Ganondorf Board's Question & Answer Thread.

[Ray_Kalm]

I'm absolutely positive this has been asked before, but I'm tired of whiffing my buffered D tilts. What's the method you guys use to buffer F tilt/Dtilt after a choke?

(Spamming the A button while holding down after I choke them doesn't seem to be working for me).

Time it. That's really all I could say.

 

[Legendary Pikachu]

Hi all. Just visiting with a present for everybody. Man... I needa visit this place some more... i play with a Gannondorf few times too.

Anywayz, cutting to the chase:

I was wondering if you guys could make use of this new AT with pikachu? I'm teaming with my bro (arc-thefallen-, plays Toon Link and Samus) and am going to advance the technique. Here's the original post AND video! ^_^ enjoy!

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8104088&postcount=14

Cool thing about this move is that it allows a INSTANTANEOUS NON-FASTFALLED d-air right in the middle of it. Works for those with laggy (but epic) spike-moves with high fastfall risk.

Thanks for the time. I hope you like and laugh. Please pm me if you have any neat contributions or comments. :D

 

[TP]

Cool thing about this move is that it allows a INSTANTANEOUS NON-FASTFALLED d-air right in the middle of it. Works for those with laggy (but epic) spike-moves with high fastfall risk.

How can Dair have a risk of being fastfalled? If you want to fastfall it, you do, if you don't, you don't. The AT seems pretty worthless even for Pika, due to how situational it is, so it's DEFINITELY not worth us caring about it.

 

[:034:]

It looks awesome, though. If you can pull off a kill with it - awesome. However, I don't think Ganon is the best choice for a trick like that because of his lack of running speed. You'd require a 2v1 for it to happen, so it'd be unlikely with Ganon as a partner.

 

[ul7r05]

I use Ganon for dubz.

 

[smashkng]

Is Ganon-IC unwinnable? It's if hitting IC is impossible, otherwise it's 1-99. And why did Olimar change to "unwinnable"?

 

[stRIP]

Yes it is an unwinnable MATCHUP

But you can still win if your Opponent isnt possessing the metagame.

 

[Swoops]

I really don't think we should have any 0:100 match ups. I don't think we should have any match up that's basically "Ganon will never ever have a chance of winning this match up. It's completely impossible." Hell, a 0:100 pretty much implies that if the player is still worse than you, you're definitely going to lose.

This probably is a discussion for the match up thread anyways. I don't know why Olimar is changed to impossible.

 

[Tesh]

I have a question about Ganon's pivot grab.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Dc9bps1ch0
At 5:12 in this video Ray Kalm grabs pit from what appears to be an absurd range. Is Ganon's pivot grab always this huge? Pit warps to Ganon from about 2 body lengths away.

 

[PhantomX]

Ganon's pivot grab is large for sure, (not ridiculous like Marth's or Snake's, though), it looks larger in that clip than it actually is b/c of how he was sliding away when he did it.

 

[thexsunrosered]

I have a question about Ganon's pivot grab.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Dc9bps1ch0
At 5:12 in this video Ray Kalm grabs pit from what appears to be an absurd range. Is Ganon's pivot grab always this huge? Pit warps to Ganon from about 2 body lengths away.

It's because Kalm read the pit and knew he would move that direction, so the running pivot + pit running quickly makes the range seem insane, when in reality it was just Kalm taking advantage of the pivot grabs range as well as the Pit

 

[Zero Hour]

I'm not a ganon main but i was using him for fun against a comp... I was fighting a mario and i used the Uspecial to recover and as i was grabing the ledge he used the cape. It ended up that i was grabbing the ledge from inside the stage. Unfortunately i didn't react fast enough to actualy see if this was usefull at all but i was just wondering if this had happened to anyone else before... i probably could have jumped up and punched him or something but I doubt its usefull just cool... i saved the video but again, its probably not worth the effort.

 

[weinner]

gannon

It's spelled Ganon

And I believe you are refering to this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v10373amNZY

 

[LinkSceptile333]

Dudes, Ganondorf's Utilt wind properties are sexy. I was playing a Snake and he tried recovering by using the C4. He went into the range of the Utilt wind and he just fell down and died as soon as he touched the wind.

 

[18.15.2.15x12.9.14.11]

At the matchup thread, the chart says 20:80 G&W... but the write-up says 40:60... which is it?

 

[SaltyKracka]

At the matchup thread, the chart says 20:80 G&W... but the write-up says 40:60... which is it?

We generally don't pay attention to the chart. Ray is notoriously unrealistic with that. You're probably better off with the write-ups, those that are there...>_>

 

[18.15.2.15x12.9.14.11]

We generally don't pay attention to the chart. Ray is notoriously unrealistic with that. You're probably better off with the write-ups, those that are there...>_>

Doesn't Ray write the write-ups? lol XD

 

[Z1GMA]

The only unrealistic match-ups there, are the "0:100" ones.
They should be 05:95 at worst.

