This is dead, look for the new matchup thread. Be sure to read the rules.

[chckn]

I auto ban luigis when I see an mk no matter what lol. Just picked up snake again a couple days ago after being tired of losing every tournament to mks with ROB. Surprised by FD as a good cp though. I would think BF wouldnt be that bad. explination? Also you didnt even mention c4 as a good tactic. Really cuts down manuverablity on bf of smashville as well as mk's recovery.

 

[Sinz]

Snake has the advantage in the match up if he doesn't get gimped at a low percentage. Grenade camping is too good for MK. Really, it cuts off so many choices that MK has.

Also, I would rather ban Jungle Japes vs MK with Snake. I can camp MK out on Mansion.(Yes I know about how messed up good it is for MK.)

 

[AlAxe]

snake owns.. spam f tilt and u tilt u beat every 1

WOW. And you call us noobs. Here's a good hint of advice, don't go full ******, it never works.

As for the matchup vs. MK I think FD is a great counter pick. You can't get ***** on platforms and you have a good amount of space to work with. I think a general rule with MK and stages should be the less platforms the better for you. Because of this Luigis is a certain ban. There's too many platforms and it's hard to get star kos.

 

[indianunit]

Wow this has been going on for a while. Why hasn't anyone updated the thread with the Metaknight matchup yet? Not trying to force everyone to speed up but I was just wondering what's going on?

 

[Cecilanius]

I thought Rusty was back because he's been posting here and there. I thought he was going to take right over. Bleh, sorry. I'll get back to this thread.

 

[abit_rusty]

Oh, I'm sorry, I'm back but I really have no access to a wii anywhere remotely close right now. Can't play, can't practice, can't really do anything brawl related. I would have no problem helping write up the synopsis for future characters but until I find someone here at college with a wii+brawl (won't take long I think), I can't really contribute with any current metagame :/

 

[Hot_ArmS]

i found a freshman going to msu with a wii...........i 3 stocked him though

but uhhh no need to rush cecillanus, schools starting soon anyway and ppl wont have time anyway

 

[dingding]

WOW. And you call us noobs. Here's a good hint of advice, don't go full ******, it never works.

As for the matchup vs. MK I think FD is a great counter pick. You can't get ***** on platforms and you have a good amount of space to work with. I think a general rule with MK and stages should be the less platforms the better for you. Because of this Luigis is a certain ban. There's too many platforms and it's hard to get star kos.

yup im ******** and could probaly 3 stock u while jacking off so stfu and go play with urself

 

[JesiahTEG]

yup im ******** and could probaly 3 stock u while jacking off so stfu and go play with urself

No really, based off of what you said you actually are really bad at this game.

 

[nice1]

yup im ******** and could probaly 3 stock u while jacking off so stfu and go play with urself

ewwww thats nasty

 

[misterbushido01]

yup im ******** and could probaly 3 stock u while jacking off so stfu and go play with urself

whats wrong with you?

 

[dingding]

lawl RJE when are u coming back to A2, gotta play u soon.

p.s. i suck at this game. I can't even beat a level 1 CPU in training mode, I get 3 stocked each time.

 

[Cecilanius]

So I updated the thread. Now we are onto Lucario. I really need some help on this one, guys.

 

[Ghetto Soldier]

how do i beat D3 people please help a ***** out

 

[Hot_ArmS]

Here guys

Disclaimer: All of this is based on wifi experience/play/info, don't even both reading if you think wifi doesn't help, these info are also tentative; it could change


I played the "best" lucario on Allisbrawl (TantalusIX) to get a feel for this match up, lost the first two and won the next five here are some things i noticed


Expect:

