ZSS Video Critique Thread!

[infiniteV115]

Suitpieces - Utilise Z-catching more for these. If you're going to try to use a bouncing suitpiece to your advantage, make sure it's bouncing in front of you, and make sure you have another suitpiece close by to use at your disposal. The bouncing suitpiece will keep you safe, and you can attack with the suitpiece you're holding, or pressure with paralyzers, sideB, dsmash, etc.
A good mindgame is to put yourself at mid-range from your opponent (eg his ftilt can't hit you but you can hit him with sideB/paralyzers) while you're holding an item, and just wait. Do nothing, it's hilarious. Sometimes they panic and hold their shield up for a bit, and then their shield is low. Or they spotdodge/roll/jump. Just punish whatever he does in his response to your nothing. And you also have the option of pressuring with sideB/paralyzers.

I also noticed that you tried to clank with the items (when he was throwing them at you) with jab1, but you took damage cause you screwed up the timing. Can't you just...hold A, and let the jab1spam auto-clank with the items?

Yeah...jab1 is pretty risky on Snake, seeing as how his ftilt comes out on frame 3. I usually jab1 and then run away, or jab1>jab2 and then run away as they try to shield jab3 XD. Don't rely on jab1 in this MU.

You have a bad habit of frolling OoS when your shield gets ftilted.
You have a bad habit of not capitalizing on landing your dsmashes. I don't think you EVER used dsmash x2. FYI, if you dsmash Snake at low percents you can chain into another dsmash x2, so you end up landing 4 dsmashes. Which leads into fair. Which is a ton of damage overall, like, around 50%.
You have a bad habit of approaching with shff (shorthop fastfall) aerials.
You need to dtilt and utilt more.
You need to keep him above you more. BF is awesome in this MU (imo) cause of how well we can platform pressure Snake.

Uh, when Snake is recovering high offstage, jump at him facing away and use the back hitbox of nair.

 

[PEACE7]

I love you man thanks a lot and I didn't know we could chain him at low percents that's dope thanks again.

 

[BioDG]

vs. Olimar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIJ6u5VVbBs

After rewatching...I think I jump too much in this mu, didn't account for purples, and, for some reason, don't try to punish him in the air but his landings instead. What do you guys think (and anything else would help of course)?

vs. Peach: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UAdK6Qilc0

Bah, I gotta get over my dumb grab habit. Other than that, I think I could have no doubt won this set if I played smarter. I jump pretty often in these, too, but then again I don't know if it was an issue for this MU. Don't know where to go on this one. Any thoughts?

--

If there are any habits you guys pick up on that aren't good let me know. I feel I have plenty bad habits though not sure what to do for correction (other than the grab thing...which is to just...don't grab much).

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Okay.

for the first match, you were camping too hard. You need to apply pressure against olimar. If he can outcamp Snake, he can outcamp you. Don't paralyzer fight him, run in with a grab or a DA. You never want to be above him and you always want to be below him.

for peach, I watched your matches and :

1) grab against peach is awful. She always floats just out of range and doesn't airdodge to the ground like most characters.
2) Never grab when you're over like... 90. You dead.
3) When i was in Miami last time, i asked Mr. Riddle "Hey. How do i beat peach?" and he said "Never use Side B and always Bair". It works.
4) You keep using Dsmash when she's hovering infront of you. It's not going to hit. You're going to get faired.
5) when she fairs your shield you should be able to hit with an OoS Uair.
6) Delay your back airs more, make her be scared in her shield.
Oh and when someone's charging a smash attack by the ledge, just ledgehop side b.

 

[Dakpo]

Up air out of shield beats peach....peach has no answer

 

[BioDG]

Thanks, Mink/Dakpo! This advice should be a great help before next tourney.

 

[Cygnet]

Hi! I've just started playing ZSS, comparatively, and really, I've just started playing Brawl seriously.

As such, all of my videos will be of completely horrendous play, but I'm hoping to change that.

Here are some of my recent videos (you probably shouldn't watch all of them because there is a lot of bad play, just choose a few randomly....?): 12345678

Thank you very much for reading!

(If it helps at all, I'm coming from playing Marth so that might explain my complete lack of ZSS skill whatsoever.)

 

[Chiko_]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUiezAs8KOw&feature=g-u-u&context=G24a9e0fFUAAAAAAABAA

I'd really appreciate some helpful pointers, I can't seem to beat any Falco's ever with ZSS. Match one begins at 05:51 and second match ends at 14:03.

