The Unity Ruleset: Discussion

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I can see people just bringing this up just to do it. I think I'll go make the topic. I just don't feel like discussing this again in the future..lol Simple as that.

*goes to our forum*

 

[DeLux]

I'm merely pointing out that you Lux were pretty much the only person that knew that it was not "technically" an Infinite. Because you did the work and researched it. Probably 1% of the community after reading will call it a Walking CG even if they understand the logic and reasoning behind your post.

Also if our reasoning /ruling behind something is explained that's pretty much it. If the BBR RC defines an IC chaingrab as an Infinite under the Unity Ruleset it's an Infinite. Even before that its been considered an Infinite. Because of that, why should we be obligated to re word something when the only people that would call it a Walking CG know our reasoning behind calling it an Infinite anyway.

Just something to throw out.

But, I agree with you Lux. I don't see a sound argument against editing the rule. It'd squash any un-needed arguments especially if others are going to just arbitrarily bring it up just to argue (which people will do for one reason or another...)

There are better things to discuss personally

Thanks Tech. Obviously if it's defined as an infinite in the rules based on a competitive concrete criteria, then it's an infinite. I was simply pointing out that there isn't any definition at this point, only an abstract "commonly accepted" viewpoint.


ALSO: Just one last update, Hylian says he has video evidence that it doesn't apply to MK.

Which might be the case, because MK was an outlier based on my theories of mechanics based on weight. I personally think there's a chance he's mistaken, but video would obviously prove me wrong on MK. (I say MK was an outlier because as I mentioned in the thread earlier, I found it weird that I could regrab Pikachu in testing but couldn't regrab MK when they are essentially the same weight and size. But I also haven't factored in DI, which could make things moot.)

However, Kirby, G&W, Squirtle, and Jiggs are still technically noninfinites, until the rulesset defines them as such

I want to know soon though how the committee decides. If you guys redefine infinite or the 300% rule to make any tactic capable of going to 300% inescapably or something like that as a "infinite", I won't bother testing DI effects on mechanics because there wouldn't be a point to anymore lol

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I started a discussion on it so we'll be letting you know shortly. I doubt anyone is going to be against the re-phrasing of the rule though.

 

[adumbrodeus]

substituting infinite for "any combination of moves cannot be escaped by the opponent before at least 300 damage is recieved at the time of initiation", or something of that nature would be a good substitute. You still wanna cover current and future infinites, but making something that works for IC (and other similar situations) on a technical basis is a good idea as well.

 

[ErikG]

"Any infinites or chaingrabs cannot go past 300%"

 

[AlphaZealot]

The BBR-RC has updated the Unity Ruleset. As always we will continue to discuss the rules of tournaments across the country and will do our best to adapt with the constantly changing metagame. We are still discussing some aspects that were simply not ready for release at this time, like expanding the number of starters and the possible inclusion of a new stage. The new version 1.1 rules have the following modifications.

Pictochat is now banned

Conduct Rule #2 has been modified to: Pause can be requested off and that request cannot be denied. If one pauses mid-match, the person who initiated the pause loses their current stock. If the pause causes the opponent to lose their stock (Such as interfering with recovery), the person who initiated the pause loses two stocks.

For better clarity, General Gamplay rules #4 and #7 have been changed to:

#4: All infinites and chain grabs are legal.
#7: The act of stalling is banned: stalling is intentionally making the game unplayable: Such as becoming invisible, continuing infinites, chain grabs, or uninterruptible moves past 300%, and reaching a position that your opponent can never reach you.

Finally, the creation of Conduct Rule #11:Disrupting your opponent physically or intending to disrupt their play (through something such as screaming in a player's ear) will result in a warning. Repeated action will result in disqualification from the tournament and possibly ejection from the venue. Observers who physically disrupt players are to be dealt with as the Tournament Organiser sees fit. Disqualification is recommended if possible, and ejection from the venue is also a punishment.

And finally, two general clauses to help protect TO's:
•These rules are subject to change leading up to the event date. The Tournament Organizer reserves the right to remove you from the venue at his discretion for any reason.
•The Tournament Organizer and his assistents, and any persons helping run the event may not be held liable for any lost, stolen, or damaged goods during this event. Nor will the Tournament Organizer, the venue, its owners, affiliates, employees, members, sponsors, or volunteers be held liable or responsible for any injury or harm that may befall a person during the course of this event. By entering the venue during the posted date you are displaying your agreement with this policy.