-Short hope fair to dairs, will poke through your shield
-A lot of aerial approaches (fair, nair)
-If the lucario is at 0% or low damage his sideb can chainthrow Snake till 30-40%*
-Jab to grab combo, dthrow to some aerials (iirc)
-Utilt juggles
-A LOT of fsmashes, especially when you land; when you land itll either be a fsmash, charged aura sphere, or a grab
------B spamming to make you approach and fsmash as you approach
------The lucario can anticipate you spot dodging the fsmash so they would charge it up and release until after your spot dodge is done*
------Lucario’s fsmash can be a bit deceptive too as the start up time (when lucario picks his foot up) is already (maybe) a second away from the actual release
-Lucario rolling behind you to attempt for the grab*
-Basically a lot of jumping around by lucario lol


>>>>> Things marked by * either means that the info was told to me by Tantalus or that it could just be her doing those actions mentioned

>>>>> If you wanna see actual Lucario vs Snake play there's none better than Ally vs Azen here http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=azen+ally&search_type=&aq=f

AGAIN that is WIFI so take it for what it's worth, the person that recorded those matches is none other than Tantalus


>>>>>Tantalus gave me Azen's aim and apparently he welcomes challenges so hopefuly i can catch him soon (since i was told he's invisible most of the time) and get a better feel for this matchup. If you want Cecilanius i can give you Azen's aim and you can play him yourself too



I'll write more later, more on how i got around those stuff, i have the basic layout of the writeup in mine i just need to confirm some stuff first

 

[dingding]

Hot_ArmS is sexy

 

[indianunit]

I would say a matchup between Lucario and snake is pretty even. Lucario has a pretty good projectile, his forward smash has great range, and his chain grab to aerial game is pretty good.

-Watch out for aa-->forcepalm-->fair-->nair-->repeat. huge damage + it chases Snake off stage where he can get gimped by Lucario's amazing air game or aura sphere.

-Remember to abuse those tilts cause as far as I'm concerned spamming grenades and mortars leaves an invitation for Lucario to use his double team.

thats all I can think of.

 

[bman in 2288]

...Wouldn't abusing tilts also leave an invitation for Lucario to use Double Team? Get some explosives on the stage to keep him on his toes, and to stop him from possibly sliding into a grenade/landmine.

 

[iRjOn]

well ftilt wont leave u open for double team its fast enough to hit before the counter period.

 

[Hot_ArmS]

I actually think grenades and mortars work well

Grenades would make them shield and you can grab them from there and get them off stage, and since theyre in the air alot theyd have a hard time landing if there's grenades on the ground, same with mines. Mortars work well too imo, even just random ones so the lucario would hesitate its aerial approaches.

Dang i really need to do more further testing on all these

 

[Cecilanius]

Do you think it would be good to toss the grenades into the air instead of leaving them on the ground? From what I've seen, Lucario can get around the ground bound ones easily.

Oh and, that would be awesome if I can play with him Hot Arms. Thanks a lot for the info man.

 

[indianunit]

...Wouldn't abusing tilts also leave an invitation for Lucario to use Double Team? Get some explosives on the stage to keep him on his toes, and to stop him from possibly sliding into a grenade/landmine.

well ftilt wont leave u open for double team its fast enough to hit before the counter period.

What he said.

I actually think grenades and mortars work well

Grenades would make them shield and you can grab them from there and get them off stage, and since theyre in the air alot theyd have a hard time landing if there's grenades on the ground, same with mines. Mortars work well too imo, even just random ones so the lucario would hesitate its aerial approaches.

Dang i really need to do more further testing on all these

Oh they definitely work well, it's just if you use them in a pattern a Lucario user will maybe find the pattern and double team against it.

 

[LP4Life666]

I would say a matchup between Lucario and snake is pretty even. Lucario has a pretty good projectile, his forward smash has great range, and his chain grab to aerial game is pretty good.

-Watch out for aa-->forcepalm-->fair-->nair-->repeat. huge damage + it chases Snake off stage where he can get gimped by Lucario's amazing air game or aura sphere.

-Remember to abuse those tilts cause as far as I'm concerned spamming grenades and mortars leaves an invitation for Lucario to use his double team.

thats all I can think of.

