Should Metaknight be Banned? ***Take 3***

[BOB SAGET]

And so it shall be. We shall ban metaknight because he is completely overpowered. We will answer the people's call. We shall also ban planking as there are characters that cannot fight against that. Now we shall also ban camping because pikachu's thundershock is too good and no one can seem to get by it. Next we can ban Snake because his land mines and C-4 are nearly invisible to the player on stages at night, therefore it gives snake an unfair advantage. So we can then go ahead and ban lucario and Pit because their roll dodgy and turtling tendencies also create an unfair advantage to the opponent. Next we'll ban bowserciding, kirbyciding, ganonciding, dededeciding, wariociding, and all other cides because its just not right. Lets go ahead and ban the ice climbers because of their infinites as well. Lets also ban Delfino's plaza because if you land in the water, you're likely to get spiked to death and there's also walk off sections that Dedede can infinite you off of. Yohsi's island should be banned too because the ghost platform can randomly save characters, especially peach who can use her parasol to buy time for the next rising. That stage also has a platform in the center which is great for campy characters to hide under. Lets also ban Smashville because there is not enough platforms. Lets then ban Final D because the stage's ledges make it too easy to get caught under, resulting in a gimp, which is just not fair. We should also ban Battlefield, because there are so many platforms that olimar can hide under and use his OP smashes. We can ban chaingrabbing, too, just because racking up an instant 50% is unfair.

As a result, the only stage that can ever be played on is a create-a-stage stage, designed with a flatground, no final d like ledges, and no way to fly under the stage, with one platform centered in the middle, high above the stage preventing camping, but not so high that MK's upthrow would kill, but wait, he is banned. And the only chracter allowed is Mario, because he is an equal and fairly balanced character that is not hard or easy to learn and has decent moves.

If the sarcasm wasn't blatant enough, I went ahead and expanded on EVERYTHING else I hear people complaining about when it comes to Brawl. So back to the topic of whether or not MK should be banned...

Should not. I've seen him get owned. I've seen good players go at it with him and beat him. I've seen DK's Samuses, pikachu's, olimar's, snakes, lucario's, and a few other characters tear him up. IMO, your likelyhood of beating metaknight is based on two things %25 character selection, %75 player skill. While tiers are good to show you where characters lay compared to others, it should in no way be your bible to how you play. There are some beasty Captain Falcon's, Ikes and links out there. If I remember right, lucario was a mid tier chracter, and only now because so many people have started picking him up (and if you picked him up so you can run the clock out, shame on you) he is moving up to high tier.

So in short, pick the character you like, and get good with him. You have more then just character stats at your disposal. You have mindgames, turtling, camping, planking, and a lot more depending on who your character is. Samus is actually a good character to pick these days because not many people know a counterpick stage for her, nor do they recognize her playstyle well enough to fight her, similar to Olimar. If you have never faced an olimar, prepare to get destroyed.

And just for the record: I main Lucario, and I'm an agressive lucario at that. I chase after MK's who try to plank, and I spike them off the stage instead. He's beatable. Learn how he works, and more importantly, learn how your OPPONENT plays him so you can work around his strategies. That is all.

Don't let my post count fool you =D

i couldnt agree more. some people r sucks. the matchup chart isnt 100% correct anyway. just pick wat character u like and skill will lead u in victory's

 

[Plum]

This seems like the best solution to make Brawl a more fun and competitive game to me, it's just unfortunate that so many people dismiss the concept before giving it a chance.

I don't want to bring Brawl + into the argument but I will say that it is a **** shame when you see the amount of people who dismiss it as something which is doomed to fail and as a stupid idea.

Brawl + already has a tournament scene with pros like Chu and Boss, and now we're even seeing people like Ninjalink playing or at least giving it a shot. And loving it. The shear amount of viable characters is amazing. Yeah, there is still dominating characters, but the effort to make every character viable without destroying the importance of counterpicking and matchups is amazing.

I hate to be a Brawl + fanboy, but people do need to find a tournament who is hosting Brawl + as well, and give it a shot if you aren't willing to mod your Wii. There is very few nerfs to characters that didn't happen already because of the added hitstun (which removed most CG's for example) and outside of that it is really little buffs to the characters that need it.

