Improve your MK: Tactics, Theory-crafting, & More!

[Player-4]

Or they could just DI the Dthrow away and to the ground and not have any of those problems lol

 

[!!!RM!!!]

And get shield>regrab'd depending on the character lolz.

 

[Player-4]

Or they can grab you instead lolz

 

[!!!RM!!!]

^Tru. ;P Its situational, but if you can gay them enough when they DI down then they'll consider other options instead.

 

[Kaffei]

just read them mother fkers

 

[-LzR-]

Isn't there an option like every single time from Dthrow as long as you read them correctly?

 

[Master Raven]

Pretty much.

 

[-LzR-]

Well yes, it's the best non chaingrab throw in the game if you ask me, unless we count stuff like Snake's Dthrow as chaingrabs.

 

[Player-4]

Lol I think Snake's and GW's Dthrow are the best non-CG grabs in the game

 

[!!!RM!!!]

I don't really like G&W's followups out of Dthrow though. Unless you don't tech or tech in place the worst he can do is dash attack or regrab. They've gotta be on prediction as well. But if you're against a ledge its about as bad as Snake's Dthrow imo. Down Smasssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhh!

 

[Kaffei]

Oh yeah RM, I have a very very adifjidfhasd question

Ok, let's say GW Dthrows MK, and MK techs to the left. If GW is frame perfect on his read, can he upsmash? or can MK use one of his moves first before usmash comes out?

 

[Exdeath]

Oh yeah RM, I have a very very adifjidfhasd question

Ok, let's say GW Dthrows MK, and MK techs to the left. If GW is frame perfect on his read, can he upsmash? or can MK use one of his moves first before usmash comes out?

There is a thread on the G&W boards talking about it.

Because I'm not lazy:

Metaknight:
Tech in place: 18
Techroll: 32 (techchase Judgement works. Getting a 9 requires Judgement from frame 14-16 assuming you buffer dash after throw. Confirmed by God-is-my-rock, chasing the techroll with both hits of D-air is evidently possible. Dashing for at least 11 frames gets the ground hit only. Dashing for at least 14 frames gets the sweetspot. D-tilt can cover techrolls, but away techroll may require you to delay it and/or take a step forward before doing it.)
Blocked getup attack: 31 front (has deceptive range behind him), 21 back

 

[Kaffei]

wait but what about usmash

 

[Exdeath]

wait but what about usmash

Usmash isn't guaranteed. MK's tech roll is -32 and Usmash comes is out on frame 24-28. In other words, that gives G&W 8 frames to dash before you can shield. I'm not certain, but I believe that G&W will hit with Usmash if MK does anything but shield or spot dodge.

 

[Kaffei]

ok thank god lol

 

[Exdeath]

I'm not 100% sure yet, but I'll find out.

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Usmash isn't guaranteed. MK's tech roll is -32 and Usmash comes is out on frame 24-28. In other words, that gives G&W 8 frames to dash before you can shield. I'm not certain, but I believe that G&W will hit with Usmash if MK does anything but shield or spot dodge.

^Pretty much this. :D Shield shuts it down, but then he could grab you instead.

 

[Exdeath]

^Pretty much this. :D Shield shuts it down, but then he could grab you instead.

If the timing is as tight as I think that it is, MK can buffer shield>Up-B and cover both options. This would lose to G&W shielding/spot dodging, though.

 

[Kaffei]

So it's all a matter of reads... GW is so gey lol

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Well first he has to read which direction you're going to roll, or if you're even going to tech...

Since its a matter of reads then just choose an option at random after rolling(or make it seem that way). Its harder to predict what number a dice will land on than what number comes next in a pattern of 2, 4, 6, 8. If you leave no pattern then it makes his job much, much harder.

 

[theunabletable]

It's tougher for your opponent if he can't read you?

huh

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Its tougher to blindly guess correctly than it is to read correctly. :3

 

[Kaffei]

adfasd nvm

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Drill Rush Ledge Cancel stuffs!

DRLC into...
Nair
Reverse SL
Rising Dair
Tornado
FF Uair>SL

If only we could reliably use Drill Rush... there has to be a way!

Not quite sure, but I think Drill Rush's hitboxes actually have decent priority as well.

 

[etecoon]

drill rush is actually really underrated IMO

it's good against a lot of characters in the air if it beats their aerials because you can't air dodge it usually either

 

[Player-4]

I used DR cancel to Nair for a kill in a friendly this past weekend and the same thing on BF against an Olimar in a tourney match to grab an early instant 19% lead

Also if you use DR into people and end it right and into the ground you have frame advantage to Dsmash or grab as a follow up. I'm sure there are more follow ups but those are the 2 I use personally.

 

[!!!RM!!!]

That's on hit right?

If you can connect a Dsmash out of it then you should also be able to Nair too.

 

[Player-4]

Yes that's on hit, it gives enough hit stun to Dsmash though I'm sure people will start picking up on it and SDI'ing it

 

[Orion*]

Yes that's on hit, it gives enough hit stun to Dsmash though I'm sure people will start picking up on it and SDI'ing it

people I play already sdi that shiiiiiiiiiiii

also, how is GaW grabbing you....

The only thing I focus on not getting hit by vs GaW is

Grab
Fair
Key

 

[Kaffei]

people I play already sdi that shiiiiiiiiiiii

also, how is GaW grabbing you....

The only thing I focus on not getting hit by vs GaW is

Grab
Fair
Key

Cus Vinnie is smarter than me

 

[etecoon]

Cus Vinnie is smarter than me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-yKEeh70R8

focus on GAW IMO, don't let the person behind him get in your head

I'm really bad at the MK/GAW MU myself though lol, I do better with my secondaries :/

 

[Master Raven]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-yKEeh70R8

focus on GAW IMO, don't let the person behind him get in your head

I'm really bad at the MK/GAW MU myself though lol, I do better with my secondaries :/

Interesting perspective in that vid, though I think you still also need to treat your opponent as a sentient thing that can think and mix-up, but if his point was just to not be scared of the person controlling the character, then I agree.

 

[etecoon]

yeah I think that goes without saying, you pay attention to what the character is doing, what their habits are and everything, but you don't let the other person and their reputation enter your mind. that vid talks about how this perspective makes it easier to play against top players but it also helps avoid trap games where you might underestimate someone else, you just have to fight how you know how to without concerning yourself with how good or bad your opponent is

 

[Staco]

Im doing Drill Rush edgeguards a lot

 

[Toronto Joe]

i said long time ago it was good once in a while vs falco and noone believed me lol

 

[Master Raven]

i said long time ago it was good once in a while vs falco and noone believed me lol

I've seen Seibrik do it in some vids that are months old. idk if he uses it anymore though but I guess it wouldn't hurt to experiment with it once I friendly some Falcos.

 

[Orion*]

It's good with a hard read IMO and I do it sometimes but tornado is much more consistent overall for me

edit: that is in general now that I reread it but I am talking about falco specifically

 

[Magma Dolphin]

I've seen a video (don't remember when) where Drill is cancelled on the ledge when MK is coming off stage; almost like how wolf can with his side b. But meta goes into fall, but gains all his jumps back... how useful would that be to perfect?

 

[-LzR-]

So what's this drillrush edgeguarding... I hear about it a lot and everything, but I haven't even seen it or anything. What is it and is it important. I wanna learn a lot more about all the tricks with SideB because they are cooool.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Start from a good ways away from the ledge, and then drill rush so that you would go well offstage with it... And curve down to catch errant foes. There's a vid kicking around somewhere... Or at least was. I can't find it now.