 2.0 project that is starting up."

What the...When did THIS happen? O__o'

 

[MK26]

i thinkk its called ProjectM and its very very secret

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

I see. Most likely to prevent needless flaming. Gotcha. :3

 

[RiteToRmnSilent]

I don't see why auto snapping recoveries when someone is in a shield is such a big deal. It only happens when someone shields right? If that's the case, then if they are going to just stand there in shield why should the person who's recovering be punished for it? Like Marth, sure you can try to space it dead on perfect each time, but then you are extremely susceptible to an edge guard, even when you mix up your recovery. If the other person isn't edge guarding properly by standing in his shield, then that's their fault. Maybe im looking at this the wrong way. But to me it should be left alone either way. This is Brawl+, not Melee.

 

[shanus]

I see. Most likely to prevent needless flaming. Gotcha. :3

Nah, its because it won't get many details revealed until its ready for near release ;-)

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Nah, its because it won't get many details revealed until its ready for near release ;-)

Oh, okay! Needless to say I'll be playing that faithfully whenever it's finished. I've actually been wanting a project like that to happen for when I need an alternate to Brawl+. :3

 

[ValTroX]

I don't see why auto snapping recoveries when someone is in a shield is such a big deal. It only happens when someone shields right? If that's the case, then if they are going to just stand there in shield why should the person who's recovering be punished for it? Like Marth, sure you can try to space it dead on perfect each time, but then you are extremely susceptible to an edge guard, even when you mix up your recovery. If the other person isn't edge guarding properly by standing in his shield, then that's their fault. Maybe im looking at this the wrong way. But to me it should be left alone either way. This is Brawl+, not Melee.

L2Sweetspot, it's certainly not melee, but it's a competitive game and competitive games require skill, sweetspot is one of those skills in smash brothers