NES n00b
Smash Master
Video one: while explaining the basics, scar will also randomly talk about Jigglypuff's brokeness .
Sorry couldn't resist
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Scar talks Lean Melee [2012YotF]
- Thread starter Scar
- Start date
TheManaLord
Smash Hero
Oh lawl.
Also, according to good logic, NES n00b is as good as Darkrain (same placing at tourny) which means he may or may not be the best falcon in the world. Good **** NES n00b we gotsta play. Go to that canadian genesis thing... or the real genesis.
NES n00b
Smash Master
According to inui logic, I am as good as darkrain and khepari is better than both of us. Uhh I will see if I can go to Gensis but it entirely depends on summer schedule for this year and if I think it is worth to go by myself....
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
Just a quick terminology question. Whats considered a chain throw.
Like if someone can grab twice nomatter the di but the third time they break out. is this a chain throw?
Also if they can always grab but only if they read or guess right is that still a chainthrow
Like if someone can grab twice nomatter the di but the third time they break out. is this a chain throw?
Also if they can always grab but only if they read or guess right is that still a chainthrow
DrewB008
Smash Lord
i dont think theres an example of a cg that people are unable to react to, thus needing to read anything. the only example i can think of would be due to the fact that the ice climbers dthrow dair cg is technically escapable, but its so hard to escape that its not worth reading the escape DI
i would consider an escapable cg a cg still, so long as on some DI it is inescapable
so falcon can cg marth when marth doesnt DI the dthrow for about 30%
its still not a good tactic, considering even if marth does nothing but rotate the stick as fast as he can he'll get out, but if you dthrow and see him move in the no DI trajectory, you know you can regrab
the twice guaranteed but getting out the third time, i dunno
i would consider an escapable cg a cg still, so long as on some DI it is inescapable
so falcon can cg marth when marth doesnt DI the dthrow for about 30%
its still not a good tactic, considering even if marth does nothing but rotate the stick as fast as he can he'll get out, but if you dthrow and see him move in the no DI trajectory, you know you can regrab
the twice guaranteed but getting out the third time, i dunno
metashinryu
Smash Ace
I TOLD U I HAVE DONE IT and bigD here comfirms it XD
you people are too biased in what can and cannot do falcon that you dont experiment with stupid things anymore,and if you do it ur gonna surprise in what you find...
you people are too biased in what can and cannot do falcon that you dont experiment with stupid things anymore,and if you do it ur gonna surprise in what you find...
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
Calm down!! I still experiment with dumb stuff all the time cuz its fun. I believe you are talking about dthrow chain grabs with falcon. on marth/floaties?
To be honest, if its a chain grab you would do it alot more. What you are talking about only happens with poor or inappropriate DI[not suer which situations happen with what percents].
Yes you would need to jc your grabs but after like 2 dthrows as marth I can DI up and away and fair if you go for a third. Not only is this enough time for me to regain control of myself from the throw, but its also enough time for me to attack as well.
This is not a chain throw that is in anyway inescapable or else players with closer to frame perfect timing would do this in combat all the time.
This would be represented on the character matchup making falcon higher on the tier list because of his ability to **** any floaty including the highest rated character, marth.
Trust me. One of the first things people experiment with is throws because its one of the easiest things to test. There is no skill required to DI you simple hold a direction, as throws cannont be SDIed. Every throw has been under extreme scrutiny against every characterr for every matchup, all DI and probably every percent.
We never said you can't do it. It's just not practical. Most good players willl see dthrow and DI out of it.
DrewB008
Smash Lord
yeah like i said, all they have to do is rotate the control stick, not even knowing what theyre doing, and theyll get out probably
so basically, dont do it, because it wont work. lvl 9's dont di throws ever, and lvl 1's dont di the first one then di in after that
so basically, dont do it, because it wont work. lvl 9's dont di throws ever, and lvl 1's dont di the first one then di in after that
TheManaLord
Smash Hero
Uhhh Shin I've done it too lol the fact is it will never work versus a person. I didn't deny you did it to a cpu. But a person will never get CG'd to 50% unless they don't know how to DI out of it (a noob).
