Smash Back Room Weekly Character Discussions! FINAL UPDATES: Ness + Lucas. All done!!

[Pose]

pit =/= severly underplayed at all

At a competitive level, I would say so.

 

[ddizzeldexley]

how do u get mewtwo??

 

[Yinlong]

how do u get mewtwo??

ok, read this all carefully.
getting mewtwo is a very difficult process.
first, you must unlock everything on the board, BUT WITH NO HAMMERS
thats right, if u used a hammer already, ur screwed, delete ur file
now, you must be at EXACTLY 150 hours of group play combined (u can check this in brawl records). it MUST be EXACTLY 150 hours before going on to the next step.
now, you must beat 3 lvl 9 snakes with all the handicaps on their favor. and they have to be teamed up against you.
you must play as jigglypuff with the straw hat, however you must use the wiimote and you cannot use specials otherwise mewtwo will not be unlocked.
Hope this helps
you can't unlock mewtwo you dumb***

 

[Sir Bedevere]

So I didn't want to look through 6,000-something posts. ExCUUUUUUSE me, princess.

xD

I was only kidding (you could probably tell), obviously this thread is way too long for people to actually say "Sorry, that's been said before." unless it was said a page ago.

Someone probably said the same thing earlier on in the thread, and is lost under mountains of Yoshi/Ike/Lucario fanboy spam and "It's Mewtwo". The world will never know...

On a completely different note, I think Wildfire's got me convinced it's Shiek. She fits better into each of the hint's, er, hints than Pit, in most cases at least (not played much and not thought highly of, D3/Snake counter, good edgeguard, bad KO potential (well, unless you switch to Zelda >_>), stoppable recovery, gimmicky ATs), though I'll have to take Wild's word on the gimmicky ATs thing, since the Sheik boards are so cluttered and unmoderated I couldn't find a thing. Seriously, not even a Sheik guide. Maybe its hidden away on the Zelda boards...

On another somewhat personal and slightly related note, I've recently began playing Sheik (who I used to main in Melee, but stopped playing as her in Brawl due to nerfs) and she's really not as bad as I thought she was. Though, I have to switch Zelda if I ever want to get a kill (probably because I spam nair, and thus, lose a valuable KO move). But the main reason I like her is because she's just so dang fun to play as.

EDIT: LMAO, a mod must have seen my post or something, or it might be one big coincidence, but a whole bunch of Sheik threads (as in important threads, including a guide) just got stickied. There used to be only one sticky, and it was just some weird match-up chart (which was copy-pasted from the Zelda boards >_>). Guess I'll be able to check out those ATs after all...

Thank you, mysterious mod of the night.

 

[Semmick]

ok, read this all carefully.
getting mewtwo is a very difficult process.
first, you must unlock everything on the board, BUT WITH NO HAMMERS
thats right, if u used a hammer already, ur screwed, delete ur file
now, you must be at EXACTLY 150 hours of group play combined (u can check this in brawl records). it MUST be EXACTLY 150 hours before going on to the next step.
now, you must beat 3 lvl 9 snakes with all the handicaps on their favor. and they have to be teamed up against you.
you must play as jigglypuff with the straw hat, however you must use the wiimote and you cannot use specials otherwise mewtwo will not be unlocked.
Hope this helps
you can't unlock mewtwo you dumb***

lol im gonna try that!

 

[Ztarfish]

Sheik hands down.

 

[Kirby Redux]

Im gonna say Lucas or Olimar.

 

[cjrocker]

ok, read this all carefully.
getting mewtwo is a very difficult process.
first, you must unlock everything on the board, BUT WITH NO HAMMERS
thats right, if u used a hammer already, ur screwed, delete ur file
now, you must be at EXACTLY 150 hours of group play combined (u can check this in brawl records). it MUST be EXACTLY 150 hours before going on to the next step.
now, you must beat 3 lvl 9 snakes with all the handicaps on their favor. and they have to be teamed up against you.
you must play as jigglypuff with the straw hat, however you must use the wiimote and you cannot use specials otherwise mewtwo will not be unlocked.
Hope this helps
you can't unlock mewtwo you dumb***

I'd sig that if it wasnt too long.

 

[Timbers]

it is lolimar

 

[Everence]

edgeguarder? severely underrated and overlooked? i'd say its mario

 

[rambull]

i say olimar. sometimes hard to get a kill and he has one of the worst recoveries. he also is good at edgeguarding and is underrated. definately olimar.

 

[Zook]

Mario. That cape is nasty, and FLUDD can really screw a few characters over. Also underplayed.

 

[DanGR]

Where are the gimmicky ATs? All he's got is his whistle SA which isn't gimmicky, it's actually useful.

He's got a couple ATs that are sort of useful. CLC-chain ledge canceling can be useful. It's gimicky.
upb platform canceling might be mistaken for an AT.

i say olimar. sometimes hard to get a kill and he has one of the worst recoveries. he also is good at edgeguarding and is underrated. definately olimar.

He's easy to kill with. I bet the BR played with him for like a day and came to the conclusion that he can't kill well. >_> His edgeguarding is actually pretty good, but it's way too risky to use very often.

