The Unity Ruleset: Discussion

[Zankoku]

I disagree. Given the amount of support you'd give that thread, I'd predict several requests for a thread lock followed by the thread being locked before it reaches over 15 posts.

However, if you do feel that this ban ruling is warranted, feel free to advocate it to your local TO, as then you'll have more to back up your proposal than "nobody disagreed with me in my thread, therefore everybody agreed with me."

 

[SaveMeJebus]

I disagree. Given the amount of support you'd give that thread, I'd predict several requests for a thread lock followed by the thread being locked before it reaches over 15 posts.

However, if you do feel that this ban ruling is warranted, feel free to advocate it to your local TO, as then you'll have more to back up your proposal than "nobody disagreed with me in my thread, therefore everybody agreed with me."

The problem with that is all the extra work the TO will have to do if he wants to do that since he is in the BBRC. I don't think he would want to get all that data down. I could ask though

 

[Arcansi]

Players are not allowed to use any game altering hacks, such as no-tripping.

Why aren't tournaments allowed to be run using this again?

3.

 

[Overswarm]

Tripping is one of the dangers of running. Yes, it sucks, but it also is part of the strategy of the game. Luigi trips twice as much. Characters that run a lot (like Sonic) put themselves in situations where they will trip more often. Removing something simply because "it sucks" inadvertently gives certain characters an advantage they should not have. Changing the game in the name of "But come on, that sucks" is a slippery slope you should not partake in.

 

[DMG]

But what if it only involved tripping?

What's the harm in getting rid of tripping and ignoring the people who then want to go further?

 

[Arcansi]

Tripping is one of the dangers of running. Yes, it sucks, but it also is part of the strategy of the game. Luigi trips twice as much. Characters that run a lot (like Sonic) put themselves in situations where they will trip more often. Removing something simply because "it sucks" inadvertently gives certain characters an advantage they should not have. Changing the game in the name of "But come on, that sucks" is a slippery slope you should not partake in.

Slippery Slope: See: France, Germany(I Believe).

If tripping is one of the dangers of running, matchups should cover it, correct?

Please show me one matchup that covers tripping as part of it.

Also, why is inputting a dash and getting a dash 100% of the time an advantage luigi or sonic or ANYONE should not have?

 

[Overswarm]

But what if it only involved tripping?

What's the harm in getting rid of tripping and ignoring the people who then want to go further?

Because then it's completely arbitrary, which is even worse. The same logic could be used for adding turtle shells as items. Or eliminating Dedede's infinite. Or forcing players to stop edgeguarding. Anything that someone says "that's gay" to and has an emotional response to, woosh, out the window. The people that use that logic HAVE done that, we most often see it at convention tournaments where they go up to people like Baro and say "Stop chaingrabbing, we're making that against the rules now!".

Slippery Slope: See: France, Germany(I Believe).

If tripping is one of the dangers of running, matchups should cover it, correct?

Please show me one matchup that covers tripping as part of it.

Also, why is inputting a dash and getting a dash 100% of the time an advantage luigi or sonic or ANYONE should not have?

The same reason Meta Knight shouldn't be issued a handicap. Arbitrarily changing things to suit our whims is always a bad idea.

 

[Arcansi]

The same reason Meta Knight shouldn't be issued a handicap. Arbitrarily changing things to suit our whims is always a bad idea.

This isn't to suit a whim, or arbitrary at all, this is to make the game more competitive.

Meta Knight already has been issued a handicap(LGL), so your argument falls apart.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

This isn't to suit a whim, or arbitrary at all, this is to make the game more competitive.

Yes, and if editing the game to make it more competitive is legitimate, why not edit it in other ways as well?

 

[Arcansi]

Yes, and if editing the game to make it more competitive is legitimate, why not edit it in other ways as well?

I see nothing wrong with it as long as it changes the game in such a way as to make it more competitive while not changing the game in such a way as to make it effect conscious decision on the part of the player (in the vast majority of games.)

 

[WindMajor]

What exactly is "more competitive" then? Is it exactly what I think or is your idea of it different from mine?

 

[Arcansi]

What exactly is "more competitive" then? Is it exactly what I think or is your idea of it different from mine?

You would need to explain what you think of as "more competitive" for this to make any sense.

However, because you didn't.

I'm assuming we all have the same definition of more, as this is something I can expect of everyone over 12.

com·pet·i·tive
   [kuhm-pet-i-tiv]
adjective
1.
of, pertaining to, involving, or decided by competition: competitive sports; a competitive examination.
2.
well suited for competition; having a feature that makes for successful competition: a competitive price.
3.
having a strong desire to compete or to succeed.
4.
useful to a competitor; giving a competitor an advantage: He was careful not to divulge competitive information about his invention.

The definition we should be using (see: Context) when we say 'more competitive' I have bolded.

Therefore, 'more competitive' should mean 'better suited for competition, having a feature that makes for more successful competition.'

Correct?

The philosophy of "try and make the game as competitive as possible without affecting conscious decisions made by the players" seems pretty legit to me.

Thank you!

 

[Grim Tuesday]

The philosophy of "try and make the game as competitive as possible without affecting conscious decisions made by the players" seems pretty legit to me.

 

[WindMajor]

You would need to explain what you think of as "more competitive" for this to make any sense.

However, because you didn't.

I'm assuming we all have the same definition of more, as this is something I can expect of everyone over 12.

com·pet·i·tive
   [kuhm-pet-i-tiv]
adjective
1.
of, pertaining to, involving, or decided by competition: competitive sports; a competitive examination.
2.
well suited for competition; having a feature that makes for successful competition: a competitive price.
3.
having a strong desire to compete or to succeed.
4.
useful to a competitor; giving a competitor an advantage: He was careful not to divulge competitive information about his invention.