/Brawl + rant

Can somebody genuinely explain to me what banning Meta Knight accomplishes? With a lack of condescension please.

The argument really can't be that he is broken; he isn't. That is a fact that he isn't broken, because the fact that other characters have tournament results automatically refutes that. Yes, Meta Knight holds more wins that any other character to the point where he is dominating the tournament scene, but he isn't broken. Other characters are playable, and players do win with them, and people like Anther or Ally win consistently. His moveset isn't broken either. Yeah it is **** good, but not broken. It isn't like you can never beat out any of his moves no matter what you do. It might be tough do deal with his specials, or his speed, but that doesn't make it broken. I really feel that people are using broken way too loosely as a substitute for difficult.

You can say that he over centralizes the metagame, but this is really just an over dramatic statement. Isn't the existence of Smashboards, and other sites like Allisbrawl evidence that he isn't? Maybe there are more Meta Knight players than any other character, but that isn't over centralizing. That is just evidence that he is a popular character to play as. Every character here has a growing metagame (well... there is Link... so maybe not every character >_>). Just because the best character in the game has a more developed metagame doesn't mean that the entirety of the game is over centralized around him.

The other argument becomes the diversity that would result when he is banned. How will banning him make anything change? Other top tiers easily shut down more characters than MK does. Look at DDD for example. DDD goes so far as to make characters unplayable. Without MK, these other top tiers who already see results and have been proven viable will be the ones winning the national tournaments. Without MK there will be more of these top tiers; that's going to limit low and mid tiers even more. DDD, Snake, G&W, Falco, Wario and other top tier characters shut down more characters than MK, and with more of these characters in the metagame won't it make life even harder for the lower tiers? These characters are already proven to win, so really the same characters are going to be winning; perhaps more often but it is the same characters none the less. To me, increased diversity doesn't mean that the other top tiers have more of a chance to win, it means that more characters than who we already see winning will be viable; that just won't happen. Maybe the low tiers can do well against one of the other top tiers, but can any of them claim that they can stand against all of the top tiers? They would lose eventually just the same as they do now, and see the same low tourney results as they do now.

So there is my views, and I don't want to hear why MK deserves to be banned. I understand the argument for him. I want to know what banning MK accomplishes. And please leave fun out of it... Fun is a reason to play the game, but can't be a reason to ban anything. Meta Knight may not be fun to play against, but he is beatable and it is just something you have to deal with.

 

[bigman40]

i couldnt agree more. some people r sucks. the matchup chart isnt 100% correct anyway. just pick wat character u like and skill will lead u in victory's

Too bad that skill for any other character means 1/8 of the amount of skill MK can produce to match every other character.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I feel that everyone is under the assumption that the SBR is never going to ban MK, and that its a waste to even talk about it.

I just feel that if that were true, a mod thats in the SBR wouldnt have been teh one to make this thread. So if SP or AZ or whoever made this thread (too lazy to go check) felt it necessary to make the thread, at least part of the SBR feels that it warrents some serious public discussion.

Ive said it once and Ill say it again, please dont assume the postions of the SBR or its members unless you are actually back there to see what is going on. Making random assumptions only makes people look stupid

In this case, I think it's pretty safe to assume because, as I mentioned before, a lot of higher ups have already voiced their opinions and if you compare the overall ranks and prestidge of the people who voted "no" and "not sure" as opposed to "yes", you can easily tell that this will have the same conclusion as the first two discussions. As I said in my last post, the main arguement that will be made in the end is that "it's too early to tell" and that "people should wait until *insert big tournament here* before the issue is brought up again." When the tournament finally does pass and it once again shows that Metaknight did OMGWTFBBQ good, the same statements will be made again and nothing will be accomplished aside from staying the course and allowing directors to ban Metaknight in their own tournaments if they want to (although this doesn't seem to happen too often out of fear of detering really good Metaknight players from participating thus driving down the appeal of said tournaments).

 

[Eddie G]

The "fun" you get from Brawl+ is so shallow that I can't see anyone getting competitive value out of it for a very long amount of time.

Brawl may be not fun to you, but Brawl+ is not a proper fix in competition. You should play a real fighter. There's plenty out there.

