My Recovery tier list.

[PKNintendo]

Updated.

30 pages. Nice.

 

[mimic_king]

How are Jigglypuff and MK up there? Snake and Pit should be alongside ROB.

 

[Levitas]

are you saying to move MK down? Have you played brawl?

 

[Blackbelt]

Probably a stupid question, but how is Ganon lower than Olimar and Ivysaur?


Beyond that, I find this list very accurate.

Edit: Actually, another question: Sheik higher than Charizard? I really gotta question that.

 

[Chis]

Mine again...

Rank S
Metaknight
Rob
Jigglypuff


Rank A
Kirby
Sonic
Wario <- Him having his bike and a charged fart is to situational to be reliable
Game and Watch
Pit
Pikachu
Lucas



Rank B
King DDD
Luigi
Lucario
ZSS
Toon Link
Fox
Diddy Kong
Samus


Rank C
Snake<- Blow himself back up
Zelda
Ice Climbers
Princess Peach
Charizard
Sheik
Marth <-Marth can stall and stage spike
DK
Captain Falcon <-Stage spike and spike with raptor boost



Rank D
Mario <-Stall with the cape, stop projectiles with the cape and stop edge guarders with B
Yoshi
Squirtle
Falco
Wolf
Ness <- Stalling in the air while PKthudering, to gimpable
Ike

Rank E
Bowser
Link
Ivysaur
Olimar
Ganondorf <can't hamper edge guarders and gimpers unlike Link, Olimar and Ivysaur
Solo climber
Nolimar


One or two changes again, what do YOU think?

Stop flamming and more explaining!

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

I'd say Solo IC is worse than Oli... I mean he ain't that bad, and purple stagespikes if it is at the end.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Luigi and Lucario are too high, Zamus has a better recovery than both of them

 

[Chis]

Luigi and Lucario are too high, Zamus has a better recovery than both of them

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=jb-tq8PzaJo

And Luigi could still use his upB.

 

[mimic_king]

Here is mine:

Rank S
ROB
Snake
Pit

Rank A
Kirby
Sonic
Wario
Game and Watch
MK
Pikachu
Zelda


Rank B
King DDD
Luigi
Lucas
ZSS
Captain Falcon
Fox
Diddy Kong
Samus


Rank C
Jigglypuff
Lucario
Ice Climbers
Peach
Ivysaur
Sheik
Marth
Olimar



Rank D
Mario
Yoshi
Bowser
Falco
Wolf
Ness
Ike

Rank E
Toon Link
Link
Charizard
DK
Ganondorf
Solo climber
Solo olimar

 

[Darkest-Link]

heres a copy of your list with my comments on each

Rank S
Metaknight-Biased rank C, B at most
Rob
Jigglypuff



Rank A
Kirby
Wario-to much to relie on, charged fart and bike? ya right
Sonic
Game and Watch
Lucas-easy to gimp and takes so much stall
Pikachu-The recovery isnt close to being that good
Pit-Give the guy more credit than this.




Rank B
King DDD
Toon Link-not too bad, more like C tho
Luigi-C
Fox
ZSS
Lucario-C
Diddy Kong
Samus-E, cmon its worse than Links for crying out loud.



Rank C
Snake-B
Zelda
Princess Peach
Ice Climbers
Sheik
Charizard-D
Marth
DK




Rank D
Yoshi-E
Squirtle
Ness
Mario-E
Falco-how is this worse than foxes?
Captain Falcon
Wolf-how is this worse than foxes?
Ike-C




Rank E
Bowser
Link-wth this is better than Marios and Yoshis for sure, might be better than sheiks too
Ivysaur
Olimar
Ganondorf
Solo Climber
Solo Olimar

 

[Omis]

Darkest Link youre kidding right.
Metaknight in C rank is where I stop respecting opinions and just leave.

 

[Chis]

Darkest Link youre kidding right.
Metaknight in C rank is where I stop respecting opinions and just leave.

Lol. Both of those lists are BS.

 

[DanGR]

wait... I thought solo olimar was a joke. seriously?

 

[XienZo]

Falco's Firebird goes shorter and the illusion can't be used from below.
Wolf's recovery is super limited in direction, distance, and he can't grab the ledge unless he's right next to it.
Mario has cape and his ledge grab range is like... the size of his up-B >_<

Link falls too fast with an up-b that slowly goes sub-par distance with too much openings.

If you make a large custom stage, put blocks on a bottom corner, and hit MK off of it as far as possible, he's coming back. Even if you have 3 Snakes with Nikitas waiting.