The definition we should be using (see: Context) when we say 'more competitive' I have bolded.

Therefore, 'more competitive' should mean 'better suited for competition, having a feature that makes for more successful competition.'

Correct?

Yes, correct.

Now, what is more suitable for competition for you? A game with tripping, or modifying a game to have more trpping?

 

[Arcansi]

Yes, correct.

Now, what is more suitable for competition for you? A game with tripping, or modifying a game to have more tripping?

A game with tripping.

(Taking bait here because I have no idea where it's going, props twinkie.)

How does this relate to our discussion?

 

[Ussi]

If you guys didn't need to have a concrete logical reason that can't be opinionated.. we'd stop arguing in circles.

Nothing wrong with a majority doesn't like this aspect.. Even if they are wrong, they still are the majority :x and this isn't a life or death situation where being in the wrong is bad. The wrong itself is opinionated anyways.

Now arguing about hacks is a bit different... But unless we are gonna get picked up by mlg .. Our grassroot tourneys can run a mild hack (brawl 1.1 i'm thinking as it only needs 1 SD for all setups) though majority just wants vbrawl?

 

[DeLux]

Just an Update

We had a meeting and discussed somethings:

- We discussed amending the coaching rule
- We discussed tie breakers in pools
- We made a procedure to determine weighing experimental rulesset applications for tournaments
- We will be starting once a month skype discussions with the public


If you have any questions, direct them towards Xyro he says

 

[Xyro77]

Just an Update

We had a meeting and discussed somethings:

- We discussed amending the coaching rule
- We discussed tie breakers in pools
- We made a procedure to determine weigh experimental rulesset applications for tournaments
- We will be starting once a month skype discussions with the public


If you have any questions, direct them towards Xyro he says

yes sir! LAY IT ON ME YA WIMPS!!!!!

 

[WindMajor]

A game with tripping.

(Taking bait here because I have no idea where it's going, props twinkie.)

How does this relate to our discussion?

Oh man, my laptop died on me just as I was responding to this.

I'm gonna have to make you wait.

 

[Tesh]

Okay, Xyro how come you guys didn't discuss a scrooging rule. Is scrooging okay? Is it also okay for me to homing attack stall on frigate?

 

[Arcansi]

Oh man, my laptop died on me just as I was responding to this.

I'm gonna have to make you wait.

This is cool.

 

[Xyro77]

Okay, Xyro how come you guys didn't discuss a scrooging rule. Is scrooging okay? Is it also okay for me to homing attack stall on frigate?

We are working on a scrooging rule. We have not talked about sonic but we will take care of it.




Next? Im getting bored......

 

[Tesh]

Why has there not been an official low tier ruleset revolving around keeping Lucas legal?

 

[-Ran]

Because we first look at the main events [Singles/Doubles]. Once we're done composing what needs to be done there, we will move on to lesser ones.

 

[Xyro77]

Why has there not been an official low tier ruleset revolving around keeping Lucas legal?

are you serious.......

 

[Tesh]

Has there been any talk of lowing the LGL for MK?

How about a 9 stage starter list?

 

[Xyro77]

Has there been any talk of lowing the LGL for MK?

How about a 9 stage starter list?

All kinds of ideas are being brought up and discussed.

 

[Tesh]

anything along the lines of banning more stages or bringing some new ones in?

 

[Xyro77]

anything along the lines of banning more stages or bringing some new ones in?

Some people tried to bring up the idea of banning more stages but it failed cause its a stupid idea. Adding new stages came up too but sadly it was shot down.

 

[Sinister Slush]

What's the direction Norfair is heading, Stay banned Or CP? With neither player using MK.
Since obviously MK, the fact you can time people out with almost half the cast, and very noticeable Lava hazards (That players still manage to get hit by for not noticing them...) are about the only problems with this stage.

 

[Xyro77]

What's the direction Norfair is heading, Stay banned Or CP? With neither player using MK.
Since obviously MK, the fact you can time people out with almost half the cast, and very noticeable Lava hazards (That players still manage to get hit by for not noticing them...) are about the only problems with this stage.

norfair is an easy hell no. esam brought it up and it was a total shut down. doesnt mean it wont come up again though

 

[ElDominio]

norfair is an easy hell no. esam brought it up and it was a total shut down. doesnt mean it wont come up again though

So what's so bad about Norfair again?

 

[CT Chia]

Why has there not been an official low tier ruleset revolving around keeping Lucas legal?

The BBR creates the Tier List, we do not

 

[SaveMeJebus]

What about adding an extra ban?

 

[WindMajor]

Forgive me for not reading if this is already posted, but are you guys opening up skype chats to the public, and when would you be doing so?

I want to know when I can derail everything and badger everyone with talks of Norfair and stuff.

 

[DeLux]

There's been talk of doing Skype chats with the public, and I believe Tech Chase is going to head that initiative. There will be more definitive announcements from him I suppose

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

yes sir! LAY IT ON ME YA WIMPS!!!!!

Why are you such a tool?

Why is FD still a starter?

 

[Deleted member]

So what's so bad about Norfair again?

Nothing is wrong with it.

 

[B.A.M.]

Has BBR RC been paying any attention to the alternative CP Rulesets that have been proposed in beneath this topic? I really believe that those rules could change the current out look of our game.

 

[DeLux]

Our next meeting, the first item on the agenda is actually a discussion on amending the stage striking / counter picking procedures in ways that maintain stage diversity of counterpicking but create great competitive neutrality in the last game of a set as well as causing decentralization of the importance of game 1.