It's not him though. I'm telling you-it's sheik or yoshi.

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

YES I WAS RIGHT AGAIN, LUCARIO!!! WOOT SUPER LONG CORRECT STREAK.

OMGOMGOMG. THIS IS DEFINITELY YOSHI. YOSHI. DEFINITELY YOSHI. I AM SERIOUS. IF ITS NOT THEN ITS MIS LEADING XD.

come on, his recovery can be gimped (he can lose DJ easily if u time ur atk right and hit him without SA frames). he has impressive but gimmicky ATs (idk what gimmicky really means but i think it means like they're not that useful but can make the char look better/showyoffier). he sometimes does have trouble KOing occasionally. he CAN stand up to chars like D3 and Snake (CGs on Snake and can do a release grab CG combo to fair = auto KO on Snake). etc etc. he's underated and underplayed. it takes patience to become good with him.

It's Yoshi.

:D

 

[vorpal]

I actually think it's Yoshi too O_o

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

i dont see how a lot of u ppl r getting chars like Pit especially. Mario seems likely too but im sticking with Yoshi.

@ the yoshi guys

Don't some of you guys talk about yoshi being a hard character to gimp? (airdodge + 2ndjump)

Also, your matchup chart says Yoshi has a disadvantage against the fat penguin

Otherwise, it does seem to be Yoshi.

yes, Yoshi is hard to gimp, but the thing is, once u do, then he loses his DJ and will most likely fall to his doom (Up B doesnt get u too far).

if you know when to hit Yoshi, theres a couple times in his jump where he loses SA frames. when u hit him during some of these few frames, he loses his DJ. But it's not always easy to do it since u need to practice.


ya the chart (last time i saw) says yoshi has a disadvantage against DeDeDe, but he's gaining more things on him such as a CG. but it's a 6:4, DDD has the advantage. it's not a 7:3 which would show that DDD has a pretty big advantage.

edit: ok nvm i take that back, Pit has a likely chance of being the char. so either Yoshi or Pit.

 

[nightSN]

i say yoshi. AH HA! told you it was lucario (:

 

[pidgey14]

takes time to learn?
Very underused and underrated?
quite easy to gimp? (not really sure on that one about my prediction)
can fight characters like Snake and D3?
good ATs?

Sounds like Yoshi to me.

 

[Inuashakent]

Pit sounds to fit the description pretty well.

 

[Griffard]

21 is sonic. no lie, just count on it

 

[x After Dawn x]

Sheik fits a lot of that description except for the fact that she has good recovery.

 

[Timbers]

I don't fokkin understand the people saying /LuigiMario. They get like, infinited by DDD, y'know.

EDIT: I like the idea of Lucas. Everything seems to fit him quite well. I have no idea on his matchups though, so I might be wrong in the Snake/DDD matchups.

 

[stealthsushi]

Severely underplayed and underrated, this character can prove to be one of the more annoying characters to fight against.
Sheik, underplayed? Yes. Underrated? Yes. Annoying? Yes^100
With some interesting strategies that can possibly even counter characters like D3 and Snake, and an edgeguarding game that can destroy quite a few characters, people may be missing out by overlooking this character.
Sheik's best high tier character match-up is DDD since she can't be chain-grabbed and the F-Tilt makes for easy aerial setups due to DDD lacks some speed with the F-Air and N-Air. Snake matchup is pretty even and is definitely manageable if you use Zelda for the KO. Not to mention, Sheik's grab range is pretty good for the Cypher gimp.

Sheik's edgeguarding = very good and very flexible.
However, it may be that only those with patience will be able to handle this character well, as getting the KO can sometimes prove to be an arduous process.
If you're just talking about Sheik, yes, KO's are quite difficult to come by. If you use Zelda, you have an easy solution
And with a recovery that can be stopped quite easily, this character has a few holes that keep the character from being too powerful.
I wouldn't say that Sheik's recovery can be stopped easily. Its easily gimped, but not THAT easily stopped given her amazing 2nd jump height + speed, a recovery with invincibility frames, and the fastest tether in the game.
Although the character has impressive, yet gimmicky, ATs to add to the character's game, it seems that this character is overall quite solid but not quite outstanding.
Chain jacket epitomizes gimmicky. Its very neat to watch, amazingly difficult to incorporate into Sheik's game. There are just sooooo many better options out there.
Impressive AT's = DACUS and Vanish Gliding.

Enough good AT's and characteristics to make (solely) Sheik a good character, but not outstanding. She needs Zelda to be outstanding and awesomely fun character she is :D

I'll take a stab and say #21 is Sheik making the assumption that being able to transform into Zelda is omitted.

 

[petrie911]

Well, here's a case for Ness.

Ness is criminally underplayed and generally disregarded. However, Ness's PK Fire is quite useful against large characters like Snake and Dedede. He has a lot of ATs involving it, too, as well as a lot of ATs in general (see the Ness boards). The Pillar Spike absolutely owns any character with slow moving/predictable recoveries, and PK Flash screws over anyone that can't auto-sweetspot. His PKT2 is ridiculously easy to gimp, though, and the grab release crap just adds another hole to his game.