 

[Smoom77]

I'm an amateur Ganon player, he's my secondary (lol, I know) and main in low tier tournaments. Just a little intro.

But a question, I'm not understanding Ganon's Super Jump. Should this be used in play at all? Like for example, you can hit Samus after a dthrow with a wizkick. Could you super jump there to escape from punishment from lag? Or is there something I'm not seeing?

 

[18.15.2.15x12.9.14.11]

I'm an amateur Ganon player, he's my secondary (lol, I know) and main in low tier tournaments. Just a little intro.

But a question, I'm not understanding Ganon's Super Jump. Should this be used in play at all? Like for example, you can hit Samus after a dthrow with a wizkick. Could you super jump there to escape from punishment from lag? Or is there something I'm not seeing?

You can only cancel wizkick into the super jump if you wizkick from the ledge of the stage into the center. >_>

 

[TP]

In any situation in which you can Super Jump out of a Wizkick, you can also do a regular jump out of it. Choose the regular jump, with an aerial or choke to go with it.

The Super Jump has essentially no use. You can theoretically use it against a Snake who is recovering high (or another character that recovers high, such as Sonic, though Snake makes the most sense). Another potential use is as a mixup to fight aircamping, which a Wario or MK can use to shut you down if you are on a stage with platforms.

The BEST use of the Super Jump is to show off your tech skill. I did the SH version twice in a row while fighting Kalm online once and he was like O_O.

 

[thexsunrosered]

In any situation in which you can Super Jump out of a Wizkick, you can also do a regular jump out of it. Choose the regular jump, with an aerial or choke to go with it.

The Super Jump has essentially no use. You can theoretically use it against a Snake who is recovering high (or another character that recovers high, such as Sonic, though Snake makes the most sense). Another potential use is as a mixup to fight aircamping, which a Wario or MK can use to shut you down if you are on a stage with platforms.

The BEST use of the Super Jump is to show off your tech skill. I did the SH version twice in a row while fighting Kalm online once and he was like O_O.

truth
10FoGs

 

[Lord Chair]

How do you ledgehop an aerial with Ganon, the way pros do it and manage to have no landing lag on whichever aerial they did?

 

[thexsunrosered]

How do you ledgehop an aerial with Ganon, the way pros do it and manage to have no landing lag on whichever aerial they did?

like this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnydiAsEjTQ

 

[Lord Chair]

Great! Thanks

 

[thexsunrosered]

Great! Thanks

yep, thanks for using the Q&A thread =]

 

[Kofu]

Two things:
Exactly what is a "stutter-step" Forward Smash?
and
What is the Short Hop version of the FoG?

 

[TP]

Two things:
Exactly what is a "stutter-step" Forward Smash?
and
What is the Short Hop version of the FoG?

The SS Fsmash is a trick that gives it much more range. There are a couple versions. The easiest and quickest is to just hit back on the control stick and then immediately hit forward on the c-stick. Ganon's Fsmash has more range if you do it in the direction you are not facing, so this turns you around right before it to maximize the range. You can get even more range out of this by hitting forward on the control stick, then back on the control stick, then forward on the c-stick. This is the same thing except you are doing it out of a mini dash dance, giving it an even larger range boost. This is the harder method, and you are usually fine with just the simple one.

I'm too lazy to explain the SH FoG, someone else do it.

 

[PK-ow!]

Jump.
At a particular height, double jump and air dodge at the same time.

The moment before you hit the ground, you will be out of the air dodge. Time a jump at this exact frame, and simultaneously enter a down-special.

I don't know anyone who achieves this is any way other then setting one of the controller triggers to Special. You could use a trigger to jump, and hit B, but then you'd be so hypothetical you'd fall right off the end of this sentence.


Quiet TP you and I both know that you're just a delusion I invented to protect me from the Space Invader sprites.

 

[TP]

I don't know anyone who achieves this is any way other then setting one of the controller triggers to Special. You could use a trigger to jump, and hit B, but then you'd be so hypothetical you'd fall right off the end of this sentence.

I find it easiest to do it with B, and I succeed about 90% of the time out of a jump.

 

[Kofu]

Jump.
At a particular height, double jump and air dodge at the same time.

The moment before you hit the ground, you will be out of the air dodge. Time a jump at this exact frame, and simultaneously enter a down-special.

I don't know anyone who achieves this is any way other then setting one of the controller triggers to Special. You could use a trigger to jump, and hit B, but then you'd be so hypothetical you'd fall right off the end of this sentence.


Quiet TP you and I both know that you're just a delusion I invented to protect me from the Space Invader sprites.

Okay. I can do the standard version, but that one sounds like it could be more applicable (if only a mite).

The SS Fsmash is a trick that gives it much more range. There are a couple versions. The easiest and quickest is to just hit back on the control stick and then immediately hit forward on the c-stick. Ganon's Fsmash has more range if you do it in the direction you are not facing, so this turns you around right before it to maximize the range. You can get even more range out of this by hitting forward on the control stick, then back on the control stick, then forward on the c-stick. This is the same thing except you are doing it out of a mini dash dance, giving it an even larger range boost. This is the harder method, and you are usually fine with just the simple one.