EDIT: Yes, we needed four different posters in a row to shoot him down, good work team =)
EDIT: Yes, we needed four different posters in a row to shoot him down, good work team =)
Even noobs try to push away when you start doing stupid stuff like that to them.
______(INSERT STUFF SHOOTING METASHINRYU DOWN HERE)______
this the cf boards people, keep the combo going!
this the cf boards people, keep the combo going!
screw it i think his moral is down enough
FAAALLCONN PAUUUNCHHHH
FAAALLCONN PAUUUNCHHHH
Faithkeeper
Smash Lord
[Taunt after kill]
So while on the topic of grabs...
Is there a time of un-bufferable lag during the end of or slightly after the throw?
Too many times I'll grab, throw, press jump and have nothing happen. Is this just a timing issue I need to resolve, or is my controller broken or I'm not pressing it far enough or something along those lines? Thanks in advance.
So while on the topic of grabs...
Is there a time of un-bufferable lag during the end of or slightly after the throw?
Too many times I'll grab, throw, press jump and have nothing happen. Is this just a timing issue I need to resolve, or is my controller broken or I'm not pressing it far enough or something along those lines? Thanks in advance.
pockyD
Smash Legend
are you buffering jump with shield + c-stick up? because if so, then no, your attack lag is not "un-bufferable"
or what do you mean by buffered jump?
or what do you mean by buffered jump?
TheManaLord
Smash Hero
He probably doesn't mean it in the literal sense of buffering but rather just pushing the button.
If you use the real buffering system of melee (ctick input is example) as Pocky said, it should work because that has a buffer queue sort of (close as melee gets).
But otherwise there is some lag and you can't just hit the jump button during that period then jump afterward.
If you use the real buffering system of melee (ctick input is example) as Pocky said, it should work because that has a buffer queue sort of (close as melee gets).
But otherwise there is some lag and you can't just hit the jump button during that period then jump afterward.
metashinryu
Smash Ace
YOU DIDNT SHOT ME DOWN my mom kicked me of the computer XD
but anyways i will keep practicing the *chaingrabbing* unless you have an objection
and yeah is a timing issue, just learn to press the button/stick when u hear the smack of the throw
pockyD
Smash Legend
that's how you get into trouble
practice doing actual buffering at first (just hold shield and c-stick any direction, or even just shield) to see when you will be able to act after a throw ends (though I believe buffered actions out of throw will be on the second available frame, not the first)
and of course note that the timing varies by character weight for downthrow
metashinryu
Smash Ace
what did you mean when u said *that's how you get into trouble* ? i do it like that fine man
pockyD
Smash Legend
if you mean act as you hear the sound, you are clearly way too early
if you mean react to the sound then act, then that is a timing that varies from person to person based on their natural reaction time, and therefore if his reaction time is slower than yours (or if your reaction time is slower than the perfect window and his is equal to or faster than yours), he won't be acting optimally
learning the timings on your own is by far the best way to get accustomed to such things
if you mean react to the sound then act, then that is a timing that varies from person to person based on their natural reaction time, and therefore if his reaction time is slower than yours (or if your reaction time is slower than the perfect window and his is equal to or faster than yours), he won't be acting optimally
learning the timings on your own is by far the best way to get accustomed to such things
metashinryu
Smash Ace
i meant after you hear the sound as a reference to react man if you do it a the same time u hear it will still have the problem
pockyD
Smash Legend
. .
metashinryu
Smash Ace
what? im not right? look, im not ashamed or embarassed of talking about things i think cuz smashboards are for that, i say something wrong then u just tell me what was it, if i talk something stupid was my opinion so go to hell if you disagree, if you were right my bad.
Faithkeeper
Smash Lord
Thanks to all who replied. Themanalord was partially right, I'm just an idiot and didn't understand buffering. I have a better understanding now, please excuse my ignorance.
Anyway, so you are saying that you'd suggest using buffering to figure out the first (or second) available frame and then timing it accordingly?
Anyway, so you are saying that you'd suggest using buffering to figure out the first (or second) available frame and then timing it accordingly?
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
I agree that smashboards if for having fun, networking the community and learning to get better.
Only problem here is that you are confusing opinions and facts. Its a fact that with the proper DI theres no way in hell you can Cg someone to 50%.