Seems like KOing isn't a problem for him, though, as PKT2 kills, though not reliable, happen more often than you'd think and kills very early, and bthrow, bair, and uair are potent killers.

 

[Rogue Pit]

My reason why i think it's Pit

Severely underplayed and underrated, this character can prove to be one of the more annoying characters to fight against.

Spam annoys everyone, most pit camp, and shoot arrows so much, Angel Rings can be quite annoying as well.

With some interesting strategies that can possibly even counter characters like D3 and Snake, and an edgeguarding game that can destroy quite a few characters, people may be missing out by overlooking this character.

While i doubt he's a counter for snake or D3 he can disarm traps by snake, and his edge game is really hard for snake to break. With multi hit attacks stop most D3 who try to step dodge and grab, Also because of Pit's ground traction its very hard for pit to get Chain Grabbed by D3. Though it is possible.

However, it may be that only those with patience will be able to handle this character well, as getting the KO can sometimes prove to be an arduous process.

It seems hard to get KOs with pit as he's not that strong after degraded moves. He only seems to have 4 Kill moves and 2 are very situational, Including Bair, Glide Attack, Dsmash, and Fsmash.

And with a recovery that can be stopped quite easily, this character has a few holes that keep the character from being too powerful.

Pit's UpB if hit offstage will kill him. As good pits don't get hit out of the recovery easily, it's basically a last resort but its our move evasive and dangerous phase. (Like the Avatar state :smile: )

Although the character has impressive, yet gimmicky, ATs to add to the character's game, it seems that this character is overall quite solid but not quite outstanding.

Impressive ATs such as Wing Dash, Arrow Loops, and Wing Refresh. Pit is a solid character with aerials, fast and semi strong.

Seems to me that #21 is Pit. But thats my opinion. Could be Yoshi, love that green Dino.

 

[Timbers]

Isn't Pit like top of C rank in Ankoku's character rankings?

I'm not sure if I'd warrant that as "severely underplayed and underrated."

 

[Mmac]

I'm not sure it's Pit though....

I'm actually not that sure who it is actually

 

[Dynamism?]

Random guess on Ness...

 

[Rawrness]

Luigi

10luigis

 

[FBM]

I'll take a stab and say #21 is Sheik making the assumption that being able to transform into Zelda is omitted.

Agreed. But as long as it's not my beloved ZSS (who can KO just fine and doesn't really have character-specific AT's), I don't really care who that is.

 

[gallax]

im gonna go out on the limb and say its Zamus.

 

[Izaw]

Either Pit or Shiek

10pits

 

[TheSMASHtyke]

EDIT: I like the idea of Lucas. Everything seems to fit him quite well. I have no idea on his match ups though, so I might be wrong in the Snake/DDD matchups.

Last time I checked, Lucas wasn't too hot vs snake.

The hint also mentions trouble getting kills. Lucas has absolutely no trouble with this. his F smash is fast and has a ton of knockback, his downsmash is powerful and really hard to spot dodge, he can edgeguard with PKT2 ....and his up smash is freaking amazing.

His recovery is also decent since his PKT2 is slower than nesses, allowing it to curve into lucas faster. He also has his rope snake if your in a pit or something.

Random guess on Ness...

He does fit the description well, but he has no trouble killing things either.

I honestly thought Yoshi when I first read the hint. For the love of god I hope it is him just to get yoshi out of the way -.-

EDIT: it just occured to me, what about peach?

 

[0RLY]

Pit or Yoshi.

 

[UltiMario]

Yea, I bet Pit.

 

[B!ggad]

It's finally Sheik ! (or Yoshi ... >.>)

 

[Tenki]

While i doubt he's a counter for snake or D3 he can disarm traps by snake, and his edge game is really hard for snake to break. With multi hit attacks stop most D3 who try to step dodge and grab, Also because of Pit's ground traction its very hard for pit to get Chain Grabbed by D3. Though it is possible.

Enlighten me more on Pit vs Snake/Dedede.

I think that Pit vs Snake thing might be enough, but arguing that it's "hard" to chaingrab Pit (that is, in the technical sense) is irrelevant. I can say it's hard to chaingrab Sonic because of spring, but with correct input buffering and/or good timing (in other words, with practice on Dedede's part, since you can't DI out of it), then it's inescapable.

 

[Crank]

Peaaaach

10char

 

[cj.Shark]

Dededes can chaingrab pit but if they miss the timing By only a few frames. Pit can WoI to wingpush out of dedede. same with sonic i believe but spring comes out quicker. either way vrs a pro dedede doesnt matter they wont miss.

 

[kupo15]

Pit does counter snake. The wingdash helps to space Pit from Snakes tilts and when you do that, you shut down 3/4th of snakes plan not to mention kill moves. He has a mirror shield that can reflect the nades as well as the WoI wind push. The AR traps snake when he uses his usmash while the reflected shell comes down to hit him. You can shoot an arrow or wingdash to blow up the dsmash safely. Every non multi hit move counters the cypher and with wing refresh, you can follow him out quickly to knock him off. A half charged arrow also knocks from the cypher killing snake if he decides to go really high. He is also easy to CG due to his weight and when he gets to the edge, grab release him.