Meh, I have fun competitively with both Melee and Brawl. Brawl+ is just a refreshing side event to play with some friends who crave more offensive validity within the Brawl setting.

I wouldn't preach about what is "shallow" or what is "real", as that is all subjective to the individual player. Ah well, I'd rather not continue with this.

 

[JayBee]

why are people ODing on this banning domino theory? that's the most unrealistic event that could ever happen. it wont happen. its not totalitarian to ban ONE CHARACTER, and it doesn't make the game unplayable at all. you can't use meta. oh nos. you have over 30 characters to pick. and dont tell me these meta players dont play other characters, and that they'll have to do sooooo much work to get back in the mix. please. this ins't brawl plus, where every character can do something as disgusting and easy as meta can. it just isnt like that. i feel like people enjoy owning so much sometimes that they dont care what you think as long as they aren't messed with, and any attempts to counter argument are usually labeled with words like "johning"

so what if M2k calls most smashers...whatever. it makes perfect sence to me that he'd defend his character that he wins nearly every tourney he goes to with, while he doesnt realize that many people are under his influence and probably switching to meta simply because he is ****** with him.

yes, the matchups are not correct completely. the tier list isn't either by any measure. but some thing are true that we know.

 

[Zankoku]

I wouldn't preach about what is "shallow" or what is "real", as that is all subjective to the individual player. Ah well, I'd rather not continue with this.

Fair enough.

 

[|RK|]

*sigh* I never thought that I'd say this, but when it comes so that I don't need to use the Twilight Hack to play Brawl+, and that method is proven tried, tested, and safe, I think I'm going and play Brawl+. There's just too much arguments. Melee is better than Brawl, Brawl sucks, MK is broken... nobody wants to do anything about it, and our standard of pros is dropping. I mean, look at the new Smash Elitists. I'm sick of this whining. It just pisses me off. (Heh, Brawl+ is like Genosha. 100 points if you get the reference.)

EDIT: Wasn't there a smaller scale project for regular Brawl Tournament legal hacks? Just lower MK's priority or something, you bunch of whining babies.

 

[ShadowLink84]

*sigh* I never thought that I'd say this, but when it comes so that I don't need to use the Twilight Hack to play Brawl+, and that method is proven tried, tested, and safe, I think I'm going and play Brawl+.

There is no other method so far besides the TP hack.
Banner bomb isnt going to be released for some time let alone that the TP hack is very safe.
Everything has a small chance of bricking the wii.
There is no completely safe thing.

Once the TP hack is in, you can ensure that you can recover from a brick.

As for the reference I am guessing X-men

Edit: Its obvious you do not understand what MKs priority is, it is transcendant priority, meaning it acts like a laser. Let alone the issues concerning nerfing and buffing characters, especially when i feel the basic parts of gameplay for Brawl + aren't finished.

 

[Suspect]

*sigh* I never thought that I'd say this, but when it comes so that I don't need to use the Twilight Hack to play Brawl+, and that method is proven tried, tested, and safe, I think I'm going and play Brawl+. There's just too much arguments. Melee is better than Brawl, Brawl sucks, MK is broken... nobody wants to do anything about it, and our standard of pros is dropping. I mean, look at the new Smash Elitists. I'm sick of this whining. It just pisses me off. (Heh, Brawl+ is like Genosha. 100 points if you get the reference.)

EDIT: Wasn't there a smaller scale project for regular Brawl Tournament legal hacks? Just lower MK's priority or something, you bunch of whining babies.

Im trying to get the reference...but i cant

 

[Exceladon City]

The "fun" you get from Brawl+ is so shallow that I can't see anyone getting competitive value out of it for a very long amount of time.

Brawl may be not fun to you, but Brawl+ is not a proper fix in competition. You should play a real fighter. There's plenty out there.

People who say Brawl+ is a better Brawl are people who play Melee but have nobody else to play it with. Therefore, they find people who like Brawl and are like "Hey it's Brawl with COMBOS!!" To paraphrase Ankoku, if you want combos, play SF, MvC2, Guilty Gear or some other game that has a visible combo counter.

