Grand Old Thread: League of Legends!

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Only champs I worry about top lane are mundo and renekton.

Trundle is someone I've come to like more recently.

I still go Nasus/Garen top a lot, when I go there rare as it is.

 

[Player-3]

Rengar still best top lamer all time

 

[Z'zgashi]

I basically only play Nasus and Darius top, although Top is probably my least played position. I even end up jungling more, and Im an awful jungler.

 

[Life]

Nasus/Udyr/Shyvana top here, probably gonna add Zed top when I'm a bit more familiar with him.

 

[Asdioh]

I kept hearing about Lich Bane changes, and apaprently these are them http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/VPBE#Items
Spellblade now deals (+75% base AD)(+50% AP) instead of 50 (+75% AP).

Any idea what's up with these changes? Are AP champs 2op now?

I'm actually surprised that top is as popular as it is. Support is actually extremely fun and rewarding with the changes to vision and their income; I think most players just still have the anti-support mentality from past seasons and aren't too willing to give support a real try.

Top lane on the other hand is just the most brutal lane imo.

I was kinda hoping they would change something about top, but even after all these months it still seems like it's a minigame inside of a game. I've always hated top, boring and stressful at the same time.

I'm also nervous at the prospect of jungling again, some friends and I made a spontaneous 5s team and we went 5-0 in placements, and I played mid every time and was perfectly comfortable. But even though I played mid/jungle about equally in s3, I don't really know how the jungling meta has changed so I feel like it will take a lot more practice.

 

[Pikaville]

I feel jungling is way easier this season since no one really invades anymore and anyone can do it with the new items.

 

[john!]

jax saw a lot of play during the s3 championships i think

he's very basic and you can build a lot of stuff on him so he's pretty resistant to changes in the meta

 

[Sinister Slush]

Because Jax ***** Shen, that's why john.

 

[victra♥]

what made shen fall off in flavor this season?

 

[Asdioh]

damn, good question. His winrate's low, his usage and banrate are ridiculously low... he used to be practically free elo if I had to play top and he was open, at least in lower elos.

 

[victra♥]

Yeah likewise, i had a great win record with Shen during S3. I remember in earlier seasons people complained about how broken his ult was...can't it still be abused the same way?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

My best guess.

His laning got harder.

 

[Plum]

His repeated nerfs finally took their toll I guess. His laning is mediocre at best, his splitpush is underwhelming, and he doesn't do much damage which makes his impact beyond his ult and taunt pretty low.
His ult and taunt are definitely high impact, sure, but you can just take teleport and do something similar to Shen while actually killing the enemy carries on something like Irelia or w/e.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Trundle shyv and Renekton outdamage Shen early, while mundo is meh and of course nobody is tanky early.
To make it worse for against Trundle, all the tank shen builds trundle can just swallow the stats while also having bork and whacking his face in or his teammates during teamfights while shen trys to compensate that but taunting as many enemies as he can but cause of defenses being eaten he doesn't survive as long while in their faces.

As P3 said a page or two back, he's not the invincible diver like the top 4 are right now, he's more of keeping the jungler alive for that when it use to be tank junglers but Eve panth wukong kha'zix etc. are seeing more play over tanks. Even then the tanks Elise Vi or Lee sin build elder lizard/Haunting guise before going for randuin's or something.

 

[Niko45]

I feel jungling is way easier this season since no one really invades anymore and anyone can do it with the new items.

It definitely is. Jungle is carrying harder than ever right now imo. Mid and Jungle provide 80% of impact, and support provides like 15% after that. ADC and top have almost no impact unless they get very snowballed.

what made shen fall off in flavor this season?

Shen does not do any damage. He is basically outclassed now because Mundo and Shyvana, for instance, are both tankier and higher damage than him so he is just not very good. He does not have a convenient build path for damage, either, the way Renekton can just build hydra and then pure tank afterwards if the game calls for a build like that. He could go triforce, but it's so expensive and not exactly tailor made for him, since he is still a champion that needs tons of tank items to be effective. His only really viable build is pure tank, and like I said Shyv Mundo do that wayyyy better than him both defensively and offensively.