I agree with indianunit...I think Lucario's aura-sphere is one of his greatest assets against Snake because it prevents us from recovering high. A perfectly timed aura-sphere will always hit Snake when he's trying to recover. Also, his F-smash ruins much of our approach in this fight. It's a difficult battle, but an even one for both characters.

 

[dingding]

Hot_ArmS is sexy

 

[TKD]

My advice on Metaknight.

Keep grenades handy, don't place the C4 on the stage, you need it for recovery (if you do, blow it up quickly), and most of all, DON'T GET GRABBED (MK may follow dashgrabs up with extreme gimping to KO, even if your stock is fresh).

What I usually do is shield drop a grenade, pick it up and having it with me. Then I suddenly drop it while jumping backwards (so it should blow up soon), or spotdodge if it's about to blow up and I won't drop it in time. If you have time, you can get two nades out. Grenades rock, they're so cool.

I don't main Snake, but I can do as well as any decent Snake vs Metaknight (actually win 40% of the time), so I know the matchup.

Oh yeah, to not get grabbed. Umm spotdodge. It's nice to spotdodge after popping out a grenade. It gives you a priceless "can't touch this" moment.

This is kind of an auto-quote of myself from another thread, but it works. It's short and to the point. Fresh uptilt KOes at around 110% btw.

 

[Hot_ArmS]

KO's meta at 110%?

it ko's at like somewhere at the 80's lol, depends on where you hit the utilt

 

[ICE27]

Abit rusty can u update this forum with kirby advice?

 

[Azgner]

As edgeguarding lucario, he will rarely aim his up b to the ledge, as it does no damage. if you try to edgehog him, he is likely to stall a little by clinging in the wall of the stage. Try to predict if he is going to the stage and punish him. If you think he will try to sweetspot the ledge, leave a grenade by it and edgehog. this way, if it tries to cling, he will be stage spiked. Just be careful not to be hit by the grenade too, make sure you have your invencible frames when it goes off( you can let it cook a bit and edgehog, our begin to climb a spare second before the explosion). I don't know if mortar edgeguard goes well against lucario, i think that one of his aerials goes through the mortar.

 

[Ori_bro]

ok i have a question about the controller port priority and snake how does it work does anyone have a link to a thread about it???
because im trying to get my snake up to tourney standards but this is just bugging me.

side note: Hot_armsS r u going to the aadlgt on the 20th i want to see if i know anyone thats there besides okiyama and lain

 

[Hot_ArmS]

heres a video about the port priority concerning grenades, link to thread is in the video description

and yeah ill be there, im gonna win it why wouldnt i be lol.........solons gonna be there too he goes to the digiops and rofa tourneys

 

[Ori_bro]

heres a video about the port priority concerning grenades, link to thread is in the video description

and yeah ill be there, im gonna win it why wouldnt i be lol.........solons gonna be there too he goes to the digiops and rofa tourneys

hahaha... me and 2 or 3 friends are going to come are there any people besides u, dingdong, okiyama and solon that are relatively good going???

 

[Hot_ArmS]

there's this one pretty good sheik (good for a sheik) that plays gamebattles, theres a falco but all he does is chaingrab and fsmash so just mindgame him and youd win.........theres my younger brother and his friend, they got 2nd in teams last time after mine and dingdongs first

 

[ICE27]

Hmm I feel like lucario can easily combo a snake at low percents with aerials and the insuffiable over b (force palm) atk. I've seen snake cged all the way across FD with that atk. An aerial if timed correctly can knock u outta cyper and combo u with Dair. A good way to beat lucario is grenade and stay on the ground. Stay out or the air i can't stress that enough, once ur in the air its hard to come down. Well spaced F-tilts can out range his and if u time ur spot dodge against his forward smash u can counter with tilts. I've never rlly had trouble with lucario you just have to be overly agressive and not let him get aerials. When facing lucario they main approach will be something like short hop foward air oh dash to forward b and chain forward b's. Also, he will attepmt to combo you with u-tilts at low percents. They will use that to rack damage and also may play campy with projectiles (aura spheres) learn to manuver around those and that will cut off their options as damage builders. They may turn to aggressiveness and since u can be more aggressive it turns in ur favor.

