[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Fatmanonice]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that Fire Emblem has another game coming out too. Also, I keep hearing people say that Nintendo said something about a new Ice Climber game today; can anyone confirm this?

 

[DekuBoy]

WHAT? Oh my god Nintendo! What can't you do? The screens for Mario Kart and co are up and they look amazing!
LOOK AT THESE PICS! SSBDS will definetly come out, you mark my words.

http://gonintendo.com/viewstory.php?id=127063

Here you go!

 

[Pieman0920]

@Fatman: I head someone on G4 asked where a new IC game was to Reggie, and he ignored it completely.

 

[Shorts]

That was Amazing! I havent been this hyped since melee! Did anyone notice how nintendo basically just shut down Sony and Microsoft at e3? I mean no one had anything close to the 3ds.

Medusa looks legit, Villain rep sounds wonderful!

Those graphics are fantastic! I can now, honestly say SSBDS is possible!

 

[Fatmanonice]

@Fatman: I head someone on G4 asked where a new IC game was to Reggie, and he ignored it completely.

I would have probably done the same, to be honest. Considering how Nintendo has a new title in the works for all its major franchises except Smash Bros, asking for something else would be a bit of a d*** move at the moment.

 

[Starphoenix]

I'm excited to see the new Paper Mario for the 3DS!

Also, Ocarina of Time remake for 3DS

 

[ChronoBound]

Hmmmm.

Here is MY two cents based on the massive unveilings we have had today, and how it relates to character speculation for Smash 4.

It turns out that Project Sora has been unveiled (Sakurai originally said that he would not even unveil it until 2011). It turns out that it was Kid Icarus: Uprising. If Sakurai can finish the new Kid Icarus by the middle of next year, then he probably can start development of Smash 4 shortly after.

Donkey Kong:
I am extremely happy to see Donkey Kong get revived, and to have a talented developer behind it (Retro Studios). I am even MORE happy to hear that it is 2-D. However, it seems that neither Dixie Kong or K. Rool benefit from this announcement. It seems the game focuses around only DK and Diddy. Also, K. Rool and the Kremlings are nowhere, and it seems a new antagonist army has been made (the Tikis). Hmmm, Donkey Kong may be back, but I am not sure if it is going to give Donkey Kong a third character.

Kirby:
I am really ecstatic about Epic Yarn. Its looks to be the most visually beautiful Kirby game since Dream Land 3. Looks like Kirby has a blue sidekick in this one, however, he seems too similar to Kirby to warrant being playable. Regardless, Kirby is more than adequately represented with Meta Knight and Dedede.

Zelda:
I am intrigued that the next Zelda has a cell-shaded look. Does this mean that Toon Link will be called Young Link in Smash 4 (since normal Link is now cell-shaded too)? I guess Young Link never got cut. Also, it is interesting that Ocarina of Time is being ported to the 3DS.

Star Fox:
I like it that the only good Star Fox game (Star Fox 64) is getting remade. Let's hope it is not a mess like the remake of the only good Lufia game (Lufia II). This just shows that Sakurai was correct in choosing Wolf over Krystal.

Kid Icarus:
Looks like Sakurai's Project Sora was a new Kid Icarus game. Again, I am hyped. Considering that Sakurai played favorites in Brawl, does anyone think that Kid Icarus will get a second character in Smash 4? Mother only has three games, and it has two characters. Also, a lot of people seem to want a female newcomer (preferrably one they can drool over), so Palutena and Medusa seem to be decent choices considering they are both important characters and fit the visual quota for Smash's pervert community.

Paper Mario:
Paper Mario is now leading the back for the prospective Mario newcomers, and it looks like he may have a Chain Chomp sidekick in this one. The only other Mario characters that I can see for Smash 4 are Toad, Bowser Jr., and maybe Dr. Mario (if Sakurai decides to bring back all previous Smash characters).

 

[Starphoenix]

I agree with you Chrono completely. You pretty much sum up my thoughts as well.

Only thing I am curious about is how the design of the Zelda characters next time around are impacted by Skyward Sword and the Ocarina of Time remake. If we get two different interpretations of say Gannondorf, how will that play out? Logic would dictate that the console version would be the more likely, but OoT isn't considered the greatest game of all time for no reason (though that point is debatable).

Stage wise I think it is reasonable to believe we would see Bridge of Eldin return alongside a new Skyward Sword stage and a new Ocarina of Time stage (maybe Gannon's Castle).

 

[Pieman0920]

I don't think that the remake of OoT means that we're going to automatically get an OoT stage in the next Smash. The DS kicked off with a remake of Mario 64, but there were no new stages from that game in Brawl or anything. As it stands, I still think the stages will be a location from SS and the train from Spirit Tracks.