As for MK, why is this argument still going on? Chances are nobody is gonna be completely pleased with him being banned or him still being available for tournament use because he's "unfair". Just leave the MK be and get over it. Sheesh.

 

[popsofctown]

Let's start small. Can we ban the slippery slope argument? Because it's ridiculously stupid, and a total oversimplification and strawmanning of the proban side

 

[Fatmanonice]

*sigh* I never thought that I'd say this, but when it comes so that I don't need to use the Twilight Hack to play Brawl+, and that method is proven tried, tested, and safe, I think I'm going and play Brawl+. There's just too much arguments. Melee is better than Brawl, Brawl sucks, MK is broken... nobody wants to do anything about it, and our standard of pros is dropping. I mean, look at the new Smash Elitists. I'm sick of this whining. It just pisses me off. (Heh, Brawl+ is like Genosha. 100 points if you get the reference.)

EDIT: Wasn't there a smaller scale project for regular Brawl Tournament legal hacks? Just lower MK's priority or something, you bunch of whining babies.

Brawl+ is becoming increasing appealing to me as well because a much larger percentage of the cast actually looks viable but I do have some concerns because some characters, like Olimar and Fox, seem to make regular Brawl's Metaknight look like Captain Falcon. Also, I'm glad that there's another person out there who has also raised an eyebrow to some of the people who have become Smash Elitists and MODs as of late. Are we lowering the standards to save face for the Brawl community as a whole? I certainly hope not but I have been wondering lately...

 

[PCyph]

I'm maining metaknight nao you guiseee11!!!one!!!11!!!!.......



seriously thought, I'm considering it.

 

[Overswarm]

Let's start small. Can we ban the slippery slope argument? Because it's ridiculously stupid, and a total oversimplification and strawmanning of the proban side

Not to mention already disproven.

Name this character:

-has more tournament wins than any other character
-most of the top players in the country main him
-did well on all the starter stages
-had a variety of playstyles very early on and continues to grow






.....Snake.

In the first few months of the game.

Once the metagame focused around BEATING Snake, it changed a lot and we saw MK's dominance come up. Snake started being beaten by ROB, D3, and Metaknight primarily, while other characters started to go even.

Then MK came to the top, and the metagame focused around beating him.

Nothing happened, he just stayed on top and increased the gap.

 

[Kain6th]

I know this is silly talk, but what if Sakurai deliberately made MK the way he is so we wouldn't take SBB as seriously as other fighters? Maybe he just wants his game to remain a happy freindly party game that's supposed to remain fun. If anyone were to try and make it into something else i.e. competitive, MK is there to **** everyone and think otherwise.

Yeah it's stupid, then again I wouldn't put it past the guy to do that. I mean just look at how he had wifi designed.

And lets not forget about some of the stages too: Mushroomy Kingdom, Big Blue, Mario Bros, 75mm?
and of course the items. lol. well i'm just putting this out there. Probably nonsense though.

 

[|RK|]

There is no other method so far besides the TP hack.
Banner bomb isnt going to be released for some time let alone that the TP hack is very safe.
Everything has a small chance of bricking the wii.
There is no completely safe thing.

Once the TP hack is in, you can ensure that you can recover from a brick.

As for the reference I am guessing X-men

Edit: Its obvious you do not understand what MKs priority is, it is transcendant priority, meaning it acts like a laser. Let alone the issues concerning nerfing and buffing characters, especially when i feel the basic parts of gameplay for Brawl + aren't finished.

I heard that they were working on a way you wouldn't have to use TP for.

 

[Zankoku]

To paraphrase Ankoku, if you want combos, play SF, MvC2, Guilty Gear or some other game that has a visible combo counter.

MvC2 is also bad. I don't understand how it had a community for so long.

 

[JayBee]

i just feel like there is no desire to even TRY anything. people are too comfortable with the way things are, and only will admit anything unless some sort of "worst case" scenario that won't come, comes.

Not to mention already disproven.

Name this character:

-has more tournament wins than any other character
-most of the top players in the country main him
-did well on all the starter stages
-had a variety of playstyles very early on and continues to grow






.....Snake.

In the first few months of the game.

