List of anti-ledge camping moves:

[SexTornado]

I'm not sure if it's been said yet but I'm pretty sure pika's fsmash is good vs ledge camping

 

[Tesh]

Considering you mentioned something as risky and unlikely to work as Ganon or Falcon jumping off and using Side B to suicide/spike, I think you might as well put in Sonic's homing attack, since it will stagespike someone as it hits them in the back, pushing them into the stage.

Also, for Ganon and C.Falcon, you can do a Wizkick/Falcon kick cancel directly into any aerial or Side B for a stagespike or just a normal spike. It would probably be more useful than jumping off and trying to kill yourself, since edge camping is done while in the lead usually.

I actually wish that in training mode, there was a cpu action you could set to ledge camp. No doubt they wouldn't do it very well anyway.

 

[SpongeBathBill]

The lasers wont hit if you're on stage and they're not. If you try to go off stage and blast from there, it's a free gimp.

Ah, thanks.

 

[Flayl]

Thanks for the initiative, it's a pity when one of the community has to do this while the staffers make a premature thread asking for a ban.

 

[Denzi]

The hitbox on Marth's Usmash somehow extends below his feet and can stage spike characters below the ledge.

 

[c3gill]

Lucas' PK Freeze needs to be on here.

 

[bobson]

Ah, yes, and Ness' aerial PK fire. PK Flash is also a possibility, but there's a 95% chance you'd get punished.

 

[ZMan]

for lucas also add dsmash pkfire (goes 50/50) and fair and nair (both risky)

 

[Linkwearsgreen]

What if MK just drops off the ledge and then dair or shuttle loops you?

Ledge invincibility Link can up b right to the edge. Not too hard.

 

[Poltergust]

Yoshi can also do a Yoshi Bomb edge-hog. I did it a couple of times at a tournament today, actually.

 

[B!squick]

The hitbox on Marth's Usmash somehow extends below his feet and can stage spike characters below the ledge.

Wolf's USmash can do that to. But both are just as unlikely to work.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

jump off edge > drop c4> jump back on + NOW at same time?

Why wouldn't mortars work? And c4 probably isn't the best option, but you can jump drop it and explode it in mid air so it is staying on there. Tilts idk about. I went off of what that other post said, but I had my doubts when I read it. I'll take them off for now.

Anybody who is ledestalling CORRECTLY (which I mentioned in my previous post) would punish you in a second for trying to do this. It takes about a year to set it up, and really only works if they're recovering from really low underneath the stage. It would NOT work effectively as an anti-ledgestalling tactic at all.

And with mortars you can charge them differently and things. It may be predictable, but it drops right by the edge, which keeps metaknight off of it, which is the ultimate goal.

And what are they going to do while you charge it? Sit there and watch you? No, if MK is already on the ledge and you try to do a mortar to get him off, you're just asking for a world of hurt.

I was talking about Snake's most realistic options to beat ledgestalling. Not all of his "well, its technically possible" options.

 

[crifer]

Mabye DK´s dair? like ganons dair?

 

[DanGR]

* Olimar
1. side b
2. fsmash
3 Usmash with yellow

#1 and #3 don't work. Only spaced, non-purple fsmashes can do anything about it.

 

[Dark 3nergy]

#1 and #3 don't work. Only spaced, non-purple fsmashes can do anything about it.

would Oli's dsmash work?

 

[DanGR]

would Oli's dsmash work?

Just as much as his jab or dtilt would.

 

[The Sauce Boss]

Anybody who is ledestalling CORRECTLY (which I mentioned in my previous post) would punish you in a second for trying to do this.

Well saying correctly in italics doesn't really prove anything. Define correctly. Metaknights, even good ones, can't be PERFECT on the ledge. If correctly just means they punish your every decision, well then I guess every single one of these ideas won't work.

But anyway I'll take mortars off if they are really that bad. Let me emphasize again that I am depending on the community for building this list. So I am not going to debate any further if you are that adamant about it.

I will just quietly update the OP from here on out and let you guys argue on what works and doesn't.

 

[RP`]

I am not sure if it was mentioned or considered yet, but how about Lucario's counter? If you reverse Lucario's counter's direction couldn't he can slide right into MK and possibly stage spike him (if it is fast enough)? But I know it might not be so smart because if you whiff the counter (or yiff the counter, in this case) by MK not triggering it or he grabs the ledge too fast and you fly into his invincibility frames then you can easily be punished. But it is still something that should be tested, if it hasn't been already.

 

[Denfo]

G&W's dtilt ***** planking.

 

[Pr0phetic]

For Marth, DTilt and Tipper Fsmash are like definites if they ledge stall/camp. Usmash for certain characters to do a pseudo-stage spike.

 

[Eddie G]

It's sad, but Falcon is pretty much SOL against ledgestalling.

