just sex kick off the edge. there is no strong answer for most characters hanging on the ledge.
Of course there are exceptions.
Of course there are exceptions.
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List of anti-ledge camping moves:
- Thread starter The Sauce Boss
- Start date
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
LOL@ thinking offstage is the wrong position for sonic...
Sure, you CAN punish all of his options, but WILL you?
lolno.
LuLLo
Smash Ace
Definitly NOT a good option, but Ike can Quick Draw to the ledge, it CAN hit the one ledgecamping, but it's very risky. But I've pulled it off a few times, just to surprise them.
His Counter could also be used, but is risky and if it fails it'll put you in a nasty situation.
His Eruption could also work, as it hits under the stage, but again, if it fails, you're in a bad position.
His Counter could also be used, but is risky and if it fails it'll put you in a nasty situation.
His Eruption could also work, as it hits under the stage, but again, if it fails, you're in a bad position.
crazycrackers
Smash Journeyman
turnipd r pretty good but dont have much of a bite. also....sonic bair? what? if your dealing with a ledge camping mk hel'll jusr smack you lol.
talkingbeatles
Smash Ace
Has no one mentioned Falcon's up tilt? It's a pretty well against ledge camping. Also, a sliding up smash can catch people rising from the ledge.
Luigi has the option of jumping off and attempting to sweet spot with up b, but that's kind of ridiculous.
Luigi has the option of jumping off and attempting to sweet spot with up b, but that's kind of ridiculous.
Kage Me
Smash Ace
And what if it's not an MK? Looks a lot better then, no?
talkingbeatles
Smash Ace
I am serious about the falcon stuff.
LuLLo
Smash Ace
Love it how many people in this thread assume that ledgecamping automatically involves MK...
.
I was JUST gonna post that, about Falcon's u-tilt, it's very good against ledgecamping since it has good priority, only the startup lag is an issue, but it's imo good enough to present Captain Falcon in yellow in the OP
.
talkingbeatles
Smash Ace
Rock. Thanks for the back up man.Love it how many people in this thread assume that ledgecamping automatically involves MK...
I was JUST gonna post that, about Falcon's u-tilt, it's very good against ledgecamping since it has good priority, only the startup lag is an issue, but it's imo good enough to present Captain Falcon in yellow in the OP
Levitas
the moon
It's not worth talking about unless it is MK. He's the only one that can ledgecamp that well, though I hear rumors of others trying to do it.
The Sauce Boss
Smash Ace
This thread is 100% about dealing with a metaknight. I started this thread and that was the intention. People are correct to assume that.
lol
lol
Kage Me
Smash Ace
...Well then, just ban Meta Knight. Problem solved.
^_^
^_^
Falconv1.0
Smash Master
Dont be a troll, or I will beat you over the head with the myriad of reasons as to why he's not banned, such as the fact that no one who can place worth **** wants him banned.
Crow!
Smash Lord
I agree. I only brought it up because it is a source of noise; it's hard to analyze if Link has options against the ledgestall because you don't see it happen at higher levels because it's not needed. But this is just semantics; below is why I bothered responding to this thread again:
I'm going to call foul here. You came to the community seeking input as to which moves are effective against ledge stalling. For each type of move on the list, I provided my opinion as to whether those moves are effective, and most importantly I provided an argument for each of my opinions. If this is a serious project that is actually trying to determine the validity of each option, it should address the contents of the arguments rather than simply shrugging them off as though an analysis of the validity of certain options is not relevant to a thread trying to study the validity of those options. Why does this thread exist if not to provide a place for back and forth, point by point debate about the effectiveness of certain moves agaisnt ledge camping?
I admit that I am not a staple of the tournament scene and some of my arguments and assertions may be off base. But just because what I say might be wrong doesn't mean every statement can be ignored without even considering the possibilities argued therein, which is what I feel like the quoted response did.
Hive
Smash Lord
hmmm.. i said this a little earlier but bombs aren't very good at edgguarding mk for samus, unless its you know beforehand that he is going to ledgehop nado onto the stage. You are too vulnerable during it imo.
but yea, anyways, probably homing missile and zair are her best spam options, homing missiles can hit people on the ledge and zair can keep opponents from coming up from the ledge.
Fully charged low charge shot is a techniques too where you can basically hit people hanging on the ledge with a charge shot, which has good knockback and of course ko potential.
At close range samus can use dairs (if she's lucky for a spike), utilt (to hit enmeies who are hanging or just getting up, also has decent ko potential), or dsmash on yoshi's island bc of the ledges imo.
but yea, anyways, probably homing missile and zair are her best spam options, homing missiles can hit people on the ledge and zair can keep opponents from coming up from the ledge.
Fully charged low charge shot is a techniques too where you can basically hit people hanging on the ledge with a charge shot, which has good knockback and of course ko potential.
At close range samus can use dairs (if she's lucky for a spike), utilt (to hit enmeies who are hanging or just getting up, also has decent ko potential), or dsmash on yoshi's island bc of the ledges imo.
Mr. Escalator
G&W Guru
I know G&W's ledge camping can out maneuver the PKT, but it does apply some necessary pressure that most characters cant exercise to someone on the ledge. Also, MK cant clank with PKT through his normal moves. His attacks just ignore projectiles.