 

[Starphoenix]

I don't think that the remake of OoT means that we're going to automatically get an OoT stage in the next Smash. The DS kicked off with a remake of Mario 64, but there were no new stages from that game in Brawl or anything. As it stands, I still think the stages will be a location from SS and the train from Spirit Tracks.

Technically we did get a Super Mario 64 stage, Rainbow Cruise. But yes, I know what you mean. I realize it we do not automatically receive an OoT stage, but I do think it certainly gives us the option (as unlikely or likely). Given the profile of the game already, adding upon how many people are likely to purchase the game (either for the first time or to relive an old experience) it is something to think about.

 

[Arcadenik]

The fact Metal Gear Solid 3 is ported to the Nintendo 3DS instead of a brand-new Metal Gear Solid game for the 3DS, to me, hints that SSB4 might be announced within the next two years at least. Why?

Remember that the only reason why Snake got in Brawl was because Kojima begged Sakurai to add him but Sakurai had this rule where third-party characters must appear on Nintendo systems at least once and Kojima took advantage of that rule by simply remaking the PS1 game, Metal Gear Solid 1, for the Gamecube to ensure that Snake got in Brawl.

Well, now we got a new Metal Gear Solid game but it is only a port (or remake) of the PS2 game, Metal Gear Solid 3... could Kojima be working on ensuring Snake's place in SSB4? Remember, Sakurai is probably almost finished with his Project Sora game which is Kid Icarus: Uprising so he might move on to work on SSB4 soon...

 

[Big-Cat]

Donkey Kong:
I am extremely happy to see Donkey Kong get revived, and to have a talented developer behind it (Retro Studios). I am even MORE happy to hear that it is 2-D. However, it seems that neither Dixie Kong or K. Rool benefit from this announcement. It seems the game focuses around only DK and Diddy. Also, K. Rool and the Kremlings are nowhere, and it seems a new antagonist army has been made (the Tikis). Hmmm, Donkey Kong may be back, but I am not sure if it is going to give Donkey Kong a third character.

It's too early to tell really. K. Rool and Dixie may very show up. Dixie could easily come up as an unlockable as a form of fan service.

Zelda:
I am intrigued that the next Zelda has a cell-shaded look. Does this mean that Toon Link will be called Young Link in Smash 4 (since normal Link is now cell-shaded too)? I guess Young Link never got cut. Also, it is interesting that Ocarina of Time is being ported to the 3DS.

It's kind of like pseudo-cel-shading to me. It's almost like they went with Twilight Princess' artstyle and gave it a much more vibrant color palette, which we desperately need in a time where Real is Brown.

I don't think Young Link ever really got cut. I think they will still call WW Link (or the Links with that art style) Toon Link as Skyward Sword lends itself to more realistic measurements for its characters (Link's feet don't look like stubs).

Star Fox:
I like it that the only good Star Fox game (Star Fox 64) is getting remade. Let's hope it is not a mess like the remake of the only good Lufia game (Lufia II). This just shows that Sakurai was correct in choosing Wolf over Krystal.

The evidence seems to suggest that he didn't know about her anyway so he didn't choose him over Krystal.

@Arc
Metal Gear was on the NES years before SSB was even conceived. Besides, it was Kojima and Miyamoto talking together that led to The Twin Snakes on the GC. With that in mind, this means that half of the MGS series has bee on a Nintendo platform. Don't count on MGS4 anytime soon though.

I think in terms of OOT, we are going to get some stuff. At the bar minimum, it'll be music. I just hope it's not a medley this time because I want Saria's Song to be standalone.

 

[Arcadenik]

I really don't think it matters if Dixie Kong is or is not playable in Donkey Kong Country Returns because Sakurai was still going to add Dixie Kong in Brawl even though she hadn't been a major character since 1996/1997 (DKC3/DKL3) and the only reason why she was not in Brawl was due to technical problems since it looked pretty obvious that Sakurai originally planned for Diddy and Dixie to be a team a la DKC2 (a specific team combination that haven't been around since 1995/1996). Diddy's down B looks odd as if he is reaching his hand in the back and waiting for Dixie to tag-switch with him. Diddy's side B also looks odd as if he threw himself instead of having Dixie throw him like in DKC2.

