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List of anti-ledge camping moves:

BRoomer
BRoomer
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LessThanPi
just sex kick off the edge. there is no strong answer for most characters hanging on the ledge.

Of course there are exceptions.
 

da K.I.D.

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
19,658
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Rochester, NY
Sonic: Run off the stage B-air (Who?) MK..... Mk gets up, Sonic misses.....
Sonic: Double jump-Spring
or double jump wall jump to the ledge
or homing attack
or double jump homing attack
or spring without double jump
or side b (in either direction) to doublejump spring
or side b to wall jump
or side b UNDER THE STAGE to double jump spring
or spring wall jump on either side of the stage

MetaKnight- Continuous UAirs, Tornado, Shuttle Loop, Fair, DAirs, Drill???
Sonic: neutral position

Sonic gets punished because he put himself in the wrong situation......Nuff Said
LOL@ thinking offstage is the wrong position for sonic...

Sure, you CAN punish all of his options, but WILL you?
lolno.
 

LuLLo

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 27, 2006
Messages
765
Location
Netherlands, NB
Definitly NOT a good option, but Ike can Quick Draw to the ledge, it CAN hit the one ledgecamping, but it's very risky. But I've pulled it off a few times, just to surprise them.
His Counter could also be used, but is risky and if it fails it'll put you in a nasty situation.
His Eruption could also work, as it hits under the stage, but again, if it fails, you're in a bad position.
 

talkingbeatles

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
790
Location
Austin, TX
Has no one mentioned Falcon's up tilt? It's a pretty well against ledge camping. Also, a sliding up smash can catch people rising from the ledge.

Luigi has the option of jumping off and attempting to sweet spot with up b, but that's kind of ridiculous.
 

|RK|

Smash Marketer
Moderator
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Jan 6, 2009
Messages
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Maryland
Luigi can taunt and meteor them >_>

Since you DID include CF's taunt...
 

LuLLo

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 27, 2006
Messages
765
Location
Netherlands, NB
Love it how many people in this thread assume that ledgecamping automatically involves MK...

Has no one mentioned Falcon's up tilt? It's a pretty well against ledge camping. Also, a sliding up smash can catch people rising from the ledge.

Luigi has the option of jumping off and attempting to sweet spot with up b, but that's kind of ridiculous.
I was JUST gonna post that, about Falcon's u-tilt, it's very good against ledgecamping since it has good priority, only the startup lag is an issue, but it's imo good enough to present Captain Falcon in yellow in the OP :).
 

talkingbeatles

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
790
Location
Austin, TX
Love it how many people in this thread assume that ledgecamping automatically involves MK...



I was JUST gonna post that, about Falcon's u-tilt, it's very good against ledgecamping since it has good priority, only the startup lag is an issue, but it's imo good enough to present Captain Falcon in yellow in the OP :).
Rock. Thanks for the back up man.
 

Levitas

the moon
Joined
Jul 20, 2007
Messages
5,734
Location
Ann Arbor, MI
Love it how many people in this thread assume that ledgecamping automatically involves MK...
It's not worth talking about unless it is MK. He's the only one that can ledgecamp that well, though I hear rumors of others trying to do it.
 

The Sauce Boss

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 14, 2008
Messages
766
Location
Ann Arbor, MI
This thread is 100% about dealing with a metaknight. I started this thread and that was the intention. People are correct to assume that.

lol
 

Crow!

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 30, 2008
Messages
1,415
Location
Columbus, OH
The Link onstage match up is totally irrelevant to this thread.
I agree. I only brought it up because it is a source of noise; it's hard to analyze if Link has options against the ledgestall because you don't see it happen at higher levels because it's not needed. But this is just semantics; below is why I bothered responding to this thread again:

Everything else you say is arguable, but you say it like it is proven fact. It is not. It is your opinion. I don't really have time to pick at your post and argue, so I am ending the back and forth here. This is the wrong thread for this. Take it to the ban poll.
I'm going to call foul here. You came to the community seeking input as to which moves are effective against ledge stalling. For each type of move on the list, I provided my opinion as to whether those moves are effective, and most importantly I provided an argument for each of my opinions. If this is a serious project that is actually trying to determine the validity of each option, it should address the contents of the arguments rather than simply shrugging them off as though an analysis of the validity of certain options is not relevant to a thread trying to study the validity of those options. Why does this thread exist if not to provide a place for back and forth, point by point debate about the effectiveness of certain moves agaisnt ledge camping?

I admit that I am not a staple of the tournament scene and some of my arguments and assertions may be off base. But just because what I say might be wrong doesn't mean every statement can be ignored without even considering the possibilities argued therein, which is what I feel like the quoted response did.
 

Hive

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 12, 2006
Messages
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Mountain View, ca
hmmm.. i said this a little earlier but bombs aren't very good at edgguarding mk for samus, unless its you know beforehand that he is going to ledgehop nado onto the stage. You are too vulnerable during it imo.

but yea, anyways, probably homing missile and zair are her best spam options, homing missiles can hit people on the ledge and zair can keep opponents from coming up from the ledge.
Fully charged low charge shot is a techniques too where you can basically hit people hanging on the ledge with a charge shot, which has good knockback and of course ko potential.

At close range samus can use dairs (if she's lucky for a spike), utilt (to hit enmeies who are hanging or just getting up, also has decent ko potential), or dsmash on yoshi's island bc of the ledges imo.
 

Mr. Escalator

G&W Guru
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Can't MK almost outrun it? At the very least, he can easily outmanuever it or clank with it.
I know G&W's ledge camping can out maneuver the PKT, but it does apply some necessary pressure that most characters cant exercise to someone on the ledge. Also, MK cant clank with PKT through his normal moves. His attacks just ignore projectiles.
 

