The Official BBR Tier List v4 -> Sonic's HA Stall is NOT beaten by spot dodge!!!!!!!!

[Goldenadept]

wolf is so cool that his gun has a knife on it that hits you before his projectile :3

 

[Justblaze647]

I though we established a long time ago that you know nothing about PT, and that you should stop posting about said character, Niddo...

When you were parading around talking about how bad of a character PT is, and you didn't even know the pokemon change order...

 

[Nidtendofreak]

I though we established a long time ago that you know nothing about PT, and that you should stop posting about said character, Niddo...

When you were parading around talking about how bad of a character PT is, and you didn't even know the pokemon change order...

I thought we established that I had referred to that incorrect idea from the beginning, and nobody corrected me for what, 6 months? Kinda makes other people look stupid as well, particularly PT mains. What, I get a fundamental thing wrong, and it takes you guys 6 months to figure that out?

There is also the fact I am indeed correct about Ivy. I don't exactly see overwhelming support for the idea Ivy is underrated. Quite the opposite actually.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

When you were parading around talking about how bad of a character PT is, and you didn't even know the pokemon change order...

Rofl this guy just lost all credibility he ever had xD

 

[Flayl]

Not knowing the change order means you've never played a 3 stock game as PT.

 

[Justblaze647]

I thought we established that I had referred to that incorrect idea from the beginning, and nobody corrected me for what, 6 months? Kinda makes other people look stupid as well, particularly PT mains. What, I get a fundamental thing wrong, and it takes you guys 6 months to figure that out?

So, let me get this straight. When you are wrong about something, one of the most basic fundamentals at that, it's up to the people who actually know what they're talking about to correct you, otherwise they are the stupid ones?

Your logic is undeniable.

 

[Purple]

So, let me get this straight. When you are wrong about something, one of the most basic fundamentals at that, it's up to the people who actually know what they're talking about to correct you, otherwise they are the stupid ones?

Your logic is undeniable.

This person is pretty cool.

 

[Nysyarc]

I though we established a long time ago that you know nothing about PT, and that you should stop posting about said character, Niddo...

When you were parading around talking about how bad of a character PT is, and you didn't even know the pokemon change order...

If you have actual refutations to his points, then let's hear then, otherwise you're just trolling and wasting everyone's time.

Rofl this guy just lost all credibility he ever had xD

Why exactly? Not knowing the order the Pokemon switch out (which he knows now anyways) has nothing to do with understanding each Pokemon's moveset, which is all that's being discussed here. Your post was useless and dumb.

So, let me get this straight. When you are wrong about something, one of the most basic fundamentals at that, it's up to the people who actually know what they're talking about to correct you, otherwise they are the stupid ones?

Your logic is undeniable.

Your debate skills are undeniable. You still have yet to refute anything Niddo has claimed about Ivysaur. He's right about everything he's said and you're just falling back on old mistakes he made in a lame attempt to make everyone think he's wrong. If you disagree with me, let's see some evidence instead of silly personal attacks.

This person is pretty cool.

No, you're just hiding behind his attacks because you also can't debate against Niddo. Again, feel free to prove Niddo and myself wrong, or you could continue flaming and getting nowhere.

 

[<π]

My last post was uncalled for. I'm just frustrated that people refuse to put effort into their mains and find out how to work with what they have available.

who cares if razor leaf is bad compared to whatever. Ivy doesn't have dins or Paralyzer. Razor leaf works great for slowing approaches at that mid range. use it for what its good for, dont expect it to be able to do something it can't. you gain nothing from these horrible comparisons except what can't be done.

 

[Ussi]

<3, you're making a statement that Ivy should be using what she has to her advantage. Which fine and dandy but in this thread its all about comparison.. cause a tier list shows where a character is comparatively to the rest.

Now you can compare Ivy's side B's annoyance to other forms of annoyance and well... there are plenty of other moves that are more annoying than Ivy's razor leaf due to how easy it is to PS razor leaf... The best mind game with razor leaf is changing the speed you throw it at but a little reaction time can stop it cold.

Looking just at a few low tier's annoying moves and just listing the most annoying move) :

Link: Zair
Zelda: Usmash
Samus: Zair

I don't think Ivysaur has anything to compete with those kinds of moves. And the higher up the list you go, the more "annoying" moves a character will have

 

[Z'zgashi]

Kirby's Up B isn't use as a projectile. It's an added bonus to his move, and isn't meant to be used to keep people back. It basically just adds range to the landing. That would be like calling Firebreaths a projectile: they aren't.

Game and watch can bucket that, so technically it must be a prjectile

 

[YagamiLight]

I would personally qualify Bullet Seed, a frame 4 move that is invincible from frames 1-4 (see: Dolphin Slash) and can cause 20% or more easily, to be one Ivysaur's most annoying move. It sort of makes you think before you rush in, as it punishes loose combo frames. Of course, if you bait it then it's a free Ike Fsmash, but that's just the main downside of the move.

Game and watch can bucket that, so technically it must be a prjectile

Did you know: Game and Watch can bucket Kirby's Chef (copied) move but not Game and Watch's chef? Is it a projectile or not?! We'll never know!