Also, adult Link now has TWW's cel-shading!! But I doubt he will be replacing Toon Link. He could still be called Link and Toon Link could still be called Toon Link. Hell, Toon Link isn't even cel-shaded in Brawl so the "toon" part of his name must refer to his cartoony looks.... By the way, I am very happy with the visuals in Skyward Sword because it is a combination of TWW's cel-shaded graphics and TP's realistic models. Although I would very much love to see TWW's cel-shaded graphics and cartoony models in another home console game instead of seeing OOT's polygonal graphics and TWW's cartoony models on the DS games.

 

[ChronoBound]

The fact Metal Gear Solid 3 is ported to the Nintendo 3DS instead of a brand-new Metal Gear Solid game for the 3DS, to me, hints that SSB4 might be announced within the next two years at least. Why?

Remember that the only reason why Snake got in Brawl was because Kojima begged Sakurai to add him but Sakurai had this rule where third-party characters must appear on Nintendo systems at least once and Kojima took advantage of that rule by simply remaking the PS1 game, Metal Gear Solid 1, for the Gamecube to ensure that Snake got in Brawl.

Well, now we got a new Metal Gear Solid game but it is only a port (or remake) of the PS2 game, Metal Gear Solid 3... could Kojima be working on ensuring Snake's place in SSB4? Remember, Sakurai is probably almost finished with his Project Sora game which is Kid Icarus: Uprising so he might move on to work on SSB4 soon...

Yeah I think the arrival of the MGS3 port means that Snakle will probably return for Smash 4.

As to your later post about Link's new cell-shading, I said earlier that I can very well see Toon Link being called Young Link in Smash 4.

 

[Big-Cat]

He might not be as the two Links sport radically different art styles. If they both had the TSS artstyle, then I could see him being called Young Link.

 

[Arcadenik]

Named Young Link but looks like Toon Link? Fine with me. I don't really care what they name him as long as it is the chibi Link, you know, big head with cat eyes and small body with stubby limbs like how Link looks in TWW, PH, and ST.

Let's discuss stage ideas from all these announced games! I would love to see a stage based on Kirby's Epic Yarn... you know, like N64 Yoshi's Island and Melee Yoshi's Story but in Kirby's setting. I am also happy that Paper Mario 3DS's battle scene retains the stage from PMTTYD because that's what I really want as a Paper Mario stage (but I still don't think we need another Mario).

 

[Big-Cat]

I wonder if we'll get some new attacks for Pit in SSB4. Maybe his FSmash can become a projectile type attack.

 

[ChronoBound]

An update on Ocarina of Time 3DS:

Aparrently, Nintendo pulled down the screenshots from their official servers. Also, the title is not listed in their official list of upcoming titles. Perhaps Ocarina of Time DS was nothing but a tech demo. Its existence though is very peculiar. Hopefully, someone will ask one of the Nintendo higher-ups about it.

 

[Arcadenik]

Maybe... but if Palutena is added as a playable character, I think it is appropriate for Palutena to have Pit's old Final Smash and for Pit to get a new one from Kid Icarus: Uprising.

I hope that Ganondorf at least gets a new neutral B move from Zelda OOT 3D (you know, the lightning balls?). I don't even care if he is still a semi-clone of Captain Falcon, I just want him to have at least a different neutral B move. Oh, and Ganondorf does not need a sword because he never used swords in OOT and that's why he didn't use it in Melee. Personally, I always wanted Ganon over Ganondorf anyway, especially the ALTTP/FSA version.

And I think OOT 3D kinda cements Sheik's place in the franchise since she is only in OOT and OOT is the most popular Zelda game of all time and it has more ports than even the original Zelda. Because of OOT's popularity and marketability, Sheik gets overexposure by association, you know. Sheik is pretty much a shoe-in for SSB4 now.

 

[Starphoenix]

Don't worry Chronobound, it is official now.

 

[Big-Cat]

As I've said in the past, not only is Sheik a popular character in her own right, but she was a starting character in Melee. I think that guarantees a return.

Anyway, just give Ganondorf two movesets, swappable with up taunt and make his weapon either a trident or double swords like in Wind Waker.

 

[ChronoBound]

I see. That is good to hear that Ocarina of Time 3D has been confirmed.

 

[Arcadenik]

Kuma, I dislike the idea of giving Ganondorf two movesets just to please the conservatives (fans who want Ganondorf to be the same like in Melee/Brawl) and the liberals (fans who want Ganondorf to have a sword so he would be different from Captain Falcon). I rather see Ganondorf get a few moves here and there... you know, change him up little by little, decloning him little by little. It worked wonders for Luigi.

Also, I am concerned about the idea of a playable Palutena. I mean, since she was the one who practically gave Pit his moveset... wouldn't she be like a wingless clone of Pit? Sure, she could fight with her staff but the function of that staff could still be similar to Pit's bow... not to mention she even has her mirror shield, too.