XienZo

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 12, 2008
Messages
1,287
I know G&W's ledge camping can out maneuver the PKT, but it does apply some necessary pressure that most characters cant exercise to someone on the ledge. Also, MK cant clank with PKT through his normal moves. His attacks just ignore projectiles.
Yeah, but all of his specials eat right through projectiles, and I don't think it'd be too hard to shuttle loop and clank the PKT while grabbing the ledge again.
 

brinboy789

Smash Champion
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Aug 6, 2008
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Suffolk, Long Island, NY
I saw friendly match where an MK aerial out prioritized PKT. >.>
lies. all of MK's attacks have transcendent priority, or no attacks clank with it. PKT of both motherboys will go through MK's attacks and hit him. except for glide attack, which i dont know if it has good priority or not. either way, MK cant clank or outprioritize PKT unles its glide attack, in which im not sure.

LIESLIESLIESLIESLIES
 

c3gill

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 12, 2009
Messages
951
Location
VA
you might as well add Lucas' SH Dair. it can threaten easily.

And Lucas should have the green letters- he poses a threat with no threat to himself. He is completely safe while threatening a planker.
 

Gindler

Smash Champion
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Feb 26, 2008
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I said that last page, then instantly someone says it doesn't work on metaknight at all and you jsut die. I know it works though I've seen it happen

(and as if MK is the only character that ledgecamps.........................)
 

t3h n00b

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 17, 2008
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Location
Laurel, Maryland
It would work, but not when MK is invincible, and if it doesn't work, that's death, whereas MK can often survive. Tethering with someone like Link or Samus would be much safer and almost as easy.
 

Gindler

Smash Champion
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I'm taking it you haven't seen the video, you can instant tether from above the edge.............so oh my i missed, I'll land on the stage. No death involved, he's invinvible good for him, if he's shuttlelooping and you snap the ledge with vinewhip before he does. bye metaknight.


I guess this thread should be renamed anti-ledge camping move against MK list, since that's what everyone cares about
 

Levitas

the moon
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you might as well add Lucas' SH Dair. it can threaten easily.

And Lucas should have the green letters- he poses a threat with no threat to himself. He is completely safe while threatening a planker.
You're... wrong. Lucas doesn't really have a good way to deal with it.
 

choknater

Smash Obsessed
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choknater
He can PK Freeze!!!!!! Hahahah.

can he nair?
dair?
pk thunder?

they have long lasting hitboxes
 

B!squick

Smash Master
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I guess this thread should be renamed anti-ledge camping move against MK list, since that's what everyone cares about
=_= That's what it was made for.

This thread is 100% about dealing with a metaknight. I started this thread and that was the intention. People are correct to assume that.

lol
^The TC said so himself.

Also, that instant tether wouldn't faze MK in the slightest.
 

Gindler

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86-0H96ZsMQ

Observe, all I'm saying is that it CAN work not that it WILL work. As long as you whip the edge when MKs going for a shuttle loop (the main way they plank anyway) he can be killed he's not invincible on the edge. Of course I would never go all the way under the stage to do it (since it can be done above the stage) just showing that he can get "gayed" by vinewhip. If you don't agree that's fine too but it is possible.......
 

Terrydactyl

Smash Rookie
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Aug 26, 2008
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Baltimore, MD
Switch FC
SW-6110-5215-0645
I don't think anyone's mentioned Weegee's down taunt yet. When he does the little "Aw shucks" kick, it spikes hard.

Completely and utterly impractical, but Weegee isn't really about practicality anyhow.
 

B!squick

Smash Master
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86-0H96ZsMQ

Observe, all I'm saying is that it CAN work not that it WILL work. As long as you whip the edge when MKs going for a shuttle loop (the main way they plank anyway) he can be killed he's not invincible on the edge. Of course I would never go all the way under the stage to do it (since it can be done above the stage) just showing that he can get "gayed" by vinewhip. If you don't agree that's fine too but it is possible.......
Seen it and that MK was trash (funny vid though). After a Shuttle Loop, IF it misses, they can Glide Attack you away and then just go back to the ledge. But MK doesn't even need to Shuttle Loop anyway. Especially not against Ivysaur.
 

t3h n00b

Smash Ace
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961
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Laurel, Maryland
I'm taking it you haven't seen the video, you can instant tether from above the edge.............so oh my i missed, I'll land on the stage. No death involved, he's invinvible good for him, if he's shuttlelooping and you snap the ledge with vinewhip before he does. bye metaknight.


I guess this thread should be renamed anti-ledge camping move against MK list, since that's what everyone cares about
If you miss, there is a good chance that if the MK is proficient enough to plank effectively, they can gimp Ivysaur offstage. But I admit Ivysaur wouldn't die 100% of the time in that situation, although I'd think most of the time that would be the case. And MK can glide under the stage if he gets edgehogged, although it would be difficult to see coming. Also, can't Ivysaur get hit when he's reeling the vine in to get invincibility frames?
 

Levitas

the moon
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He can PK Freeze!!!!!! Hahahah.

can he nair?
dair?
pk thunder?

they have long lasting hitboxes
Dair is bad unless MK wants to shuttle loop into it for some reason. And even then shuttle loop can win with some spacings and timings.

Nair is beaten by any aerial MK has.

PKT has tons of lag and isn't good enough to outmaneuver a MK at the ledge. If you go for attacking a MK below the edge with it and they're close to the edge, they can just edgegrab, roll up, and do whatever they want to you. If you don't attack them under the stage, they can just camp the edge like normal. Also, they can hit the bolt and you're still in lag for a while.

The hell? Fire <<<<< PK Thunder
What are you talking about?
 
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