~Marth's Match Ups~

[AndrewCarlson]

I understand the need to analyze every option in these match-ups, but I honestly feel that some of these match-ups are a bit generous towards other characters.

 

[Emblem Lord]

You are a shining beacon of hope in an otherwise barren landscape of mediocrity and conformity.

 

[∫unk]

Easywin against campy kirbies = tilt and jab. The only thing kirby tried to approach with was bair (kirby camping is pointless IMO lol). Jab and tilt him up to 50% and land a tipper. I agree with 70:30 or 65:35

No. That Kirby is way better than you. That Marth is way better than you. You haven't played a good Kirby.

The Kirby is camping with b-airs cause if he tried anything else he'd get *****.

50% Tipper doesn't kill Kirby unless they have terrible DI and/or got hit by the edge.

Most of the matchup is Marth doing a move then Kirby punishing it with ff b-air (because its his best aerial and is easy to keep himself safe if he misses aka spacing). DDD does the same thing.

Tilts aren't any different and actually are worse cause they're relatively laggy and you can't move to a safer spot unlike an aerial.

Kirby has multiple jumps so he can just bait you into doing a move that might seem like it will hit then punish.

That said if the Marth is patient he should win.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Marth wins this for a super simple reason.

Kirby has limited options.

He has Bair, F-smash, the occasional f-tilt, grabs and....................hmmmmm

Yeah.

 

[∫unk]

EL where have you been

 

[feardragon64]

^Having a life.

And you forgot utilt EL. ****in utilt. Sets up perfectly for a bair.

 

[_Kadaj_]

why is wolf 50:50?

 

[feardragon64]

why is wolf 50:50?

Woah what? Got distracted?
I disagree with that number as well...

 

[_Kadaj_]

Ye a

 

[feardragon64]

Ye a

Steel, why did you have to start that trend? -.-

 

[_Kadaj_]

I knew about that before

 

[Steel]

we discussed moving it to 50:50 a while back, the general consensus was ok but i was just too lazy to update it

 

[_Kadaj_]

:mushroom: Im bored

 

[AndrewCarlson]

we discussed moving it to 50:50 a while back, the general consensus was ok but i was just too lazy to update it

I thought we agreed on 55:45? I don't think Wolf is an even a match-up as R.O.B. The Wolf boards have their match-up listed as 55:45 Marth too.

 

[mikeHAZE]

What a boring match lol

And I usually don't say that

i'm sorry i don't live up to your expectations.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

You guys think too hard and too much.

And that's bad why/how?

 

[Odigo]

I'm having a lot of trouble against Diddy. I play a very defensive Marth so this matchup is hard for me because I can't let Diddy gain momentum with his nanerz, otherwise I just get *****, so I have to stay on the offensive.

Does anyone have any tips for a defensive Marth against Diddy?

 

[Emblem Lord]

Don't be defensive.

Done.

 

[VietGeek]

And that's bad why/how?

Keep things simple and to the point.

Concise.

 

[Steel]

And that's bad why/how?

 

[Steel]

don't juggle snake ITS A TRAP

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHIEv_n49LI

 

[Pr0phetic]

don't juggle snake ITS A TRAP

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHIEv_n49LI

I lol'd, what a fluke way for a Snake to win lmao.

 

[BacklashMarth]

I lol'd, what a fluke way for a Snake to win lmao.

Lol, sad thing is it happens....A LOT. C4 is a broken juggle bail-out.

 

[AvoiD]

Mm, stopped working on the summaries?

Well if you do get started, mind doing Sonic or Wario. One of the toughest imo.

<_<

 

[doom dragon 105]

How is Ike 40/60

At least 20/80

One of Ike's worst matchups imo

Marth can move circles around ike, marth's *** have a longer range, Ike's fair out ranges marths fair, but Marth's fair comes out alot quicker. Marth has range, some of Marths moves out range some of Ike's a perfectly spaced fair can out range Ike's nair which is arguable Ike's best approach. Marth shuts down Ike's offense and Can work around his defense

 

[Punishment Divine]

How is Ike 40/60

At least 20/80

One of Ike's worst matchups imo

Marth can move circles around ike, marth's *** have a longer range, Ike's fair out ranges marths fair, but Marth's fair comes out alot quicker. Marth has range, some of Marths moves out range some of Ike's a perfectly spaced fair can out range Ike's nair which is arguable Ike's best approach. Marth shuts down Ike's offense and Can work around his defense

Good Ikes don't get Turbo-gimped

 

[AndrewCarlson]

Ike also has the ability to punish extremely well.

 

[_Kadaj_]

lol 80-20???

 

[Shaya]

It's because Steel says Ike's jab is really really fast.

Even though I'm not convinced, I'm pretty sure Marth's dtilt to jab is much faster.

 

[_Kadaj_]

Cant you DS out of his jab?

 

[Shaya]

Cant you DS out of his jab?

Not a 'perfectly' normal one (from what I hear). The multiple jab tricks stuff however, yes.

 

[_Kadaj_]

wow lol thats not good

 

[Pr0phetic]

Steel told us to write summaries, and if they're knowledgable he'll post them up. I though Bengalsz was doing some but iunno.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Ike is not easy imo. Played a good one in tourney yesterday, barely lost, it's hard to get inside on his jab cancels and aerials. And he can kill you way easier, you have to hit him at least twice as much as he has to hit you to get into killing range, it sucks...

