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Matchups Chart & Lists - Updated: 29/Oct

TLMSheikant

TLMSheikant

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Toon Link boards changed the matchup for pikachu and kirby to 55:45 Toon Link. Changed the olimar matchup to 55:45 olimar too.
 
Rajam

Rajam

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Xonar said:
Except for not doing individual pokemon, it's fine.

cpt falcon 80/20
link 75/25

and that would conclude the list for falco, even though i think most falcos say sheik is 55/45 in her advantage.
Click to expand...
:o sorry i forgot to update them; i'll do it next time, though putting those ratios in the Falco thread previously would be better

Nidtendofreak said:
Ike boards have placed the Ike VS Pit match up ratio at 45-55

EDIT, wrong link, give me a moment.

EDIT2: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=238648

There
Click to expand...
phi1ny3 said:
Lucario boards have decided that the PT, Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Charizard MU are 55:45, 55:45, 65:35, and 55:45 respectively.
Click to expand...
TLMSheikant said:
Toon Link boards changed the matchup for pikachu and kirby to 55:45 Toon Link. Changed the olimar matchup to 55:45 olimar too.
Click to expand...
updated all :)

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OP updated:

18-Sep-2009: Ice Climbers 55 Marth; Link 25 Falco, 35 Kirby, Mr. Game & Watch, Pikachu, 40 Peach, Pit, 45 Ice Climbers, priority of threads changed; Lucario 55 Charizard, Pokémon Trainer, Squirtle, 65 Ivysaur; Lucas 35 Snake; Mario 45 Peach; Meta Knight 55 Ice Climbers; Toon Link 45 Olimar, 55 Kirby, Pikachu; Zero Suit Samus 50 Lucario, 60 Pokémon Trainer, 70 Ivysaur
 
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Yonder

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What happened to all of Luigi's matchup ratios?
 
S

Sasuke3759

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Can someone make sense of this for me?

Shouldn't the third chart be the true tier list?

The Street Fighter community rationalizes a tier in this way, and I want to know the reason the Smash community doesn't.

Does it have something to do with how well certain characters play on certain stages?
 
zeldspazz

zeldspazz

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Sasuke3759 said:
Can someone make sense of this for me?

Shouldn't the third chart be the true tier list?

The Street Fighter community rationalizes a tier in this way, and I want to know the reason the Smash community doesn't.

Does it have something to do with how well certain characters play on certain stages?
Click to expand...
Cus you factor in tourney results, moveset, and stages into the tier list as well. Smash is weird :p
 
phi1ny3

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Not to sound trollish, but SF community also thinks we should never be a competitive game, nor should it be played without items.
Just sayin'
:\
 
hadesblade

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Sasuke3759 said:
Can someone make sense of this for me?

Shouldn't the third chart be the true tier list?

The Street Fighter community rationalizes a tier in this way, and I want to know the reason the Smash community doesn't.

Does it have something to do with how well certain characters play on certain stages?
Click to expand...
IMO it should be like this, but some of these matchups are horribly outdated *looks at yoshi having an advantage on tl LOLWUT*. Anyway, not using this means that I get to keep my yoshi in low tiers...
 
'V'

'V'

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This game really is too broken... Too many factors to truly determine anything. It's still fun though... sometimes...
 
S

Sasuke3759

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zeldspazz said:
Cus you factor in tourney results, moveset, and stages into the tier list as well. Smash is weird :p
Click to expand...
Well moveset should obviously be factored in, and because of how important counter picking stages is, they should be too.

Say for example you have two characters; character x and character y. When just comparing their movesets, attributes, how easy it is for one to gimp another, etc. they come out at 50:50. But then character x has three very strong counter picks, and character y maybe doesn't have any that are that strong. The match up, imo, should be considered in character x's favor.

Tourney results shouldn't have anything to do with a tier. How well a skilled player plays a character shouldn't have an effect on a tier list. A tier list is just supposed to reflect match ups. I don't see the point in a tier list constructed this way, because it doesn't really tell a person a whole lot.

