Grand Old Thread: League of Legends!

[Asdioh]

http://www.twitch.tv/hoidsa streaming some placement matches. most likely no music or anything exciting so definitely don't come watch ok

although i might stop because ping is being bad right now

 

[Niko45]

I will say though that I do think another aspect of elo hell is that to get a certain rank, you often need to play better than what that rank actually requires. For example I think if someone deserves to be silver, they should only have to be able to maintain a 50-55% winrate in silver 5. I'm pretty sure I could do that because I've beaten silvers (and even people who were gold in season 3) in lane before and play with silvers a lot because I often duo with my cousin who is low silver. The thing is, most low silvers, such as my cousin, like me aren't good enough to carry afks and feeders in bronze. So if someone is silver, they either got there because they got superior teams over 50% of the time, or they're just actually good enough to consistently carry afks and feeders, in which case they probably deserve to be higher than low silver, if you get me.

Best advice I ever got was to embrace the badness of my teammates. If my teammates all look like all stars to me, I'm probably going to start tanking eventually. If the players around you in game seem less experienced than you, it's a sign that you can climb. I agree with you that it takes a higher level to climb. You can't just be barely Diamond MMR to hit Diamond. You need to be solidly Diamond to actually CLIMB to it, even if you are already ready to hold your own when you get there. Climbing at low elo is very basic. Pick something that carries very hard when it gets fed, get good at getting yourself fed every game. I think that first part is something a lot of people overlook. For instance, I used to play a lot of Renekton top, and though I could consistently do well on Renekton and win lane, I would often lose games in very disappointing fashion because the bottom line is, it's easy to do well on Renekton in lane. But he's not an assassin and he's not the tankiest, so he WILL need someone else in the game to do well in order to win.

Eventually I realized if I play champions that are supposedly poor in lane, but scale really hard, I could have much more success because if you get good at champions like this, you can actually win or even stomp lanes that on paper you should be losing. And if you're a late game champion stomping lane, the game is just about over. On Renekton, I was just holding serve by winning lane. There is much more upside with late game champions if you can get good at them.

 

[Dre89]

Yeah I agree with a lot of that. I switched from Rumble to Wu and I've had a lot more success as Wu because he snowballs harder and is much easier to use. He also takes towers quicker because he's AD.

Thing about lategame farmers is that I feel like they have lower skill ceilings and it's just a matter of whether the enemy is good enough to close out the game before you become unstoppable. The burden is on them to make plays early whilst you can just farm, but if they do make good plays there is little that you can do as an individual. Farming champions have an easier post laning phase well, because whenever you don't know what to do you can just farm and know that the longer the game goes on in a stallfest the better it will be for you. I just personally prefer aggressive champions who can reward you with early kills if you have lane mechanics.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Dre you built the same **** in every game; never deviating.

don't lie to me, I have your lolking/elobuff >:[

 

[Dre89]

Dre you built the same **** in every game; never deviating.

don't lie to me, I have your lolking/elobuff >:[

I said I build the same 5 items on Wu most of the time (I alternate boots based on the game) because they're core, and the 6th item changes depending on how the game. I've only built maw once. Normally if I'm not jungle I'd build something like a randuin's, or I might get a damage item like a bloodthirster if I feel like I don't need the extra tankiness.

Considering that my item builds are virtually identical to a d1 Wu main in NA (he gets mobi boots instead of tank boots) I don't think my Wu builds are really an issue.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Dre I see two in your lolking.

 

[Asdioh]

These placement matches are far harder than anything I ever had in Plat 1. Games where I'm jungling and all 3 lanes are losing IMMEDIATELY and yelling at me for ganks are common. What a pleasure to get back into :/

 

[Shaya]

These placement matches are far harder than anything I ever had in Plat 1. Games where I'm jungling and all 3 lanes are losing IMMEDIATELY and yelling at me for ganks are common. What a pleasure to get back into :/

Yeah, jungling is such a downer. Everyone blames you for them counterpicking themselves in lane, everyone blames you for them over extending without wards, everyone blames you for not ganking when every lane is always sub half health/low resources with no vision. Best you can do is say "pull your heads in, the only chance we have is if I camp bot"

 

[Dre89]

Aero- I don't remember building maw twice, but if I did it was probably against heavy AP, which is fine.

Asdioh- Just camp mid, mid is the best lane to get rolling IMO. But yeah, having all your lanes losing is the main reason why I stopped calling jungle.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Aero- I don't remember building maw twice, but if I did it was probably against heavy AP, which is fine.

TIL Ahri and Teemo is "heavy AP".

See, imo this is why you'll never get better because you absolutely refuse to listen to other people regarding almost anything.

http://www.lolking.net/summoner/oce/477992

You don't even seem to lose that many games... lol.

ily dre but you say silly things sometimes and I wish you'd just listen to me instead of saying "oh you play fiora and feed sometimes how can you ever be right".

 

[Dre89]

How is maw a bad item against all the teemo shrooms? I've seen Wukongs build it b4.

