Who Has the Best General Purpose Dair in the Game?

[Joxer]

This means best Dair in general, NOT SPIKE. There is a seperate thread for that debate.

Any ideas?

Contenders ATM:

1) Meta Knight:
Pros:

• Very quick attack
• Zero Lag
• Massive hitbox
• Sweetspot that launches
• Hits foes horizontally

Cons: None?

(see post)

2) Lucario:
Pros:

• Very quick attack
• Zero Lag
• Deceptively large hitbox
• Stalls in the air

Cons:

• Hits enemies anywhere but down, depending on the hitbox, making it a situational kill move.

(see post)

(see post)

3) Peach
Pros:

• Quick attack
• Comboable
• Zero ending lag
• Multi-hitting damage racker
• Projectile shield

Cons:

• Can be smash-DIed out of

(see post)

(see post)

4) Wario:
Pros:

• Multi-hitting
• tough to punish if it connects
• great for damage racking

Cons:

• you can smash DI out of it
• landing lag, allowing for a punish

(see post)

5) Fox
Pros:

• Quick attack
• Comboable
• Zero ending lag
• Multi-hitting damage racker

Cons:

• Punishable/Shield-grab-able

(see post)

(see post)

6) G&W:
Pros:

• Spikes
• Can be slow-falled
• Can be recovered from if done off-stage
• Has a landing hitbox

Cons:

• Can be punished on landing if landing hitbox is outreached or shield-grabbed

(see post)

7) Falco:
Pros:

• Spikes
• Comes out fast
• Zero landing lag

Cons:

• Small hitbox
• Does not spike of not sweetspotted.

(see post)

8) Ganon:
Pros:

• Spikes very hard
• Huge damage
• Auto-cancels

Cons:

• Landing lag if not auto-canceled
• Difficult to time correctly
• Very punishable if it misses.

(see post)

9) Link:
Pros:

• Spikes very hard
• Comes out quickly
• Hard to punish if used with boomerang

Cons:

• Easy to punish due to landing lag if not used with boomerang
• Can kill yourself with it if you miss off-stage.

(see post)

10) Ness

Pros:

2. Spiking can kill at a decent percent
3. Has a big hitbox
4. Can sweet and sour spot
5. Good for hitting spotdodgers
6. Good for pressuring shields

Cons:

1. Start up and ending lag

Thoughts?

PLEASE try to keep your arguments constructive and avoid name-dropping.

 

[Sosuke]

Toon Link.
/thread

 

[Barge]

I'll have to go with TL as well.
Because it's just that awesome.

10dairs.

 

[PhantomX]

Probably Wario, Lucario, MK, Ganon. They're pretty difficult to punish and are amazingly good moves.

 

[sMexy-Blu]

If by Dair you mean Spike I'd said Ike or Ganon :?

 

[Kitamerby]

Probably GnW. It's virtually unpunishable.

 

[YagamiLight]

It's probably Ganondorf's. 22%, super powerful spike and combos to boot? Yes please.

 

[Fire!]

Probably GnW. It's virtually unpunishable.

Agreed, dang key....

@Above: It's 23%, but yeah

 

[8AngeL8]

DeDeDe's deserves mention. He can stay airborne forever and it has the priority of the gods.

 

[PhantomX]

Watch's key is more than punishable -_-

 

[Agent Snop]

probably Lucario and Link(on a pro hands)

 

[Sosuke]

22%

Ahh, melee. =P

 

[cleeb101]

lucas and lucario both devastating if mastered.

 

[Sephiroth27]

Best Dair Spike = Ganondorf, Ness

 

[MRTW113]

Lucario's. Helps recovery, stalls in mid-air, strongest aerial, and quick.

 

[cutter]

Meta Knight; by a mile or two.

 

[YagamiLight]

Ahh, melee. =P

That's quite correct. I totally forgot they made it 23% for Brawl.

Melee Ganondorf - Always in our hearts.

 

[AndrewCarlson]

Imagine if Meta Knight's D-air had the forceful spike effect of Ganondorf's. And the same speed and range it has now. I remember seeing that during a hacked game once.

 

[Kitamerby]

Watch's key is more than punishable -_-

If you're Ivysaur with Bullet Seed. :\

 

[Joxer]

If by Dair you mean Spike I'd said Ike or Ganon :?

By Dair i mean as an attack in general, used in any situation.