Samus and TL are floaty enough to give them the distance.

 

[Frown]

heres a copy of your list with my comments on each

Rank S
Metaknight-Biased rank C, B at most LOL
Rob
Jigglypuff



Rank A
Kirby
Wario-to much to relie on, charged fart and bike? ya right
Sonic
Game and Watch
Lucas-easy to gimp and takes so much stall
Pikachu-The recovery isnt close to being that good
Pit-Give the guy more credit than this.




Rank B
King DDD
Toon Link-not too bad, more like C tho
Luigi-C
Fox
ZSS
Lucario-C
Diddy Kong
Samus-E, cmon its worse than Links for crying out loud. LOL



Rank C
Snake-B
Zelda
Princess Peach
Ice Climbers
Sheik
Charizard-D LOL
Marth
DK




Rank D
Yoshi-E LOL
Squirtle
Ness
Mario-E LOL
Falco-how is this worse than foxes?
Captain Falcon
Wolf-how is this worse than foxes?
Ike-C LOL




Rank E
Bowser
Link-wth this is better than Marios and Yoshis for sure, might be better than sheiks too LOL LOL LOL
Ivysaur
Olimar
Ganondorf
Solo Climber
Solo Olimar

Fail in red, lol in green.

 

[DemonicTrilogy]

Well, this is my opinion on recovery.

Rank S
Metaknight-No doubt about it
Rob
Jigglypuff



Rank A
Kirby- Should be below Wario. Has bad horizontal recovery even with all that Side B and forward aerial stuff. Can be easily knocked farther away since all his aerials are use purely to increase horizontal distancemaking him resort to Up-B which has horrible horizontal recovery. Wario can actually be free to focus on attacking the guarding while recovering in most cases.
Wario
Sonic
Game and Watch
Lucas
Pikachu
Pit




Rank B
King DDD
Toon Link
Luigi- Should be higher than Toon Link. Has Side B to increase Horizontal recovery and Down B for vertical. Fireballs and F-air break guards.
Fox
ZSS- Way too high. Can be easily edgehogged.
Lucario
Diddy Kong
Samus- Should be higher that ZSS. Can use a grapple, use bomb jump to stall in air and use bomb to go farther horizontally. Can use missiles to break a guard and has a damaging Up-B.



Rank C
Snake
Zelda
Princess Peach
Ice Climbers- How is their recovery worse than Toon Link's??? Has better horizontal and vertical recovery potential.
Sheik
Charizard
Marth- What??? Should be somewhere near Fox since Up-B is instantaneous and goes higher than Fox's recovery. Fox has worse air speed and the illusion recovery is situational. Marth can use Shieldbreaker to increase horizontal recovery.
DK




Rank D
Yoshi
Squirtle
Ness
Mario
Falco
Captain Falcon
Wolf
Ike




Rank E
Bowser- Should be below Link. Can't secure recovery with projectiles like Link. Has worse vertical recovery than Link.
Link
Ivysaur
Olimar
Ganondorf
Solo Climber
Solo Olimar

 

[PKNintendo]

Rank S
Metaknight
Rob
Jigglypuff


Rank A
Kirby
Sonic
Wario <- Him having his bike and a charged fart is to situational to be reliable
Game and Watch
Pit
Pikachu
Lucas



Rank B
King DDD
Luigi
Lucario
ZSS
Toon Link
Fox
Diddy Kong
Samus


Rank C
Snake<- Blow himself back up
Zelda
Ice Climbers
Princess Peach
Charizard
Sheik
Marth <-Marth can stall and stage spike
DK
Captain Falcon <-Stage spike and spike with raptor boost



Rank D
Mario <-Stall with the cape, stop projectiles with the cape and stop edge guarders with B
Yoshi
Squirtle
Falco
Wolf
Ness <- Stalling in the air while PKthudering, to gimpable
Ike

Rank E
Bowser
Link
Ivysaur
Olimar
Ganondorf <can't hamper edge guarders and gimpers unlike Link, Olimar and Ivysaur
Solo climber
Nolimar


One or two changes again, what do YOU think?

u Stop flamming and more explaining!

I think that you credit Mario a bit too much. Squirtle's air movement is EXTREMELY good. Having him below Mario is really wrong. Stalling with the cape cool, But squirtles nice aerials protect him in the air. His Forward B makes him Invulnerable to damage (seriously) and it gives him some horizontal distance. Ness below Wolf, and Falco is just sad. People keep forgetting about his double jumps distance.