Also, Eggplant Wizard for Assist Trophy. Medusa for Adventure Mode boss.

 

[Shorts]

Dixie still has a good chance, afterall wasnt Pit, and Lucas planned for Melee? It seems sakurai doesnt like giving up on a character idea. However the "forbidden seven" all probably wont get into ssb4. Hopefully Mewtwo does...

 

[ElPanandero]

So we get a remake of a great game...again...for a silly pseudo 3-D portable system. Woo >.>

Zelda Wii looks mas terrible'. The fact that it's going to be easier than Twilight Princess is a joke, maybe I'll do it with my eyes closed for a challenge >.>

Other than that though, I wouldn't be surprised if a large number of these titles fall through. They are going to abuse the undying fandom of Nintendo fans. I hope for all of your sakes these don't tank.

/Rant

Related question: Is the new Fire Emblem on the DS or 3DS?

 

[Arcadenik]

I think most of the Forbidden Seven were planned as last-minute clones for Brawl but thanks to Sonic, we didn't get them. I don't think we will see any of them except for maybe Dixie Kong and Mewtwo in SSB4.

I don't think Dixie Kong needs a new game to be considered for SSB4 because she is already one of the key characters of the Donkey Kong franchise despite the fact her last major role was in 1996/1997.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Related question: Is the new Fire Emblem on the DS or 3DS?

It's for the DS but given the huge amount of hype that now surrounds the 3DS I wouldn't be surprized at all if they changed their mind and developed it for the 3DS instead.

 

[Shorts]

I think most of the Forbidden Seven were planned as last-minute clones for Brawl but thanks to Sonic, we didn't get them. I don't think we will see any of them except for maybe Dixie Kong and Mewtwo in SSB4.

I don't think Dixie Kong needs a new game to be considered for SSB4 because she is already one of the key characters of the Donkey Kong franchise despite the fact her last major role was in 1996/1997.

but you could say the exact same thing about King K Rool, the only difference is K Rool has been in more games. However he has only been playable in a few. Where Dixie is almost always playable. Although for a while it seemed Tiny was replacing her.

 

[ElPanandero]

That would be upsetting.

Fire Emblem and Pokemon are the only series I have any interest in anymore (and pikmin if I could use a controller with buttons >.>)

luckily, Pokemon is for the DS already (unless E3 butt-***** me there too)

 

[Arcadenik]

but you could say the exact same thing about King K Rool, the only difference is K Rool has been in more games. However he has only been playable in a few. Where Dixie is almost always playable. Although for a while it seemed Tiny was replacing her.

Yeah, good thing she wasn't replaced by her little sister.

Also, it is noteworthy to mention that almost all of the playable characters in Brawl have been playable in their native franchises before being playable in Smash. The only exceptions are Zelda (unless you want to count the CD-i games), Sheik, and Ganondorf. And this is why I think that playable characters usually take priority over unplayable characters in my hierarchy. The more often a character is playable in their native franchise, the better their chances are, I believe.

 

[Shorts]

Yeah, good thing she wasn't replaced by her little sister.

Also, it is noteworthy to mention that almost all of the playable characters in Brawl have been playable in their native franchises before being playable in Smash. The only exceptions are Zelda (unless you want to count the CD-i games), Sheik, and Ganondorf. And this is why I think that playable characters usually take priority over unplayable characters in my hierarchy. The more often a character is playable in their native franchise, the better their chances are, I believe.

By Native franchise, do you consider DK barrel blast a native franchise? What about Mario Sluggers. Thats two of the only games K Rool has ever been playable in. I still think he has some chance, i mean even if Bowser wasnt Playable In Super Mario RPG Im sure he would have been playable in SSBM. Still, Donkey Kong getting either character is a victory.

Speaking of dead franchise revival, anything on Yoshi?

 

[Arcadenik]

I suppose so. Donkey Kong Barrel Blast is part of the Donkey Kong franchise. But the truth is, Dixie Kong has been playable in more games than King K. Rool has.

Dixie Kong has 13 playable roles:
- Donkey Kong Country 2
- Donkey Kong Country 3
- Donkey Kong Land 2
- Donkey Kong Land 3
- DK: King of Swing
- DK: Jungle Climber
- Mario Superstar Baseball
- Mario Super Sluggers
- Donkey Konga 2
- Donkey Konga 3
- Mario Hoops 3-on-3
- Diddy Kong Racing DS
- Donkey Kong Barrel Blast

King K. Rool has 3 playable roles:
- DK: King of Swing
- Donkey Kong Barrel Blast
- Mario Super Sluggers

It seems to me that Dixie Kong is more popular than King K. Rool even though she is slightly less important than King K. Rool. So, what does that say about popularity vs. importance in relation to Smash? I mean, Dixie Kong was considered for Brawl before King K. Rool. Personally, I think being popular or important is irrelevant as long as the character is one of the faces of their native franchise (and being a playable character helps a lot).

