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The Official BBR Tier List v4 -> Sonic's HA Stall is NOT beaten by spot dodge!!!!!!!!

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Elyssa Xey Hexen

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Yaaay said:
German located Yoshi avatar has a name you know. A shorter one too.
As for your question, its most likely there isnt.
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I was in it for the lulz with the name. Anyway, yay, I couldn't find one myself.
Flayl said:
Z'zgashi, read his post again. The only way to find information about european low tier tournaments is to check the results threads (which can be in either the results forum or in the european forum).
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Which is what I was afraid of. I have to do things the manual way. Either way, the results could be interesting.
 
uhmuzing

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New tier list hype! :O

I'm really interested to see what happens to Snake, Diddy, and Falco.

EDIT: Here's my final tier list; it comes in three versions... anyways, the numbers are really arbitrary, and matter more in comparison to nearby characters than the grand scheme of things.

and yes, the title is the font from Meno's thread in the tactical forum since it's so awesome
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=7947788&postcount=53
 
Spelt

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This thread was so interesting a few days ago, and now it's back to being boring. :(
 
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CheeseBurger

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let's also discuss why bowser rise/fall

most people don't really understand the way he works

not that he's good

just that they don't understand the inherent properties that make bowser good
 
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dragonblooded said:
New tier list hype! :O

I'm really interested to see what happens to Snake, Diddy, and Falco.

EDIT: Here's my final tier list; it comes in three versions... anyways, the numbers are really arbitrary, and matter more in comparison to nearby characters than the grand scheme of things.

and yes, the title is the font from Meno's thread in the tactical forum since it's so awesome
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=7947788&postcount=53
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Wolf is too low. Fox is too high. Zelda could move up a spot. Lucas is too low.
 
Spelt

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Fox is too low. Wolf is too high. Jigglypuff could move up a few spots. Lucas is too low.
 
Conviction

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Lol you really have some hate towards Fox Auspher? Everytime I've seen Fox being brought you always have something negative to say about it lol.

EDIT: You could ask Auspher the same thing King of Murder.
 
Z'zgashi

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dragonblooded said:
New tier list hype! :O

I'm really interested to see what happens to Snake, Diddy, and Falco.

EDIT: Here's my final tier list; it comes in three versions... anyways, the numbers are really arbitrary, and matter more in comparison to nearby characters than the grand scheme of things.

and yes, the title is the font from Meno's thread in the tactical forum since it's so awesome
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=7947788&postcount=53
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game and watch is a little too high, sonic is too high, ike is too high, zelda is a little low, and lucas is way too high
 
BSP

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I don't think Sonic is comparable to DK yet. The only reason DK is unviable is because D3. Sonic is about mid tier, but IDK next to DK. DK might just be too low.
 
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Elyssa Xey Hexen

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Ripple said:
let's make it interesting then.

sonic should move back up
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CheeseBurger said:
let's also discuss why bowser rise/fall

most people don't really understand the way he works

not that he's good

just that they don't understand the inherent properties that make bowser good
Click to expand...
Auspher said:
Wolf is too low. Fox is too high. Zelda could move up a spot. Lucas is too low.
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Spelt said:
Fox is too low. Wolf is too high. Jigglypuff could move up a few spots. Lucas is too low.
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Blacknight99923 said:
I think MK is to low on the tier list
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Inferno3044 said:
Ike and Sonic are overrated.
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Z'zgashi said:
game and watch is a little too high, sonic is too high, ike is too high, zelda is a little low, and lucas is way too high
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mariobrouser said:
I don't think Sonic is comparable to DK yet. The only reason DK is unviable is because D3. Sonic is about mid tier, but IDK next to DK. DK might just be too low.
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I wish everyone included why they think characters should rise or dive. It's so much more interesting to read debates and flame wars lol
 
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xIblisx said:
Lol you really have some hate towards Fox Auspher? Everytime I've seen Fox being brought you always have something negative to say about it lol.