B!squick
Smash Master
I saw friendly match where an MK aerial out prioritized PKT. >.>
Yeah, but all of his specials eat right through projectiles, and I don't think it'd be too hard to shuttle loop and clank the PKT while grabbing the ledge again.
brinboy789
Smash Champion
lies. all of MK's attacks have transcendent priority, or no attacks clank with it. PKT of both motherboys will go through MK's attacks and hit him. except for glide attack, which i dont know if it has good priority or not. either way, MK cant clank or outprioritize PKT unles its glide attack, in which im not sure.
LIESLIESLIESLIESLIES
B!squick
Smash Master
Yeah, it was glide attack. I was thinking it was FAir for some reason. Still, I was right. MK aerial > PKT.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Yn5ZRouWqI
^Happens at about 0:45
EDIT: Also a 'Nado is seen beating it too in this vid.
EDIT2: 3:00, another Glide Attack > PKT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Yn5ZRouWqI
^Happens at about 0:45
EDIT: Also a 'Nado is seen beating it too in this vid.
EDIT2: 3:00, another Glide Attack > PKT
brinboy789
Smash Champion
is glide attack considered an aerial? well either way PKT wouldnt get outprioritized except through glide attack
B!squick
Smash Master
Glide Attack and specials.
Samuelson
Smash Lord
Dude...Bowsers and Charizards fire really doesn't work...Only the very end of the fire works and by that time MK will have had plenty of time to attack Bowser/Charizard.
M.K
Level 55
Ivysaur can also use "Instant Tether" as a viable technique for anti-ledge stalling.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVSmzY_VRrw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVSmzY_VRrw
Gindler
Smash Champion
I said that last page, then instantly someone says it doesn't work on metaknight at all and you jsut die. I know it works though I've seen it happen
(and as if MK is the only character that ledgecamps.........................)
(and as if MK is the only character that ledgecamps.........................)
t3h n00b
Smash Ace
It would work, but not when MK is invincible, and if it doesn't work, that's death, whereas MK can often survive. Tethering with someone like Link or Samus would be much safer and almost as easy.
Gindler
Smash Champion
I'm taking it you haven't seen the video, you can instant tether from above the edge.............so oh my i missed, I'll land on the stage. No death involved, he's invinvible good for him, if he's shuttlelooping and you snap the ledge with vinewhip before he does. bye metaknight.
I guess this thread should be renamed anti-ledge camping move against MK list, since that's what everyone cares about
I guess this thread should be renamed anti-ledge camping move against MK list, since that's what everyone cares about
Levitas
the moon
You're... wrong. Lucas doesn't really have a good way to deal with it.
choknater
Smash Obsessed
He can PK Freeze!!!!!! Hahahah.
can he nair?
dair?
pk thunder?
they have long lasting hitboxes
can he nair?
dair?
pk thunder?
they have long lasting hitboxes
B!squick
Smash Master
=_= That's what it was made for.
^The TC said so himself.
Also, that instant tether wouldn't faze MK in the slightest.
Gindler
Smash Champion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86-0H96ZsMQ
Observe, all I'm saying is that it CAN work not that it WILL work. As long as you whip the edge when MKs going for a shuttle loop (the main way they plank anyway) he can be killed he's not invincible on the edge. Of course I would never go all the way under the stage to do it (since it can be done above the stage) just showing that he can get "gayed" by vinewhip. If you don't agree that's fine too but it is possible.......
Observe, all I'm saying is that it CAN work not that it WILL work. As long as you whip the edge when MKs going for a shuttle loop (the main way they plank anyway) he can be killed he's not invincible on the edge. Of course I would never go all the way under the stage to do it (since it can be done above the stage) just showing that he can get "gayed" by vinewhip. If you don't agree that's fine too but it is possible.......
Terrydactyl
Smash Rookie
I don't think anyone's mentioned Weegee's down taunt yet. When he does the little "Aw shucks" kick, it spikes hard.
Completely and utterly impractical, but Weegee isn't really about practicality anyhow.
Completely and utterly impractical, but Weegee isn't really about practicality anyhow.
1048576
Smash Master
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2006
- Messages
- 3,417
The hell? Fire <<<<< PK Thunder
B!squick
Smash Master
Seen it and that MK was trash (funny vid though). After a Shuttle Loop, IF it misses, they can Glide Attack you away and then just go back to the ledge. But MK doesn't even need to Shuttle Loop anyway. Especially not against Ivysaur.
t3h n00b
Smash Ace
If you miss, there is a good chance that if the MK is proficient enough to plank effectively, they can gimp Ivysaur offstage. But I admit Ivysaur wouldn't die 100% of the time in that situation, although I'd think most of the time that would be the case. And MK can glide under the stage if he gets edgehogged, although it would be difficult to see coming. Also, can't Ivysaur get hit when he's reeling the vine in to get invincibility frames?
Levitas
the moon
Dair is bad unless MK wants to shuttle loop into it for some reason. And even then shuttle loop can win with some spacings and timings.
Nair is beaten by any aerial MK has.
PKT has tons of lag and isn't good enough to outmaneuver a MK at the ledge. If you go for attacking a MK below the edge with it and they're close to the edge, they can just edgegrab, roll up, and do whatever they want to you. If you don't attack them under the stage, they can just camp the edge like normal. Also, they can hit the bolt and you're still in lag for a while.
What are you talking about?
thesage
Smash Hero
Ness has pkt, u-smash yoyo spike, and pk fire.
Metro Knight
Smash Ace
Link's Dtilt and Ftilt also can hit someone on the Ledge hogging.