Also, I do listen to other people, where do you think I get my builds from (my Wu build is from a d1 Wu main). I just don't take don't your advice on absolutely every single thing you say, there's a difference. Just because I don't take your advice on abosultely everything doesn't mean that I never listen to anyone at all.

You literally said that you want me to 'blindly' accept everything you say. I'm not going to do that. You also told me that if I ever disagree with you, you interpret it as me saying 'F U' to you, which is ridiculous.

Also I'm losing less games now because I"m switching to ADs. Things like Wu Fiora Khazix Jax are getting me better results just because they snowball harder and are just easier to use in general.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

ok dre =(

10ithinkijustgottoldoff's

 

[Dre89]

Just lost my promo because someone picked ghost revive Rammus without saying a word in champ select, then just ran under tower and intentionally fed the entire game building all movement speed, feeding like 34 deaths. They even clicked no when we surrendered lol.

Lolnotribunal

 

[Hot_ArmS]

yo 4man backdoor!!!!


Also I recently got triumphant ryze so i wanna try him out, what do i build first seraphs or rod of ages?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Just lost my promo because someone picked ghost revive Rammus without saying a word in champ select, then just ran under tower and intentionally fed the entire game building all movement speed, feeding like 34 deaths. They even clicked no when we surrendered lol.

Lolnotribunal

so he's basically this guy:

http://smashboards.com/threads/donkey-kong-frame-data-3-02.350206/

 

[Asdioh]

went 5-5 in placements and got placed in gold 2, graves' spellbreakers. I was plat 1 at the end of last season. I guess this is pretty typical, especially considering how poorly I did in the placements. I only had 1 game with an afk, amazing!
p.s. swain is fun

Do any of you streamers find that narrating what you're doing and why helps you focus on playing well? I imagine that it would actually help you play better, because if you say what you're about to do, you have to justify it, and if it's a dumb play then it will be obvious to everyone. Too bad I inevitably end up stuttering when I try to talk and focus on things at the same time :|

 

[Gbay99]

Do any of you streamers find that narrating what you're doing and why helps you focus on playing well? I imagine that it would actually help you play better, because if you say what you're about to do, you have to justify it, and if it's a dumb play then it will be obvious to everyone. Too bad I inevitably end up stuttering when I try to talk and focus on things at the same time :|

It actually does help you focus a ton, but not as much when you're streaming. When you stream you're more focused on engaging your audience and keeping people entertained rather than focusing on the game yourself.

 

[Dre89]

Random question, what's the difference between an AD caster and a melee ADC? I get that casters use their spells and ADCS use their autos, what I'm saying is what makes people build caster items on certain melees, and AS items on others. I always figured it was just that Melee ADCS has AS steroids, but then so do Wukong and Zed. If I built AS items like Bortk on Wukong why would that be worse than doing the same on Jax? Is it just the qualities of the steroids, or does it have to do with the scaling of their base AD as well?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Random question, what's the difference between an AD caster and a melee ADC? I get that casters use their spells and ADCS use their autos, what I'm saying is what makes people build caster items on certain melees, and AS items on others. I always figured it was just that Melee ADCS has AS steroids, but then so do Wukong and Zed. If I built AS items like Bortk on Wukong why would that be worse than doing the same on Jax? Is it just the qualities of the steroids, or does it have to do with the scaling of their base AD as well?

AD casters don't really auto attack ever. They might get one or two off during their rotation but that's it (Example: Talon, Zed)

Compare with Fiora <3, or Yi <3 who both need to auto attack a lot to do tonnes of damage.

 

[Dre89]

Casters don't auto attack because they build to do damage with their spells, I get that. What I'm asking is why can't they build AS instead and rely more on autos than their spells, and vice versa for ADCs.

I'm asking what is it about Wukong's kit, a champ who has an AS steroid, that makes it better for him to build pure AD and armourpen. And what is it about Jax's kit, who has spells with similar base damages to Wukong's, that makes it better to build AS.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Casters don't auto attack because they build to do damage with their spells, I get that. What I'm asking is why can't they build AS instead and rely more on autos than their spells, and vice versa for ADCs.

Because melee adc's have defensive steroids that let them hit things. Fiora gets intangibility + a parry, Tryndamere can't have his HP reduced to zero and reduces attack damage, Yi get's intangibility and a 60% damage reduction with a heal on it............. etc

Meanwhile Wukong gets like, 20 armor and magic res. They don't compare.

 

[Dre89]

It's 40 armour and MR at max level with the entire enemy team nearby, but yeah I get your point.

So basically, being able to build AS is just a luxury that you can only afford if you have really strong defence mechanisms, and you to have to build caster if you don't.

What about Renekton? He's considered a caster but he's really hard to kill with his 600 health ult and tons of natural sustain. Why couldn't you just do a melee ADC build on him?

So does that mean that you could build pure AD and armour pen on melee ADs, and they'd be just as effective as casters a sthe traditional ones. I kinda did something like that with Fiora, so that my Q-R combo was more effective and nuking carries (I played her more like an assassin than a carry).

 

[KuroganeHammer]

you can melee adc as renekton

you'll die in 7 hits instead of 5 though

Also Fiora is weird, she doesn't build attack speed (hello 120% attack speed buff) or crit because they don't really synergize with her kit.