 

[Dakpo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUiezAs8KOw&feature=g-u-u&context=G24a9e0fFUAAAAAAABAA

I'd really appreciate some helpful pointers, I can't seem to beat any Falco's ever with ZSS. Match one begins at 05:51 and second match ends at 14:03.

Wow, saw some really cool stuff there. I like how you can control both your characters

First off i want to say that I think you lack some of the same skills with both characters.
Namely, your out of shield punishes. With MK you should nair out of shield a lot more if they try to get behind you. Its powerful, does a lot of damage, and has very little commitment. especially at times like 0:33 , 1:13, 2:42, 2:55
I really like your backwards downsmash mind games with MK XD
3:08 why would you DI to the side after falco down throws you? Thats just asking to be B dacus'ed. You get away with it that time, but it costs you a stock later in the set. Always lean up.
Hudet has a really cool falco too XD

So now on to the zss. Im uploading a match vs a good falco as i type this, so if you want I'll just link it when they are up.
So why did you switch? i mean you literally just won with MK.
wow, the first match with zss. That falco was in your face before the "GO!" even faded lol
I try not to play armor to much against falco, but salem could teach us all a lesson on how to play with armor. Go check out his vids vs falco.
5:58- You jumped into falcos arms on that one XD not sure what you were trying to do there. Try to spam down B while getting chain grabbed.
6:08- Fancy B reverse, but you totally ate damage for it. I try and only do it if they proceed to chase me after I see what they do after the first time I down B footstool
6:10- It seems you already decided what you were going to do, regardless if you hit falco or not. But the armor piece could have led into a really nice combo
I like the ground B reversals ))
7:30- You down tilt, hoping he air dodges into down smash. He doesn't and hits you in the face for it. Thats ok, but you didn't adapt and punish this and continued to try and bait air dodges. If you notice someone hits you when they land, then punish with out of shield options like Jump Cancel Upsmash out of Shield or Shield drop up tilt.
7:50- Now this is a problem I have with almost every other zss player. Bad Down smash combo choices. Why only one down smash? You could have for sure got 2. Second you staled your best kill move. So less damage and a staled killed move try fair, nair , or uair. Just save Back air for the kill. Nair has a really cool sweet spot you should try. I do it in my more recent vids if you watch some.
I like the Wave bouncing Side B I use that too.
7:54- really awesome Up air
8:03- good mix ups
8:13- that recovery worries me. A lot of unnecessary movement.
8:47- Could have punished that
8:52- Hudet should have kill you there. He really screwed up. You used the second jump with the up B so you could jump higher, but it leaves you WAAAAAY open for falco's bair when you do it right next to him like that.
9:26- up smash works wonders on people stuck on platforms.
9:54- Just jumping around with the tether cancels and trying to down B onto the stage after your second jump is a really good way to get gimped. Be really careful of how much you play on the ledge like that. He punishes you pretty well every time you down B like that.
10:05- lean up after down throw!!!
Hmm frigate? That's an interesting choice

Again, I don't like armor vs falco
10:59- People charging smashes on the ledge = free Down B kick.
11:06- really beautiful combo
11:22- cool Wall jump B reverse, but come'on. You really think you going to hit falco with that? its not even level to ground and he is no where even close to it. If anything you were just putting yourself in risk of getting hit with lasers.
11:32- nearly got killed for that Down B onto the stage, be careful with that >__<
11:42- why did you drop your shield?
12:27- why did you use your Down B as soon as you jumped? you made your recovery that much harder.
12"30- unfortunate try to focus less on the flashy stuff on the ledge
12:49- he rolled right in front of the edge, you should have tried to push him off with like jab or f tilt or something
13:11- Refer to everything I said at 7:50
13:18- that was really really cool I'm glad you got away with that haha
13"33- again, I dont think the falco minds landing into you with attacks, so be ready to shield instead of charge smashes.
13"45- same thing! stop falling for that! You have to adapt faster!
13:55- Ok I have had that happen to me more time that I can count. Your opponent has super low percent and you try to hit them off but they just regrab the ledge. I found an amazing solution to this problem though. If you can't hit them off, then spike them
So image you got another shot at that recovery. You jump off the platform and use your first jump with the up B--> then you down B to get closer to the stage --> then you go really low until you are right next to the stage and use your second jump with Up B to go straight up and spike anyone grabbing the ledge.