 

[WindMajor]

Holy conservative stagelist.

AZ, any discussions ongoing for the addition of some stages?

 

[DeLux]

The rule changes themselves aren't what's important. The fact that there were changes at all lends large amounts of credibility that the committee is working in the interests of the community.

That in my opinion is cause for celebration

 

[Overswarm]

Hahaha....

*makes conservative stagelist*

wait for it...

*bans another stage*

Keep it classy

 

[AlphaZealot]

Last weekend (5/14/11): There were eight Brawl tournaments that occurred around the country. Of those eight, five of them used the Unity Ruleset (62.5%) making it by far the most used Brawl ruleset in a single weekend, ever, and to date the most used Brawl ruleset, ever.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AN3TqGkCpQY

also, when was the last time anyone here has ljello shots besides me today? aka just ignore this whole post, ima having too much on the shots atm and just feel like harrassing this thread for no apparent reason.

eidt:
also.... yay for bbr-rc listening! this brings hupe to the future of this rluset for me at least!

 

[AlphaZealot]

I've never once been to a tournament that was held in a public area. You are completely incorrect about that.

All house tournaments: obviously private
All LAN centers: obviously private
Hotel venues: obviously private & you need permission from the hotel, which typically also means paper work and also the authority over whatever room you are renting.
All university tournaments ("public" universities or "private"): private & you need permission from the university, which typically also means paper work and also the authority to call the university police in the event someone should not be there or is disobeying the rules.

Trespassing is very easy to enforce, actually. The only grounds is you need to prove you have the authority (via "ownership" of a space), and when it comes to Hotels/Universities you have filled out paperwork and signed agreements. When it comes to houses you would need the permission of the owner/renter (if you are not already the owner/renter) and when it comes to LAN centers you would need to the LAN center owner (who hopefully would back you up, I guess this one might be a bit ambiguous).

Short of someone holding a tournament in a park or something, I cannot think of an example where the TO would not have the authority to call the police and get someone kicked out.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

AZ... please just ignore me rghit nwo. im just harrassin ya. hear il go chaneg it

edit:
there, now instead of tallkyn about tresopasin we can talk about chef

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Holy conservative stagelist.

AZ, any discussions ongoing for the addition of some stages?

I'm not sure if we can disclose that information.

 

[Kuro~]

So the only change so far as far as stages go is that pictochat was banned correct?

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Yes, that is correct Kuro.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I'm very much happy that infinites are still allowed. This obviously comes from maining Dedede, but whatever.

VERY mixed feelings on Pictochat's ban.

I'm happy because it has no business being in a competitive stagelist due to completely unannounced random events which can completely turn the tide of an entire match.

I'm worried that rather than making the stagelist more competitive this will be used as a reason not to allow stages which people consider "more gay" than Pictochat, despite being far more competitively viable, such as Jungle Japes, Norfair, hell even Rumble Falls is more competitive than Pictochat tbh. (don't take this the wrong way, as me saying RF should be legal, I'm just comparing Picto to it)

 

[Tin Man]

Why did ya'll decide to Ban Picto (or is that information private)?

 

[WindMajor]

Why did ya'll decide to Ban Picto (or is that information private)?

This would be nice to know. Adding simple release notes to the change log wouldn't be a bad idea IMO. Not asking for a paragraph, just brief statements or something of the sort.

 

[Chuee]

Conduct Rule #2 has been modified to: Pause can be requested off and that request cannot be denied. If one pauses mid-match, the person who initiated the pause loses their current stock. If the pause causes the opponent to lose their stock (Such as interfering with recovery), the person who initiated the pause loses two stocks.

How would this part be enforced?
I mean, someone could be in a position where they probably wouldn't make it back anyways, and say the pause caused them to die. Even though this seems like it wouldn't happen almost ever, it looks like there could be some problems with what seeing if the pause actually caused them to lose a stock.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

How would this part be enforced?
I mean, someone could be in a position where they probably wouldn't make it back anyways, and say the pause caused them to die. Even though this seems like it wouldn't happen almost ever, it looks like there could be some problems with what seeing if the pause actually caused them to lose a stock.