Once the metagame focused around BEATING Snake, it changed a lot and we saw MK's dominance come up. Snake started being beaten by ROB, D3, and Metaknight primarily, while other characters started to go even.

Then MK came to the top, and the metagame focused around beating him.

Nothing happened, he just stayed on top and increased the gap.

this. but naaaaaaaaaah. let's wait another 2 years. then maybe we'll do something. i remember when people were like " it's never gonna be a top ten of mostly metas, people will adapt and get bettuuuuur"

yeaaaaaaaah. that happened. it happens.

it'd be nice, but there won't be a change of that due to player evolution for a looong time, if ever..

 

[|RK|]

I know this is silly talk, but what if Sakurai deliberately made MK the way he is so we wouldn't take SBB as seriously as other fighters? Maybe he just wants his game to remain a happy freindly party game that's supposed to remain fun. If anyone were to try and make it into something else i.e. competitive, MK is there to **** everyone and think otherwise.

Yeah it's stupid, then again I wouldn't put it past the guy to do that. I mean just look at how he had wifi designed.

And lets not forget about some of the stages too: Mushroomy Kingdom, Big Blue, Mario Bros, 75mm?
and of course the items. lol. well i'm just putting this out there. Probably nonsense though.

Sakurai doesn't like playing to win himself. He removed techs and such for a reason. It's not crazy. At all. I mean, how do you make a character like MK on accident? Really, now? YOU make the properties of moves, YOU make the priority, YOU make the speed... It seems obvious that a glance at the source code would give you all knowledge about Brawl. They could have told that MK was the best from the beginning. Unless... there's a character that's better... that we don't know yet... as much people that say it isn't too early, they must admit, we still don't know what's in store for the future...

Someone who can easily counter MK...hmm...

Hey, what percent does MK's best kill move kill at?

 

[Plum]

People who say Brawl+ is a better Brawl are people who play Melee but have nobody else to play it with. Therefore, they find people who like Brawl and are like "Hey it's Brawl with COMBOS!!" To paraphrase Ankoku, if you want combos, play SF, MvC2, Guilty Gear or some other game that has a visible combo counter.

As for MK, why is this argument still going on? Chances are nobody is gonna be completely pleased with him being banned or him still being available for tournament use because he's "unfair". Just leave the MK be and get over it. Sheesh.

Oh god no...
We are not trying to replicate Melee at all. We are trying to balance out the options in the game to create a more competitive environment. Really it is about balancing an overly defensive game and creating a more diverse environment by buffing those characters who need it to become a more viable option.
Brawl + is for people who like Brawl and what it gives us, but feel like it was poorly implemented and a poorly tested game. It isn't about emulating Melee; it is about making a more balanced fighting game in terms of the options given and the characters available.

 

[Kain6th]

Also One more thing I wanted to add is this:

Let's say we did Ban MK permanently. If somewhere in the future, say 1-2 years time, there was a serious poll asking for the ban to be lifted and the vote's are overwhelming for him to come back, are we to just ignore it or do we lift the ban?

In other words are we putting our foot down, no questions asked, when we say permanently ban him?

 

[brinboy789]

Sakurai doesn't like playing to win himself. He removed techs and such for a reason. It's not crazy. At all. I mean, how do you make a character like MK on accident? Really, now? YOU make the properties of moves, YOU make the priority, YOU make the speed... It seems obvious that a glance at the source code would give you all knowledge about Brawl. They could have told that MK was the best from the beginning. Unless... there's a character that's better... that we don't know yet... as much people that say it isn't too early, they must admit, we still don't know what's in store for the future...

Someone who can easily counter MK...hmm...

Hey, what percent does MK's best kill move kill at?

his best kill move is fsmash, and it kills very late in middle of FD. somewherel ike 110-120. not sure of exact percent

 

[Fatmanonice]

I know this is silly talk, but what if Sakurai deliberately made MK the way he is so we wouldn't take SBB as seriously as other fighters? Maybe he just wants his game to remain a happy freindly party game that's supposed to remain fun. If anyone were to try and make it into something else i.e. competitive, MK is there to **** everyone and think otherwise.

Yeah it's stupid, then again I wouldn't put it past the guy to do that. I mean just look at how he had wifi designed.