 

[Z'zgashi]

Well game n watch cant bucket ALL projectiles (Ex. Samus's missles, Ivy's leaf, Link & Tink's everything) but if he can bucket it, it's a projectile for sure

 

[Kofu]

He buckets disjointed energy moves, not projectiles.

He can bucket the far end of Lucario's Side B lol

 

[Z'zgashi]

Really? didnt know that... aw well I must be wrong then

 

[Kofu]

It's mostly just projectiles though, since you can't bucket stuff like Pika's Side Smash.

Bucket Guide
Might be a bit outdated, but I think it's mostly accurate.

 

[Steeler]

the problem with razor leaf is that it is too unsafe at mid range and there isn't much reward for the risk...it's not walling anything and smart players can avoid most of ivy's setups that involve the leaf.

it almost seems as if nidtendofreak has some kind of vendetta against PT, i'd ignore anything he says about the character...lol.

but yeah PT is low tier, people just aren't gay enough to realize it yet.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Nys said most of what I was going to say, but yes: not pointing out an obvious mistake makes you stupid. It means you didn't even fully read the argument, which apparently nobody did for 6 months. That would be like me not correcting somebody who comes in here and says "Ike's jab doesn't have much hitstun."

Now, actually prove me wrong and stop throwing in irrelevant arguments, or shut up and leave while admitting defeat. Either I'm correct about Ivy, or I'm not. Nothing about switch order here.

it almost seems as if nidtendofreak has some kind of vendetta against PT, i'd ignore anything he says about the character...lol.

Same as above. Prove me wrong. Enough with the "don't listen to that guy". Either I'm right, or I'm wrong. So far: nobody has proven me wrong, but I do see a few attempts to discredit me without touching my argument. I'd say I win.

Game and watch can bucket that, so technically it must be a prjectile

I believe Firebreath can also be bucket'd, and it's not a projectile. It's an energy based move, most of which are projectiles, but not always. ZSS's Dsmash can also be bucket'd, that's not a projectile.

 

[Steeler]

i don't even disagree with most of what you said lol. ivysaur isn't triforce bad though.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Folks, that was stupid when he said it, but he had PLENTY of time to research and get a better understanding of PT.


Unless he said anything else idiotic, lay off the guy, I'm sure he fixed that issue by now. If he says anything else idiotic, then roast him about that, don't just refer to previous issues, and use LOGIC.

 

[Purple]

I didn't even know Zelda was that bad to be honest. But then again it doesn't exactly get into how good a character can be, but how good they are in comparison to others around them. Meh.

Steeler, did you really think that those three characters were really that bad before the most recent tier list?

 

[Kitamerby]

I believe Firebreath can also be bucket'd, and it's not a projectile. It's an energy based move, most of which are projectiles, but not always. ZSS's Dsmash can also be bucket'd, that's not a projectile.

Fire Breath is a projectile no matter how you define it.

ZSS's Dsmash is a special case.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Imo zelda isnt THAT bad. Low tier for sure but not third worst. She actually has a few advantageous matchups and isnt as bad as link and ganon for sure

 

[YagamiLight]

Link is consistently underrated by the entire smash community.

He's not horrible, it's just that his learning curve is steep and the end result of that learning curve is a character that is probably upper low tier at best. Almost nobody wants to put that sort of effort into a character only to end up with a fairly mediocre result.

 

[Z'zgashi]

I like link, but no matter how hard you try he still has some insanely bad disadvantages

 

[Steeler]

Steeler, did you really think that those three characters were really that bad before the most recent tier list?

i don't think they are bad enough to be in their own tier but ivysaur isn't a bottom 3 character regardless.

 

[T-block]

Razor Leaf is bad in the same way many projectiles are bad... they don't really force approaches, and don't control space that well.

I think Ivysaur is underrated, but that's not saying much since I've seen people put Ivy as second worst in the game =\

 

[Nidtendofreak]

I think Ivysaur is underrated, but that's not saying much since I've seen people put Ivy as second worst in the game =\

See, not even I say that.

I say she's fourth worse. :D

 

[Chuee]

See, not even I say that.

I say she's fourth worse. :D

Such a big difference.

 

[demonictoonlink]

I'd say she's the absolute worst.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

y do people **** on Zelda so much?

 

[Chuee]

y do people **** on Zelda so much?

I think he's talking about Ivysaur.

 

[Browny]

I'd say she's the absolute worst.

I cant decide whether ivy or ganon is worse, but they both deserve their own bottom tier imo.

 

[T-block]

If I HAD to place Ivysaur individually (which I don't agree with at all btw... Ivysaur isn't forced to play every role that a "good character" needs to play), I'd go with between Yoshi and Mario, for what that's worth (I also think Jiggs should be higher ^^)

 

[stingers]

wow you greatly overestimate ivysaur. i dont think he's horrid but I would not put him above mario.

 

[#HBC | J]

idk about above Mario but maybe above Samus or CF for Ivy.

Also i'd agree Jiggs should move up a bit.

 

[vVv Rapture]

Does anyone think that Donkey Kong will move up at all or has the potential to move up in the future?

 

[stingers]

dk's have been doing better lately and there's no way that he's actually below rob on the tier list so probably :3

 

[Steeler]

mario is too low as it is...

 

[vVv Rapture]

dk's have been doing better lately and there's no way that he's actually below rob on the tier list so probably :3

Thank you, finally someone else thinks this.