I think you give Mario's recovery too much credit. It doesn't defeat Yoshi's (air movement, distance) or squirtles. It might edge out Ness' but thats it. Ness PKT stalls him for a short time. Reversing the PKT, or having a different direction is nice. I really hate Mario's constricted recovery distance.

I will change Marth's and C.F though.

 

[Kitamerby]

Marth being above Fox is pretty laughable. He's so easy to edgehog and stagespike that it isn't funny.

 

[PKNintendo]

Marth being above Fox is pretty laughable. He's so easy to edgehog and stagespike that it isn't funny.

Not above Fox of course. But, I'll move him up. Hey, what do you suggest?
For the OP, I mean.

 

[MysticKenji]

wait... I thought solo olimar was a joke. seriously?

Nolimar is a joke.
IDK where Sololimar came from.

Luigi and Lucario are too high, Zamus has a better recovery than both of them

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYsg3eozBaQ
2:18
Zamus needs (and didn't have) 2nd jump to make it back, Lucario/Weegee don't.

 

[Chis]

Marth being above Fox is pretty laughable. He's so easy to edgehog and stagespike that it isn't funny.

Marth can stall untill the edge hogger's invincible frames run out then he can UpB for a stage spike.

 

[Deidara~Tail~]

Peach should be in Rank B. While she lacks vertical recovery, she has amazing horizontal recovery (Forward B + Float).

I don't understand why King DDD is so high in Rank B. He falls more quickly than most fo the cast. His Up B is easily punishable.

 

[TeeVee]

LOL at Sololimar

 

[Yuna]

Marth can stall untill the edge hogger's invincible frames run out then he can UpB for a stage spike.

What the hell is he supposed to stall with? Who'd just hang on the ledge and get stagespiked by Marth's Up B anyway?

 

[Chis]

What the hell is he supposed to stall with? Who'd just hang on the ledge and get stagespiked by Marth's Up B anyway?

Exactly, that's why he's harder to edge guard then Fox.

Edit: I forgot about Fox's stalling abilities...

 

[Hive]

hmmm :/ I guess I'll give it one more try to argue samus' postion... I truly believe she is an A rank recovery.... and at least a bit underrated...

bomb jump- each of these is about equivalent to a second jump, and also doesn't take away her regular jump....
even without jumping the horizontal distance gained is really good. Its also a great way to stall off ledge until a better opportunity for approach arises....
screw attack- has ok horizonatal movement (which is taken care of by bombs)but pretty good vertical movement, its pretty much invincible coming up to the ledge. she can also offshoot the ledge and punish someone close by...
her tether- is one of the longest in the games.... and is a great fast way to recover...it comes out almost instantly... effectively ledgehogging anyone foolish enough to jump out after her with limited recovery...
ledgehogging- when samus is knocked horizontally from the ledge, and someone tries to ledgehog her she will have her pick of zairing them off, using missiles/charge shot, and/or screw attacking them off... all which are almost impossible to punish because of their range or invincibility.... if the need arises she can also aerial...
spiking- because she uses her bombs mainly for horizontal distance if someone comes out after her she can surprise or evade them by jumping over them or bomb jumping back... if she finds herself over an opponent her spike is definitely coming out... and its pretty viscious... even if she trades hits... its a stock for the opponent and more vertical for her recovery...
I've said it before but she can recover under the bottom of fd (2 bomb jumps, jump, screw attack).... and I've seen it used as an ingame strategy in levels battlefield or smashville where the stage bottome is higher... she can also decide to switch directions mid-way under and recover from the same ledge... in some cases she doesn't even need the second bomb jump to make it, but just the horizontal movement from a single bomb....

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Why is Fox so high? Is it due to decent jumps + ok recovery + Shine Stall?

I'm curious about Jigglypuffs placement. Could someone explain this to me please? Are her jumps better than Kirbys? Does his Up + B which gives him nice vertical height not make up for the fact that Jiggly has no proper Up + B?

 

[Yuna]

Exactly, that's why he's harder to edge guard then Fox.

Edit: I forgot about Fox's stalling abilities...

I repeat, what the hell does Marth use to stall in the air with?

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Marth can Side-B stall.

 

[Snail]

I repeat, what the hell does Marth use to stall in the air with?

SideB, once. <_<

 

[PKNintendo]

So except for a few kinks, the list is kinda solidified?

 

[wolfbrawl]

Wolf should be higher.

If you can master his recovery, you it would be around C rank not D

 

[Mmac]

Power went out, so I couldn't reply yesterday.

So you'll always DJA? Then why would I not always jump out, wait for it and chase you? So you'll time it differently and we're back at the fact that it's a mixup.

