Exceladon City
Smash Hero
You have 1 of 2 options on how to fight Olimar.
1. Ask Nairo
2. Watch M2K vs Brood and do everything that M2K isn't doing right.
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Meta Knight Q&A Thread
- Thread starter Dojo
- Start date
You have 1 of 2 options on how to fight Olimar.
1. Ask Nairo
2. Watch M2K vs Brood and do everything that M2K isn't doing right.
Enzo
Smash Lord
Pick marth for wario and lrn2grtipfsmash
for olimar pick faLco and analyze what dehf did to brood in Apex GF
for olimar pick faLco and analyze what dehf did to brood in Apex GF
I'm pretty sure N-Air would have to outrange it, which isn't happening. D-Air would be possible, but you've have to have perfect timing in that.
Enzo
Smash Lord
ure chopper avatar is godlike
You don't have to; you're actually better off not doing so if you're not already well-acquainted with either character. I'm convinced Meta Knight fights Wario better than Marth, anyway; the same probably can't be said for Falco/Olimar, but Meta Knight has a decisive advantage in the matchup in the first place.
That's old news to me, but, thanks anyway, hah.
demonictoonlink
Smash Master
If Solo un-fatigueing Squirtle was a legal character I would main him instantly. Except for Marth. **** that.
Budget Player Cadet_
Smash Hero
Character ability ≠ player skill.say that when you stop losing to low tiers at least bro LMFAO
what the hell does this even meanCharacter ability ≠ player skill.
and he's right, MK plays nothing like squirtle. like, I think everyone should have at least a pocket MK but the way you worded that was pretty horrible
It works, if you kill the Pikmin with it before he reaches your hurtbox.
Also doesn´t work all the time, e.g. purples don´t die at the first hit.
MK vs. Wario ist pretty even, but I don´t think it´s easier with Marth.
Just get better at the MU.
As Reflex allready said, stay deffensive, retreating FAirs, Tilt, UAir beats him pretty badly.
Don´t get combod by him, Nair to Grab, UAir to UAir etc.
If you DI right, Nair to anything shouldn´t hit you, you could also jump out of the 2nd Nair hit.
If he uses DACUS a lot do get into you, DI the DACUS in, so you will get out before last hit + get in a good position.
Putting in some DTilts should also stop him from doing it.
I think that FTilt is also a pretty effective weapon against Wario, since the third slash hit´s in the air.
Orion*
Smash Researcher
the way you worded it made mk seem insta-winCharacter ability ≠ player skill.
and that hes like infinitely better than squirtle (and A tier character btw)
and also, i am a firm believer that past a certain level it is the player and not the character. lol
FEAR977
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Oct 10, 2010
- Messages
- 138
Not unless you are a tier *****.
FEAR977
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Oct 10, 2010
- Messages
- 138
On the japanese tier list, each pokemon is seperate. Squirtle, according to the list, is worse than ivy and charizard.
FEAR977
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Oct 10, 2010
- Messages
- 138
Gimp Olimar and wario, idk.
Player-4
See you in 25 years
Pit is also 4th best, what's your point?
Stop multiposting, that's what "edit" and "multiquote" are for >_>
Kaffei
Smash Hero
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2008
- Messages
- 7,048
I think it depends on the person. For example, perhaps an MK main has trouble fighting Falcos, and decides to use Pikachu as a counter.
Theoretically, MK doesn't need a counter, since all his match ups are either in his favor or even.
FEAR977
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Oct 10, 2010
- Messages
- 138
I was just saying that squirtle may not suck (trust me he doesn't) but he is worse than all the other pokemon.
And sorry for the multipost, I didn't know...
But Jigglypuff is terrible.
Player-4
See you in 25 years
...Do you really believe Squirtle is the worst out of the PT trio? I hope you're trolling...I was just saying that squirtle may not suck (trust me he doesn't) but he is worse than all the other pokemon.
And sorry for the multipost, I didn't know...
Player-4
See you in 25 years
I'm not trying to be harsh >_>
Just asking a question
Just asking a question
To be fair, with players of close to equal skill, there's only so much one can do with their limited amount of options. Some characters don't have a reliable ground poke; some characters have no aerial to prevent lots of juggling; some characters have a bad grab. As a result, characters with significantly more options than the rest of the cast (say, Meta Knight and Falco) have less trouble with being predictable than, say, Pokémon Trainer.
I feel like I have to make -all- the right moves and Meta Knight has to make many of the wrong ones in order for that matchup to work. He's just too good at what he does. "U-Air -> D-Air" edgeguarding is an absolute nightmare that requires simple reaction, rather than a read one has to work for.
I know Pokémon Trainer isn't exactly the top of viability, but such things screw over a lot of otherwise-viable characters.
Dojo
Smash Champion
That goes for less than half the cast imo though.