 

[Plum]

Damn CLG going back to top lane Ryze into Mundo. Very smart. DIG basically has no choice but to 2v1 because Mundo can't do anything to stop Ryze from farming.

I also like the supporting cast around Ryze. Nidalee heal on somebody that actually builds resists is huge, Sivir ult to keep him mobile, and Morgana shield because an un-CC-able Ryze is fair. If Ryze gets his items he'll be unstoppable.

 

[Dre89]

That's why I don't like Mundo, because you can just pick a hypercarry into him so they can freefarm.

 

[Plum]

mfw DIG tries to force Baron against a full team with Ryze and Nidalee
absolute throw with Baron amplifying all magic damage taken

 

[Sinister Slush]

They threw before that with scarra getting caught bot forever ago. That just swung the momentum in their favor when previously the game was literally anybodies.
Them "throwing" at baron was just a desperate attempt to make it even again but it failed miserably.

 

[Niko45]

Ya, I also was kinda confused by the call to back off after they kill mid inhib tower and traded amumu for sivir? 4v4, everyone pretty healthy, I understand ults are down (but they're down on both sides) and they don't even feel like they can get the open inhib with jinx ziggs wukong mundo?

 

[Plum]

They could have still come back from Scarra getting picked. It would be uphill at that point because they lost the inhib after that play, sure, but still possible because of how even they were up until that point. The Baron call was basically handing the game away on a silver platter.

 

[Sinister Slush]

I'll type it again, they lost momentum after the baroned up team lost their source of waveclear bot so they went around like headless chickens for awhile along with CLG cause still evenish game till scarra got caught out again mid, which threw their chances of winning.

Baron call was just desperation at work.

 

[Ussi]

Dig and Baron throw go together like apple and pie

 

[Niko45]

Honestly even the first baron was preeeeeetty dicey but they lucked out there and looked like geniuses. Lightning doesn't strike twice tho. Pretty cool play by Crumbz tho if anyone noticed he Wukong ulted nothing in the pit in anticipation of Elise repelling in so she was instantly knocked up when she came in and could not Q baron making it a pure smite battle.

 

[Shaya]

And a team that literally did not pick anything that remotely shuts kassadin down (they just went for more damage/similar mobility picks), won the game against kassadin.

inb4 a month or two of "NA is ****"

 

[Player-3]

kassadin was pretty much a nonfactor though all dig did was **** all over the other 4 members and ignore him because he didnt get enough items to compensate for the base damage nerfs early enough to make them acknowledge him

 

[Niko45]

Kassadin appeared to be doing plenty of damage to me but they picked an awful 5v5 team. Jax with Kassadin doesn't really make any sense. If they'd had like a Shyvana jumping in disrupting the back line and doing solid AOE damage to everyone I think Kass could have done his thing and blinked in to execute chunked targets.

 

[Shaya]

Yeah, curse had an early lead and kass was doing good damage when he was able to. Their comp was really wishy washy.

 

[Niko45]

Shiphtur also no dcap in that game. Probably a mistake to go for a zhonyas on top of the seraphs, overkill on defense. People will adjust. Ur prob gonna want to prioritize dcap on Kass now cause he still has ridiculously good ap ratios (considering his CDs) that can keep him as good as ever in the late game.

 

[john!]

http://community.pbe.leagueoflegend...dback/jHhmhlGe-lets-talk-about-lee-sin-retune

chemo

 

[Shaya]

Lee sin's late game problems would've been resolved by having his passive hold more than 2 stacks as the game progressed
(like 2/3/4; abilities still only gave 2 stacks). IMO IMO.