Luigi could possibly try to drop off with a bair and rise with a tornado (not guaranteeing this would work though).

 

[Veggi]

DK can run at them and up b, the super armor could beat their attack and if they don't attack you it hits them anyway. Foward smash would probably work too for DK and Lucario.

I can't understand how Fox's shine would work. The only way I could see it working is by shine stalling above the edge camper to bait an attack and the punish with dair.

 

[ALiAsVee]

It's sad, but Falcon is pretty much SOL against ledgestalling.

Luigi could possibly try to drop off with a bair and rise with a tornado (not guaranteeing this would work though).

An offstage Bair with luigi is pretty well orchestrated, so most ledgestallers will see that coming. The only time i can really do that is if they are spamming MK's downB or something off the ledge, otherwise eh.

His fireballs don't work too well because they are lateral and can't get under the stage, unless you jump off...but that's basically asking for a stock off. Same thing as using rising tornado as an anti-ledge tactic. You can footstall on the start up and otherwise just get off stage, wait for luigi to pass you and punish, since you can't sweet spot it.

He has nothing.

 

[SwastikaPyle]

Any Mk worth his salt should not fall for pretty much any move on that list.

 

[Eddie G]

An offstage Bair with luigi is pretty well orchestrated, so most ledgestallers will see that coming. The only time i can really do that is if they are spamming MK's downB or something off the ledge, otherwise eh.

His fireballs don't work too well because they are lateral and can't get under the stage, unless you jump off...but that's basically asking for a stock off. Same thing as using rising tornado as an anti-ledge tactic. You can footstall on the start up and otherwise just get off stage, wait for luigi to pass you and punish, since you can't sweet spot it.

He has nothing.

You have a point there. ^.^;

 

[Kitamerby]

Any Mk worth his salt should not fall for pretty much any move on that list.

This man is correct.

If the MK is truly good at ledgecamping to the point where you need help getting around it, chances are he won't fall for these shenanigans.

 

[B!squick]

DK can run at them and up b, the super armor could beat their attack and if they don't attack you it hits them anyway. Foward smash would probably work too for DK and Lucario.

How is an UpB on stage gonna help? And FSmash for both of those would only work if they let the ledge invincibility frames run out... for whatever reason.

Any Mk worth his salt should not fall for pretty much any move on that list.

This, especially if you think motars are a viable solution. But anything is better than nothing and it's probably best to figure out everyone's best bet before the first time you're planked.

 

[RP`]

How is an UpB on stage gonna help? And FSmash for both of those would only work if they let the ledge invincibility frames run out... for whatever reason.

DK's UpB has SA frames and a little knockback (good enough).

 

[bobson]

Any Mk worth his salt should not fall for pretty much any move on that list.

Planking is no longer a functional time stall if the planker risks getting hit by a projectile every three seconds.

 

[B!squick]

Here's the list of things I find especially silly and impractical.

* Falco
1. angled ftilt

* Ice Climbers
1. ice blocks

* Ivysaur
1. razor leaf

* Ike
2. dtilt

* Lucas
2. pk freeze <-This one's a maybe. I feel like it's asking to be punished but it's cerntain better than mortars. And if you have this there's no reason not to list PK Pulse.

* R.O.B.
1. laser <-This would only work off stage so it's not very viable. Throwing a Gyro down is probably "best" but it's perdictable so, eh.

* Samus
1. missles
2. bombs
^Both of these are meh with Bombs probably being the best, though not by much.

* Sheik
1.chain
2.needles
^Needles are alot safer but HIGHLY unlikely to work and Chain is a bit dubious due to the ending lag.

*Snake
2.c4 <-Panda covered the reasons. I don't see this working well unless it's placed before hand. Stick with Nikitas and 'Nades.

* Squirtle
1. UpB off stage? That's the best thing I can think of.

* Wario
1. bike/pieces
2. Bite off stage <-Why not?

 

[B!squick]

DK's UpB has SA frames and a little knockback (good enough).

... But if it's on stage, how does that help, especially when MK can just punish the ending lag?

Planking is no longer a functional time stall if the planker risks getting hit by a projectile every three seconds.

... From TJolt maybe, that's about it.

 

[The Sauce Boss]

Any Mk worth his salt should not fall for pretty much any move on that list.

This man is correct.

If the MK is truly good at ledgecamping to the point where you need help getting around it, chances are he won't fall for these shenanigans.

Please keep comments like this out of this thread. Take it to the ban poll if you must say it.

I even said in the OP

This is a thread for dealing with ledge camping, not complaining about it.

While for some characters the situation is very bad, many have perfectly viable options.

 

[Toby.]

Charizard isn't that great at using flamethrower vs plankers to be honest. You need to be too close for it to hit, which is just asking for some serious punishment from any decent MK. Plus Mk can easily just drop down and avoid it until its too short to hit him when he regrabs. Take it and razor leaf from the list.