Stacking armor pen Fiora is fine; it's really cheap and does tonnes of damage (which is the point of playing Fiora since she has literally zero utility).

 

[Dre89]

Well I thought Bortk was a common item on her because the active synergises really well with her ult.

Black Cleaver at least gives her ult some utility.

I also considered Ghostblade on Wukong. 20 flatpen is nuts, and would mean I'd probably end up doing true damage to squishies. The CDR will give you max CDR with CDR boots and mastery along with a cleaver, and the active is good for dueling and splitpushing. I'd probably get flamed for trying it though.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Fiora can build pretty much any AD item. Unlike some champions *cough yasuo cough* her build isn't restricted to like, 4 items and boots.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Just go black clever on Wukong and take the armor shred.

 

[Niko45]

went 5-5 in placements and got placed in gold 2, graves' spellbreakers. I was plat 1 at the end of last season. I guess this is pretty typical, especially considering how poorly I did in the placements. I only had 1 game with an afk, amazing!
p.s. swain is fun

Do any of you streamers find that narrating what you're doing and why helps you focus on playing well? I imagine that it would actually help you play better, because if you say what you're about to do, you have to justify it, and if it's a dumb play then it will be obvious to everyone. Too bad I inevitably end up stuttering when I try to talk and focus on things at the same time :|

I went 6-4 and also got gold 2 (from P1 season 3). I'm in promo to get back to Plat 1 currently. Dun worry, you'll climb fast. And no clamping this season!

I'm asking what is it about Wukong's kit, a champ who has an AS steroid, that makes it better for him to build pure AD and armourpen. And what is it about Jax's kit, who has spells with similar base damages to Wukong's, that makes it better to build AS.

Because if you can go either way, it's almost always better to be a bursty spell damage AD champion. Ninja Tabi, Randuins passive, thornmail, crit reduction mastery in defense tree, these are all major major checks on AS/auto attack damage. It's why ADCs in general are considered very underpowered currently.

And don't be fooled, attack speed on Jax is nice and all, but it should not at all be the focal point of your build. Hybrid items effecting 7 ratios is what you're going after there.

 

[Plum]

also Wukong doesn't really have any business building multiplicative stats like an ADC when he can't even auto attack for four seconds when he ults
that's like half a teamfight that he wastes any crit or attack speed he bought from items

and Jax doesn't even really go hybrid anymore aside from Triforce
Gunblade isn't even that good on him anymore after its repeated nerfs and the introduction of BotRK, and Rageblade has always been an awkward item
his core is Triforce + BotRK, and then you typically see stuff like Randuins and Guardian Angel afterwards

 

[Niko45]

but gunblade jax is still 1000 times better than botrk jax

 

[Sinister Slush]

Gunblade gives him more stats cause AP, but Bork gives him Movespeed and % health damage.
If you're up against a jax they're very likely gonna rush either bork or go TF route starting with phage most likely cause MS passive.

Edit: ph age
y crashboreds....

 

[john!]

tried malz, he still sucks

u lied to me shaya

 

[Sinister Slush]

Loss prevented though so worth.
Also might stream in a bit, but dunno how long cause server maintenance soon

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Gunblade gives him more stats cause AP, but Bork gives him Movespeed and % health damage.
If you're up against a jax they're very likely gonna rush either bork or go TF route starting with ****e most likely cause MS passive.

Edit: ph age
y crashboreds....

censor's been dead for a week

blame garchomp7

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I like hybrid items and champs, but Riot doesn't anymore :<

 

[Shaya]

tried malz, he still sucks

u lied to me shaya

Ask me any malzahar question you like! Or have me watch/coach your game live.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

How does malz beat QuickSilverSash?

 

[john!]

Loss prevented though so worth.
Also might stream in a bit, but dunno how long cause server maintenance soon

mfw i was at 0 lp anyway

 

[Life]

How does malz beat QuickSilverSash?

Presumably the same way Zed does: ult someone else, or wait for them to use it on something else.

 

[Shaya]

Be ready to Silence them the moment they QSS so they don't use an escape and are still screwed (ults 700 range, while Q is 800 [sometimes escapes will still come out but they'll end up silenced still]). If you're behind against an assassin with QSS, you can be pretty ****eddddd (Akali for example). Try not to fall behind against assassins then them having QSS usually won't matter. The more reactive your team is though, the better your ult is anyway, as it's just an automatic team focus targeting device.

But yeah, ult someone else or save it for after they use it.

 

[Gbay99]

but gunblade jax is still 1000 times better than botrk jax

The issue with saying that is Gunblade Jax doesn't get the crazy attack speed that BotRK gives. Statistically speaking, gunblade gives a higher total gold value (TGV = 4112g) than BotRK (TGV = 2893g) for only 200g more. However, BotRK gives more useful stats and a better unique passive. A 40% attack speed bonus is huge on Jax with the way his passive and ulti work, and it's much more important than the AP and spell vamp Gunblade gives.

I gotta admit though, Gunblade has a lot nicer build path lol.