But the AS thing ramping up like it does will be pretty significant, his "attack speed issues" is the only reason why I build trinity force on him (getting off a second AA just that 10th of a second faster I find very significant in handling his energy problems). W costing twice as much energy for creeps/wards is going to be quite crippling though, I think it may kill his laning, like not being able to harass someone in melee range then disengage... or coming into someones range when they farm near creeps/etc.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Why do u build TF on lee sin.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I think those nerfs are a tad harsh but he has needed one for quite a while.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Spoiler

Lee Sin
55.8(+3.2) base AD

Level 9, 15 AD from runes, 10 AD from masteries, Old Q

109.6 AD
170 (+22.5) = 192.5
340 (+45) = 385 with resonating strike

Level 9, 15 AD from runes, 10 AD from masteries, New Q

109.6 AD
95 (+98.5) = 193.5
190 (+197) = 387 with resonating strike


Level 9, 15 AD from runes, 10 AD from masteries, bloodthirster, Old Q

215 AD
170 (+117) = 287
340 (+234) = 574 with resonating strike

Level 9, 15 AD from runes, 10 AD from masteries, bloodthirster, New Q

215 AD
95 (+193) = 288
190 (+386) = 576 with resonating strike

Wow it's ****ing NOTHING!
All they did was make sure he can't freely trade and safeguard away while laughing cause no energy to do so along with taking some damage away from lee sin's ult to keep his dueling power from being anymore powerful than it already is. He needed those nerfs, I hate lee but I ain't no XJ9.
>tank lee can 1v1 AD with 3 completed items

 

[KuroganeHammer]

so basically it's rivman "nerfs" except on Lee Sin

lolriot

 

[Shaya]

Why do u build TF on lee sin.

I love phage, fits my play style. I notice the attack speed in team fights speeding up everything he does by a lot.

WOW COME ON GUYS. P-h-a-g-e.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

the custom word filter is off at the moment I believe, so things like phage, Cofagrigus etc are all censored.

I reminded Garchomp7 yesterday about it since node permissions regarding the censor weren't working

pls understand

Edit: you are more than welcome to ***** to him about it though.

Edit 2: because I'm pretty sure he's sick of me tagging him. :D

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Slush you shouldn't forget what this means at other levels of his skills.

Current Lee Sin:

Base Damage at lv 1: 50 + 50 = 100dmg
Scaling AD dmg at lv 1: (0.9)x 30 BonusAD + (0.9)x 30 BonusAD = 54dmg
Total Damage at lv 1: 154dmg

Changed Lee Sin:

Base Damage at lv 1: 15 + 15 = 30dmg
Scaling AD dmg at lv 1: (0.5)x 80 TotalAD + (0.5)x 80 TotalAD 80dmg
Total Damage at lv 1: 110dmg

He lost 44 AD at lvl 1. I do agree though this skill I think got off the luckiest of all his skills, though this isn't including the change to the bonus damage based on missing health.

Tempest:
• Damage changed to 25/50/75/10/125 (+0.6 total AD) from 60/95/130/165/200 (+1.0 Bonus AD)
• Now deals physical damage instead of magic

This is a larger nerf, he needs a lot more AD to make up the difference.

• Damage changed to 50/150/250 (+0.75/0.875/1.0 Total AD) from 200/400/600 (+2.0 Bonus AD)
• For each enemies target collide with would make target take 25/75/125 (+0.375/0.4375/0.5 Total AD) extra damage

He lost tons of base damage and now has to make them collide to do more damage.

~

This actually hits him kinda hard, though well needed, now he can't build straight tank and get amazing base ratios with all the utility he has. He needs to build actually AD to get his old power back.

 

[Sinister Slush]

You do know that's what they were aiming for.
Lower his dumb early game damage while still somewhat retaining the same damage later in the game outside of Ult doing more damage to the one you kicked if they collide with more people.

Also what I said in my previous post, having enough high base AD damage to 1v1 the AD carry when you're full tank lee sin is just ********.

 

[Shaya]

Also what I said in my previous post, having enough high base AD damage to 1v1 the AD carry when you're full tank lee sin is just ********.

Uhh, what circumstances is this in? I don't see full tank lee sin able to kill anyone 1v1 unless he has a significant level advantage. Being able to... zone out an AD 1v1... sure. I'd expect tanks to be able to do that.