And lets not forget about some of the stages too: Mushroomy Kingdom, Big Blue, Mario Bros, 75mm?
and of course the items. lol. well i'm just putting this out there. Probably nonsense though.

It's extremelly unlikely that he put that much thought into it and things like Metaknight being freakishly good were probably unintentional just like things like L canceling and wavedashing were in Melee. Truth be told, it is pretty easy to tell that Brawl was mostly built around the idea of 4 player matches with items on which may explain why Metaknight Final Smash is weaker than most but, again, there's really no way to prove it. All three Smash Bros games have been party games that were given enough options to allow the player to change things to their standards like how we in the competitive community do just that, try to make the games as competitive as possible. Despite popular belief, this personally keeps me from believing that Sakurai is biased to any of the two "camps" of gaming, "casual" or "hardcore" because the options allow for both to be realitively satisfied (or at least they hoped.)

 

[BOB SAGET]

sagat=MK
sagat is huge
MK is small
but they're both the best!

 

[Remzi]

I've said this before but I'll say it again:

If a decision HAD to be reached today, then MK should be banned. As it stands, he is broken and far too dominant, and that most likely won't change. Removing him from Brawl would make it so that rather than a top 8 full of one character at almost every tournament, we can have a variety of characters winning at high level play including Snake, D3, GW, Diddy, Falco, Marth, ROB, etc.

Luckily for us, a decision can wait. I understand that people want him out of the way asap so that they can have the best experience in tourneys as early as possible, but there is far more to gain than there is to lose in waiting. If we wait about 2 more seasons, it's possible that a counter will develop, or people will simply find it easier to deal with him and his rankings will fall. If this happens, MK will remain the best character in the game, but will probably be of Melee Marth status rather than being utterly broken. Again, after six or so months, NOTHING will probably change, and then it will be clear that removing this character is the right way to go, and we won't be just chopping off a perfectly legit character. But if we do wait, we can be sure. Better safe than sorry.

Needless to say, my vote was no.

 

[Exceladon City]

Oh god no...
We are not trying to replicate Melee at all. We are trying to balance out the options in the game to create a more competitive environment. Really it is about balancing an overly defensive game and creating a more diverse environment by buffing those characters who need it to become a more viable option.
Brawl + is for people who like Brawl and what it gives us, but feel like it was poorly implemented and a poorly tested game. It isn't about emulating Melee; it is about making a more balanced fighting game in terms of the options given and the characters available.

Funny thing. Brawl isn't a fighting game. It's a party game with a competitive nature.

@Ankoku: People love infinites and hearing Yipes! funny commentary.

 

[HiddenBowser]

Meh, I have fun competitively with both Melee and Brawl. Brawl+ is just a refreshing side event to play with some friends who crave more offensive validity within the Brawl setting.

I wouldn't preach about what is "shallow" or what is "real", as that is all subjective to the individual player. Ah well, I'd rather not continue with this.

Just a quick comment on brawl+ (and this is directed at you specifically, more at everyone who's talking/thinking about brawl+) :

Melee is good because you have a ton of different options before the hit. Basically you work and work to get that first hit, and then afterward, when you start to combo, the options for the most part stop or become greatly limited until the comboing stops.

Brawl is good because you have a ton of different options after the hit. It has limited approach options but that is made up for by the mass of options post hit and you need to work and think much harder about how to follow things up.

Brawl+ has limited approach options and then after you land a hit it's all about set combos. The game lacks the parts that make melee and brawl good and is basically just a better version of smash 64.

tl;dr: Melee has tons of options before the initial hit but a lack of options after; Brawl has a ton of options after the initial hit but a lack of options before; Brawl+ has a lack of options both before and after the initial hit.

Name this character:

-has more tournament wins than any other character
-most of the top players in the country main him
-did well on all the starter stages
-had a variety of playstyles very early on and continues to grow



.....Snake.

In the first few months of the game.

Once the metagame focused around BEATING Snake, it changed a lot and we saw MK's dominance come up. Snake started being beaten by ROB, D3, and Metaknight primarily, while other characters started to go even.

Then MK came to the top, and the metagame focused around beating him.

Nothing happened, he just stayed on top and increased the gap.

