Stuff About Puff

[KirbyKaze]

The only things you really have to worry about with Illusions is whether they go for the edgecancel off a platform or if they go for the edge sweetspot. It has a high amount of landing lag, so F-smashing it or doing a simple onstage punish isn't too difficult and can be brutal anyway.

 

[Mahone]

Ya, but i find that when they shorten the side b and i try to cover the edge from on stage, my attack misses because they aren't close enough and then they just do that magnet grab bs from a little bit away from the ledge

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Shortens are a really powerful sweet spot tool. The spacing generally leaves you safe from onstage attacks. I used to shorten when going for a regular edge sweetspots to remain safe to everything. I used to have 3 of the 5 shorten lengths down, but no longer

 

[Mahone]

Ya exactly, Sveet knows what I'm talking about

 

[genkaku]

In my case it's more of a mental game than RPS smash.
I bait stuff really hard and put on as much mental pressure with my spacing as I can. I'll move in and out of position at times just so that they're aware that I'm prepared to rest full illusions and then watch their spacing to anticipate and react. Half of the reason I'm in the middle is to force the other player to make a hasty decision. I pay attention to their recovery habits and based on the situation select the best choice. It's just like standardized tests, haha.
It doesn't work very well unless I'm making them nervous, which is most of what I aim to do when I play puff.

 

[idea]

mm okay, that makes enough sense.

wouldn't work on unknown though

 

[username12345678]

it hurts my soul. it does.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aU7G-A4D4nA

 

[idea]

dude, hungrybox, don't take young link to kongo when he's outcamping you =/

go fd or yoshi's imo

or even FoD, limit his platform choice somewhat...

maybe even pokemon. he's just too fast for jiggs on those platforms, that's the main thing i would want to get rid of if it were me. last time i think i said yoshi's was best but now i'm thinking FD. unless he banned it.

edit: [^ that was all typed up while i was halfway through the set by the way]

and speaking generally...one of the main problems you had was that when you decided to start approaching you completely stopped camping. and it'd be better to go somewhere inbetween. you just kinda switched from one extreme to another. looked like you were frustrated, though.

i think waffles had a point about one thing, too -- less bair. from the looks of it armada has specifically trained to counter your bairs fair looked nicer anyway. combo'd into itself better, i dunno.

for more theorycrafting...young link has a ****ty grab and at best mediocre shield pressure, so you should be shielding a lot. which would lead into more fairs anyway since you'd be facing him already most of the time in shield.

and people from my region keep saying you should upair more.

 

[erbanez]

Hungrybox winning by 1% was the first time EVER I've seen a game determined by that.

 

[Bamesy]

And it was hilariously awesome.^

Jiggs arpes YLink if played to beat YLink, but YLink is kind of wack. Play OPPOSITE to how you would against a good character and things will work. lol

 

[crush]

In my case it's more of a mental game than RPS smash.
I bait stuff really hard and put on as much mental pressure with my spacing as I can. I'll move in and out of position at times just so that they're aware that I'm prepared to rest full illusions and then watch their spacing to anticipate and react. Half of the reason I'm in the middle is to force the other player to make a hasty decision. I pay attention to their recovery habits and based on the situation select the best choice. It's just like standardized tests, haha.
It doesn't work very well unless I'm making them nervous, which is most of what I aim to do when I play puff.

you either have it or you dont, really

not everyone can be a master, and who you are depends on whether you are or are not not everyone

 

[Bamesy]

Who you are makes a huge difference in everything you do, it's extremely evident in smash. So do what you do best, and keep getting better at everything. You got this, your way!
Though to say that someone can't be a master isn't accurate.
Everyone can at everything, though that's a strange thought to most... it's also extremely evident to those who understand it.

 

[hungrybox]

Please, someone be my guest and try playing Armada's YL with Jiggs and see what it's like. At least on Dreamland.

 

[Tekk]

I will, at BEAST. =)

 

[Mahone]

good luck at BEAST tekk

also, should i look at the vid you posted or did idea already cover most of it?

 

[Tekk]

Yea, I'd like you too, just to have a different perspective on my playstyle. ^^

 

[Mahone]

Ok sure, I'll do that later today

 

[genkaku]

Rest OoS is scary to commit to. But it's pretty ****.
What's the earliest frame you can use it? I'm curious as to exactly what it can get away with if you get closer to frame perfect.

We need a puff player that can rest at any and every opportunity. Like Andale on steroids.

 

[SDC]

I was curious as to whether or not the Z button wears down more rapidly after steady, repetitive, continuous use than the A button. If I use Z for my ariels, will it wear down the Z button in a relatively short amount of time, thus rendering my controller useless sooner than if I had relied as heavily on a different button? How well does the Z button endure the continuous pressure placed upon it by a jiggz main?

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

the Z button is built differently than the A button. For some reason nintendo thought itd be cool to put a spring loaded button which served no purpose. Theoretically you could wear down this metal strip that causes the Z button to bounce back into place, but i've never noticed a change in it. Also, its not a necessary part of the button, you could just remove the "spring" if you don't mind the button flapping around.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Mahone I watched you vs Plank WS at Sypher's thing. You guessed more than conditioned and read in my opinion. Also you should have probably went in on his shield more(at least when he did it a lot....it won you a good stock in game 2 towards the end when you finally went in).