DJA = Double Jump Armour. I think you mean DJAD. Anyways, DJAD should be the most recommended recovery at times. He can also Attack out of it if the opponent lacks a solid air game, or coast to the ledge with Egg Tossing, or Cancel the Double Jump to the ledge with an Egg Toss. Most of the time though he doesn't even need to Double Jump. His Airspeed will get him back just fine and all he has to do is just Dodge the interceptions.

Bair. Or pick a character, any character who can chase Yoshi's DJA with an aerial. There are plenty.

First of all, Falco can't reach with Bair. Second of all, and again, how can you gimp him by knocking him towards the stage? Also please list all the characters you think that can intercept Yoshi from an airdodge.

Lag from DJA + 2 or so frames = Frames where you can be hit. And if you are, you're very badly off. If you hit Zelda out of her 2nd jump, well, Up B... into Up B... into Up B... into Up B. You either kill me outright or edgehog me, there's no other way to KO me unless I screw up a DI. Yoshi, whack him.

All this tells me is that Zelda has a much harder time recovering despite the fact She has a true UpB from this Pong effect scenario. It would be nice if you told me what the launch angle was. I'm just going to assume it's the more common 45 Degree Angle, Which Yoshi can recover just fine from, even without his Double Jump. In fact Yoshi can recover from any attack without Egg Support from any angle above 30.

No, because their Up Bs/2nd jumps are different.

Obviously, yet you are treating them like their completely worthless, and that Yoshi is completely screwed without his Double Jump. This is not at all true. Along with what I said above, Egg's add Horizontal Distance, while protecting from interceptions. Yoshi is unique because you need to treat his Double Jump like his UpB, and his UpB's like his Second Jumps.

Hello, my name is Pit, say hello to any number of my multi-hit and long-lasting aerials.

Except Pit has the same airspeed as Falco, and doesn't really improve in the Range Department

 

[Snail]

^ Mmac, this might be completely off-topic but why do you start random words with capital letters? O_o

 

[Yuna]

DJA = Double Jump Armour. I think you mean DJAD. Anyways, DJAD should be the most recommended recovery at times. He can also Attack out of it if the opponent lacks a solid air game, or coast to the ledge with Egg Tossing, or Cancel the Double Jump to the ledge with an Egg Toss. Most of the time though he doesn't even need to Double Jump. His Airspeed will get him back just fine and all he has to do is just Dodge the interceptions.

Did you know, there are characters with moves fast and lagless enough they can throw them out, have someone airdodge them and throw out a new move before the opponent can do anything to stop them? There are also moves with hitboxes that linger, like, say, Marth's Nair, in other words, moves which are hard to airdodge.

Did you know, there's the thing I mentioned several times called guessing game where I could jump out, predict when you'll airdodge and punish you for it? You act as if airdodging is a guaranteed escape every time.

First of all, Falco can't reach with Bair. Second of all, and again, how can you gimp him by knocking him towards the stage? Also please list all the characters you think that can intercept Yoshi from an airdodge.

Reverse Bair? Anyone with fast and lagless moves or moves with lingering hitboxes. Marth's Nair comes to mind. And Meta Knight.

All this tells me is that Zelda has a much harder time recovering despite the fact She has a true UpB from this Pong effect scenario.

Wait what? If you hit Yoshi and his 2nd jump is gone, he's very badly off, often dead meat. If you hit Zelda with her 2nd jump gone, well, there's still her Up B. And she can Up B as many times as she wants. You have to outright kill her or edgehog her.

Yoshi you can just whack lightly and watch as he falls into the abyss.

It would be nice if you told me what the launch angle was. I'm just going to assume it's the more common 45 Degree Angle, Which Yoshi can recover just fine from, even without his Double Jump.

Any angle and positioning where Yoshi cannot make it back through Egg Toss and air control alone.

Obviously, yet you are treating them like their completely worthless, and that Yoshi is completely screwed
without his Double Jump.

If he doesn't have his DJ and is slightly far away from the stage.

This is not at all true. Along with what I said above, Egg's add Horizontal Distance, while protecting from interceptions.

Or people could not always get hit by them. Maybe they have their own projectiles. Or they aerial the eggs and you through them. Yoshi's eggs are not the ultimate anti-edgeguard projectile.

Yoshi is unique because you need to treat his Double Jump like his UpB, and his UpB's like his Second Jumps.

That's an exaggeration if I've ever seen one (Up B = 2nd jumps).

Except Pit has the same airspeed as Falco, and doesn't really improve in the Range Department

So, are you going to magically DJAD halfway across the stage so I can't possibly reach you with my attacks?