 

[Shaya]

Wrong Solid.

I don't think you realise how pretty much every move Marth has deals 12% or more damage and is amongst most of the fastest and longest ranged in this game.

Shieldbreaker 8/16/24%
Jab 4/6%
Dtilt 9/10%
Ftilt 10/12%
Utilt 10/12%
Fair 10/13%
Uair 10/12%
Bair 11/14%
Dair 12/14%
Nair 12%/15%/18%
Dolphin Slash 13%
Dancing Blade 13-21%
Dsmash 14/16%
Fsmash 14/20%
Upsmash 17-22%

Ike's moves, in comparison to most of their start up time/cool down time do less damage overall. Yeah Ike may be able to kill you at 50% (if he lands an fsmash), but you shouldn't be at 50% without Ike being well into his death zone; you're the faster character who can string a lot of his moves together too, many of our strings can deal from mid 20%s to early 40% damage, we have a wide variety of moves that can support this, Ike does not.

 

[∫unk]

ike can legitimately punish f-air that's why

and ppl with bad recoveries (like Marth but even more so Ike) need godly DI to be played well

 

[takeurlife2]

I was helping another marth with the pit matchup and i figured i would share the knowledge.

" Aight, so here's the gameplan vs pit
First off, walk towards him. He will undoubtedly start spamming away with arrows, so walk to make it easier to powershield each one. After you safely approach him, stay in his face with TIPPER fairs and dtilt(if you dont space it right it's easy to get shield grabbed.) Something I like to do is 0-31% combo with uair to usmash, but if he knows it's coming all that will do is get you punished. It is just good for mixup and looking flashy lol. If he rolls, punish it with dancing blade. All of his smashes are fast but can be punished OOS with dancing blade.

Now that you are in the lead, he will try to ledge camp. My new strategy is just go to the other ledge and hang until he approaches so i dont take unneccecary damage from his planking uairs and arrows. But, if you find yourself behind in damage while he is doing this then you have a few options:
1. You can angle your sheild down during his uair and upB it. This is difficult at times if he spaces it right, but know that you can still upB it.
2. When he uses a jump and aims an arrow at you, you can powershield the arrow and run off the ledge for a fair or 2.
3. If he is really bad at spacing you can try to dtilt him. It wont work on better players but meh, it's safe if he's not uairing.
Like i said, once you are ahead in damage there is no need to try and attack him when he's on the ledge. So just go to the other side once you have caught up.

Marth's ability to gimp pit is the reason this matchup is in his favor. Most pits will try to recover low. Don't waste your energy by chasing him from ledge to ledge because most of the time when he reaches the other side he just starts ledge camping anyway. If he ever makes the mistake of recovering towards you then drop down to fair or DB1 him during the wings and it's over. If he recovers high then chase him with uair. You will probably have to wait for him to airdodge then hit him. If you wait for him to land, unless you are frame perfect, he will most likely spotdodge on ground then fsmash to punish whatever you tried to hit him with when he landed. Sometimes charged usmash hits because he airdodged too early, but more often you will just get grabbed or fsmashed for doing it.

Another fun fact: if you plank on the edge sometimes(like me) with fall back fairs to upB, he can mirror shield your fair and really mess with your timing and sense of things. Dont be caught off guard if this happens. Just double jump and recover normally.

Hope this helped =D"

 

[BIGM1994]

random question,but does ken have an account for this site?

 

[dean.]

random question,but does ken have an account for this site?

He is/was a moderator IIRC. sephirothken.

 

[**Havok**]

Ike's moves, in comparison to most of their start up time/cool down time do less damage overall. Yeah Ike may be able to kill you at 50% (if he lands an fsmash), but you shouldn't be at 50% without Ike being well into his death zone; you're the faster character who can string a lot of his moves together too, many of our strings can deal from mid 20%s to early 40% damage, we have a wide variety of moves that can support this, Ike does not.

See the problem with the matchup is you can't space Ike like you would with any other char. His Fair out ranges yours Close in Fairs get shield grabbed, the matchup is not as easy as it looks against a good Ike. (I only know two good Ikes and I play with them frequently).

Marth actually has to stay on the floor for the majority of this matchup, while Ike Fairs at the height where he won't get landing lag. His jab = your dancing blade in terms of punishment. While Marth has a lot of tools to work with, most of them are nullified to Ike's range, so that means you have to stay close which winds down to Jabs vs DB. It's a gigantic guessing/punishing game. You block jabs = DB/Grab. He blocks your DB = Jabs/Grab.

Marth does have shield breaker though . Ike does have a really good spot dodge

Ike may not have the assortment of tools that marth has but he has enough. One Bad: DI'ed dash attack, spot dodge , air dodge could mean potential death.

Ike doesn't want to be beneath Marth...neither does Marth underneath Ike.

Off the stage marth has a slight advantage with counter and gimps. Ike can be smart and grab the edge while you're trying to recover to make you land on the stage for landing lag from your up-B to punish you

If the player is well aware of the difficulty that marth has trouble to kill at times then Ike not dying will be annoying.

Oh Fire Emblem Chars

it is pretty well down at 60-40.

IMO might be 55-45. Sole reason is that Marth is quicker and has better mobility than Ike.