I would explain more but not in the mood.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Please, someone be my guest and try playing Armada's YL with Jiggs and see what it's like. At least on Dreamland.

why did you strike to dreamland though

 

[Ministry]

Please, someone be my guest and try playing Armada's YL with Jiggs and see what it's like. At least on Dreamland.

maybe u should get a sheik...

 

[strawhats]

Please, someone be my guest and try playing Armada's YL with Jiggs and see what it's like. At least on Dreamland.

Mango Land? mabe wit puff. seriously mango puff needs to come out. Also it may be riskier but perhaps it would be better fighting him on a smaller stage.

 

[genkaku]

what can puff do to catch up to the current meta-game? Is she even capable of breaking open or even with new ground?
I ask because it feels like the fox and falco boards are in near constant discussion about how to establish or trump innovations, wheras the puff boards are kinda' like "well, you should just play closer to the ideal puff we've already established."

 

[-ShadowPhoenix-]

that is because Puff and her moveset have a more simple approach to the game.

at least when compared to space animals.

 

[strawhats]

that is because Puff and her moveset have a more simple approach to the game.

at least when compared to space animals.

funny since mango's approach is more simple as he tries to play "too legit". He definitely, from what I heard from PP at least, didn't know how to handle laser/sheild pressure from falco with puff. Hence why pp thinks his puff is so old school.

I really wanna see those friendlies of pp vs mango (puff)

 

[SDC]

what can puff do to catch up to the current meta-game? Is she even capable of breaking open or even with new ground?
I ask because it feels like the fox and falco boards are in near constant discussion about how to establish or trump innovations, wheras the puff boards are kinda' like "well, you should just play closer to the ideal puff we've already established."

I'd be willing to bet that when the space animal communities speak of innovations, they're probably just attempting advancements in their tech skill, which as far as I know, are rarely useful in a match aside from just looking cool. Jigglypuff applies Occam's Razor to smash bros, which is something that the space animal communities, with their hilltops upon mountains of tech skill vids, just can't stand.

That and the modern jigglypuff metagame really only has 1 great influence: Hungrybox, whereas the space animal communities have many great players from which they can all derive influence. We just need more great players to main jiggz, but considering the numerous punitive social contingencies at work discouraging the use of jiggz, that probably won't happen very soon.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I'd be willing to bet that when the space animal communities speak of innovations, they're probably just attempting advancements in their tech skill, which as far as I know, are rarely useful in a match aside from just looking cool. Jigglypuff applies Occam's Razor to smash bros, which is something that the space animal communities, with their hilltops upon mountains of tech skill vids, just can't stand.

Not sure if serious, but definitely made me

 

[Mahone]

Mahone I watched you vs Plank WS at Sypher's thing. You guessed more than conditioned and read in my opinion. Also you should have probably went in on his shield more(at least when he did it a lot....it won you a good stock in game 2 towards the end when you finally went in).

I would explain more but not in the mood.

Ya i got serious johns for that tourney but its whatever.... i completely agree i was so pissed when i watched those matches because i'm so on autopilot its terrible.... like i nair nowhere close to him and then uptilt because I'm not even thinking about where he is or what he's doing lol

I felt like i was just spamming a ****load of attacks and i kept trying to tweak my uptilt timing to hit his roll oos but i could never get it so i should of just started to hard predict rolls or grab faster or something... ughh, even talking about this is making me sad...

I appreciate you watching the matches though... I wish I could of been playing like myself though

 

[Mahone]

Yea, I'd like you too, just to have a different perspective on my playstyle. ^^

First game you played fine aside from some obvious mistakes (like letting go of the edge when sheik was dead)... You just need to practice upair rest more since you seemed to miss a lot and it looked like it was just a timing thing.

Game 2 the main issue i saw was you are using fair too much... you aren't spacing it as well as your other aerials, but even if you did it's not that good until mabye high percent where the weak hit will combo into a strong hit, since when you were using it, a lot of times you get the weak hit and then get punished... or you don't weave it out properly and get punished.

Game 3, i feel like you use a lot of fsmashes, which are great when they hit, but it sorta looks like you are throwing them out hoping instead of reading something. Also upsmash is really bad against falcon, just take an uptilt or upair and you will be able to combo. At the end that rest is kinda weird.. you go for a lot of random rests and I think you hit them a decent amount but it just adds variance to your matches so its up to you whether you want that or not.

Game 4, grounded pounds are too risky, you do a good job the whole match.. at the end there i think a rollout or a charged dsmash (except mabye he could tech it idk) would have been better... but the ending was funny.

Game 5, you do really well, not much to critique.

In general you need to work on your reaction time, you crouch a lot of things but then don't punish. Your spacing is really good though, just work a little on full hop fair spacing and your pound spacing (stop doing them grounded lol). You have the same problem i have against falcon which is that you are just a little too slow... occasionally you shield after an lcancel or just don't move quickly after lcanceling an attack and that happens to me too... imo vs. falcon requires jiggs to be the most technical since you have to keep up with his speed. Also in the air you sort of float a little to long, when you get out of combos you do an upair usually which slows you down and in general your movement speed is just a little too slow. Rising upairs can be good but i think you use them in the wrong spots too much.