 

[Yuna]

SideB, once. <_<

It's not a good stall. From the sound of it, I thought they meant something like Shine Stalling. Side B stalls you for only a short time and then you start falling and lose height. It's not like you can stall several times to mixup when you Up B.

 

[Snail]

It's not a good stall. From the sound of it, I thought they meant something like Shine Stalling. Side B stalls you for only a short time and then you start falling and lose height. It's not like you can stall several times to mixup when you Up B.

I know it's not a good stall, I was just pointing out. If you ask me it's kinda useless.

 

[Chis]

So except for a few kinks, the list is kinda solidified?

Yes it's getting better.

 

[Mmac]

Did you know, there are characters with moves fast and lagless enough they can throw them out, have someone airdodge them and throw out a new move before the opponent can do anything to stop them? There are also moves with hitboxes that linger, like, say, Marth's Nair, in other words, moves which are hard to airdodge.

It doesn't matter how lingering and lageless the move is. If you can't keep up, then it's pointless. at least Marth is plausible because he has a decent airspeed and Range, However even if you can keep up and wait the airdodge, all you can do is Bair, which again I stress, How can you gimp him with a Bair?!?

Did you know, there's the thing I mentioned several times called guessing game where I could jump out, predict when you'll airdodge and punish you for it? You act as if airdodging is a guaranteed escape every time.

It doesn't work because because they don't have the airspeed to chase, and the ones that do can't Intercept him normally. I know it's not 100% guaranteed , but you are again making it out that it's a Common and serious problem for Yoshi's, which again is not the case at all

Reverse Bair? Anyone with fast and lagless moves or moves with lingering hitboxes. Marth's Nair comes to mind. And Meta Knight.

It doesn't change the fact that Falco can't chase Yoshi from his Recovery. It doesn't matter if you jump backwards with it, you still can't reach

Wait what? If you hit Yoshi and his 2nd jump is gone, he's very badly off, often dead meat. If you hit Zelda with her 2nd jump gone, well, there's still her Up B. And she can Up B as many times as she wants. You have to outright kill her or edgehog her.

Yoshi you can just whack lightly and watch as he falls into the abyss.

It sounds like She's taking an heavy hit everytime she's being intercepted. I wouldn't be surprised that even if she survives, she would have taken well above 70% of damage.

Plus, I already explained how he can recover without his 2nd Jump, yet you seems to plainly ignore it altogether. And you REALLY think that a simple Jab will kill him? Isn't there something called, I don't know, a LEDGE?

Any angle and positioning where Yoshi cannot make it back through Egg Toss and air control alone.

The only attack that comes to mind that will put him into this position is G&W's Dsmash. Other than that, it's never regularly possible to happen

If he doesn't have his DJ and is slightly far away from the stage.

Slightly far away! Oh noes! Really though, I wouldn't be surprised if you haven't played a decent human Yoshi ever

Or people could not always get hit by them. Maybe they have their own projectiles. Or they aerial the eggs and you through them. Yoshi's eggs are not the ultimate anti-edgeguard projectile.

Yet, the Egg will usually be coming straight for him. the interceptor has to do some fancy work to avoid it without going into Airdodge and possibly blowing his attempt. Plus only people with swords can really intercept the eggs due to splash properties of the explosion. Even if you get through, you'll probably hit him upwards and overall helping him recover

That's an exaggeration if I've ever seen one (Up B = 2nd jumps).

Yet, it's the truth. Just take a look.

What do you think is Yoshi's primary way of recovering?
What do you think is Zelda's primary way of recovering?
What do you think is Marth's primary way of recovering?
What do you think is Bowser's primary way of recovering?
What do you think is Lucario's primary way of recovering?

It's not that exaggerating at all.

So, are you going to magically DJAD halfway across the stage so I can't possibly reach you with my attacks?

You really do underestimate the momentum of a DJAD.... Again, I wouldn't be surprised if you haven't played a Yoshi yet. I don't really expect Yoshi to be that popular in Sweden anyways....

 

[Crystanium]

I know it's not a good stall, I was just pointing out. If you ask me it's kinda useless.

What happened to Marth's Forward+B to launch him forward? I see Marth players do this a lot when recovering.

I still honestly fail to see why Pit is at the bottom of Rank A, Sonic being above him in recovery. And why isn't Kirby in Rank S, just below Jigglypuff? Both have six jumps, and Kirby can uses his Forward+B like Jigglypuff. It's not better, but that's why it would be just below Jigglypuff.