I'm too lazy to explain the SH FoG, someone else do it.

I kinda guessed that was what it was, just didn't know it boosted the move's range.

Thanks.

 

[TenSen]

When should I gimp off stage with backward uairs or do a dair spike?

 

[Superspright]

Whenever they are off the stage? Duh. Well, optimally you want to put them in a position where their recovery can become predictable--like an ftilt off stage will knock them low and away, so for some characters it REALLY stretches their recovery--so if you know the matchup, then you know the path they MUST follow in order to recover. Predict, viola. Stomped, wizkicked, whatever. It's not that easy of course unless they are in a perfectly screwed spot--ganondorf is ironically notorious for having a very predictable and garbage recovery [that's considering he flies in nearly every game and has magic and teleporting and crap].

Basically, you want to go for the gimp 100% of the time. You are playing virtually the worst character in the game.

If you are asking how, then it's pretty easy. Just hit them with the tip of your feet--it's disjointed a little bit so if you have amazing spacing you can just tipman them into oblivion.

 

[RuNNing Riot]

Say, overall who has the better priority - Lucario or Ganondorf? I know some of Ganon's attacks have enough o the stuff to clank with swords, but I'm rather unclear about Lucario's.

EDIT: And, er... someone please tell me what FoG is. It sounds like Murder Quake if you ask me.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

Say, overall who has the better priority - Lucario or Ganondorf? I know some of Ganon's attacks have enough o the stuff to clank with swords, but I'm rather unclear about Lucario's.

EDIT: And, er... someone please tell me what FoG is. It sounds like Murder Quake if you ask me.

Ganon's priority is overrated, most of his physical attacks are beated by the majority of the moves in the game, and the priority on his specials are so horrible, they shouldn't be mentioned.

Lucario has more priority.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=221578&page=149

 

[Superspright]

Uhhh...just a quick question. I am probably a scrub by all means--I have knowledge of this game, but I doubt I could compete on a great level. Maybe I could...who knows? But, that aside.

I always see the shad as a nice mix up, and it goes into a nice flow of my game of weaving around and then doing unpredictable things. But, I was just messing around for a second and I started doing full hopped FFAD it was the same result. Mindgames? No landing lag it seemed--I was able to effortlessly buffer a reversed dtilt right out of it. Ganon needs to get much faster--and I think that's one way to give him a quicker mix up. More full hop FF stomps need to be done. Ganon I think can control a little bit more of the stage than we are giving him credit for, and it needs to be actualized. Japanese Ganons do crazy stuff, but sometimes I wonder if it can be used in a useful way to further his metagame, and perhaps make him a little more robust. Some characters are very tall, and his stomp is a lot like his knee when it is used from a full hop in respect to them being grounded. The target can be very small, but characters who are tall also tend to have excellent defenses above them. But, we can maybe be able to get a little faster so we can gain some more whiffs. Thus, more opportunities to punish. This is really long-winded, and I hope it wasn't something we've already discussed, but I lurk pretty hard and I haven't read anything like what I am suggesting.

 

[Denti]

So Ganon is epic. me and my teamate wana do a team dorf. any ideas and strategies? so far we both hafta watch eachother's back, we are also going to murder choke loads and mind game together with Dair auto cancel. any information would be great!

 

[TP]

Stick together as much as possible. Ganon is the worst character in the game in a 1v1, so the opponents will want to turn the fight into two 1v1s on opposite sides of the stage. Keep everyone in one pack where trading hits happens often, because Ganon is the king of trading hits.

 

[Superspright]

TP is right, but to expand on it: Um, it's just going to be very hard to help each other recover which is going to be the main problem. Floaty characters like R.O.B. can go out and uair for the save--maybe another ganny can do the same with a perfect tipman to tech or something.

If you can get a real thunderstorm going then GJ, but I suggest LOTS of SHADing with one SHADing while the other thunderstorms or uairs through the other. If you could keep a sync like that you could be like the most annoying pair of ganons in the universe. I believe the timing is incredibly easy. It would look like demented ice climbers essentially, and it would give you the full benefit of being able to stick together and stay close. Knowing each other very well and when you are going for mindgamey kills can help--and the SHAD will keep you both out of trouble. I have never really seen a 2v2 Ganon team do anything like that, but I think it's possible. GL.

Given the perfect IASA frames in the SHAD, thunderstorm, shorthop uair, short hop bair, it can become extremely lethal if one mixes in some dtilts out of the shad or dash attacks.

I am drooling at the ******** possibilities. :[ But maybe I think too flashy.

 

[Noobicidal]

Alright kids, I have a question.

In Zig's eye candy of a combo video, he uses this odd, run in place fair at 0:57 and at 1:07. What is it called, and how do you do it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWq_2eAA4vY