As much as I hate to agree with you this is what the trend is looking like. CoT4 had 4 MK's in top 8, and then Whobo had 7 MK's in top 8. I think we should give it until after Genesis to see if the trend holds or goes to 8 MK's in the top 8 and then make a more informed decision after that.

 

[BOB SAGET]

sagat=MK
some people consider sagat and MK cheap. MKs priority and sagats low tiger shots.

 

[Plum]

sagat=MK
some people consider sagat and MK cheap. MKs priority and sagats low tiger shots.

How about not spamming useless comments that don't help move the discussion here forward at all?

 

[x0obymaulerx]

meta is so cheap

meta knight along with many others in ssbb shouldnt have even been included in the roster
such useless characters like king dedede, ice climbers, sonic, ness, game and watch, rob, and def. meta knight.
meta knight requires no skill to use at all. he is amazingly fast and surprisingly strong for his speed. meta knight is def. a failed character when it comes to skill. all you have to do is spam "B" or "b over" the twister is constant move you can do and catch all players on the stage off gaurd. the b over move is seriously overpowered and has too good of launch behind it. this make meta knight a terrible character. kirby's whole line up existing in ssbb makes no **** sense. why boot great characters such as "roy" for terrible characters like the ones that were named before.

 

[BOB SAGET]

How about not spamming useless comments that don't help move the discussion here forward at all?

its not worthless. my point is sagat is soft banned in japan. the same might happen to MK because its basiclly the same scenario.

 

[Zankoku]

You're thinking of Akuma, not Sagat.
Unless you're talking about Old Sagat.

 

[Falconv1.0]

You're dreaming. How many people do you think already quit or converted to Brawl+ because of Metaknight? How many do you think are about to? What non-MK would quit from MK being banned. Find me one example other than yourself.

I will almost definitely quit if MK is banned.

 

[HiddenBowser]

its not worthless. my point is sagat is soft banned in japan. the same might happen to MK because its basiclly the same scenario.

This isn't Japan. Soft bans don't work for very long here.

 

[Shadow 111]

Not to mention already disproven.

Name this character:

-has more tournament wins than any other character
-most of the top players in the country main him
-did well on all the starter stages
-had a variety of playstyles very early on and continues to grow






.....Snake.

In the first few months of the game.

Once the metagame focused around BEATING Snake, it changed a lot and we saw MK's dominance come up. Snake started being beaten by ROB, D3, and Metaknight primarily, while other characters started to go even.

Then MK came to the top, and the metagame focused around beating him.

Nothing happened, he just stayed on top and increased the gap.

i don't understand this overswarm. is this thread actually going to be taken seriously?
a majority of the votes are yes, but i'd say that is because there are a lot of ppl voting that aren't very knowledgeable players. There are plenty of ppl who have posted in this thread saying "ban mk!!" but giving a stupid reason to support their choice.
is there a way to survey a bunch of knowledgeable players and actually take it seriously?

it's quite obvious that you guys aren't taking action on this yet... are you waiting for the results of Apex and Genesis? If so, that's fine.. but i think you guys see where this thread is leading, no where.... there have been many votes and it's clear what most of the players want. i think you should just close the thread now >_>.

 

[Falconv1.0]

Also, why is Bob Saget still posting, wasn't he banned.

 

[BOB SAGET]

You're thinking of Akuma, not Sagat.
Unless you're talking about Old Sagat.

ya its the old sagat. no i aint talking about akuma but its the same scenario aswell. it all depends if the people who run the tournaments allow MK or not. i dont enter real life tournaments, i enter online ones. i doubt the online ones wil have MK banned

 

[|RK|]

I will almost definitely quit if MK is banned.

You should go to Brawl+ if MK is banned. That's what I'll do. Or just split up and make an entirely new board and have REAL tournaments hosted. Oh, and ban people for being noobish or suggesting we ban MK sounds fun to me!

 

[BOB SAGET]

You should go to Brawl+ if MK is banned. That's what I'll do. Or just split up and make an entirely new board and have REAL tournaments hosted. Oh, and ban people for being noobish or suggesting we ban MK sounds fun to me!

that sounds very good. lets split up