Sorry my critique is sorta lazy... i used to put a lot of time into these things and be a lot more helpful, but the same johns for why i played so bad last tournament are why this critique is sorta meh...

If you get matches recorded at Beast I'll try to be more helpful

 

[idea]

I'd be willing to bet that when the space animal communities speak of innovations, they're probably just attempting advancements in their tech skill, which as far as I know, are rarely useful in a match aside from just looking cool. Jigglypuff applies Occam's Razor to smash bros, which is something that the space animal communities, with their hilltops upon mountains of tech skill vids, just can't stand.

That and the modern jigglypuff metagame really only has 1 great influence: Hungrybox, whereas the space animal communities have many great players from which they can all derive influence. We just need more great players to main jiggz, but considering the numerous punitive social contingencies at work discouraging the use of jiggz, that probably won't happen very soon.

lol well that's unfairly judgmental of spacies mains

i feel like jiggs has lots of potential, there just aren't that many of us. i mean, besides darc and hbox, the rest of us are just trying to keep up with the other characters' metagames and better players. if i weren't struggling to get 5th or 6th at everything then maybe i'd have put more effort into coming up with cool things...

like hbox with his dairs. that's a great example, i've thought for a while that dair is underdeveloped with jiggs, but when i actually go to play good people i have to pay full attention to my spacing and stuff to even have a chance of taking a match...it's hard to do that while also being innovative, y'know?

darc is another good influence...or he would be, if he ever posted here or went to anything <_< what i learned from watching darc is that i should use upair more. you also told me to do bair more but i already knew that, i just feel like a **** using so much bair i use it more now than i used to anyway.

nair could use some work too. it's situational but good. other things jiggs mains don't do enough: dthrow.

 

[Tekk]

Thanks Mahone! You're already really helpful, don't worry.

I've got some nair and Dthrow tricks myself, I'll try to show them at BEAST. ^_^

 

[SDC]

Not sure if serious, but definitely made me

To be honest, that was serious. Some spacie mains are quite comical: these are people who main the cheapest and best characters in this game and who are simultaneously the loudest whiners about Jiggz being "cheap" and "gay", while their own characters are "cheapness" incarnate.
Space animals are cool and interesting characters and everything, but some of the people who use them can be quite obnoxious and snobbish.

Ok I'll stop ranting now lol. Glad you could derive humor from my irritation.

 

[ShroudedOne]

To be honest, that was serious. Some spacie mains are quite comical: these are people who main the cheapest and best characters in this game and who are simultaneously the loudest whiners about Jiggz being "cheap" and "gay", while their own characters are "cheapness" incarnate.
Space animals are cool and interesting characters and everything, but some of the people who use them can be quite obnoxious and snobbish.

Ok I'll stop ranting now lol. Glad you could derive humor from my irritation.

I completely agree. This attitude became rather evident during Genesis 2.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

To be honest, that was serious. Some spacie mains are quite comical: these are people who main the cheapest and best characters in this game and who are simultaneously the loudest whiners about Jiggz being "cheap" and "gay", while their own characters are "cheapness" incarnate.
Space animals are cool and interesting characters and everything, but some of the people who use them can be quite obnoxious and snobbish.

Ok I'll stop ranting now lol. Glad you could derive humor from my irritation.

I think everyone who johns about cheapness or gayness or anything like that has some serious attitude problems and wont be improving in that way any time soon

 

[Keblerelf]

Does anyone try to do this?

If falcon is recovering really high and up-b's, sometimes I mistime a bair. I've though about using fair, but hitting with the reverse hitbox so that it kind of pops him up when you hit him so that it can lead into a bair.

amipronow??

 

[idea]

reverse fair is best for edgeguarding, time it with ledge invincibility and it ***** everything...you can also apparently beat firefox with it even without invincibility. but its best use imo is to hit them from the edge in various ways.

lol if you feel like being super gimmicky, you can reverse fair onstage so that it hits fox (or anyone) and you land behind him, then grab. this really really doesn't actually work.

also yeah, it often does seem to combo into bair, so you could try doing that. i mean, you can kind of kill falcon with whatever you want at that point, so pick whatever is most comfortable for you. personally i just got more used to the bair timing...

 

[jiggelz]

i respect u in any way mangopuff, i want to be the best jiggly there is. do u think u can make some videos on youtube about training. my youtube account is JIGGFULLY (dumb name i know). plz, i want to be at least as good as all the other pros.

 

[V3ctorMan]

Help por favor??!?!?

idk, if anyone knows Yoshi, but played Hbox, at Genesis, yeah that's interesting...

Vman (Yoshi) vs Hbox (Puff) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFRjXRIvgTI&feature=channel_video_title

To those who've helped before, I appreciate it, but I've got a much better puff for everyone to help me with this time...

Btw, sorry for the quality.. , and random, mishaps, in the video..

Hope you all can help?.. ^^