For top/high/some of mid I believe the human error part doesn't have to be as drastic.
For some characters I do agree that they have to make all the rights moves while the Metaknight or whatever makes many wrong moves from mu inexperience or whatever but I don't agree that it's to that extremity with alot of the characters higher on the food chain.
There is no such thing as perfect play that comes with human hands so it goes both ways in saying the person with the least significant mistakes and harder capitalization on opposing mistakes will win.
For top/high/some of mid I believe the human error part doesn't have to be as drastic.
For some characters I do agree that they have to make all the rights moves while the Metaknight or whatever makes many wrong moves from mu inexperience or whatever but I don't agree that it's to that extremity with alot of the characters higher on the food chain.
There is no such thing as perfect play that comes with human hands so it goes both ways in saying the person with the least significant mistakes and harder capitalization on opposing mistakes will win.
BigLøu
Smash Lord
Can anyone help me with the ditto?
What would you guys say are the best moves to use?
What would you guys say are the best moves to use?
Umm, all of MK's moves are good in the ditto for something or other haha. Can you please be more specific in what you're looking for?
theunabletable
Smash Lord
Ftilt is really good at a neutral position, and so is Dtilt, and recovering well is ESSENTIAL.
DC from a spacing that diagonally away from the stage is ridiculously safe as a recovery option. You can cover yourself with uairs, then DC towards the ledge, if they grab the ledge, you go past it and land on the stage, and if you space it right, you’ll auto-snap to the ledge.
And if they grab the ledge, they might be able to punish your landing, but as long as you’re not really high in percent, any punish they do will keep you on the stage, and give you an opportunity to get to the center of the stage for stage control.
If they stay low and below the stage so that they can shuttle loop you, you can either out-wait them until they have to get back to the ledge, and then DC from the spot I was telling you about, or you can simply just go high and tornado. If you space it right, it’ll beat out SL, and you’ll have crazy stage control.
Juggling is REALLY helpful in this matchup. You’re at a REALLY advantaged position when the opponent is in the air, and you’re on the ground.
When the opponent is on the ledge, you can pressure the HELL outta him. There’s a certain spacing where the opponent can’t really do much to you, in my experience. It’s kinda like… barely an Ftilt away from the ledge. You can charge Fsmashes, and it makes any option he tries to do to get back on the stage really risky. Along with using other attacks so that he just can’t really do much.
Ledge pressure is reaaaally helpful in this matchup. You can rack up a ****load of damage whenever the opponent is off stage.
And punishing people who recover badly is really helpful, too.
Grabs help a lot. They deal good damage, and give you a really good position. Dthrow is good in some scenarios, but don’t forget that Bthrow is really good, too. Generally Dthrow is used more, but at highish percents, I think Bthrow generally becomes better because it has higher growth, and pushes the opponent offstage more.
Like at low percents, if your Bthrow will put the opponent right next to the ledge, or off the stage, use Bthrow.
Imo your usage of throws is dependant on which one gives you the best position. Sometimes Dthrow is better, sometimes Bthrow is better. Generally I just use the one that I know will push the opponent towards the ledge/offstage more.
Like Xdeath said, like all of his moves are good in certain situations. But my general gameplan is:
Try and space at a neutral position, punish mistakes with grabs for stage control, pressure the opponent towards the ledge and limit his options by gaining stage control, recover well and mixup a lot on the ledge when I'm off stage/on the ledge, and when he's on the ledge pressure the hell out of him and get a lot of percent that way.
A good portion of my damage in the ditto when I play against most players is when they're on the ledge. It limits they're options really hard, and at high percents can force them to do something risky that allows me to safely throw out a kill move.
BigLøu
Smash Lord
This is exactly what I was looking for. This helps a lot thanks a bunch.
Shield breaker outranges our entire moveset but it isnt very practical for spacing or zoning
Orion*
Smash Researcher
ill correct myself and say good/viable characters lmao
i dont really consider PT to be viable.
demonictoonlink
Smash Master
It's actually very viable. It's not "safe" on shield, but it's extremely close to being safe. That, and you really don't want to be shielding it.
For that reason yes but its player dependant not MU dependant same with counter although there are MUs where they're both more viable
Can you guys tell me some of the little things that might not be known to a new player like myself?
For example, the pressing down and b while coming around from a SL makes it near lagless, or dtilt without crouching.
Also, how do you pivot fair, and does stutter stepping fsmash increase the actual hitbox range?
For example, the pressing down and b while coming around from a SL makes it near lagless, or dtilt without crouching.
Also, how do you pivot fair, and does stutter stepping fsmash increase the actual hitbox range?
demonictoonlink
Smash Master
For sure. I'd say MK is a MU where both moves should be used in moderation.
Most definitely agree. All of marth's specials are effective against tornado