EDIT: You could ask Auspher the same thing King of Murder.
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I just don't see why people are saying he should rise. He's fine where he is. Not to mention you have M2K saying things like "Fox counters MK 60:40".

He also has NO reason to be above Wolf on the list when Wolf not only has better MUs against the cast overall, but he has been doing better tournament-wise. Things have changed since the last tier list.

I see the flames approaching. Sweet.
 
Conviction

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Idk if he has better match-ups overall but I'm not gonna touch the MU subjects cause we, the Foxes, as a board, are too lazy to do anything...well finish any major project.
 
Kofu

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YagamiLight said:
He hits and dies like a bus full of fat people.

Am I missing something?
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Bowser's attacks are fairly fast and have good great range and good damage output. His Up-B in general is an excellent move, doing 16% fresh if all hits connect and allows him to escape a myriad of situations. Punishes shielding incredibly well, with an aerial grab that has insane range and does 18.9% fresh and a ground grab that allows him to chaingrab most of the cast, with a finisher that can tack on even more damage.

And frankly Bowser's attack power is often lacking, at least in comparison to other Super Heavyweights and Heavyweights like Donkey Kong, Snake, and Ganondorf.
 
uhmuzing

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MenoUnderwater said:
Impact just works sometimes.
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Yeah, I may have used a bit too much. It's pretty nice as a title though imo.

Auspher said:
Wolf is too low. Fox is too high. Zelda could move up a spot. Lucas is too low.
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Spelt said:
Fox is too low. Wolf is too high. Jigglypuff could move up a few spots. Lucas is too low.
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Just gonna say, I effing hate Wolf; he's my least favorite MU as Marth.
I don't see how he's a particularly good character though, or as good as Fox. Fox has a better recovery, a better kill move (with a good set-up), a better projectile, and better tools to skate around the things that make his and Wolf's bad MUs so bad.

In comparison to the characters closer to Wolf here, Sheik seems underrated to me. Ftilt itself clocks her in mid-tier, and she has a good damage output. Her aerials are pretty good and her gimping game is too, thanks to the chain. Her recovery isn't really that bad; the chain makes a good tether and for recovering from a (fair) distance, and her upB is pretty good at recovering from under the ledge.

And Sonic's raw ability to get in and get out does him good. Sure, I mean, nothing Sonic can do should be working, but in the face of human error, nobody capitalizes on mistakes than him.

Z'zgashi said:
game and watch is a little too high, sonic is too high, ike is too high, zelda is a little low, and lucas is way too high
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GW is still good imo, regardless of what everyone else seems to think. He has fantastic killing ability, good survivability, a tech chase, a great off-stage game, good juggling, bair, and a small frame. Granted, his MUs with MK and Marth (maybe Snake?) are really unfortuneate. But he shouldn't be dropping anymore; he's too broken in too many MUs.

Idk about Sonic. I had Sheik and Wolf above him for a while.
Zelda is trash. Her recovery is horrible (worst in the game? I wouldn't rule it out..), she dies easily, she's slow, has little ability to hit you, little ability to pressure or threaten you, etc. Jigglypuff can atleast hit-and-run with that air speed. Heck, she can atleast hit you.

Lucas..... I don't anything about this character. To me, he is the single most unappealing character; why do any of you even play him? Play Ganondorf or something, it's not like it'll matter much. :p

mariobrouser said:
I don't think Sonic is comparable to DK yet. The only reason DK is unviable is because D3. Sonic is about mid tier, but IDK next to DK. DK might just be too low.
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DK might just be a little low, yeah. It depends on how bad the MU is against an inexperienced. Sometimes I hear that the MU is so easy for Dedede that no practice is needed, and sometimes I hear differently.
Other wise though, DK's certainly a good character. He'd be like 8 or 9 spots higher w/out Dedede.
 
Blacknight99923

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I honestly don't think lucas should be any higher. Results consistently show he shouldn't move up, and while the tier list is opinion and not results without representation I cannot say lucas truthfully deserves a rise.
 
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