Its your opinion that its a good idea to keep trying it.
my opinion is listen to the pros. Scar was the first one to say that didnt work and obviously his opinions and knowledge about the game are not 100% correct or valid but arent you here to learn from these people?
Edit: try to cg your mom to 50% and maybe she wont kick you off the cpu anymore lol
pockyD
Smash Legend
Yeah, just use buffering as a tool to find your actionable frames. I don't mean that you should always (or really ever) buffer a jump immediately after a throw in a game situation
metashinaeruyusyu, the point was i had already given my perspective on your viewpoint in the post immediately preceding yours, and yet you insisted on asking me 'what was wrong'. if you wanted my answer, you could have just read it before you posted
tubes
Smash Ace
but what about Shiek dittos!
metashinryu
Smash Ace
man that was mean XD
Milos
Smash Lord
ey bobby boo
i was listening to the final countdown so i thought boutchuuuuu
wassup sweetie
i was listening to the final countdown so i thought boutchuuuuu
wassup sweetie
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
the lol signifys a joke. but im sorry if u were offended. wasnt my intentions.
Scar
#HarveyDent
Mokumo
Smash Ace
scar, are you going to the next mass madness?
AND IS there any way to avoid that fox/falco uptilt when I'm trying to stomp them, or should I just use the mindgames and try something else?
edit: wait, I actually have a good question i think. When i play people that are good at this game (tournaments), the only consistent thing that I can really do against falco or fox is techchase with grabs. I almost always miss a dair, side b, or a knee, but I can always react fast enough for the grab. My question isn't how to techchase with a dair (I can figure that out), but when you miss a techchase, what can falcon do to keep the pressure on?
example: I dthrow -> run and stomp, predicting falco to tech away, but he teched inside/in place. Should I just flail a nair at him asap to keep him on his toes or should I go back to the drawing board (i.e. getting lasered and comboed until i sneak in a nair)?
AND IS there any way to avoid that fox/falco uptilt when I'm trying to stomp them, or should I just use the mindgames and try something else?
edit: wait, I actually have a good question i think. When i play people that are good at this game (tournaments), the only consistent thing that I can really do against falco or fox is techchase with grabs. I almost always miss a dair, side b, or a knee, but I can always react fast enough for the grab. My question isn't how to techchase with a dair (I can figure that out), but when you miss a techchase, what can falcon do to keep the pressure on?
example: I dthrow -> run and stomp, predicting falco to tech away, but he teched inside/in place. Should I just flail a nair at him asap to keep him on his toes or should I go back to the drawing board (i.e. getting lasered and comboed until i sneak in a nair)?
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
I was saying that you probably arent 100% but he should listen to what you had to say. Like its more of a nobodys perfect but in a falcon thread id give you the benefit of the doubt lol, especially about a secret chain grab lol
and ummm so if I were cooking an omelet to make me better at falcon, what should I put in it?
SuperMatt
Smash Champion
i actually also want someone good to answer this question
i would think you obviously should chase after them as soon as possible but without just jumping in gung-ho because you'll get outprioritized by a bair or something
Mokumo
Smash Ace
yeah or one of those up tilts UGGHH
It's just in that situation I only have as much time until I get lasered/hit again, which is as soon as i make a tiny mistake or strategic err. seriously, its like falcon has the disadvantage in this matchup even when he has the advantage.
Don't forget dashdancing. That's huge in melee and stupid in brawl. amazing things happen when you dashdance in conjunction with a wavedash. you can dodge stuff and move super fast.
Ayaz18
Smash Champion
pretty much ^^^
real question:
As falcon you run up to an upon and nair or stomp or do some aerial right on their shield, then you fast fall and l-cancel it. What do you do right after you've done this? Grab? When ken used marth he would dash through the cahracter and then back for a grab. I've tried dashing away and then dashing back. and are jabbing or immediately aeriel attacking again viable options?
Please someone good answer. Like scar.
As falcon you run up to an upon and nair or stomp or do some aerial right on their shield, then you fast fall and l-cancel it. What do you do right after you've done this? Grab? When ken used marth he would dash through the cahracter and then back for a grab. I've tried dashing away and then dashing back. and are jabbing or immediately aeriel attacking again viable options?
Please someone good answer. Like scar.