Well I really enjoyed watching your zss. You have really good control over her and I hope to see more from you in the future

 

[Dakpo]

Double post sorry
Match against Bassm's Wario. I really thought I had this one! Waft is broken. So any tips would be nice. Especially against nair.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezJDzRZOCLw&list=UUU3sL6PushrKi8Ar5ZPXSfQ&index=3&feature=plcp

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Usmash it or Utilt it before it hits.

Use lotsa fair/bair in the Wario mu. That way, Uair opportunities arise more often. You gotta play the MU horizontally

 

[Dakpo]

That seems so risky >__< since he can literally pull back if he sees it coming. But thanks though

 

[Chiko_]

Thanks a bunch Dakpo, your input is really appreciated. Will try to keep all of it in mind the next time I play.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

That seems so risky >__< since he can literally pull back if he sees it coming. But thanks though

Playing against Wario is based on small reads like that.

 

[infiniteV115]

I like usmash against Wario. Run under him and usmash if you can predict his jump.

Also, I didn't see you use air release --> fair (from the first few minutes that I watched, didn't watch the whole thing). I do that every time I land a dsmash on Wario XD

 

[FEAR977]

Can someone please critique these for me. These are some friendly matches vs Fox. They're a bit old but any tips will help.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dHo...xt=C3a54f14UDOEgsToPDskLPT7ATdYZj5VfbVeIgyZDi

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbNa...xt=C3bd4d92UDOEgsToPDskL4dYc7C-HfKaH-xYx2GAE2

 

[Chef Fox]

^Hi Zero Suit Samus players, my pal Degree of Fear in the previous post could really use a critique if you're not too busy. He would really like to not be awful any more

 

[infiniteV115]

Though you got the lead with items game 1, I felt it could have been bigger. Try not to be intimidated by characters with reflectors when it comes to your suitpiece game, because often you can bait the reflector and punish it. Try mixing up between
-throwing the suitpiece at the opponent
-throwing it up/down and dtilting/grabbing/dash attacking/dsmashing/sideB (I personally like to grab and throw them into the bouncing suitpiece)
-sideB while still holding the suitpiece

It also helps to put up a wall with items. Keep 1 or 2 (or maybe even 3, though this is harder) of them bouncing and/or airborne in the same spot, and stand behind them. SideB/neutralB/dsmash from behind the items, your suitpieces will protect you. Sometimes I even get away with whiffed grabs XD

I noticed you dsmashed the Fox at like 21%, and you didn't chain into more dsmashes. In case you didn't know, we have a dsmash chain on Fox that does like 100%, I don't know the exact range of when the fresh dsmash has to hit but I think it's 0-60%.
Your use of uair OoS is excellent, keep it up. Nice edgeguarding on his first stock too.
Oh my god, you jabbed his shield and got usmashed. Don't jab shields please.
SD second game was unfortunate, but I don't know why you downB'ed that way.
I noticed that when the Fox is on the ledge, you usually try to dsmash him. So he ledgedrops, jumps away from the stage, and sideBs onto the stage and gets away with it. Try predicting this and punishing with
-paralyzer-->edgehog
-paralyzer-->spike
-paralyzer-->footstool-->edgehog
-grab-->pummel until ground release (which means he falls straight down, off the stage), then edgehog/stagespike
Something you did both games was, when the Fox was on the platform above you (you were on the main stage), he shielded cause he expected an uair. And both times, you did a rising uair. While you didn't get punished either time, most players would probably punish it, and I'm pretty sure that like every character can punish it.
Instead, approach the situation with one of the following
-uair (shorthop, delay and fastfall the uair, make sure it's spaced)
-fair on shield (drift away from his shield after the 2nd hit)
-usmash (hope for poke)
-upB (hope for poke)
In general I think you need to dsmash and dtilt more, and try to work on SDIing Fox's dair. Be safe on Fox's shield, especially when you're at higher percents, that Fox was just waiting to usmash you OoS, both games. You also need to work on dsmash follow-ups.

 

[FEAR977]

Thank you very much for the critique I don't remember why I didn't do the dsmash lock though... I have a lot to go work on. Thanks again.

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Here we go guys,
Vids from Come To Papa

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_vG...xt=C3a75f52UDOEgsToPDskJsfiI76IX0EeahJqk-FO_u Me vs Trump

I guess the rest are coming.

I should have short hopped spike (If you actually watch game 3)

 

[infiniteV115]

Damn Mink, you need to tilt more. I don't think you ever utilted, and you dtilted once. Nobody cares about ftilt though.

Seriously, whenever you were in cqc against him, you either spotdodged or jabbed. ZSS' tilts are awesome, use them.