A good counter stage is Corenia with its short walls and short ceilings. Plus lack of room for the lucario to run around and spam projectiles.

As far as stage ban goes banning battfield might be smart. And rainbow cruise is a nightmare altho i did fairly well against a good lucario on that stage so i guess it all depends on how well you know that stage.

 

[Timbers]

Guys, forcepalm chaingrab is ineffective. You guys can break out of it easily. Instead, be aware of jab jab>forcepalm into sh fair>dair.

Lucario doing anything EXCEPT retreating if his fair is shielded is punishable. Your tilts can easily punish any followup we have if you shield it. His best option is to DI away. Throwing himself into your shield is a terrible idea.

Fsmash and aurasphere help tremendously in this match for Lucario. Luc boards are also discussing Snake right now.

What I've said so far. It's barely scratched the surface of the matchup but I'd like to contribute.

Aurasphere camping>Nade camping. It forces Snake to approach you, which is good. Just charging them up and throwing them so that it hits Snake right before the nade should be thrown is perfect for disarming his camping. He'll be forced to shield the aurasphere, and at the same time having to shield the nade. This eats up a ton of shield, and makes him unable to effectively get a nade thrown successfully. Nades clank with auraspheres unless the nade is too close to either Snake or Lucario. Keep that in mind when wanting to disarm his nade game. Also he does have lag while throwing the nade. There's a considerable window you're allowed to actually peg him with an aurasphere if he does try to throw the nade.

It's hard to explain, practice. Know when is the proper time to shield the nades, and when you have to shut him down with auraspheres.

The stage you'd want to take Snake to would be FD or Japes. No platforms makes it harder to him to approach you, also harder for him to camp due to platforms and utilt gayness. Japes encourages aerial combat, something Snake isn't that great at. High ceiling hides your poor vertical resistance and subpar vertical killmoves.


What a Snake WILL TAKE YOU TO is BRINSTAR. That's not a bad stage for Snake. It's a freakin' amazing stage. Every competent Snake you play against is going to have Brinstar or Lylat as their CP. He can camp behind the "mucus" stupidly well when edgeguarding you. Platforms are perfect height for his utilt and depending on the stage level he can autocancel his fulljumped nairs. Top it off with low ceiling and enclosed sides (perfect for his ftilt and utilt) and you have a sad Lucario.

Avoid Brinstar, Lylat, Battlefield. Try to force FD and Japes.

 

[ICE27]

Guys, forcepalm chaingrab is ineffective. You guys can break out of it easily. Instead, be aware of jab jab>forcepalm into sh fair>dair.

Lucario doing anything EXCEPT retreating if his fair is shielded is punishable. Your tilts can easily punish any followup we have if you shield it. His best option is to DI away. Throwing himself into your shield is a terrible idea.

Fsmash and aurasphere help tremendously in this match for Lucario. Luc boards are also discussing Snake right now.

What I've said so far. It's barely scratched the surface of the matchup but I'd like to contribute.

Thanks for the advice but force plam chaingrab is possible

 

[Ken Neth]

New match up please. The snake boards seem to be dying

 

[abit_rusty]

I would start one but I just about retired brawl. It's all casual for me now.

Person who I left in charge (Cecilanius) basically stopped too.

Bah.

 

[bman in 2288]

...I'm not on here enough nor competitive enough to continue the work, so I can't help all that much.

Sorry rusty.

 

[Azgner]

I can help in the match-ups that I have some kind of experience...

 

[Hot_ArmS]

im too busy owning gb for that 1250$ cash money

sorry guys =/