 

[wangston]

Falco's dair works great in any situation it comes out fast and has decent priority.

 

[Pikaville]

G&W or Lucario probably.

 

[Joxer]

Imagine if Meta Knight's D-air had the forceful spike effect of Ganondorf's. And the same speed and range it has now. I remember seeing that during a hacked game once.

That just sounds silly and unbeatable to me. No character can withstand that kind of punishment at that speed.

 

[PhantomX]

If you're Ivysaur with Bullet Seed. :\

If you're anyone w/ a decent grab range or quick move. Dodge the ground hit if they go for it, grab/attack. If they DI it away, no harm done, lol. I love Watch's that dair a lot, seriously.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Link/Toon Link:
Pros: Spikes very hard and comes out quickly.
Cons: easy to punish due to landing lag and you can kill yourself with it if you miss off-stage.

Nope. Not with TL; He has the advantage of a wind blowback even when he misses; it's incredibly hard to punish.

 

[Sosuke]

Wow guys. TL's Dair is the freaking noobiest move.
Its so easy to punish.

 

[Joxer]

Nope. Not with TL; He has the advantage of a wind blowback even when he misses; it's incredibly hard to punish.

Right, but doesn't if fall much slower, thus easier to avoid?

 

[Kitamerby]

If you're anyone w/ a decent grab range or quick move. Dodge the ground hit if they go for it, grab/attack. If they DI it away, no harm done, lol. I love Watch's that dair a lot, seriously.

Because he has 5 years of lag after the hitbox goes away like Link does, right?

GnW can basically move immediately after the hitbox is gone.

 

[PhantomX]

Tell that to Hylian, he's pretty tired of getting his keys punished (usually by shieldgrabs, but often by fmsash as well) by me when we play.

 

[Joxer]

Because he has 5 years of lag after the hitbox goes away like Link does, right?

GnW can basically move immediately after the hitbox is gone.

Or spot dodge, shield, roll, attack, or grab, which is why the move is very hard to punish

Tell that to Hylian, he's pretty tired of getting his keys punished by me when we play.

You probably punish him successfully only because you grab him when he decided to shield, or you attacked him when the move was over and he didn't realize it. Also, some f-smashes out-reach the landing hitbox of the key, meaning that you can punish them for it in that instance.

 

[Kitamerby]

Tell that to Hylian, he's pretty tired of getting his keys punished by me when we play.

...Bleh, fine. You win this round, Phantom.


I'm gonna go with Lucario's now. <<

 

[-Mars-]

Lucario, G&W, Ganon, and MK are all up there. As for weaker dairs, I think Foxs' dair is the best as a combo starter......it leads into grabs, more dairs, jabs, and his two best kill moves.

 

[cutter]

MK's Dair doesn't have to spike. The angle it sends someone at makes it perfect for a pseudo-WoP and for gimping. You can Dair pretty much the entire cast 2-3 times and they won't be getting back on the stage.

Combine that with the attack hitting on frame 4, disjointed, and pretty much lagless, and you have the best Dair in the game.

 

[cba]

LUCARIO.
10 chars

 

[PhantomX]

Watch's fastest option out of key is a jab, four frames. Factoring in a few frames landing lag from the key and shieldstun (they probably hit it if you're in good position to punish in the first place), your average 6 frame grab is fast enough to beat everything he can do after dair.

Just takes a little practice (and depends on your chara. You Luc players are pretty screwed )

 

[Praxis]

Seriously, where's Peach in this? 50% combos out of Dair FTW.

 

[PhantomX]

Peach's dair is only amazing early on, the others are usable and abusable throughout.

 

[Joxer]

Seriously, where's Peach in this? 50% combos out of Dair FTW.

In your opinion, where should i rank peach? The move can be smash-DIed out of, has landing lag, and is punishable if missed.

Constructive arguments please.

 

[J4pu]

Toon Link.
/thread

lmao no
10lols

 

[Praxis]

In your opinion, where should i rank peach? The move can be smash-DIed out of, has landing lag, and is punishable if missed.

Constructive arguments please.

Peach's dair autocancels into other attacks (including sometimes usmash and usually jab-grabs), utterly destroys spotdodgers, gives her a good approach game and pressures shields. Plus, having no ending lag, you can dair>nair for kills at really high %.

It's not as good as some other dairs (MK?) at high %, but it's possibly the best to have at low % and gives people something to worry about at all percentages.