You didn't dash attack much either.
When you used fthrow, he usually airdodged after. Try using a shorthop sideB if you predict the airdodge.
I think I saw you trying to platform cancel with shorthops..? Doesn't work lol
Start using run away pivot nB and run away pivot sideB.

 

[BioDG]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuPAli8AZjw

I need help. D:

 

[NickRiddle]

So I got some matches against some people. Can someone please critique these for me.

Vs. Fox
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbNaW...eWFju3KHYf5wAa


0:16
wat
D-smash lock maybe?
Anything but f-smash would have worked better...
Except maybe jab.

0:52
That was bad. You literally decided to go back in.

1:32
SDI in front of Fox. They tend to u-tilt out of habit.

1:43
... don't do that...
Nothign else to say about it.

2:28
The only time you should b-throw, and you don't do it.
Try to set up a gimp.

3:19
Punish with a simple u-tilt.
Don't need something fancy, just get damage.


Vs. DDD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrxAf...Ecpo3ZYw4YYT-k

Okay, I'm like a minute in.
Down-b really isn't THAT good. Stop it.
It put you in a bad situation like 4 times, and you landed it once.

1:15
No, seriously.

1:27
...


1:36
Okay, this one made sense.

2:34
Did you really just stand there when DDD could have done... any move...?

2:44-2:48
And that's why you down-b first.


You like to commit with laggy moves, and you're scared to commit at high %s.
Stop both of those things.

Ally is a big fat meanie because at literally every tournament where the both of us were present, he was the one to knock me out of winners' bracket.
And I don't know how to play on Brinstar.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOjgMvL04W4
It seems like my biggest problems are obvious rolls and airdodges.

\

I'm totally skipping the Lucario stuff btw. I don't know the MU enough, and I'd just tell you to do stupid things like interrupt f-smash with jab, or time him out.

After watching, you were just nervous when you started to lose.
The only advice to give is to... get over being nervous...

Zss vs Snake.
Please critique niggs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYqJuku1ypY&feature=youtu.be&hd=1

Oh boy, I love this MU.

BF?
Aim for a time-out. Snake cannot hit you on the top platform withou a double-jump.

0:29
Wait for hit two, and armor.

1:14
Instant dash-attack > hold jab here.

2:27
D-smash > falling nair > anything if you're not going to d-smashx2

Put Snake in more bad situations off-stage.
When you got him off, you didn't keep him off.






Anyways, I'll do more tomorrow. Got in the mood to do this again.

 

[PEACE7]

Alright dope stuff thanks man, gotta power up my zss

 

[NickRiddle]

vs. Olimar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIJ6u5VVbBs

0:33
Up-b?
Guaranteed damage is better due to Olimar's small frame.

1:19
Don't fall into Olimar... Ever.

1:29
Again, no follow-up.

2:49
Why are you camping against an Olimar like this?
You're going to lose the exchange...

You kept camping... It gave you SO MUCH DAMAGE.
If you're going to camp, throw in more jabs to stop Pikmin, and more jumping when the platform is near.

After rewatching...I think I jump too much in this mu, didn't account for purples, and, for some reason, don't try to punish him in the air but his landings instead. What do you guys think (and anything else would help of course)?

vs. Peach: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UAdK6Qilc0

Okay, actually, I don't know the Peach MU well enough to give advice, sorry.

Hi! I've just started playing ZSS, comparatively, and really, I've just started playing Brawl seriously.

As such, all of my videos will be of completely horrendous play, but I'm hoping to change that.

Here are some of my recent videos (you probably shouldn't watch all of them because there is a lot of bad play, just choose a few randomly....?): 1

*turns on own music due to silence*

1:05
Don't do this, ever. This move shouldn't be charged like that.

1:51
Falco was dead if you grabbed the ledge.

Umm... You don't seem to d-smash much...
And you f-tilt a lot.
That is weird.

8

...
Somehow, there isn't much to critique...
You use lots of f-tilt, you grab a lot, and you don't d-smash much.
F-tilt is generally considered a really bad move due to d-tilt being better in practically every way.
Grab is laggy, and you whiffed it a few times.
If really hurts to get punished for that.
Some people don't like d-smash, so I'm not going to comment much about that...
Umm, maybe matches that aren't the Falco player?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUiezAs8KOw&feature=g-u-u&context=G24a9e0fFUAAAAAAABAA

After watching you a little, you should get Salem to help you out.
Your playstyle is more similar to his than any other ZSS's from what I see.
Though, you try to make the same d-smash reads like 5 times, and they don't work any time I saw.
Maybe change that?