If a person wants tournament results, they can go look up tournament results. If a person wants match ups, they should go look up the match ups. One that tries to meld both into a single list just seems confusing and unnecessary. Especially when it is considered the "main" tier list.
phi1ny3 said:
Not to sound trollish, but SF community also thinks we should never be a competitive game, nor should it be played without items.
Just sayin'
:\
Click to expand...
To be fair, not all members of the SF community think that way. I would consider myself a member of the SF community first and foremost, but I love competitive Smash.

I'm not as good at it as I'd like to be, but I still like it. lol
 
Ochobobo

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lol Diddy boards say they have a 35/75 disadvantage against Ice Climbers, and IC boards say they have a 45/55 disadvantage against Diddy.

Looks like they're both pretty pessimistic there.
 
Nanaki

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Sasuke3759 said:
Well moveset should obviously be factored in, and because of how important counter picking stages is, they should be too.

Say for example you have two characters; character x and character y. When just comparing their movesets, attributes, how easy it is for one to gimp another, etc. they come out at 50:50. But then character x has three very strong counter picks, and character y maybe doesn't have any that are that strong. The match up, imo, should be considered in character x's favor.

Tourney results shouldn't have anything to do with a tier. How well a skilled player plays a character shouldn't have an effect on a tier list. A tier list is just supposed to reflect match ups. I don't see the point in a tier list constructed this way, because it doesn't really tell a person a whole lot.

If a person wants tournament results, they can go look up tournament results. If a person wants match ups, they should go look up the match ups. One that tries to meld both into a single list just seems confusing and unnecessary. Especially when it is considered the "main" tier list.
To be fair, not all members of the SF community think that way. I would consider myself a member of the SF community first and foremost, but I love competitive Smash.

I'm not as good at it as I'd like to be, but I still like it. lol
Click to expand...
tbh, matchups in Smash are much harder to analyze than matchups in SF.

A game with huge stage variation, death off the side, no health, and all other kinds of factors makes matchups hard to figure quickly.

Though once the game has progressed as far as it can go, matchups should be the main determining factor.
 
MysteriousSilver

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Counterpicks are so very important in Brawl.

Look at Oli. His counterpicks are absolute ****. Port town, etc.

I don't think stages even matter in SF? Dunno, not into that.
 
Supermodel From Paris

Supermodel From Paris

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A few ZSS corrections:

I have the ratio you have listed and then what it should be:

GaW 50:50 -> 65:35 (zss favor) wow this ratio is old and not right lol
Pikachu 50:50 -> 55:45 (zss favor)
Kirby 50:50 -> 65:35 (zss favor)
Peach 60:40 -> 50:50 (even)
Fox 70:30 -> 55:45 (zss favor)
Wolf 50:50 -> 45:55 (wolf favor)
Samus 65:35 -> 50:50 (even)
C Falcon no ratio listed, 65:35 (zss advantage)
Ike 70:30 -> 60:40 (zss favor)
Sheik 40:60 -> 45:55 (sheik favor)
 
Xyro77

Xyro77

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the 2nd link for the samus data is 100% old and outdated. could u delete it plz?

zs is 65 and samus is 35. ZS has the advantage in that fight.
 
Ray_Kalm

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A few changes in Ganon's match-ups.

Ganon:Fox - 25:75 Fox's favor.

Ganon:Kirby - 35:65 Kirby's favor.
 
#HBC | Red Ryu

#HBC | Red Ryu

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It looks like your using Kirin's Thread along with mine on Link's MU's.

What would you do if we had a conflict in ratios?
 
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Ughhhh, I don't think Luigi boards are gonna discuss matchups for a while, we seem to not believe in them and are lazy XD.
 
smashkng

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Can Wolf air camp Dedede? Wolf's air speed if very fast. Then it's very winnable in stages with plataforms. If so, a Blaster Shot combined with air camping can mean any lead of Wolf can mean a match. DDD's movement speed is awful.
 
Jdietz43

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I was about to try and post my own hideous version of this, glad you did already since mine is a piece of garbage in comparison. Lol.
 
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