You main Lucas. Wouldn't a pause while you try to use up b possibly cause a death as either your up b would completely miss or send you the wrong way?
Same applies to Ness (for the same reason), Luigi (Down B), and Snake (Down B) with a lesser extent to MK and Lucario.

 

[Yikarur]

so If I make my opponent suicide on his last stock due pause I win nevertheless?

 

[Sinister Slush]

Pictochat now Gone, Brinstar still in... What?

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Welp. Nice knowing you, chance to succeed in brawl rulesets.

GOOD ****ING JOB ATLANTIC ****ING NORTH! WASN'T ****ING ENOUGH TO RUIN THE RULESETS OF MOST MAJOR NATIONALS, WAS IT!?

Yes, I am drunk. And pissed. Deal w/ it.

Seriously. JUST BANNING PICTOCHAT. Now you're literally two steps away from the APEX ruleset. It'll get stickied yet by the end of the ****ing year.

No second stage ban.
No japes.
No norfair.
No GGs.
Not even another two ****ing STARTERS, THE SINGLE LOGICALLY CLEAR THING!!! You think I'm kidding? I can go through with it with EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU. There is no logical or pragmatic argument against 7+ starter stages. NONE!!! IT DOES NOT EXIST! FML are you guys ********?

You guys suck. Gratz.


@Sinister Slush: You may go die in a fire. We are NOT starting THAT bull****. Not here. Not where people who actually MATTER look. **** you.

 

[Reizilla]

An announcement or something for this kind of change would be nice.

 

[T-block]

Hahaha obligatory "calm down BPC"

The reasoning has already been made clear. I doubt anything has changed =\

I'm tempted to draft up a massive post about Picto, but I don't see it doing much good now. Maybe in the future when I'm really bored =P

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

I'm VERY DRUNK AND VERY ANGRY. Sue me.

 

[Esca]

I love that Picto is banned. No more free wins for scr00bs.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

I love that Picto is banned. No more free wins for scr00bs.

Be thankful I am not within 200 miles of you.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

One step at a time, BPC. This is only 1.1, not 2.0.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

I guess I'm just jaded. This organization could do SO MUCH GOOD. Instead it's only moving in the wrong direction. You're literally one step away from the average AN (ban PS2) or EU (ban Brinstar or RC) ruleset. ONE. ****ING. STEP.

 

[ErikG]

They still have infinites legal.


Honestly, they should have tried Japes as the controversial ground based stage instead of Pictochat.

Pictochat is a terrible place to start for any attempts to make a stagelist more liberal.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

They still have infinites legal.

You know what happened when I asked at german tournaments what they thought of having infinites banned? They laughed at me.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

sorry bpc, esca is under my protection, any combat going his way comes through me first. that's how it works

 

[Anaky]

Ruleset sux, if its gonna be changed get it right. Just my opinion, UK and prolly EU are gonna stick to our own ruleset from now on.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Good to see Picto is finally banned now as it should've been from the very beginning. It actually looks like a non-embarrassing ruleset now although it's still not ideal.

 

[etecoon]

I guess I'm just jaded. This organization could do SO MUCH GOOD. Instead it's only moving in the wrong direction. You're literally one step away from the average AN (ban PS2) or EU (ban Brinstar or RC) ruleset. ONE. ****ING. STEP.

you say this as if it were bad

it took far too long but respect to the BBRRC for finally doing the right thing

 

[John12346]

Picto is on the fence. Banned or not, bleh. I personally think that one stage, out of all the stages BPC's advocating to be legal, shouldn't be, just because of the magnitude at which it can affect matches.

But I do agree with BPC about the rest of things about the other stages. More stages moved to the starter list, more CP stages(there are legit ones that aren't legal right now), and two stage bans would all be enormous steps in the right direction.

 

[Life]

Sigh at the specific changes, but at least we got some.

1.2 with Japes/Norfair and two more starters by /hope?

Also, BPC's not mad that Picto was banned. He advocated the Picto ban. What he's mad about is that Picto was banned but nothing else was added that clearly should have been.

 

[Luigi player]

Ruleset sux, if its gonna be changed get it right. Just my opinion, UK and prolly EU are gonna stick to our own ruleset from now on.

What? We always did anyway lol


Nice to see Picto banned finally.