 

[The Sauce Boss]

Here's the list of things I find especially silly and impractical.

* Falco
1. angled ftilt--------probably is bad

* Ice Climbers
1. ice blocks-----------these can work

* Ivysaur
1. razor leaf---------angle it down? I could see it working but don't have experience with it

* Ike
2. dtilt--------unlikely but deadly enough to worth noting

* Lucas
2. pk freeze <-This one's a maybe. I feel like it's asking to be punished but it's cerntain better than mortars. And if you have this there's no reason not to list PK Pulse.--------------pk pulse is slower but probably worth noting I suppose

* R.O.B.
1. laser <-This would only work off stage so it's not very viable. Throwing a Gyro down is probably "best" but it's perdictable so, eh.---------why can't you go off stage? ROB has great recovery.

* Samus
1. missles
2. bombs
^Both of these are meh with Bombs probably being the best, though not by much.-----------I don't see a huge problem with these

* Sheik
1.chain
2.needles
^Needles are alot safer but HIGHLY unlikely to work and Chain is a bit dubious due to the ending lag.-----------idk about these, no experience

*Snake
2.c4 <-Panda covered the reasons. I don't see this working well unless it's placed before hand. Stick with Nikitas and 'Nades.--------not a great idea but possible enough to note

* Squirtle
1. UpB off stage? That's the best thing I can think of.--------does squirtles up b have any kind of priority?

* Wario
1. bike/pieces
2. Bite off stage <-Why not?-----------idk would it work lol

added quick comments on these. I am unsure myself on a lot of those. I just went with what other people posted.

 

[gm jack]

I don't see how Shieks chain wouldn't work. I haven't fought anyone who uses the tactic though, let alone a MK, so I am not sure how it would respond to it.

However, if you SH and throw the chian over the edge, there is essentially a hitbox on the point they need to reach for safety. If their invincible frames drop at all, they will take a hit from the chain.

Only the tip needs to be over the edge, and it could then be bought up in a whip is they try to get over it and punish to hastily.

 

[B!squick]

* Ice Climbers
1. ice blocks-----------these can work

Eh, better than Razorleaf, that's for sure.

* R.O.B.
1. laser <-This would only work off stage so it's not very viable. Throwing a Gyro down is probably "best" but it's perdictable so, eh.---------why can't you go off stage? ROB has great recovery.

If you plan on going off stage anyway I'd use BAir personally.

*Snake
2.c4 <-Panda covered the reasons. I don't see this working well unless it's placed before hand. Stick with Nikitas and 'Nades.--------not a great idea but possible enough to note

I suppose.

* Squirtle
1. UpB off stage? That's the best thing I can think of.--------does squirtles up b have any kind of priority?

I know it has a big weird hitbox and I've seen it used pretty effectively for clearing ledges, but regardless the player can just switch to the one with actual flight and the best options i.e. Charzard, same with Ivysaur. And Charzard has the best match up against MK anyway.

* Wario
1. bike/pieces
2. Bite off stage <-Why not?-----------idk would it work lol

It's got stupid priorty and as long as MK doesn't have a stock lead it's a fair idea to suicide with it. Otherwise, MK would most likely recover. Wario's DownB is also a possibility.

added quick comments on these. I am unsure myself on a lot of those. I just went with what other people posted.

The problem is that most people don't understand what the problem actually is. I suggest including "the" video. I think Panda stuck it in the OP of the ban poll topic.

 

[bobson]

... From TJolt maybe, that's about it.

Or fireballs, or PK thunder, or Din's Fire, or grenades, or bombs, or...

If you plan on going off stage anyway I'd use BAir personally.

Bair is a lot less safe than shooting a laser.

It's got stupid priorty and as long as MK doesn't have a stock lead it's a fair idea to suicide with it. Otherwise, MK would most likely recover. Wario's DownB is also a possibility.

Metaknight's sword for regular attacks has transcended priority, meaning it will outprioritize anything that doesn't outrange it. Bite would only work if you managed to trick the MK into not attacking.


On second thought, iceblocks wouldn't work all that well, as Metaknight can simply fair them back at you. Desynced iceblocks, maybe.

 

[Linkwearsgreen]

So atm... Toon Link and metaknight are best at countering ledge camping...

WOOT!

 

[CRASHiC]

How does it not look good?
Seriously, people are assuming the each character should have an option for everything.
"OH NO! Marth's throws are weak!"
Why would Marth have good throws? Look at him!

A good deal of characters have options. Only three don't have any.

 

[SilverSpark]

pikachu: QA off edge to falling attacks (very surprising :])
QA edge hog

There are probly more out of the 105+ tricks for Pikachu, but I don't think that many Pikachus have problems with plankers. The instinct would be to use T-jolt wisely