 

[Shorts]

I suppose so. Donkey Kong Barrel Blast is part of the Donkey Kong franchise. But the truth is, Dixie Kong has been playable in more games than King K. Rool has.

Dixie Kong has 13 playable roles:
- Donkey Kong Country 2
- Donkey Kong Country 3
- Donkey Kong Land 2
- Donkey Kong Land 3
- DK: King of Swing
- DK: Jungle Climber
- Mario Superstar Baseball
- Mario Super Sluggers
- Donkey Konga 2
- Donkey Konga 3
- Mario Hoops 3-on-3
- Diddy Kong Racing DS
- Donkey Kong Barrel Blast

King K. Rool has 3 playable roles:
- DK: King of Swing
- Donkey Kong Barrel Blast
- Mario Super Sluggers

It seems to me that Dixie Kong is more popular than King K. Rool even though she is slightly less important than King K. Rool. So, what does that say about popularity vs. importance in relation to Smash? I mean, Dixie Kong was considered for Brawl before King K. Rool. Personally, I think being popular or important is irrelevant as long as the character is one of the faces of their native franchise (and being a playable character helps a lot).

True, when it comes down to it we all would rather have a character we love be in smash bros over a character thought to be "Important" and most of us wouldnt really mind if either got into Super Smash Bros 4. If neither gets in, hopefully K. Rool or Dixie makes it in as an AT.


*On a TERRIBLE side note, Waluigi is TIED with Bowser Jr. for most wanted Mario character. And Waluigi has been in the lead lately D: If popularity truely does reign supream we might be hearing a "WHAHAHAHAHA!" over the sound of a paintbrush!*

Edit: Also, Dixie is behind K. Rool in the poll. So maybe he is more popular? Time will tell as the poll gets more votes though.

 

[vVv Rapture]

Just because he isn't as playable doesn't mean he isn't as popular. He's a boss character. And I'd love to see him, to be honest, especially with some of his attributes from the boss battle from DK64.

Also, Ridley needs to be a playable character. He's too awesome not to be.

In general, however, I really hope that we do get a SSB4. I was hoping for a reveal at E3, but no. I heard of some rumor that a game entitled Super Smash Bros: Last Stand was going to be revealed, but alas, we didn't get any info on it, even if it exists at all.

 

[n88]

@Shortiecanbrawl

If it's at all helpful, I've had a poll going for some time now, and accumulated some results that you might find interesting. Check it out over here.

Also, here's to hoping for some of the win displayed at Nintendo's E3 to make it into SSB4. I'm kinda hopin' for a Smash 3DS myself.

 

[BBQTV]

@Shortiecanbrawl

If it's at all helpful, I've had a poll going for some time now, and accumulated some results that you might find interesting. Check it out over here.

Also, here's to hoping for some of the win displayed at Nintendo's E3 to make it into SSB4. I'm kinda hopin' for a Smash 3DS myself.

smash on a portable?

no just no

 

[vVv Rapture]

It's possible, now that the 3DS has a joypad. It's perfectly reasonable.

 

[Shorts]

@ Raptor
Im hoping to see SSB4 showcased next year, but you never really know.

@ n88
I'll check that out! In the mean time, care to vote on mine?

@BBQTV

Who knows, I personally dont like the idea, but a portable smash bros sounds alright. No more Boring car rides. So long as every character was in a DS game, like this roster i made:

http://simonisthebeast.deviantart.com/#/d2ru3w6

 

[augustoflores]

something ive been wondering... will we ever get a Football mario game? (not referring to soccer as football here, we are americans dammit!)

one last stand? isnt that a comedy show of smash?
closest thing we got to another smash right now is Super Smash Flash 2 (an upcoming flash game) and Super Smash Bros. Rumble (DS homebrew in development)

oh and, what no last story?

 

[Shorts]

something ive been wondering... will we ever get a Football mario game? (not referring to soccer as football here, we are americans dammit!)

one last stand? isnt that a comedy show of smash?
closest thing we got to another smash right now is Super Smash Flash 2 (an upcoming flash game) and Super Smash Bros. Rumble (DS homebrew in development)

oh and, what no last story?

SSBF2 destroys the homebrew And, No we havent had Mario Football, American football is only truely popular.....here....

Also, NO PIKMIN 3!