Here we go guys,
Vids from Come To Papa

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_vG...xt=C3a75f52UDOEgsToPDskJsfiI76IX0EeahJqk-FO_u Me vs Trump

I guess the rest are coming.

I should have short hopped spike (If you actually watch game 3)

0:18
Up-b earlier for a boost, or just down-b onto the stage.

1;04
You shouldn't commit to something like this at kill %.

1:24
You could have gone one more rep I think.

2:14
This is the first time it didn't work, but run through > pivot grab is one of the most common "tricks", and as such most people should be expecting it.

2:53
SDI through?

 

[BioDG]

Thanks, Nick! I'll definitely take that advice.

As for the "more jumping when platform is near" input: why is that?

 

[NickRiddle]

Thanks, Nick! I'll definitely take that advice.

As for the "more jumping when platform is near" input: why is that?

It gives you an escape if you're on the platform.
It also slows down Olimar's camping, forcing him to jump > toss.

 

[zApollo]

vs. Olimar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIJ6u5VVbBs

I'm really interested in getting better at the olimar matchup so I'll try point a few things I saw.

Charging d-smash when olimar is falling near/into you will almost never work as it can be punished on reaction and most good olimar players cover their landing if they are near you with n-air or f-air. Best thing to do if you can't follow with u-air is to hold your sheild up and buffer a u-tilt if they use n-air or d-tilt if they use f-air.

Using side-b to apply pressure vs olimar isn't a good option as it leaves you vulnerable to tossed pikmin. It's easy to read and olimar can sheild grab or u-smash you in the middle of the move. I only use side-b if I read a roll or when chasing in the air/punishing their landing. I saw you trying to use f-air against olimar's whistle, it's an excellent option in this situation if you know the second hit will also connect.

You really want to get close to olimar during the whole match, it's risky but you can punish all of his attacks on shield with tilts. F-roll is also a great tool if used correctly. You do not want to stale any of your moves getting pikmin off you otherwise you'll have a tough time killing olimar.

I recently lost to olimar and would appreciate if someone gave some pointers with this match: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zj_IxN7B7I&context=C3591fa2ADOEgsToPDskJJUyj1TCMa6Ei2bIjCs29c

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

You guys dont jab nearly enough

 

[DeLux]

http://www.twitch.tv/legendoflux/b/309155493 14 Minutes in, my WF set. I don't understand how to beat Marth

Ideas please?

nvm, videos disappeared >_>

 

[Cygnet]

Just noticed my videos were actually critiqued a week ago..... sorry for that, but thank you so much for the help!

I used all of her moves all wrong because I'm probably still playing like if I was Marth (old main), so I'm sure a few more matches will iron that out. Thanks again for all of your input!

 

[115]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WBT9WvtnsU

Would you critique a two months old wifi match? :I
No lag, we live like, in the same city lol

 

[infiniteV115]

Me = V115
You = 115
wat

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Me = V115
You = 115
wat

I lost.

This was hilarious

 

[115]

I can always switch to the 524 tag lol.
I have more lagless online matches replays...

I won't be able to attend a tourney until July. :I

 

[Lloydder]

Hey, i would like some advice for my ZSS.

Two "recent" matches. Sorry for the quality :S

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdbA...t=UUpjI4-s8dENY0uwDXQcpvFA&lf=plcp&playnext=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V23JIW86Ou0&feature=related

 

[infiniteV115]

Dear god I got my *** handed to me game 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzAuetDb0lM
Help against Ally please

Edit: And Holy too I guess
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okaMHsxz47w
That's game 2 and game 3, game 1 didn't get uploaded for some reason.

 

[Dakpo]

Great stuff, But there are some major problems we can fix to have you kicking up hell in Canada. I'll go into more detail when i get home

 

[BioDG]

I'll take a look at them too when I get the chance and see if I can come up with input.

vs. Illmatic (Peach)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmuskfZcxl8&list=UU41J4HZrKL22qcerM3DC7nQ&index=9&feature=plcp

vs. PJ (Toon Link)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qJS3ts2nY8

--

For the Peach one, it's out of order (he CP'd Brinstar and I CP'd FD). Also I'm pretty sure PJ is extremely determined to nail this MU moving forward, so any crits would help me greatly.

 

[z00ted]

I was halfway asleep during that set :/

you should probably post the 25,548 others we have